Alonso & Mascherano - Liverpools undoing?

These two are genuinely world class, and although Mascherano has been playing in defence recently, he has been excellent (done really well in the Champions league final) and I think he would still perform well in midfield.

As for Alonso, he's still class and shining in a team full of great players.

Now at a time, where I believe midfield is key, and with teams having good strikers and good defenders, how good a teams midfield plays can determine whether a game is won or lost... (hence the best team in the world - Barcelona, having the best midfield), watching Liverpools match v Tottenham the other day I couldn't help but feel Liverpool are weak in this area.

Henderson, Adam and Lucas are all decent, but none in my opinion, are filling the void left by the 2 world class midfielders Liverpool lost. They were dominated by Tottenhams slightly better midfield.

What do Liverpool fans think?

I think it's obvious that we'd miss players of that class, any team would. They allowed Gerrard to get forward, Alonso was a brilliant playmaker and Mascherano broke up play.

I think Lucas has been trying to do both those jobs, which is hard for him obviously, but he's doing a pretty decent job of it. Hopefully Charlie Adam will be able to fill the void left by Alonso, he's never going to be as good as him, but I think we could create a better team rather than better individuals, which needs to be the aim.

The loss of Alonso was the worst decision weve made for years ( before anyone says it YES worse then spending 35 million on Andy Carroll ) Benitez had made up his mind that we were going to get Gareth Barry and we didn't need Alonso anymore , we all know that didn't happen and Xabi's relationship with Rafa soured and he left .
They say never go back but i would love to see Xabi come back to Liverpool .

Mascherano is quality but i really did think he would get sent off every game so i wasn't as bothered about him leaving . just my opinion .

I think people have to give the new lads time to settle in it s only been 7 or so games .While he will play now Henderson was bought for the future , Adam is still believe will be a good buy .

Getting Stevie G back in midfield should settle the side down .

Getting Stevie G back in midfield should settle the side down .

The last year or so i'd say Liverpool were better without him starting, him and Lampard should be bench players by now (AVB has seen to that).

think that in general liverpool have been letting players go that are better than the ones bringing in crouch, bellamy, alonso, mascherano were all replaced by players worse than them. mereiles is better than henderson and overall a better player than adam yet you let him leave. you could even argue players like warnock could have done a better job than insua's and countless other poor left backs you have had.

but do agree that alonso and mascherano were the two biggest losses, always knew you had a tough game against liverpool because how hard it was to play through the middle when you had these two plus gerrard

Xabi Alonso is one of the top midfilders in the game, he was top class since he arrived at Anfield, I remember Arsenal where linked to him the summer before he left and Wenger felt the £20m asking price was to high, utter madness considering he had no problem shelling out £13m for Walcott

The problem is when you lose players like Mascherano and especially Alonson they are almost impossible to replace. Both are amongst the elite in the world in there positions.

I think Kenny has bought well even if he has over spent on the likes of Carroll and possibly Henderson.

You have to question the logic in getting rid of Alonso though, he left because he wasn't deemed important enough by Benitez, that was utter madness, I'm less convinced by Mascherano, I don't feel he would be as hard to replace as Alonso

To be fair, Alonso was awesome the year he left, but the year before that he had been fairly inconsistent and hadn't looked the world class player he did, and had any team offered the money he eventually went for then, it'd have been madness.

That's a great point about Meireles! I'm a Chelsea fan and I've been impressed by him, but a lil surprised that Liverpool let him go easily.

Seems as though they aren't reluctant to let go of players that show any signs of wanting out, unless they're club royalty (Carragher and Gerrard). Whereas most top teams fight to keep their top players it seems that as of late Arsenal and Liverpool easily let them go, and don't hand out improved contracts when necessary.

As of Alonso, I truly feel he is special, one of a kind. Defensive midfielders these days (TRY) sit back and run a game, he's number 1 at the moment, before it was Pirlo, and whilst he edges it in terms of passing and free-kicks... Alonso is certainly the more combative midfielder.

Here's hoping Mikel could grow into that kind of player, and I'm already seeing Barca trying to do it with Busquets. Having a defensive-midfielder can be viewed as negative, so the only thing the player themself can try to do is be able to distribute the ball very well once they've disrupted play and generally add more to their game.

Whilst Makelele was a pioneer and is a legend in this role, most defensive-midfielders today don't want to be pigeon-holed and want to be known for more!

jay-z wrote:That's a great point about Meireles! I'm a Chelsea fan and I've been impressed by him, but a lil surprised that Liverpool let him go easily.

Seems as though they aren't reluctant to let go of players that show any signs of wanting out, unless they're club royalty (Carragher and Gerrard). Whereas most top teams fight to keep their top players it seems that as of late Arsenal and Liverpool easily let them go, and don't hand out improved contracts when necessary.

As of Alonso, I truly feel he is special, one of a kind. Defensive midfielders these days (TRY) sit back and run a game, he's number 1 at the moment, before it was Pirlo, and whilst he edges it in terms of passing and free-kicks... Alonso is certainly the more combative midfielder.

Here's hoping Mikel could grow into that kind of player, and I'm already seeing Barca trying to do it with Busquets. Having a defensive-midfielder can be viewed as negative, so the only thing the player themself can try to do is be able to distribute the ball very well once they've disrupted play and generally add more to their game.

Whilst Makelele was a pioneer and is a legend in this role, most defensive-midfielders today don't want to be pigeon-holed and want to be known for more!

Merieles did blow hot and cold last season and does tend not to get stuck in when the going gets tough. He did pull out of a challenge last season in which Gerrard ended up getting sent off.

Did have a good run of games last season when he bagged a few goals, but as he wanted to go and put a transfer request in, Liverpool aren't going to want to keep hold of him. We only want players who actually want to play fopr the club. Plus the fans wouldn't take to him anymore after the deadlin day fiasco

Alonso aswell had two medicore season before he Benitez wanted to get rid of him for Barry, that probably gave him that impromtpu kick up the a$$ which made him have a great last season. Considering he was going to go to Juve for £15mill the season before and they pulled out cos the couldnt believe how slow he was. It sort of worked out well cos we got double the money for him in the end.

Liverpool's undoing??

Not sure what they are being undone from, but yeah, selling Alonso, who was your best player by far the season before, is a strange one.

he allowed Gerrard to basically play up front, he was calm on the ball, and a great distibutor of it too.

To sell him for £30m would have been great business, IF he had been replaced, but it has turned out the opposite when the club have spent twice this amount in trying to replace him, and still havent been able to!

Not so sure on mascherano, his job was alot simpler and alot more destructive, basically lucas can do it, so not a massive loss!

Another part of teh undoing, is the insitance in playing Jamie Carragher, despite him clearly being well past it - but I think alot of that is down to the other options being constantly injured!

Anyway, no fear, King Kenny will turn things round, Andy Carrol will get 20+ goals this season, Charlie Adam will lose some weight, and Jordan Henderson will be the next big thing!!

I liked Meireles and would of liked to of seen him stay but once he put in his transfer request then he was always going to be sold . Meireles situation imo can be laid back to Hicks Gillette and Hodgson he was signed to a contract supposedley on £50,000 for the 1st season which was to be reviewed and possibly doubled if he settled and had a good season . Fenway and Dalglish obviously thought he wasn't worth the new contract previously discussed .

KingKenny7Heaven wrote:I liked Meireles and would of liked to of seen him stay but once he put in his transfer request then he was always going to be sold . Meireles situation imo can be laid back to Hicks Gillette and Hodgson he was signed to a contract supposedley on £50,000 for the 1st season which was to be reviewed and possibly doubled if he settled and had a good season . Fenway and Dalglish obviously thought he wasn't worth the new contract previously discussed .

Dear god, surely you can't blame Roy for that too?? What about the bankers or the greeks?

JDandfries wrote:Liverpool's undoing??

Not sure what they are being undone from, but yeah, selling Alonso, who was your best player by far the season before, is a strange one.

he allowed Gerrard to basically play up front, he was calm on the ball, and a great distibutor of it too.

To sell him for £30m would have been great business, IF he had been replaced, but it has turned out the opposite when the club have spent twice this amount in trying to replace him, and still havent been able to!

Not so sure on mascherano, his job was alot simpler and alot more destructive, basically lucas can do it, so not a massive loss!

Another part of teh undoing, is the insitance in playing Jamie Carragher, despite him clearly being well past it - but I think alot of that is down to the other options being constantly injured!

Anyway, no fear, King Kenny will turn things round, Andy Carrol will get 20+ goals this season, Charlie Adam will lose some weight, and Jordan Henderson will be the next big thing!!

Long live the King

Spoiler:

In Kenny We Trust

Spoiler:

Soldier_Of_Fortune wrote:

JDandfries wrote:Liverpool's undoing??

Not sure what they are being undone from, but yeah, selling Alonso, who was your best player by far the season before, is a strange one.

he allowed Gerrard to basically play up front, he was calm on the ball, and a great distibutor of it too.

To sell him for £30m would have been great business, IF he had been replaced, but it has turned out the opposite when the club have spent twice this amount in trying to replace him, and still havent been able to!

Not so sure on mascherano, his job was alot simpler and alot more destructive, basically lucas can do it, so not a massive loss!

Another part of teh undoing, is the insitance in playing Jamie Carragher, despite him clearly being well past it - but I think alot of that is down to the other options being constantly injured!

Anyway, no fear, King Kenny will turn things round, Andy Carrol will get 20+ goals this season, Charlie Adam will lose some weight, and Jordan Henderson will be the next big thing!!

Long live the King

Spoiler:

In Kenny We Trust

Spoiler:

JD 'trying to insert a picture of a Lemming'

JDandfries wrote:

KingKenny7Heaven wrote:I liked Meireles and would of liked to of seen him stay but once he put in his transfer request then he was always going to be sold . Meireles situation imo can be laid back to Hicks Gillette and Hodgson he was signed to a contract supposedley on £50,000 for the 1st season which was to be reviewed and possibly doubled if he settled and had a good season . Fenway and Dalglish obviously thought he wasn't worth the new contract previously discussed .

Dear god, surely you can't blame Roy for that too?? What about the bankers or the greeks?

He was a Hodgson signing (imo his best by far ) if your led to believe that Roy was involved in his contract negotiations then yes i would lay some of the blame with him but i do agree the vast majority has to lay with whoever agreed to double Meireles salary after 1 season .

not sure they were greeks though ?

liverpool tried replacing alonso with aquilani but it didnt work out.

JDandfries wrote:

Soldier_Of_Fortune wrote:

JDandfries wrote:Liverpool's undoing??

Not sure what they are being undone from, but yeah, selling Alonso, who was your best player by far the season before, is a strange one.

he allowed Gerrard to basically play up front, he was calm on the ball, and a great distibutor of it too.

To sell him for £30m would have been great business, IF he had been replaced, but it has turned out the opposite when the club have spent twice this amount in trying to replace him, and still havent been able to!

Not so sure on mascherano, his job was alot simpler and alot more destructive, basically lucas can do it, so not a massive loss!

Another part of teh undoing, is the insitance in playing Jamie Carragher, despite him clearly being well past it - but I think alot of that is down to the other options being constantly injured!

Anyway, no fear, King Kenny will turn things round, Andy Carrol will get 20+ goals this season, Charlie Adam will lose some weight, and Jordan Henderson will be the next big thing!!

Long live the King

Spoiler:

In Kenny We Trust

Spoiler:

JD 'trying to insert a picture of a Lemming'

There you go

Spoiler: