Matchplay ploy ?

First topic message reminder :

Just played a tie this weekend. The chap I was playing against uttered barely a word to me all the way round. I have never played a game of golf where this has happened and suspect this must have been a deliberate approach on his part.

Found the whole thing quite odd and not a particularly enjoyable experience. I aways regard social interaction [even if it a tie] to be important.

Has anyone experienced this before [it may be more common that I am aware as I have not played a lot of competitve matchplay golf] - indeed does anyone employ this approach themselves ?

Mac: The army does not just send people off to war to get maimed.

Far more active serving soldiers right now are in places like Congo, Kenya, Belize, providing services to local people helping rebuild their communties by build schools, providing running water etc in order to help them lead a better life. Is that a waste of their services or should we not help those less fortunate to because they don't have a Uni background.

You say the way our soldiers are treated is a joke yet you feel happy enough to joke about them saying they are drug dealers or mindless bouncers or simply dead..... Classless

McLaren wrote:I have no issue with anyone who joins the army and think the way the people who join get treated is a joke, especially those who do encounter difficulties of some sort. I am however completely against the way our armed forces are used and the wars they have entered.

I also believe society could find a much better use for young men other than sending them to get maimed. If someone see’s no better option than to put themselves in great danger for an unwinnable cause for people who are not grateful then society as failed those people.

Shock and awe that you disagree with the wars that our forces have been entered into - the bubble of a university really can make you ignorant to anything outside of the student union and the influence of students that have suddenly found politics in their late teens.

Do you not see how there may be some honour in joining the armed forces, despite the dangers that it poses? Joining the armed forces is a voluntary act and one that is universally appreciated by all echelons of society and for us that don't swan around dressed like Harry Potter, it represents a career choice that is looked upon with admiration, regardless of a person's wealth, education or social standing. I agree with you that society has very much failed though - it has wasted money trying to educate morons like you...

Mav

Yes of course there are good causes where the armed forces are vital, I just quesion whether a ten year war against "terror" in the Afgahn mountains is one of them.


Sharrison

I have no idea how to respond to that it is so ludicrous. I would however like to ask you if you are an avid watcher of the O'Reily show or how often you share a tear with Glen Beck?

I would say anything that may help thwart a potential threat to this countries national security is a valid war... I guess you would also question why we still have troops stationed in Northern Ireland even though theres a simple answer. Or why some are still posted to Germany or cypress, again simple answer is quick response units more accesible to mainland europe or the gulf hotspots...

Maverick wrote:Or why some are still posted to Germany or cypress

Is that Cypress Point?




(sorry Mav, couldn't resist)

Thats ok Cypress Point is a posting I would have loved

McLaren wrote:Mav

Yes of course there are good causes where the armed forces are vital, I just quesion whether a ten year war against "terror" in the Afgahn mountains is one of them.

Surely an educated person like yourself would understand that entering Afghanistan was more than just a war on terror? And despite your views on the war, the fact that somebody would "choose" to join the armed forces and participate in a conflict that they may or may not agree with or understand just so that people like you can sit around for 8 hours a week, 6 months a year and further your academic achievements with nothing to give back should warrant a little more respect than the assumption that they will end up as a drug dealer/bouncer/burger flipper. Shame on your lack of respect.

As for Beck/O'Reilly I take great offence to your ignorant assumptions and am yet to be surprised by what a small minded and discriminative individual you are. Just because someone disagrees with your left wing, judgemental and arrogant attitude it does not make them a racist/fascist/Thatcher lover - whatever you choose to label.

SH:

I fear were fighting a losing cause here. The blinkers mac has on could be used by a horse running the national. Clearly see's the world through tinted glass. That has no reflection on the real world in anyway, and as he only read one type of publication has no grasp on the resaons why were out in afghanistan. Probably thinks northern ireland was just a scuffle. I must say i take a personal issue with much of what he has said having been there in the turmoil of both irag and afghanistan as well as many other locations. To say the things he has about soldiers clearly shows he's no clue about what it takes to sign up and want to do the job. Probably has a degree in how to be an arrogant left wing git.. But clearly that is more use than that of a soldier or any real training for vocation

Completely agreed Mav. Really annoys me that my taxes could be wasted educating a chimp like this but I seek comfort in the fact that he will never be able to hold himself with anywhere near the dignity of someone serving in the armed forces. Even those that end up as drug dealers??! (never heard that one...)

Mav

It is sad that you have decided to listen to what sharrison has spouted about me rather than read my comments. Yes I made a flippant joke about the outcome of soldier’s careers but nothing more than the drivel posted about those who chose to go to uni. I have also never said going to uni is the superior decision that is again something you and sharrison have fabricated.

Further I do not understand how having a difference of opinion has somehow made that opinion one of a sheltered individual. I see no reason for you to draw any conclusions on how qualified I am to comment on our countries entrance to war. As you have no evidence of what knowledge I may or may not have.

I am also keen to hear what you mean when you say I have only read one publication?

McLaren wrote:Mav

It is sad that you have decided to listen to what sharrison has spouted about me rather than read my comments. Yes I made a flippant joke about the outcome of soldier’s careers but nothing more than the drivel posted about those who chose to go to uni. I have also never said going to uni is the superior decision that is again something you and sharrison have fabricated.

Further I do not understand how having a difference of opinion has somehow made that opinion one of a sheltered individual. I see no reason for you to draw any conclusions on how qualified I am to comment on our countries entrance to war. As you have no evidence of what knowledge I may or may not have.

I am also keen to hear what you mean when you say I have only read one publication?

Mac I have made my judgements based on what you have written not what has been said about you. You cannot deny anything you have said whether flippant or not theres a saying "never a truer word said than that in jest"

Please tell me where the flippancy is in joking about or where the actual punchline is in saying how out 10 soldiers, 3 will die, 3 will be nut jobs, 2 will be mindless bouncers (which you re-addressed saying one of those will be a drug dealer) 1 will flip burgers and the other will be a useless desk jockey....

How you can use that to try to draw a conclusion that a uni degree is better than being a soldier is a joke yes, but a sick joke. That can only be drawn from a complete lack of contact with any current or former serving servicemen or woman no matter what the intention meant. to then elaborate how studying about beckham being more benificial than choosing to serve your country in order to gain employment or further yourself is further insult.

I also believe it was you that said. You would encourage someone to go to uni and study beckham studies instead of joining the army

There has been no fabrication from myself or S Harrison from what i've read only response to your ridiculous insulting posts.

You did not say that "anyone thinking of going to uni should give it a go" then?

It is the fact that your opinions are just so far away from the reality that makes you appear as a sheltered individual. I don't think that my opinions about you formed from your posts would be necessary for anyone to make comment on what you have said - you've pretty much said enough for even the poorly educated to size you up.

As for the publication, I'd be amazed you don't know which one?!? But then I am rarely amazed by your posts anymore...

So I am sheltered and insulting for suggesting anyone thinking of going to uni should give it a go?

Ok, explain that one.


I also believe it was you that said. You would encourage someone to go to uni and study beckham studies instead of joining the army

Yes, and I stand by that. You have to also remember that most people will not be studying something like beckham studies. So in fact it was a lighter hearted way of saying further education is a better route than the armed forces. Whether this be something like learning to be an electrician or study the effects of easel design on impressionism.

Anyone got any thoughts on what we should call this thread when we split it off?

Evidently struggling to read a post can also be added to your list of skills.

My first point was in response to your first point, stating that "I have also never said going to uni is the superior decision that is again something you and sharrison have fabricated."

I think that it is also statements like "further education is a better route than the armed forces" that make you so open minded and endearing. Using your chosen course of "easel design on impressionism" is also a really great way of enforcing your views on university being for everyone. Good way to pay back society for funding your education...

Davie wrote:Anyone got any thoughts on what we should call this thread when we split it off?

To what extent can getting a university education make you more stupid? Discuss...

McLaren wrote:I also believe it was you that said. You would encourage someone to go to uni and study beckham studies instead of joining the army

Yes, and I stand by that. You have to also remember that most people will not be studying something like beckham studies. So in fact it was a lighter hearted way of saying further education is a better route than the armed forces. Whether this be something like learning to be an electrician or study the effects of easel design on impressionism.

Maybe then you should have used a better example then Mac than one that could only be seen as a childish gesture, and as an insult to the memory of some of our armed forces.

if someone chooses to goto Uni then that is their choice but it is not their right to assume they are better than say a mere common soldier or someone that went down the vocational route. Nor does it make it ok for them make such idiotic jokes about the plight of a soldier in assume they have no life or chance of being a success on their completion of service and can be a mere drug pusher or bouncer....

Davie as for name of the thread I wouldn't bother splitting it maybe just close it off as clearly matchplay has run it's course and Mac has done nothing but incite with his attempt at joking about plight of soldiers and how were clearly a bunch of no hopers in life after our service if were lucky enough to survive that is

Sharrison

Again I repeat, I would never recommend that anyone should join the armed forces. That does not mean I see them as inferior or anyone else as superior once they have joined up.

McLaren wrote:Sharrison

Again I repeat, I would never recommend that anyone should join the armed forces. That does not mean I see them as inferior or anyone else as superior once they have joined up.

So you didn't say 1 would be a bouncer, 1 would be a drug dealer, 1 a burger flipper and the other a mindless office worker(or words to that effect)......

So please elaborate on how your saying their not inferior then.. Just because you never used the word inferior does not mean your words did not imply this meaning

Matchplay ploy has indeed run its course !!

Bash on with this chaps - some interesting reading.......

Mav

I seriously worry about your ability to detect sarcasm if you actually think my earlier remark reflectis what I actually think the stats would be for people leaving the army.

I am sorry if the army is a sore point for you but do not come on here and cause hatred towards me because you cannot currently handle a simple joke. I am sure you have made many an offensive remark on here without a second thought for who it would offend. The likes of you and sharrisons right wing politics offend me but I do not trash you for it to the extremes you have just for me.

When we have soldiers dying just now, serving their country, then sarcasm is the last thing they are interested in, I would hope that even if you do not agree with the war, you would at least appreciate and support them in what they are doing, in giving people their basic human rights and ensuring that everyone gets a proper education.

I feel that you may need to do another degree to learn how to use sarcasm. I get the impression that this was your attempt at being funny or witty and you sadly failed at both.

As for indicating that the army may be a sore point for Mav, it has nothing to do with his military background that he has taken offence. Your joke was childish and not funny in the slightest and the fact that you cannot even understand that such jokes might be construed by the masses as such further highlights your small mindedness and sheltered life. Politics is a different issue and one to which you seem quite happy to point to so to take offence to other people's political views whilst dishing out your own speaks volumes...

Davie.

We should have a 'Chewing the Fat' sticky.

That is a very fair point OP

I am pretty sure Mac was not stating what he said totally seriously - and indeed he has made that point himself.

In general, however, I do think we have to watch that we do not paint all soldiers as paragons which I think is something that is inclined to happen. Only heroes seem to get injured - are there no soldiers that are total prats/wasters/boors etc ? I appreciate that this is a media portrayal but it cannot be reflective of reality.

I think many support the forces per se but find it difficult to support some of the wars or other actions they are asked to undertake - this can sometimes cloud opinions and it is important to differentiate between the two aspects or your opinions on one sometimes appear to be your opinions on the other.

Anyhow, notwithstanding what I said in an earlier post, let's get back to golf...............I am now in the next round and given that, when I was getting the silent treatment, I won comfortably do you think I should ask my next opponent not to speak to me !!

Mac if you actually bothered to read what is written instead of drawing your own conlcusions. You would see I took offense to your pathetic attempt at sacrasm as your now calling it, which is a far cry from flippancy which you originally claimed. It has nothing to do with my background as a soldier even though you did in fact imply soldiers cannot have a good life after the army with your examples! I can and always will rise above that as I am in a good position in my life thanks to the grounding the army gave me and I am and nor are any soldiers I know in anyway any of the things you seemingly now sarcastically implied!

As for right wing politics I have not made any political comments on here so again is this you insinuating I'm right to cover your misconceptions of me because I happen to disagree with you.

As for inciting hatred towards you I have done no such thing. If there is any hatred/dislike or disrespect toward you it is you that have brought that upon yourself with you remarks and complete lack of respect towards others

Mav

You have tried to spin this as though I am some sort of snob towards those who chose a path other than uni. Which if you read through all my comments you will realise is unfair and total nonsense. I made no such comments or sentiments and as mod I have no idea why you are trying to besmirch a posters image.

I would further argue that if something cannot be questioned then it most certainly cannot be respected. So if you are suggesting the army is above mocking or ridicule your whole argument falls apart.

McLaren wrote:This is a tactic I used often when I used to play in club comps. I could either say nothing or engage in idle chit chat with some guy that thought the daily mail had something to offer. I choose the silence route, after such a round a guy once declined my offer of a drink. I got home earlier and avoided the clubhouse. Everyone was a winner.

I think that your initial post that lit the blue touch paper for this whole tangent shows a good enough degree of snobbery so I'm afraid that you have only yourself to blame. As for pointing to Mav's moderator status you are further showing what a pathetic child you are. Mav has been posting as a member just like the rest of us and has at no point used his title as moderator in any way - for you to point this out further solidifies the impression that you are very much a tool.

Nobody is suggesting that the army is above mocking but as with any joke, the context in which it is made is very important. Your "joke" was not made in complete jest because you were using this "joke" to insinuate that everybody that leaves the army fails in their next career. This was not funny or witty and showed a complete lack of respect for a group of people that put their lives on the line so that you can indulge your dreams of being educated. Not all people in the forces are perfect, like any other industry, but the nature of their job is admirable and commands respect, especially from an ignorant child like you.

Mac
In this post you have come accross in a different way to your normal style.

It is not like you as you are usually a good read and at times give a viewpoint that others may not have considered. It is almost as if someone else has borrowed your name.

sharrison

you are obsessed man, what is it with you and education in every post?

Doon

I assure you it is me. If you read what I wrote and not how mav and sharrison seem intent on interpreting it I am sure you will recognise some of mac in there.

McLaren wrote:you are obsessed man, what is it with you and education in every post?

I was quoting you. Maybe not my obsession?

No

I think you will find it was you that said something about indulging my dreams of being educated.

McLaren wrote:No

I think you will find it was you that said something about indulging my dreams of being educated.

"Since when was university there to train people for the work place? I thought it was there to educate people in their chosen subject?

If it has the side effect of creating people better suited for work, then great. People are confusing academia for something it is not.

I am also confused how people who have never studied a subject can write it off as pointless or not worthy. Without having studied it how can you know what details and concepts you might have to grasp. There is no reason to think one subject will stretch the mind more than another unless you have studied both. Even then that is only you perception based on your own mind and intelligence."

Your strange views on further education that I briefly translate as learning for the sake of it. If the end dream is not to achieve in the career that you desire then what is it?

I must be a bit slow as I have always thought that folk went to university to study a subject that will help them gain employment in thier chosen career.

I now can see that some go to improve thier knowledge about something they are interested in and then after four to six years of hard study start looking for work.

Doon the Water wrote:I must be a bit slow as I have always thought that folk went to university to study a subject that will help them gain employment in thier chosen career.

I now can see that some go to improve thier knowledge about something they are interested in and then after four to six years of hard study start looking for work.

Unfortunately seems to be how some people go into further education - probably explains the large number of unemployed students or those in lowly paid jobs that they certainly didn't expect with all that debt. I finished uni 8 years ago an this didn't seem to be the case and almost all my friends still work in jobs related to their studies. I also don't understand smashing in a sports shop window and stealing a load of right footed trainers so maybe I'm getting old?!!?

I'm with Doon in that I honestly never realised that people might think that way. It has never occured to me that you might go to Uni with anything in mind other than a career/the rest of your life.
This kind of explains a few things!

sharrison said "... I finished uni 8 years ago ... "

You went to uni?

MPB/Doon, I think it comes from the idea that everyone should go to university, an idea that the last government encouraged to make the unemployment rate fit their promises, in my opinion. I was the first in my family to attend university because my parents' generation was one where the minority went to university and everyone else was just expected to venture into the big wide world of work. My school almost made it unthinkable for the students to not attend university and this type of behaviour was typical of schooling in the late '90's and meant that a lot of students simply chose a course that they were interested in to fulfil the expectation of going to university. That was just over 10 years ago and the number of students attending university has done nothing but grow so I would assume that the situation has got no better. The irony is that between '97 and '07, the economy saw it's biggest boom in the construction industry (due to property prices) which is largely populated by people that did not attend university. The situation has not really balanced itself out, hence the call out charge of a plumber is akin to an hour with a solicitor. It's amazing how little people really can think, particularly the educated...

gaelgowfer wrote:sharrison said "... I finished uni 8 years ago ... "

You went to uni?

Why would that be a surprise?

Plenty of people go to uni and do humanities degrees and then go on to do say a law degree or a teacher training course. University is about life experience as well as picking a vocational course.
I did a history and politics degree and I now run my own IT business, I dont think my life would have gone the same way had I stayed at home in a small north east town so Im very glad I did what some would deem to be a pointless degree.

Sharrison, it sounds like I would have been at Uni a year before you and I remember being amazed when I heard the thickest kid in my year at college (sorry for those politically correct) had got the place he applied for at Uni. Gary his name was. It still leaves a slight feeling of having tainted my joy at getting in.
Sort of like getting a hole in one and then being told that every one else had too. "oh"

sharrison01 wrote:

gaelgowfer wrote:sharrison said "... I finished uni 8 years ago ... "

You went to uni? :shock:

Why would that be a surprise?

It would be a surprise to find out that you could work out what to wipe after you had taken a shit never mind make it to uni.

Given I can only judge on what are, basically, posts related to the game of golf, I would have to question your logic and ... given a university education prides itself in providing the ability to assimilate, process and arrive at logically appraised conclusions ... ye dinnae match up!

MustPuttBetter wrote:Sharrison, it sounds like I would have been at Uni a year before you and I remember being amazed when I heard the thickest kid in my year at college (sorry for those politically correct) had got the place he applied for at Uni. Gary his name was. It still leaves a slight feeling of having tainted my joy at getting in.
Sort of like getting a hole in one and then being told that every one else had too. "oh"

I know people like that and it is so demoralising. It does put into perspective how common and pointless those bits of paper at the end are though, especially when you see how stupid some people can be at university. After a few years in the real world you also realise that despite what your teachers told you, no one cares how many GCSE's or A-levels you have got and now that the education system seems to be dishing out A-grades for the correct spelling of one's name, it seems that obtaining a job is even more about who you know and what you are like as a person - really the only way to differentiate unfortunately.

McLaren wrote:

sharrison01 wrote:

gaelgowfer wrote:sharrison said "... I finished uni 8 years ago ... "

You went to uni?

Why would that be a surprise?

It would be a surprise to find out that you could work out what to wipe after you had taken a shit never mind make it to uni.

Ah, I see that you are back! Couldn't be bothered to explain how you can be such a tool anymore so have resorted to playground tactics. Well done you, you are really growing as a person...

Time to draw a line under this one I think