Steve Hayes looking to find buyer for Wasps

http://www.wasps.co.uk/news/wasps32625.ink

Main reason given seems to be the inability to develop a bigger ground, "Sporting Village" in High Wycombe (This project had included a new 17,500 capacity stadium with community leisure facilities, retail space and a hotel and conference facilities.)

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" I fully believe that a new stadium for Wasps is essential in the coming years as we have always said that Adams Park was unsustainable as a long term option." he says.

Question is it the size of Adams Park that is the problem - pretty sure the average attendance has been some way beneath the capacity - or is Premiership Rugby in high Wycombe just a non-starter.

Surely London itself could support a Premiership team? Currently we have 4 "London" teams - but none currently play in a London Postcode.

Londontiger do you not count Harlequins as being in London?

Saracens are looking to move to Barnet. We have made an application and should hear an answer within a month.

Admittedly London Irish have no plans and will continue to be in the wilderness.

Adams Park is a dump agreed.

Where should Wasps move though?

The problem Wasps have is that it is so difficult to find suitable areas for Wasps to rock up to. Also they lack the financial muscle.

Quins are currently the closest to a London team - but strictly TW1 is not a London postcode. However they have a good catchment area, a good ground and are thriving.

Sarries currently are in a hellhole. Dire ground, crappy public transport, horrid one way loop and bugger all parking. Moving to Barnet (IF council pass the plans) will give the club control of their future and move them back in to London.

LI are now Reading based forever it seems - name change in order?

Wasps appear to be in dire straits. No real catchment area and no finances to fund a move back in to NW (or West London). If they had the money the area around Wormwood Scrubs that Chelsea had on their longlist of relocation sites could have been a goer.

Wasps desperatley need to get back into London, Wycombe is a no go and the local councillors have shown they want nothing to do with the club. If the local council and community were behind them then they would have helped get the planning permission through rather than repeatedly try and block it. Dai Young is starting to get the club playing with more passion and fans can forgive some negative results if the players are putting everything into every performance.

Maybe it's time the went and had a word with West Ham about sharing the Olympic Stadium after 2012. Would get them back into the right area and with West Ham needing some money a bit of rent from Wasps would probabley appeal to Gold and the other owners.

I agree Vicarage Road is a dump. I am confident the Barnet Council will pass the plans. They have been supportive of them in my opinion.

Saracens will have a very good catchment area - being able to attract more London support,will still keep hold of the home counties support etc.

We might even attract Wasps support too.

Wasps should really have competed with Saracens for Barnet Copthall. Too late now of course.

The problem is also the cost. I believe the Barnet Copthall plans will cost £18 million. Our sugar daddies will absorb the cost of this.

Wasps will need to come up with a plan of attack or they will fade into mediocrity.

Sam that might be a short term solution but in the long term sharing with a football team is a no go area as Irish,Wasps and Saracens are showing.

Just to clear up one misconception, Wasps merely play at Wycombe; the other 6 days a week they are the ONLY team based in a London post code –the training ground at Twyford Avenue W3

Just thought I would point that out.

There is nothing wrong with the Wycombe/ Chilterns catchment area as there are plenty of rugby clubs and good support for the game of rugby in that neck of the woods. However, getting first time attendees to Adams Park is one thing;

The single biggest issue is access to and from the ground. There is just the one road to the ground, which results in horrific traffic queues for the limited parking available. The Park & Ride and Train and Ride buses drop people half a mile from the ground. Many people will not put up with that inconvenience and that why we need to move to somewhere more accessible.

It seems to me that even in the long term Wasps are going to have to ground share with a football club if they want to return to London. Admittedly if they find an owner with massive finances and the appropriate piece of land it might be feasible for them to own their own ground, but it all seems a long way off to me. So which clubs would be happy to ground share? Barnet (obviously too close to Copthall), QPR (Been done, but now they have big financial backers), Crystal Palace (actually I believe Palace are moving grounds, could be an option… But Sellhurst park seems a bit of a Poopie). Aside from that you are looking at grounds with capacities of 9/10K like Leyton Orient‘s ground, which is one of the problems with Adams Park. On the other hand I heard that Chelseas are looking to move out of Stamford Bridge…

I’m no expert on London, but aside from the west/south west are there any other rugby hotbeds in the capital? Somewhere that Wasps could exploit existing enthusiasm for rugby?

Hound of Harrow where do you move to? That is the millon pound question.

A ground Share should be a possibilty between 2 London Clubs.

London Irish are with the Madejski Stadium until at least 2026, so that rules them out. (Berkshire Irish)

Wasps and Sarries?
won't happen would it?

Share with a football team (current rules don't allow rugby clubs to groundshare with Prem team, but it's ok if they share in the championship and are then promoted)

Selhurst Park 26,309
The Den 20,146
The Valley 27,111 (best yet)

Is ground sharing the The Valley an option.

or if Chelsea move could Sarries and Wasps make Stamford bridge a viaable buiness case for Chelsea?

Kingshu Saracens already have plans in place as previously mentioned.

Barnet Copthall is what we have in mind. http://www.saracens.com/news/view.php?Id=6532

I wouldn't want to share with Wasps.

Aren't grounds of 20k+ too big for Wasps?

[quote="beshocked"]Kingshu Saracens already have plans in place as previously mentioned.

Barnet Copthall is what we have in mind. http://www.saracens.com/news/view.php?Id=6532

I wouldn't want to share with Wasps.

Aren't grounds of 20k+ too big for Wasps?[/quote]


From an atmosphere point of view, I'd have thought so. But you need at least 15,000 to host Heineken Cup matches, so they'd probably best have a smaller stadium with room to grow. It seems to me 17,500/ 18,000 would be a good size of stadium looking to the future.

beshocked –indeed it is the million pound question. There is now talk of an 18 acre site in Battersea being developed. There is also a lot of potential around the Park Lane/North Acton industrial estate, must of which is now vacant.

This would be my preferred option as there are tube and rail stations on all four corners of that estate, and it’s easy for me to get to.

We will have to wait and see what the new owners come up with.

Sam that might be a short term solution but in the long term sharing with a football team is a no go area as Irish,Wasps and Saracens are showing..

True but a team based in London may be able to bring in better numbers in terms of crowds and once Londoners are coming to the games and the events you have on then sponsorship will be easier to find. Companies will go mad for the fact that they can promote their brand within London. Suddenly more crowd and more sponsorship and the club is a more attractive investment opportunity. That is all hypothetical of course.

Sam true but it isn't as simple as Wasps would love it to be.

Cost,planning permission and numerous other obstacles will get undoubtedbly get in the way.

Money can be used to smooth the path but it can only do so much. Wasps don't have the financial muscle to embark on something so ambitious.

Hound of Harrow plumping for Park Lane or Battersea would make things very expensive. Park Lane is one of the most expensive properties in Monopoly for a reason!

Ha, ha, wrong Park Lane!!

Cost,planning permission and numerous other obstacles will get undoubtedbly get in the way.

I was thinking more of moving to a different football ground from which they could rebuild the London fan base at a more accesible venue and attract new sponsorship on the back of this. Then look for a new investor from a stronger position. Then again they could just float the company as a private limited company and look to sell the majority of shares to the fans.

Maybe seen as Wasps have already dropped London from their name they could move completly away!

Maybe start afresh somewhere that they could settle and grow (like the wasy some American football teams have, think it was the Cowboys)

or maybe they could just move round a seris of stadiums around the world?

With Sarries moving a game abroad what about a constantly touring side?

Wasps V Leicester in Sydney
Wasps V London Irish in Dublin
Wasps v Newcastle in Dubai
ect ect

Sam in theory it could work but ultimately a proper rugby stadium is needed to really flourish.


Kingshu

Didn't Wasps play a game in Dubai already?

I thought it was Wasps vs Quins in the low value cup.

I think the Sarries game is only a one off. I hope so anyway.

IT was a one off game in Dubai,

but Wasps could become nomads with no fixed home, and just tour around the world, and back to England every second week for their 'away game'

If Bath move, take over the Rec

LondonTiger wrote:If Bath move, take over the Rec

If Bath move, the snarfing nimbys will be too busy Feng Shuing the Rec and planting organic mung beans on it for anybody to get close.

A bit late getting back into this one but I think auto correct assumed Park Lane, when I swear I typed Park Royal.


kingshu - the 'London' bit was added to distinguish the professional team from the Amateur Wasps outfit, who won the rights to keep the name 'Wasps R.F.C.' No more than that.

The pro side still train at the same facility where the Amateurs play in Acton. The Wasps' honours board (Club Presidents, Captains etc.) remains in Acton; the club having bought the facility from a utility company when we left Sudbury.

We get mocked for playing at Wycombe I know, but the guys and gals you see on European away trips are mainly the London based die hards. We have now got plenty of Wycombe area fans who travel too.

Anyway, I hope we can get some progress on the ground issue soon.

For the sake of rugby, particular in London it would be good if Wasps do get a place in North Acton as you say Hound of Harrow.

If there is indeed potential in North Acton you should definitely show your interest in developing there before other potential rival developments beat you there.

It looks like the area North Acton is half way between where Saracens plan to be and where Harlequins are. That is good.

Sounds like the perfect area for Wasps.

I wonder what Dai Young is making of all this. Wonder if he is worried as a result of this news?

beshocked wrote:For the sake of rugby, particular in London it would be good if Wasps do get a place in North Acton as you say Hound of Harrow.

If there is indeed potential in North Acton you should definitely show your interest in developing there before other potential rival developments beat you there.

It looks like the area North Acton is half way between where Saracens plan to be and where Harlequins are. That is good.

Sounds like the perfect area for Wasps.

Agreed.

If only because I can get there from home in 35 minutes. Wycombe is 25 minutes further and a bit dearer (although the pub opposite the rail station is very nice)

Welshmushroom wrote:I wonder what Dai Young is making of all this. Wonder if he is worried as a result of this news?

He's got a contract and it a pretty personable bloke, I think he will be fine.

If they could get a ground in Acton then it would be pretty perfect I think. Near to the old clubhouse and dare I say it original wasps fans. I know a fair few people in London who count themselves as Wasps fans but very few of them make the trek out to Wycombe. I'm sure they would get much better attendances if they could move back.

I suppose the first step is getting the backing so they have the money to buy the land first. Are wasps fans confident a backer will appear?

Worth testing the Olympic stadium option again? I doubt there will be a more accessible stadium anywhere in the western world once Crossrail is open - getting 15k attendees out of a 1 hour catchment of, say, 12m doesn't seem overly difficult.

Alternatively I'm sure there is something to be done at Crystal Palace - the club aspire to move a short distance which gives two options and a catchment including all of Kent and Sussex as well as vasts tracts of London.

There is already a Thames Valley team, a SW London side and, probably, a North London side (although not overly accessible). If Wasps play this smart there is a massive natural audience they could have virtually exclusive access to.

DaveM wrote:Worth testing the Olympic stadium option again? I doubt there will be a more accessible stadium anywhere in the western world once Crossrail is open - getting 15k attendees out of a 1 hour catchment of, say, 12m doesn't seem overly difficult.
Alternatively I'm sure there is something to be done at Crystal Palace - the club aspire to move a short distance which gives two options and a catchment including all of Kent and Sussex as well as vasts tracts of London.

There is already a Thames Valley team, a SW London side and, probably, a North London side (although not overly accessible). If Wasps play this smart there is a massive natural audience they could have virtually exclusive access to.

+1

Makes a load of sense, Dave

The only issue with the Olympic stadium is that it has a capacity of 60k which might make it seem a bit dead if less than 20k spectators show up and also the running track would mean that supporters would be a distance from the action. It would also be all seated which isn't ideal for the traditionalists. However, if West Ham are struggling to pay for it then the idea of receiving some rent from a rugby team might well appeal.