Does Martin Johnson have the Cojones to make the correct team selection ?

Twickenham we have a problem !!!

Our backs can't penetrate useful defences....absolutely clueless.....why.......because of mark cueto, mike tindall, shontayne hape and banahan can't cut the mustard at this level....either to lumbering, slow, old or just lacking the ability required. Johnson is commendable in his faithfulness to players however it seems silly to me picking 'solid' players when we need ones with that extra something that can change a game.

Johnson needs to make some tough decisions !

Who to come in ? for me Tindall should be around the squad but tuilagi has to be first choice...delon armitage looks very hungery at the mo and perhaps finding some old form...can we find room for delon and foden ? inside centre is the real quandary, flutey and shontayne just aren't there at the moment...any ideas anyone...Allen(will never happen)

Cueto bless him isn't an international winger anymore...he wouldn't make the squad of any other 6N or tri nations teams....ashton was given a chance and is now a useful england starter...surely sharples, monye even JSD and strettle should get a chance.

Hopefully johnson will have the minerals to make the tough decisions and stop picking his faithful bunch of chunky plodders......maybe we could try this team for the last warm up game

Stevens
Hartley
Cole
Palmer
Lawes
Croft
Robshaw
Haskell

Simpson
Wilkinson
Ashton
tuilagi (can play at 12)
armitage (has played 13 for saxons)
sharples
Foden

Care
monye
deacon
corbisero
thompson
easter
hodgson
tindall

I'd say that Armitage on the wing could be an option and I would look at exploring it for the Ireland game, maybe with Tuilagi coming onto the bench.

Team for Ireland:
1. Sheridan
2. Hartley
3. Stevens
4. Lawes
5. Palmer
6. Croft
7. Haskell
8. Easter

9. Youngs
10. Wilkinson
11. Armitage
12. Flutey
13. Tindall (C)
14. Ashton
15. Foden

16. Thompson
17. Cole
18. Deacon
19. Wood
20. Care
21. Flood
22. Tuilagi

With Corbisiero, Mears, Moody, Fourie, Wigglesworth, Hape, Banahan and Cueto also in the 30 man squad.

If Sheridan is ruled out through injury than Corbs comes onto the bench and Cole starts (Stevens at loose) and if Youngs is injured Care starts and Wigglesworth comes onto the bench.

I think it is more fundamental than the choice of individual backs. To not score with that amount of possession is actually a real achievement, and it must come down to coaching and mindset when they step onto the pitch.

Still, I thought Fourie did well and England's dominant of possession started to fade away when he was replaced by Haskell. I would certainly take Fourie to the WC.

Perhaps a bit over the top. There is a problem in the 10 - 12 axis. Flood is off form. The solution is to play Wilkinson. Flutey and Hape are off form and just not good enough respectively. God knows what we do about that, but playing Tuilangi at 12 is asking for trouble. He's a great player but he's not a 12.

I also thought Tindall played well on Saturday too. How about playing Armitage instead of Banahan or Cueto?

How's about:

1 - Stevens
2 - Hartley
3 - Cole
4 - Lawes
5 - Palmer
6 - Croft
7 - Moody/Wood
8 - Easter
9 - Youngs/Care
10 - Wilkinson
11 - Armitage
12 - ?????????
13 - Tindall
14 - Ashton
15 - Foden

with Tuilagi covering wing and outside centre on the bench.

As for mr ????????, he's been playing very well at his club !!!!!!!!! and lloks like the form centre to me....

If Flood wasn't so out of touch in the last game I'd go for
10 - Wilko
12 - Flood, swapped round in defence.

I think we all know that 12 is our bogey position and we need a stop gap in there. Unfortunately I think playing Tuilagi out of position could ruin him and sap his confidence.

I wouldn't play Armitage on the wing, it is his worst position in the backline. I would give serious consideration to playing him at 13 though. One of the reasons that many people give for Cueto playing is that he gives balance in the backs as none of the others have kicking games. If you play Armitage at 13 then you have a player in midfield who does, which means you can have anohter winger such as Sharples or Monye instead of Cueto.

In reality it matters little who plays against Ireland as the World Cup squad is announce 5 days before the game, so Johnno will have cut whoever is not going before then.

If he had the cojones to make the tough calls then we would not be approaching the final warm up game with questions still over our best 15.

LDCPete wrote:I wouldn't play Armitage on the wing, it is his worst position in the backline. I would give serious consideration to playing him at 13 though. One of the reasons that many people give for Cueto playing is that he gives balance in the backs as none of the others have kicking games. If you play Armitage at 13 then you have a player in midfield who does, which means you can have anohter winger such as Sharples or Monye instead of Cueto.

In reality it matters little who plays against Ireland as the World Cup squad is announce 5 days before the game, so Johnno will have cut whoever is not going before then.

If he had the cojones to make the tough calls then we would not be approaching the final warm up game with questions still over our best 15.

Whoops mis read it. Forget I posted anything in this comment...

I'd certainly give Armitage a go on the wing. We can bring Cueto in and re-form the back three that served us well last season if it doesn't work, but I think Armitage has showed some great form and would like to see how he does. He can rotate with Foden if needs be and both men can do a stint on the wing.

It also opens up a bench spot for Tuilagi. I would like to see him given another shot for England before the World Cup, maybe coming on for Tindall after 50-60 minutes.

LDC
Don't see how playing Armitage at centre gives us more kicking options in the back 3. Having said that, last year's game plan didn't involve too much aerial ping-pong, as the back three were encouraged to run the ball back unless it was absolutely not on.

I like Armitage as a player - he's deceptively quick with the ball in hand, and does link well with supporting players, but it's a question of getting the balance of the team right. Foden is an even better full back, Ashton is our biggest threat on the wing (would have been interesting to see if we'd failed to score a try with him in the side running support off the good breaks that Care and Tindall made), and Tindall and Tuillagi offer more power at 13 (which is what MJ and his coaches seem to have looked for.

I would like to see Delon on the bench in preference to Banahan - seems to me to offer the same versatility in a more creative way, and is more likely to change a game than the big Bath lump.

Well they say games are won and lost up front, clearly that isn't the case when your pack runs out of steam 20 minutes before full time and your backline can't create chances.

But the truth is nothing is wrong with England that can;t easily be put right. It's been pointed out about the amount of English forwards hanging around the back line, running straight lines and blocking off any potential quick passing movement among the backs.

English forwards need to learn quickly the difference between offering yourself a as potential crash ball player / decoy runner to straighten the line and simply getting in the way. This isn't a problem Johnson should be coaching, these players should learn those basics from their clubs!

Assuming we can get those big lumbering forwards to time their runs right and not block the field, we need a set of backs to cause damage.

Care is by far your best 9, he has pace and vision and is probably the best in the Uk at the moment.

Wilko has to be 10, he turns domination into points, and takes good option, he keeps the score board ticking over.

Foden would be my 11, simply because England haven't got a good one, and they need someone there.

Ashton has to be 14, because of his finishing skills, he was the difference in the 6 Nations last year and can score tries. Wingers with an eye for the try line are rare.

Armitage picks himself at 15 for me, he is deadly in attack and is the closest thing to Jason Robinson you have.

The centers are a tricky area to select, personally I'd go for Banahan at outside center he is a monster, he isnt a winger, but off first phase ball he could be amazing, smashing into the opposition line, taking 2-3 players to haul him down, tying them into a ruck and creating gaps for the rest of the English backs to run against opposition forwards.

If your going to have the power of Banahan then why not Toby Flood inside him, his wonderful array of attacking skills could come to the fore, with Johnny's passing game, as well.

dummyhalf

I ddin't say it gives us more kicking options in the back three, I said in the backs. Having a kicking option in midfield means we wouldn't necessarily need one in the back three.

LDCPete wrote:dummyhalf

I ddin't say it gives us more kicking options in the back three, I said in the backs. Having a kicking option in midfield means we wouldn't necessarily need one in the back three.

LDC
I know that was what you said, but I think your reasoning is a bit off - the back three needs a kicker so that they can just ping the ball back if a counter isn't on. As such, there's no point the kicker being the outside centre who is further up the field.

As an aside, Tindall used to be used as a kicker (back around 2005 - even remember him taking a few goal kicks at times, perhaps due to injury), but seems to not do this at all any more. Is it a result of too many injuries over the years meaning he can't kick so well any more, or just that he's not practiced enough?

Gents,
We have known the centres have been a problem for a long time. The unfortunate point is that it is still a problem. Tuilagi, for all his potential, is still a kid. He cannot be moved out of 13, basically because he is a kid and needs more experience at 12 before being put there on the biggest stage. One fix is quicker ball from the scrum half to the fly half, then again to the centres. And, as we have seen, it ain't the same Flood as a year ago. This is another big problem. So Jonny will slip in and keep the game moving. But who to play at 12? To me, thats the key to get the backs moving.

I fell bad for Cueto. He has played well, but England need a different wing. Great injury cover and late game replacement, especially if England are ahead. I wouldn't put Foden there, because he hasn't played on the wing, it weakens the full back spot, and he links so well with Ashton. Is this the time for Sharples?

I don't think that have banana as your centre makes a lot of sense. The problem appears to be creativity. Having a monster who bashes it up isn't solving that problem. What about his ability to free up the wingers? or his ability to marshall the defensive system?
I think this pre-occupation (esp Welsh and English) with finding big guy to bash it up is the wrong way to go about it. Look for the players with pace, balance, vision etc. People keep going on about Lomu but if you look at his game he became less effective when he was used to bash the ball up. He scored tries when he was set free and only needed to bash up wingers and fullbacks.
Do you really think most top international centres are not going to be able to tackle Banahan one on one?

Moving Foden to 11 be a huge waste. Armitage has played more on the wing than him anyway, so if you're playing both of them it would be Armitage to move. Johnson also said after the first Wales game "we'd been looking to give delon a game somewhere in the back three", so they clearly see him on the wing as an option as well.

I think at this point you have to give Wilkinson and Tuilagi another go.

And Robshaw, but it isn't happening.