Horrible end to a great night! Shocking ref!

i ve have watched a good dozen times now and it gets worse every time , ortiz took a ko shot flush without even looking at floyd , his mind is ealsewhere and eyes are on cortez hopeing for some guidence on what to do next ! but cortez is looking to the side of the ring ! just shocking ! yes its protect yourself at all times but cortez job is to protect the fighters as wel , if he did say box or fight on his eys and mind should have been on the action , its clear to see ortiz had not have a clue on what was going on , on the other hand floyd did , and without a thought ,left right fight over , floyd took the opportunity for a cheap shot and it paid off , not blameing him he would have won anyway and its good to see the best boxer on the planet back but just feel for ortiz , he lost due to a situation out of his hands ! it has to be the worst piece of refereeing i have ever seen and it ruined a fantastic contest !

Blaming Cortez for Ortiz's naivety is harsh.

Cortez signalled them in and told them to box. Cortez forgot about the timekeeper that's why he was looking away.

This has nothing to do with Ortiz Cortez isn't trying to punch him. Yes Cortez made a mistake he shouldn't be refereeing big fights any more he makes to many mistakes now. But Ortiz has no one to blame but himself.

Cheap shot? What do you call the head butt that Ortiz caught Floyd with then? Double standards their mate!

I have no sympathy for Ortiz, he lost any rights he had to expect good sportsmanship or such like the minute he laid the nut on Floyd, end of the day whilst it may have stretched the limits of sportsmanship to its absolute limits what Floyd did was within the rules, what Ortiz did was most certainly not.

Agree generally though that Cortez was awful, if he was not ready for the fight to re-start he should have made that clear, once he gives the fighters the OK to re-commence he should have his eye on the job in hand, how the man keeps getting the big gigs when every time I see him he looks out of his depth is beyond me.

its not the worst case of refereeing but as if called to fight on, he should have had his eyed fixed firmly on the fighters.

although, even if cortez was looking at ortiz, the result would have stayed the same. mayweather would have punched ortiz.

Blaming Cortez for Ortiz's naivety is harsh.

Cortez signalled them in and told them to box. Cortez forgot about the timekeeper that's why he was looking away.

This has nothing to do with Ortiz Cortez isn't trying to punch him. Yes Cortez made a mistake he shouldn't be refereeing big fights any more he makes to many mistakes now. But Ortiz has no one to blame but himself.

Cheap shot? What do you call the head butt that Ortiz caught Floyd with then? Double standards their mate!.
prettyboykev


fair one kev the head butt was inexcuesable but floyd knew ortiz was nt ready and made him pay kind of a cheap shot but i suppose that is boxing you gotta look after yourself , anyway like i say im not blameing floyd its just such a shame it ended that way ,

The way I look at it Ry is Floyd is not a dirty fighter, he has countless critics and being a dirty fighter is not one of the many accusations that have been thrown his way, however Ortiz decided what kind of fight it was going to be the minute he went in with the head, for me had he not done that the confusion, opportunity or indeed inclination for Floyd to do that would never have arisen so he really only has himself to blame for taking it there.

rycoys wrote:Blaming Cortez for Ortiz's naivety is harsh.

Cortez signalled them in and told them to box. Cortez forgot about the timekeeper that's why he was looking away.

This has nothing to do with Ortiz Cortez isn't trying to punch him. Yes Cortez made a mistake he shouldn't be refereeing big fights any more he makes to many mistakes now. But Ortiz has no one to blame but himself.

Cheap shot? What do you call the head butt that Ortiz caught Floyd with then? Double standards their mate!.
prettyboykev


fair one kev the head butt was inexcuesable but floyd knew ortiz was nt ready and made him pay kind of a cheap shot but i suppose that is boxing you gotta look after yourself , anyway like i say im not blameing floyd its just such a shame it ended that way ,

It was a shame it ended that way but I blame Ortiz he p!ssed Floyd off with the head butt then expected a cuddle after they touched gloves.

Great night of boxing that started with the Fury fight I really enjoyed it.

prettyboykev wrote:

rycoys wrote:Blaming Cortez for Ortiz's naivety is harsh.

Cortez signalled them in and told them to box. Cortez forgot about the timekeeper that's why he was looking away.

This has nothing to do with Ortiz Cortez isn't trying to punch him. Yes Cortez made a mistake he shouldn't be refereeing big fights any more he makes to many mistakes now. But Ortiz has no one to blame but himself.

Cheap shot? What do you call the head butt that Ortiz caught Floyd with then? Double standards their mate!.
prettyboykev


fair one kev the head butt was inexcuesable but floyd knew ortiz was nt ready and made him pay kind of a cheap shot but i suppose that is boxing you gotta look after yourself , anyway like i say im not blameing floyd its just such a shame it ended that way ,

It was a shame it ended that way but I blame Ortiz he p!ssed Floyd off with the head butt then expected a cuddle after they touched gloves.

Great night of boxing that started with the Fury fight I really enjoyed it.

I'll second that, Kev, thoroughly enjoyed watching all of the boxing last night. If only such packed nights occurred more often, hey?

rowley wrote:The way I look at it Ry is Floyd is not a dirty fighter, he has countless critics and being a dirty fighter is not one of the many accusations that have been thrown his way, however Ortiz decided what kind of fight it was going to be the minute he went in with the head, for me had he not done that the confusion, opportunity or indeed inclination for Floyd to do that would never have arisen so he really only has himself to blame for taking it there.

Missed the Gatti and Mosley fights?

Floyd has had accusations of dirty fighting in the past.

Fists of Fury wrote:

prettyboykev wrote:

rycoys wrote:Blaming Cortez for Ortiz's naivety is harsh.

Cortez signalled them in and told them to box. Cortez forgot about the timekeeper that's why he was looking away.

This has nothing to do with Ortiz Cortez isn't trying to punch him. Yes Cortez made a mistake he shouldn't be refereeing big fights any more he makes to many mistakes now. But Ortiz has no one to blame but himself.

Cheap shot? What do you call the head butt that Ortiz caught Floyd with then? Double standards their mate!.
prettyboykev


fair one kev the head butt was inexcuesable but floyd knew ortiz was nt ready and made him pay kind of a cheap shot but i suppose that is boxing you gotta look after yourself , anyway like i say im not blameing floyd its just such a shame it ended that way ,

It was a shame it ended that way but I blame Ortiz he p!ssed Floyd off with the head butt then expected a cuddle after they touched gloves.

Great night of boxing that started with the Fury fight I really enjoyed it.

I'll second that, Kev, thoroughly enjoyed watching all of the boxing last night. If only such packed nights occurred more often, hey?

Was there any word from the Money man on who he could be fighting next? All I seen afterwards was him arguing with Larry Merchant

I agree, the ref did say to fight so it was Ortiz's naivety; he was still apologising after the ref said to fight. Having said that Mayweather pretty much lulled him in and then took a shot at him unaware. Mayweather didn't prove he was the better fighter just that he was more alert - he'll still talk as though he's the best which will be annoying. Shame we didn't get to see a full fight.

I'm a bit lost on what Cortez did wrong?

He deducted a point very rightfully from Ortiz and then called them in to box. These guys aren't there to hug, they're there to win. FMJ clocked him at a point he could, yeah there's sportsmanship but elite sportsmen will take anything they can, it's the nature of the competitive beast

And Rowley, glad you're back. Did the pigeons reach you ok with the message that all was alright i assume?

coxy0001 wrote:I'm a bit lost

Im sure your boxing knowledge will improve in time

Steffan wrote:

coxy0001 wrote:I'm a bit lost

Im sure your boxing knowledge will improve in time

Please inform me of what Cortez did wrong? You can't..... can you? Which makes the above look, well, special needs esque (apologies for anyone with special needs that i've just compared to Steffie)

How did Wales do against the Saffers btw Steffie?!

coxy0001 wrote:

Steffan wrote:

coxy0001 wrote:I'm a bit lost

Im sure your boxing knowledge will improve in time

Please inform me of what Cortez did wrong? You can't..... can you? Which makes the above look, well, special needs esque (apologies for anyone with special needs that i've just compared to Steffie)

How did Wales do against the Saffers btw Steffie?!

Normally the referee would break them up after the niceties so there isn't confusion like this. He didn't because he wasn't watching, hence his shocked expression.

Coxy..you say Cortez did nothing wrong? Are you quite right in the head?

The fact that he wasn't even looking, and didn't even see the KO punches, let alone the minor fact that he called them to box on before restarting the time, goes to show that he was badly wrong last night, whether or not the fact that Mayweather hit Ortiz at that time was above board or otherwise.

Scottrf wrote:

coxy0001 wrote:

Steffan wrote:

coxy0001 wrote:I'm a bit lost

Im sure your boxing knowledge will improve in time

Please inform me of what Cortez did wrong? You can't..... can you? Which makes the above look, well, special needs esque (apologies for anyone with special needs that i've just compared to Steffie)

How did Wales do against the Saffers btw Steffie?!

Normally the referee would break them up after the niceties so there isn't confusion like this. He didn't because he wasn't watching, hence his shocked expression.

Did you see his face? Joe Cortez has to stay, wouldn't be as fun without him. He could get someone killed though.

Fists of Fury wrote:Coxy..you say Cortez did nothing wrong? Are you quite right in the head?

The fact that he wasn't even looking, and didn't even see the KO punches, let alone the minor fact that he called them to box on before restarting the time, goes to show that he was badly wrong last night, whether or not the fact that Mayweather hit Ortiz at that time was above board or otherwise.

It's OK, as Steffan says, his boxing knowledge will improve in time.

coxy0001 wrote:

Steffan wrote:

coxy0001 wrote:I'm a bit lost

Im sure your boxing knowledge will improve in time

Please inform me of what Cortez did wrong? You can't..... can you? Which makes the above look, well, special needs esque (apologies for anyone with special needs that i've just compared to Steffie)

How did Wales do against the Saffers btw Steffie?!

I dont blame Cortez. It was a joke Coxy. I thought you would of taken it a bit better to be honest

Why do you insist of calling me Steffie?

I dont follow rugby. The Saffers can stuff us for all I care

Im still crying over Earnies miss at Wembley against the mighty world beaters 2012 Euro winners England. I would of taken a draw considering we are ranked 117 in the world and England are meant to be the best team in the world (if you read the Sun or watch BBC)

Time had already restarted, he'd called the boxers in......... "lets go" from memory....? The time keeper started the clock again on that signal..... Unless the clock stopped at 2.59 and stayed there?

What was FMJ supposed to do? Stand there?

Refs miss things, did Cortez miss FMJ nailing Ortiz with a chair? Double checking the time keeper had restarted didn't exactly cost Ortiz the fight, am pretty sure he had line of sight (was his back turned) to what was happening.

I call you Steffie because i prefer to do so. If i type "steffan" i have thoughts of some German sunlounging theiving Bar Steward running through my head.

Night all, tired

coxy0001 wrote:Time had already restarted, he'd called the boxers in......... "lets go" from memory....? The time keeper started the clock again on that signal..... Unless the clock stopped at 2.59 and stayed there?

What was FMJ supposed to do? Stand there?

Refs miss things, did Cortez miss FMJ nailing Ortiz with a chair? Double checking the time keeper had restarted didn't exactly cost Ortiz the fight, am pretty sure he had line of sight (was his back turned) to what was happening.

He clearly didn't know the timing of the round/whether the timekeeper had restarted the clock, and didn't know they had continued fighting. He should have broken up the fighters after pleasantries if only he was paying attention. Floyd could have headbutted Ortiz for all he knew, he didn't have his eyes on the action. If none of that sounds bad to you, I don't know what to say. But I'd imagine your view would be different Pacquiao replaced Mayweather in the same situation...

coxy0001 wrote:I call you Steffie because i prefer to do so. If i type "steffan" i have thoughts of some German sunlounging theiving Bar Steward running through my head.

Night all, tired

Not that you believe in stereotyping...

Night

Coxy is trying to be contoversial. Comes after a vast career in the ring......

Didn't catch the fight. Only just made it through the fury match. Quite clear to everyone apart from Coxy that ref was not uo to it, victor was stupid and soft, and fmj is still a massive man sausage

The fight didnt exactly do boxing any favours did it

Mayweathers pathetic rant at Merchant sums him up. Hes happy to make all this money yet doesnt like any criticism at all. I dont hate Floyd but he just isnt the guy who I want to be the most famous fighter in the world

Boxing is in a state. How many good honest big fights have we had in the last 5 years?

Michaels, Sean wrote:Boxing is in a state. How many good honest big fights have we had in the last 5 years?

46.

Scottrf wrote:

Michaels, Sean wrote:Boxing is in a state. How many good honest big fights have we had in the last 5 years?

46.

Zero. Give me a marquee fight and I'll tell you what was wrong with it

Michaels, Sean wrote:

Scottrf wrote:

Michaels, Sean wrote:Boxing is in a state. How many good honest big fights have we had in the last 5 years?

46.

Zero. Give me a marquee fight and I'll tell you what was wrong with it

Na. If you don't like boxing don't watch it.

I have to say I thought Cortez was poor in this. He was indecisive and ambiguos. When fighters are broken up and then told to re-engage it should be clearly indicated. Cortez did not do this and everyone from ringside commentators to fans to the fighters themselves did not seem sure. If he had intended them to re-engage then he should not have his eyes off the actions. The fact he missed the knockout punches highlights this. That is incompetent for a top level referee. If the referee has his back to the fighters then its reasonable grounds for a fighter to feel that action is not intended to begin again, which is what I think Ortiz believed. The whole incident was handled poorly by Cortez. I think you can apportion blame to all 3 persons in the ring on some level but Cortez is the one supposed to be in control and I think most of the blame lies at his door. Ortiz can expect little sympathy after his deliberate headbutt but cant help feel it was an opportunistic cheap shot by Mayweather, which even if it was not strictly illegal was certainly not in the spirit of sportsmanship or gentlemany conduct of the game.

Gentlemanly conduct of boxing? Yet Zivic is applauded for using what he could to his advantage?

Scottrf wrote:Gentlemanly conduct of boxing? Yet Zivic is applauded for using what he could to his advantage?

Who applauded Zivic? He is known for what he was which was a dirty and roughousing fighter who bent the rules of the game. I dont think anyone has suggested otherwise throughout history.

Colonial Lion wrote:

Scottrf wrote:Gentlemanly conduct of boxing? Yet Zivic is applauded for using what he could to his advantage?

Who applauded Zivic? He is known for what he was which was a dirty and roughousing fighter who bent the rules of the game. I dont think anyone has suggested otherwise throughout history.

And appreciated for doing so, as if it's an achievement. I've seen people criticise modern boxers for not knowing how to bend the rules before 'the art of dirty fighting has been lost' etc.

Cortez said "lets get it on", which is not a recognised referee call. Ortiz probably didn't understand what he meant, and was still looking at Cortez for a coherant call when Mayweather hit him twice.

It's the last we'll see of Cortez in a top fight.

Jukebox Timebomb wrote:Cortez said "lets get it on", which is not a recognised referee call. Ortiz probably didn't understand what he meant, and was still looking at Cortez for a coherant call when Mayweather hit him twice.

It's the last we'll see of Cortez in a top fight.

Heard that before.

Scottrf wrote:

Colonial Lion wrote:

Scottrf wrote:Gentlemanly conduct of boxing? Yet Zivic is applauded for using what he could to his advantage?

Who applauded Zivic? He is known for what he was which was a dirty and roughousing fighter who bent the rules of the game. I dont think anyone has suggested otherwise throughout history.

And appreciated for doing so, as if it's an achievement. I've seen people criticise modern boxers for not knowing how to bend the rules before 'the art of dirty fighting has been lost' etc.

I dont believe he is appreciated in the sense peole praise him for his tactics. I think its simply recognised how he fought. Fighters would often be matched with him in order to learn how to deal with those kind of tactics in the future so one could argue his merits as a learning curve fighter was recognised back then but I havent seen too many people praise his style or conduct if I am being honest.

If you want a reputation as a clean fighter then I dont think you do what Mayweather did. It looks like a cheap shot. It can, of course, be defended on the grounds that it was not illegal but I still believe its outside the spirit of the game and is frowned upon as unsportsmanlike.

Besides, the "dark arts" described by some are more in reference to actual subtleties of fighting. I dont its intended to apply to the situation facing Mayweather. Young fighters are told to protect themselves at all times so obviously Ortiz has to carry blame for not adhering to this but it was a peice of opportunism from Mayweather which I dont think is sporting. It may be justified but I dont think he can expect to preserve a clean image if he follows this course of action.

Colonial Lion wrote:I dont believe he is appreciated in the sense peole praise him for his tactics. I think its simply recognised how he fought. Fighters would often be matched with him in order to learn how to deal with those kind of tactics in the future so one could argue his merits as a learning curve fighter was recognised back then but I havent seen too many people praise his style or conduct if I am being honest.

If you want a reputation as a clean fighter then I dont think you do what Mayweather did. It looks like a cheap shot. It can, of course, be defended on the grounds that it was not illegal but I still believe its outside the spirit of the game and is frowned upon as unsportsmanlike.

Besides, the "dark arts" described by some are more in reference to actual subtleties of fighting. I dont its intended to apply to the situation facing Mayweather. Young fighters are told to protect themselves at all times so obviously Ortiz has to carry blame for not adhering to this but it was a peice of opportunism from Mayweather which I dont think is sporting. It may be justified but I dont think he can expect to preserve a clean image if he follows this course of action.

You think he cares about being a clean fighter? He did the same to Mosley, caught Gatti unaware after a ref call, has been criticised for use of forearms and elbows.

Why are you talking about clean image with regard to Mayweather? He's one of the last I'd use that tag near.

Well I didnt say he was a clean fighter and I didnt suggest he cares. My original point merely stated that what Mayweather did was not in the spirit of the game.

You brought up Zivics conduct suggesting he was applauded for it, which I dont think he was particularly and didnt really indicate what relevance it had to Mayweather knockout unless you are insinuating that old time fighters are praised to the rafters for that kind of thing whereas modern fighters are not. Again, I would have to disagree with you on that.

OK, I was just saying, boxing is hardly known for gentlemanly conduct. Ortiz gave up his right to be treated in a gentlemanly way anyway.

It was a cheep shot, simple as.

no sportsmanship at all.

he could see full well that Ortiz was not defending him self or fighting and he smacked him twice. for me that's a cheep shot regardless ...

And he wont fight Pacman because he knows he is one of the only boxers out there who is a threat to him... why not box him?, huge money, huge credibility... and if he supposedly thinks he has his number then what's the problem?

DUCKING.

Scottrf wrote:OK, I was just saying, boxing is hardly known for gentlemanly conduct. Ortiz gave up his right to be treated in a gentlemanly way anyway.

Yes as I said above I imagine sympathy for Ortiz is limited given how the situation arose and I would apportion most of the bame to Cortez for how the situation developed. But still think what Mayweather did is not something I would like to see happen regularly in the sport and should be discouraged. Thats what I meant about gentlemany conduct which may be something of an old fashioned phrase now. Unsporting if you prefer.

Don't know if you watch F1 but it's similar to Schumacher's overtake of Hamilton in Monaco last year. Hamilton didn't expect to be racing, but he should have been and paid the price.

Not sure what you so called boxing fans were watching, but many seem to have justified mayweathers 'keep your guard up at all times'. Are we kidding here or are some bitter at the 15 quid rip-off. What Floyd did was a disgrace and Ortiz was as equally guilty with the butt. It's tragic that some people on these boards justify what Mayweather did and it's typical of how boxing is in the state that it's currently in.

I agree Westy, there is no way that it can be justified.

Ortiz was pathetic in using his head, right when he was about to win a round, too, and likewise Mayweather can not be excused for what he did. A third party to blame would be the referee Cortez, who was very inept.

Of the three men in the ring I'd aportion blame to Mayweather last. Cortez wasn't in control of what was going on, and Ortiz should have been protecting himself and not trying to kiss his opponent.

At the end of the day Ortiz cannot feel done by, he turned it into a street fight and he can't have any complaints about FMJ following suit.

Cortez has since confirmed he gave orders to box, FMJ heard it - otherwise why did he start boxing? Surely Cortez would've deducted him points if he wasn't at a point of letting them box?

Ortiz nutted Mayweather then didn't protect himself at all times.....

Steffan wrote:The fight didnt exactly do boxing any favours did it

Mayweathers pathetic rant at Merchant sums him up. Hes happy to make all this money yet doesnt like any criticism at all. I dont hate Floyd but he just isnt the guy who I want to be the most famous fighter in the world

Favourite bit of the fight to be honest, PBF pointing out what plenty of people have been saying for years but then getting owned. Hilarious.

Scottrf wrote:

Michaels, Sean wrote:

Scottrf wrote:

Michaels, Sean wrote:Boxing is in a state. How many good honest big fights have we had in the last 5 years?

46.

Zero. Give me a marquee fight and I'll tell you what was wrong with it

Na. If you don't like boxing don't watch it.

I didn't watch it. Will probably only watch fights if a mate orders until things improve.

Fists of Fury wrote:I agree Westy, there is no way that it can be justified.

Ortiz was pathetic in using his head, right when he was about to win a round, too, and likewise Mayweather can not be excused for what he did. A third party to blame would be the referee Cortez, who was very inept.

Your bias towards Pacquiao and hatred of Floyd Mayweather has no bounds fists and no way was Ortiz winning the fourth round when he was getting dominated...Floyd Mayweather did nothing wrong.

http://www.fighthype.com/pages/content10800.html

I want you to listen to this very carefully and open your eyes man cant you see Bob Arum and team Pacquiao are bs you all.

The genius of PBF wrote:

Fists of Fury wrote:I agree Westy, there is no way that it can be justified.

Ortiz was pathetic in using his head, right when he was about to win a round, too, and likewise Mayweather can not be excused for what he did. A third party to blame would be the referee Cortez, who was very inept.

Your bias towards Pacquiao and hatred of Floyd Mayweather has no bounds fists and no way was Ortiz winning the fourth round when he was getting dominated...Floyd Mayweather did nothing wrong.

http://www.fighthype.com/pages/content10800.html

I want you to listen to this very carefully and open your eyes man cant you see Bob Arum and team Pacquiao are bs you all.

Please do not accuse me of being biased toward anyone, when your name is 'the genius of PBF'. I actually like Mayweather a hell of a lot more than he may deserve - not only is he an incredible fighter who never fails to astound me, but I actually enjoy his 'bad guy' persona, such as at the weigh in when he got in Ortiz' face, I feel that that is what boxing is all about - hype, excitement and mind games to match the in-ring exploits.

I believe that Ortiz was winning the 4th, he had trapped Floyd on the ropes on more than one occasion, and landed some of his best shots. Floyd had maybe shaded the 1st, had dominated the 2nd and 3rd, but this certainly didn't continue into the 4th.

Likewise, I'm a huge Pacquaio fan in terms of his ring performances, but not so much of the 'I'll do what my promoter says' jargon that gets said all too often for my liking.

I just want Mayweather to cut the nonsense about testing out, abide by the commissions rules and get the hell on with the Pacquaio fight.