England vs India 2nd Test debate

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Sides

England:

1) Andrew Strauss (C)
2) Alistair Cook
3) Jonathan Trott
4) Kevin Pietersen
5) Ian Bell
6) Eoin Morgan
7) Matt Prior (WK)
8) Tim Bresnan
9) Stuart Broad
10) Graeme Swann
11) James Anderson

India:

1) Abhinav Makund
2) Rahul Dravid
3) Sachin Tendulkar
4) VVS Laxman
5) Yuvraj Singh
6) Suresh Raina
7) MS Dhoni (WK)
8) Harbhajan Singh
9) Praveen Kumar
10) Sreesanth
11) Ishant Sharma

no1 ranking looming

This is very interesting now. 1 or 2 more wickets this evening and England are right back in this.

cricketfan90 wrote:no1 ranking looming

Because India's worst batsmen got a diamond duck?

Excellent bowling by Broad. When he is confident, he can bowl very well.

longhopmerchant wrote:

activereactive wrote:

longhopmerchant wrote:Why do International sides pick batsmen with ordinary techniques to open the batting? We (Australia) stick with Hughes and India have this Mukund. He's barely average with the blade.

cuzz the BCCI is Cat enough to ignore Cheteswar Pujara.

Pujara had knee surgery, so couldn't play anyway. What about Rahane from Mumbai? He averages 70 in 1st class cricket.

M Vijay has proved more than once, he is a test player with solid scores, given more chances he can frimly establish himself and be as good as any olds gurads.

Matches: 12
Innings: 20
Not Outs: 0
Runs: 609
Highest Score:139
Average: 30.45

http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=3&ved=0CCgQFjAC&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.cricket365.com%2Fplayer-stats%2F14388%2FMurali-Vijay&rct=j&q=murli%20vijay%27s%20test%20recors&ei=AeQyTuLPHMLDhAff6cmDCw&usg=AFQjCNEGaE8JdrERwEVoH55-M5Iuli8hZQ&sig2=e2iv1jjRHnOw2v3q2B0ZQA&cad=rja

longhopmerchant wrote:

cricketfan90 wrote:no1 ranking looming

Because India's worst batsmen got a diamond duck?

What's a diamond duck?

I know a golden duck is when you're out 1st ball, so whats a diamond awarded for?

Was actually a golden duck...diamond is I think run out without facing a ball...

Very important partnership here: Anderson/Broad bowling well and if they break through here I could see a couple more following tonight...wonder when they pad up a nightwatchman?

Mukund is getting some unfair stick over here. the young man averages in the late 50s in FC cricket. His technique is not from the textbooks, but he has done enough not to be discarded.
Pujara is injured, and although he did open at the age levels, he doesn't do so in FC cricket. Rahane too is a middle order player, who in fact does deserve a call up, the guy averages in the late 60s after playing 40 odd FC matches.

Bang on msp, the boy Mukund is only 21 and just starting out. He is defo one for the future. Anyone who can get into this strong Indian batting line up obviously has to have some class about him.

activereactive and msp83

I think the majority of players representing Tamil Nadu are very much over hyped. You look at Badrinath, Vijay and Mukund and their 1st class record are excellent, but all 3 are very poor at International level.

With regards to Mukund's 1st class average, do they just bowl leg stump half volleys at him in the Ranji Trophy?

Have to admire the defensive skills of Dravid. Facing some very testing bowling in tricky conditions and fair pressure and he doesn't look like going out...and England have wasted a review on him.

I'm sure the rest of the batsmen , who don't want to bat tonight , are grateful for The Wall that protects them.

Lets see what Bresnan can produce..

Its probably a little unfair to judge the guy based on what we've seen so far (just 3 innings).

If we did that with Cook, we could say he's not a Test-class batsman either.

Granted Mukund got out playing a poor shot this time, but some players need a series or two to get used to Test match cricket.

Laxman's looked a bit susceptible. He's probably Englnad's best chance of a 2nd wicket.

Particularly after getting a very "hot spot" courtesy of Broad.

India defending well. These two get through to the close - which is not far off now - and it is advantage India.

Lot of cricket to come though , tomorrow will be another very interesting day , I suspect. Good weather forecast too for once...

Broad is bowling well for no result - ooh! So nearly got Dravid then !Just didn't carry...

longhopmerchant wrote:activereactive and msp83

I think the majority of players representing Tamil Nadu are very much over hyped. You look at Badrinath, Vijay and Mukund and their 1st class record are excellent, but all 3 are very poor at International level.

With regards to Mukund's 1st class average, do they just bowl leg stump half volleys at him in the Ranji Trophy?

You do have a decent case there, but then you also have to remember Vijay played only one full series in his series so far, every other times he played, he played as a last minute replacement either for Sehwag or for Gambhir. Badri hasn't had many opportunities in test matches, and Mukund so far into his 5th match, has produced scores of 62, 49 and 48, hardly the stuff of legend, but enough to have some trust to be invested in him.

Its still very much advantage India here. Broad must strike soon, he has bowled extremely well and troubled the batsmen.

Broad has bowled brilliantly and is very unlucky not to have a wicket. Having said that I reckon a couple of our lot would have edged some of his deliveries, very good defensive batting from these 2.

lol sorry i know this is off topic, but the mighty essex have reduced lecister to 29/8!!!!!

dave masters 7 wickets for 5 runs

anyway come on england

Please educate, there are 90 overs played per day in test matches, but why (apart from the 1st day play, it is easy to work out) does not the score board, include any info about it.

dravid and laxman see out the play..

unfortunately u would say that its advantage india at the end of day 1

well that was a load of balls from england.

didn't look like a 250 par with india out there. india to get 400 and beat eng by an innings.

as it's due to be sunny sunny sunny.

and strauss can't win the toss.. gotta go.

trebellbobaggins wrote:well that was a load of balls from england.

didn't look like a 250 par with india out there. india to get 400 and beat eng by an innings.

as it's due to be sunny sunny sunny.

and strauss can't win the toss.. gotta go.

that is gonna happen, no matter what.

they cannot fail.

fact.

(if ever a reverse was needed it's now after the rubbish eng produced today).

I'll take a pointless online bet with you that India don't reach 400.

Your 2nd line was nonsense, India struggled big time out there, even truly world class players like Dravid and Laxman. If the conditions are similar tomorrow then it is game on, though it is advantage India for now. England could have done with 1 more wicket, but they're still in it by the skin of their teeth.

An interesting day ahead.

Good man trebbs, keep em coming mate

India's best day in the series so far. The day of course was blotted By a crucial 9th wicket stand after England was reduced to 124-8, and Mukund's first baller, and of course Harbhajan's wicket that would ensure his continued selection for at least another 2 years.
Broad bowled pretty well, and VVS and Dravid did very well to stay together till the end. India needs more of the same from them and the rest of the batting unit if they have to have a chance. England's bowling, even without Chris Tremlett is truly world class, and although their batting is not in the same class in comparison to India's experienced middle order, they bat long, and in fact it was this quality that somewhat saved their day today.

sorry lol had to write this...

essex bowl lecister out 34 masters 8-10!!!!!

anyway difficult day for england

Massive day for Masters there cf90.

mighty masters awesome essex

eirebilly wrote:Good man trebbs, keep em coming mate

i'm making myself look insane here but i'm going to take this bullet for the team Billy.

Tough day for england with poor performances saved by a few excellent performances.

They have to raise the team's play to near brilliant tomorrow to keep india down.

activereactive wrote:Please educate, there are 90 overs played per day in test matches, but why (apart from the 1st day play, it is easy to work out) does not the score board, include any info about it.

They use to have a countdown which kept viewers and fans at the ground informed now it seems to be taboo and covered up.

I suggest when the over rate is slow and the time ticks past 6 pm a flashing light graphic and a picture of the guilty captain goes up so everyone can have a good laugh at him.

tomorrow will be a crucial day, all the bowlers will have to step tomorrow.

I'm not too downbeat about today, with a bit more luck Dravid or Laxman could both easily have edged behind, some deliveries were just too good to nick! If England keep putting the ball in the right areas they will get wickets, India could and probably will get a lead but I think we'll get them for under 300.

alfie wrote:Was actually a golden duck...diamond is I think run out without facing a ball...

A diamond duck is from the first ball of the innings, exactly what Mukund got today.

Not sure what run out without facing is ,it might be a diamond as well...

What an advert for test cricket today, hopefully it won't be a batting paradise tomorrow.

after Mukund today, some guys at the club had a net and anyone who was edging it from a pointless drive etc was being called a Mukund, i think it could catch on

Gregers wrote:
A diamond duck is from the first ball of the innings, exactly what Mukund got today.

Not sure what run out without facing is ,it might be a diamond as well...
.

If you are dismissed "timed out" before even reaching the wicket perhaps that is a platinum duck

The ball was moving about even in the India innings. Usually early morning conditions help seam and swing, the ball is pretty fresh as well. If there is not much of sun as well, it will be very dificult for India. They gave away too many very crucial runs at the end, and that negated most of the advantage that they gained in the first 2 sessions of the first day.
Dravid, Laxman and Tendulkar are the key I think. Yuvraj has a chance to redeem himself in test cricket, and Raina has it in him to tough it out in dificult conditions. Dhoni is due a score as well, and time for Harbhajan to make his first meaningful contribution to the team in this series. But then Yuvraj has problems against the moving ball and spin, Raina has a troubled history with short balls, and Dhoni hasn't had the best of times with the bat in recent times. Harbhajan's batting, like his bowling is an absolute lottery.
So eventually its up to the legends to guide India through a tough situation. Despite the Dravid ton in the last match, they have had a collective failure in the last match, will they overcome that 2nd time around?
I hope they will, but again, its not going to be easy.

Just looking at Wikipedia, Diamond duck can refer to out without facing (run out, stumped off a wide, etc), however being out first ball is sometimes called a Diamond duck, sometimes called a Platinum duck (what I always called it) and sometimes called a Royal duck (although Royal duck is sometimes reserved to only the first innings of a match).

It also talks of Silver ducks (out for 0 second ball) and Bronze ducks (out for 0 off third ball), but these aren't as common as Golden ducks.

Hopefully we get to use all of these expressions at some point today!

Come on then England, get a couple early and it's game on. Don't fancy our chances though, in all honesty.

Here we go again then!

We need to take two of DLT this morning otherwise I fear for our chances...

David and the slackman are making this look easy. i can see 400 here.

they're lucky little buggers the injuns.

once again they win the toss and get to perfect conditions.

they have to win this. the blew it last time, they won't blow it again.

flat and easy to bat now. strauss losing the toss tossed away the match.

this is the turning point of the series like last time isn't it. they win this they smash englands confidence and expose our huge weaknesses in our batting and we can't come back, leading to 3-1 for India most likely.

Typical that the sun comes out ready for The start of play...

Poor bowling so far though.

Fists of Fury wrote:I'll take a pointless online bet with you that India don't reach 400.

Your 2nd line was nonsense, India struggled big time out there, even truly world class players like Dravid and Laxman. If the conditions are similar tomorrow then it is game on, though it is advantage India for now. England could have done with 1 more wicket, but they're still in it by the skin of their teeth.

An interesting day ahead.

If you're referring to trebell there, don't be too hard on him. He is England's secret weapon in their hour of need...their 13th man...the Reverse Jinx Specialist. Basically he bigs up the opposition and say England look hopeless in the hope of inducing reverse mockers.

trebellbobaggins wrote:they're lucky little buggers the injuns.

once again they win the toss and get to perfect conditions.

they have to win this. the blew it last time, they won't blow it again.

flat and easy to bat now. strauss losing the toss tossed away the match.

I dont know how you can say its lucky. We batted awfully in hard conditions yesterday, with 3 top order batsmen (Strauss, KP, Bell) all making starts and not converting to 50. Laxman is looking great atm, but we're only 4 overs into the day and we havnt really bowled a great delivery yet

That said, the way India batted yesterday and given how they've started today, they could well reach 400. England are bowling well and creating lots of chances, but they're just not getting that extra bit of luck that causes wickets to fall.

Could have had 3 or 4 yesterday and thats a worry (i.e. the luck seems to be with India at the moment).

This is already looking ominus for England here. India really should rack up a big score.