Scarlets v Ulster (SUFTUM) 29th October 2011 at Parc Y Scarlets KO 3.00pm

First topic message reminder :

Six of Ulster's World Cup players have gone straight into the starting XV to face Scarlets in the RaboDirect PRO12 tomorrow night at the Parc y Scarlets (kick off 3pm).
Head Coach Brian McLaughlin has made a total of seven personnel changes and two positional switches. Johann Muller returns to captain the side from the second row, where he is resumes his partnership with Dan Tuohy.

Ulster (15-9): S Danielli; A Trimble, N Spence, P Wallace, C Gilroy; I Humphreys, R Pienaar;
(1-8): T Court, A Kyriacou, D Fitzpatrick, J Muller (capt), D Tuohy, P Wannenburg, M McComish, C Henry;
Replacements (16-23): N Brady, P McAllister, A Macklin, L Stevenson, R Diack, P Marshall, D Cave, A D'Arcy

Scarlets team just put up on the Scarlet Fever forum, not on the Scarlets web site though,


15 Evans, 14 Liam Williams, 13 Lamont, 12 Warren, 11 Fenby, 10 A Thomas, 9 R Williams,
1 R Jones, 2 Owens, 3 R Thomas, 4 Day, 5 Welch, 6 McCusker (c), 7 Edwards, 8 Morgan

REPS: 16 Rees, 17 John, 18 Gardiner, 19 Shingler, 20 Pugh, 21 Knoyle, 22 Newton, 23 S Williams

clivemcl wrote:
Unlike others though, i don't believe that Spence at 12 was the reason why we have been playing poorly. Look at how they linked up in the first few matches!

Its the supply thats the problem, and perhaps the tactics. Humph is the week link.

That is my view too. I haven't seen this game but for me the reason our backline is misfiring is 3 reasons:

1) Our pack haven't been getting a solid platform
2) We don't have enough effective ball carrying
3) The halfbacks in particular IHumph have been very poor.

D'arcy is not the finished article I agree and yes I would rather see Payne back but in Payne's absence I see no long term gain and very little short term gain in bringing in someone like Terblanche.

What the flipping point of giving these young guys contracts if we go out an buy in journeymen for a short term fix rather than trusting them?

Rory

I have been surprised we have seen nothing of Gaston also. That young Nelson lad has seen more gametime! I dont know if injury has played a part.

D'arcy was involved in most of our attacking play last season and had his hand in many of our tries.

On the Spence issue i dont think it is his fault at all but he isnt a 12 and has been asked to do the job of a bosher which is really undermining his potential imo. He has regressed if anything from last season and i put this down to how we are asking him to play. At the minute we need to play Wallace and Cave against Connacht and see how they go.

Are we any good at developing our young talent? Im not so sure that we are. Given that all of our coaches are ex players it is a very narrow view we have in the coaching ranks also.

http://www.ulsterrugby.com/news/9793.php

Mistake IMO.

Yep. He was past it when he left the Ospreys.

Bowe going to Leinster then is he?

Over my dead body.

Thanks guys, thought he played for Hinch. I've heard great stories about the Hinch back row, could be our answer to the Viet Gwent........(yes I know they were front rowers)

WillyGilly wrote:Over my dead body.

+ 1

Disappointed to see we've signed Terblanche. I'm sure he can do a job for us but I think he should be behind D'arcy and Gilroy in the pecking order and have to earn his spot otherwise its a very poor show of faith in the younger players and wider squad.

Rodders I am not convinced by the signing but putting him behind those two would be a complete waste of money. He is being brought in for his experience at the highest level and as such should go into the team as soon as possible. We have two massive HC Cup games in the next few weeks and will need as much experience as we can muster. Having played with Pienaar and Muller in the past will be a big plus factor. The guy is a steady, if unspectacular, player and possesses a massive boot.

Rava wrote:Rodders I am not convinced by the signing but putting him behind those two would be a complete waste of money.

Thats the problem Rava. Once you go out and sign a guy like that it becomes a financial descision to get your moneys worth. What message does this send out to someone like D'arcy? If I was him or Gaston I'd be questioning my future at a club where the management would rather go out and bring in a short term fix rather than trust the other players in the squad who've been busting their a*ses every week and waiting for their opportunity.

Where is Gaston though? He hasn't got any gametime at all this season, he must really be frustrated.

Are we forgetting that we once signed a USA international on a temporary basis and never used him. And to be fair to him, Paul Emerick was arguably USA's stand out player in the World Cup.

Are we certain Terblanche has been brought in to start, or is he just a safety net?

Guys some of these boys are only starting out on their careers so give them time. Gaston will be one for the future I'm sure but he has started maybe half a dozen games so wouldn't be anywhere near ready for the big games.

Rodders, D'arcy is so good we went out and invested in Payne. There was no argument with that. D'arcy is a fair player but isn't and won't be international class. He is a reasonable player going forward but still gives me the wobbles in defence, and he's too light.

The target this season has to be at least what we achieved last year. That will be a big ask and we need dependable guys to achieve that. Maybe in Feb/March if we haven't qualified for HC Quarters and our league position suggests we won't get a top four place then some of the young guys will get a bit of game time.

I listen to all the hype about this young player and that young player and how he should be in the team or even playing for Ireland but when most have been given a chance they haven't yet taken it. In the past year we have had Spence and Gilroy come through. They are very very good players and should go on to bigger things but they still need older experienced guys around them. Evidence would be our poor performances over the past few weeks.

Some good news at last. Afoa to start or at least feature for Ulster this weekend. Let's hope he fares better than his kiwi cousin.

Beat me to it Willy! MASSIVE BOOST!

WillyGilly wrote:Some good news at last. Afoa to start or at least feature for Ulster this weekend. Let's hope he fares better than his kiwi cousin.

+1

Rava wrote:
The target this season has to be at least what we achieved last year. That will be a big ask and we need dependable guys to achieve that.

Yes but if we achieve that using players on short term contracts then that is a false economy. We need to build something sustainable and based around long term players and local talent.

Great news on Afoa might try and make to Ravers this week too if I can persuade the GF to go two weekends in a row.....

Persuade? Rodders if she needs persuading I wouldn't put a ring on it just yet...

roddersm wrote:

Rava wrote:
The target this season has to be at least what we achieved last year. That will be a big ask and we need dependable guys to achieve that.

Yes but if we achieve that using players on short term contracts then that is a false economy. We need to build something sustainable and based around long term players and local talent.

Great news on Afoa might try and make to Ravers this week too if I can persuade the GF to go two weekends in a row.....

You bring the long term players and the local talent with you. This is only one guy on a three month contract it's not a bus load.

I don't know why people have a problem with Terblanche.

I'd agree if it was a long term signing he's not the way forward, but it's a 3 month deal (maybe extended to end of season)

Everyone agrees without Payne we are short of fullbacks
We need someone with experience also,
Remember it a short term fix, to a problem, that needed a short term fix.

Terblanche is the best we could hope for at this time of year, a good fullback with plenty of experience.

Ok so he's past his best, but he was playing for Sharks recently so has still got enough quality.

I haven't a problem with it as I don't see us getting anyone better on a short term contract. Only players intrested in a short term contract that has NO chance becoming long term. Would be a young player trying to put himself in the market (not really what we need, we have young players, and a quality player won't need to put themselves on market at this stage of season, so likely not a good option) or a quality player at end of thier career (what we had to go for).


I don't think Terblanche will come in and be first choice fullback, play games and then leave.
As I see it he's come over to act as a player/coach to our young full backs. his presence and training in the short term will improve D'arcy and Gaston, plus he will play in a number of games himself.

For that role Terblanche is ideal and again another bit of good buiness by D Humph.

Emerick played plenty for Ulster and aside from a ridiculous yellow card barge on Fionn Carr made little impression, (also apart from blocking Gilroy from playing at the start of the season).

Adam D'Arcy was very much a part of Ulster's success last season and showed as much potential as anyone to go to a higher level. When Bryn pulled out last season Ulster had to resort to dropping the rookie McIlwaine in at the deep end. That didn't do him any favours and a short term solution should have been found. THIS year they have a ready made replacement with HEC experience and is IQ with potential, yet now they decide to import! I hope Tereblanche is only brought in as cover for D'Arcy but I suspect he will be starting ahead of him as Payne would have been.

The whole thing smacks of panic to me following a run of poor results, yet the real problems haven't been in the backs, but rather in the forwards and especially in the backrow.

I agree about the backrow. Ferris should help this though we also need Faloon at 7 too. 8 is a toss up between Henry, Wannenburg and Diack.

Keep the discussions going lads. Transfer to the new article just posted for this weeks game against Connacht.