Wlad vs Haye: Who Wins and Why?

First topic message reminder :

OK so Hayes may 21st date on sky has now been taken up by warren, wlad has pulled out of the chisora fight and everyone seems to expect a bout between haye & wlad to be announced next week, in July, in Germany. Obviously it could fall through (again) but on the assumption it doesn't, let's indulge ourselves and discuss who's gonna win and why.  

First we have wlad, unbeaten in nearly 7 years. He's taller, physically stronger, athletic for his size with impressive stamina and has a bigger reach. He has an excellent jab, throws effective combinations, adopts a high guard with a stand off, cautious style, and ties opponents up coming in, using his physical strength to lean on them and sap their energy. But he has shown himself to be vulnerable to power and he's not the quickest. 

To beat haye he will need to keep the range early on with his jab, cover up as haye comes in and tie haye up, take Hayes strength away in the clinches and wear him down with the jab and pot shots. If he can get past 8 rounds doing this he should have the edge in the final third of the fight where he can be braver with his hands and let the punches fly on a weary haye. Haye trains for speed and explosiveness, not endurance, and wlad needs to use that against him. Wlad will know haye will be at his most dangerous early on, and I'm certain he'll look to fight cautious, take his strength then try to take him out late on, such is the animosity he'll want the KO. Can he do this?

And haye? Well as mentioned he trains for pure speed and explosiveness. He doesn't work a jab, instead circling his opponents and looking for openings to dart in and unleash fast, powerful combinations. He has a clear edge in speed, the power to hurt wlad, is deceptively awkward to hit, is a great finisher when his man is hurt and is naturally very strong and athletic. He is also 6 years younger and hungry. But he's also smaller, has had stamina issues in the past and whilst I wouldn't say he was chinny, he has been decked by lesser men than wlad. 

Hayes gameplan will be simple: knock wlad out. He'll look to stay out of wlads jabbing range so not to eat too much punishment, look for the gaps in wlads high guard or when he throws potshots and burst forward with his fast, heavy hands to land the kind of punches that have done for wlad in the past. Haye must be cautious not get get tagged heavy on his way in, and not to waste too much energy looking for the one big punch. He must be prepared for 12 rounds, because that's where wlad wants to take him. 

So who wins? Well I can see why, with his size, heavyweight experience and fundamental ability wlad will be the bookies favourite, but I'm gonna predict a haye win for the following reason: he has BOTH of the key attributes required to beat the current version of wlad - greasy fast hw speed, and genuine one punch knock out power. With wlads more cautious style having one of these without the other isn't enough, which is why all his recent opponents have fallen short. Its no good having big power if you cant get in range and past the high guard. Conversely its no good being super quick enough to get to him if you dont bang hard enough to make it count. But haye has both and that's the key, the real key in this fight. I can see him staying out of range, playing it very careful and waiting for very clear opportunities - but when they come he'll be clever enough, quick enough and powerful enough to make it count. Wlad will be shocked by how quick haye actually moves when face to face with him, and shocked by how hard he punches too. If haye is disciplined and takes his chances wisely, he can do it. Wlad is not invulnerable and Haye possesses the two attributes that will be wlads kryptonite. 

I predict haye will knock wlad out inside 8 rounds. 

BALTIMORA wrote:Suppose for argument's sake that an opponent didn't want to fight both-what then? He beats one, doesn't care to fight the other. In any other situation that's the norm-beat a champ and then decide on your next opponent. Treating them alike because they're close in terms of skill is fine, but there's still two opponents to fight. One opponent having to take two opponents as a package is just taking liberties.

Well first off I would argue that if thats the case, dont sign the contract. Go down the mandatory route and secure your shot that way. If you do sign the contract and it stipulates that you have to fight both then my guess is if you dont you will suffer some financial penalty and that will be it. You will still have your title and can fight whoever then. They cant make you physically get in the ring.

Is it really so different to any rematch clause used by other fighters? Or contracts like the S6 which dictate having to fight multiple opponents? Or catchweight stipulations etc? All it is to me is a new dimension of leverage brought about by unique circumstances.

The Klitschkos are no angels at the negotiating table and drive a hard bargain. But I think having a clause whereby if one brother is injured the other steps in on the exact same terms is fine and makes sense.

I'm just happy its signed and good to see Haye agreeing to whatever demands they put in place (again).

Just hope everthing goes well and we get to see them both in the ring this summer.

Looking forward to the build up over the coming months to see how Haye tries to wind them up this time around!!

But Manos, the difference is that in all the situations you listed the fight still comes down to 1 vs 1. Boxing isn't a team sport, but for the Klits that doesn't seem to be so.

Hopefully he beats both of them' in their own back yard. Won't count my chickens though...

Sam

What on earth were you doing up at 4.38am?!!

But anyway!

Haye has to figure out a way to get past one of the best jabs in boxing, be interesting to see if he decides to pile the pressure on to Wlad and try to get him out of there early. Might be his best chance as otherwise he could simply keep getting pummelled by the jab and lose a decision, probably not in the same manor as Wlad's recent foes but i think the only way he wins is by stoppage. Not exactly a human windmiller in terms of punch output, probably because he gasses...

Apparently it's gonna be in Germany, sadly won't be going across as i'm planning a holiday in Mexico mixing it with the drug dealers. If it was here i'd be there in a shot!

Enjoy Mexico coxy. Not been myself but a good friend went and absolutely loved it.

I'm still a bit confused as to the fight being held in Germany. I don't begrudge the champ fighting in his own backyard, but after all the big talk from Wlad about wanting to fight Haye anywhere and about him wanting to 'do a paintwork on Haye's face' it smacks of a wee touch of hypocrisy. I know that all we have to rely on for much of the information surrounding negotiations are the statements of Booth and Boente, but Wlad is on video record as saying these things. It's almost as bad as, oh I don't know...wanting a cut-off date on a 'random' testing period.

They could fight in a mud bath and i'd still shell out the £15 PPV!

Think we're actually really close this time, trying not to get over excited about it as they haven't signed anything and i probably won't get giddy until the week before the fight... Random injuries, Wlad changing his mind etc

Probs have a cheeky tenner on Haye by stoppage but that's more of a bet with the heart than the head

BALTIMORA wrote:I'm still a bit confused as to the fight being held in Germany. I don't begrudge the champ fighting in his own backyard, but after all the big talk from Wlad about wanting to fight Haye anywhere and about him wanting to 'do a paintwork on Haye's face' it smacks of a wee touch of hypocrisy.

I don't think he ever intended to fight outside Germany, just like he knew he couldn't fight Chisora and Haye. And just like he doesn't have an injury, hardly a guy you can take on his word. Which reminds me, Coxy - you going to upload the video of you running around your office naked? 8)

It might be me running naked round the cricket pitch.... I have done it before in the dark and ran into the nets!

Might postpone it until it gets warmer!!!

And i'm not sure why you would want to see me running round with my todger out?!

Didn't say I did, send it to D4 and he can confirm the authenticity.

Originally when the fight was signed two years ago for June, I gave Haye little chance, and after seeing him against Valuev I thought it was a fair assessment, couldn't see him making an impression on the big Ukranian. However the closer the fight is getting I'm starting to favour Haye that little bit more day by day, I don't know I just feel timing is everything, Klitshchko has been inactive he's always going to be hesitant and I reckon Haye has got to him, I going to predict a very cagey start with Klitschko building an early lead but I can see him burning an enormous amount of nervous energy ala Brewster, becoming cagey and cagey with Haye forcing a stoppage.

Got a little inkling for Haye it means nothing I know but I have, and speed kills.

Cheers

Rodders

Forget it Scott, Coxy's popular on here but not that popular, mate. As for the fight, Wladimir starts as the favourite, but I've felt from the off that Haye has a good chance of pulling this off, and I'm tipping him to do so. Against the grain, yes, but I really feel he'll give Klitschko nightmares.

Haye has no real jab of his own to speak of, but that's not much of a problem in my eyes. He's not going to out-jab Wladimir regardless, so his current tactic of circling and looking to use his 'in and out' speed to find openings is one he should stick with. Wlad's jab is awkward, but he does hang it out to dry as the old saying goes, and someone with Haye's speed (which he's carried up to Heavyweight nicely) and low crouching style is the best candidate to exploit this.

Haye's stamina will be key. While I think talk of his so-called stamina problems have been overblown, he'll still need to maintain a pace over twelve rounds which he hasn't done thus far in his Heavyweight career. The Klitschkos are perceived to have great stamina, but I believe this is partly down to the fact that they have, in recent years, always been able to dictate the pace of their fights. It's much easier to look as if you have great stamina when you're fighting at a pace which suits you; however, if Haye can keep the pressure on, his speed (which certainly trumps that of Chagaev, Peter, Rahman and so on) will force Wladimir to fight at a pace which is alien to him and, God forbid, maybe even fight off the back foot.

I know I'm setting myself up for a fall here, but my prediction is a late stoppage for Haye.

Just had a look, Haye is 2/1 for the stoppage and a whopping 8/1 by points.

Wlad is 11/10 by stoppage as well which is decent value.

Personally i think the fight ends inside the 12, will be backing Haye in the run up but won't be overly confident in my views... Haye has gassing/chin issues and we're still not sure about Wlads chin if he gets nailed flush - His defence is near impenetrable nowadays the main reason

Haye by stoppage 6-8 for me. Wlad to build an early lead, whilst being wobbled once or twice, before Haye makes the breakthrough with an overhand right that starts the beginning of the end for Wlad. Can see the ref stepping in after a couple of knockdowns.

Really hope this happens, planning on going across to Germany with a few of the lads so it would be a moment to remember!

Haye's said he signed Saturday night, been a bit out of the loop as was away from the computer all weekend...

Anyone heard if there's any press conferences planned regarding an announcement?!

Not sure i agree with your take Fists of Fury, for me if Haye stops him it's early... Depends on how he tries to fight though, for me if he dances to Wlad's tune and starts munching jabs i don't think he'll find a way back before he eats something big... Reckon he might just have a feeler for a round or two then start letting the fireworks go.

If he detonates and Wlad is still there i think he might start to worry!

Haye in 4-6 = 6/1, probs worth a deep see diver. No more as i'm really not sure on this one, doesn't help my heart is saying one thing and with the likes of Hatton before i've overruled my head with a big bet!

But hey, a few months of all sorts of insults flying from both camps is sure to be fun! Beats "i fight for my fans" and other repetitive drivel from nice fighters!

Yeah, that's a little weird Scott. I mean, to each his own and all that but...

Gotta say I'd been wondering about the probability of this fight coming off, and when I saw that Haye had been chosen by EA as the cover star for the new Fight Night I did begin to think all the faffing had been to promote the circus, with the fight clearly in the sights of both parties.

Did you know everyone who has been on the cover of Fight Night has lost his next fight? Hatton, Oscar, Roy Jones, Hopkins.

Scottrf wrote:Did you know everyone who has been on the cover of Fight Night has lost his next fight? Hatton, Oscar, Roy Jones, Hopkins.

The same happened with Barry McGuigans boxing for the Spectrum 48k back in 86.

Rodders

fearlessBamber wrote:I think Haye has almost no chance at all. His only chance is too catch Wlad in the first couple of rounds but, I just do not see that happening.

I think he'll look to circle Wlad early, but get picked off by jabs from range, end up getting discouraged and be stopped by about round 7-8 after barely even trying to hit Wlad.

This is what I worry about, Bamber.

I'll be rooting for Haye all the way, purely because I'm fed up with the heavyweight division being a private family affair, but I fear that Haye lacks the fundamentals to topple Wlad.

I argued at the old forum that Joe Louis set the blueprint for beating a reasonably sound technician with a huge advantage in reach when he twice decimated the very decent Buddy Baer, who was almost exactly the same size as Wlad. Louis did it by virtue of superb timing and either blocking Baer's jab, firing his own back SIMULTANEOUSLY, or by slipping OUTSIDE the Baer jab and countering over the top of it. Haye, generally, neither slips nor blocks a jab, preferring to pull back from it, a la Ali, and then dart back in to land his own shots. Unless a fighter is so gifted as Ali, this is a suicidal tactic against a man with a punishing jab and long reach. Even Ruiz found Haye with the jab far too often for comfort, and I fear that Wlad will be more successful still.

I hope I'm wrong, and I certainly do believe that if Haye DOES plant a good one on Wlad's chin he can knock him out, but I fear he'll ship an awful lot of punishment in trying to do so.

Agreed Windy.

Not sure if chinny is a fair label for Haye but I'd question whether he has the warriors heart to take the punishment required to get near Wlad.

Hi Windy,

There's no way I see Haye implementing Louis's strategy. Like you say he's never displayed those kind of skills.

The only thing I see in his favour compared to Louis vs. Baer is that, I think Wlad still has that weak chin. Much weaker than Baer's - one clean right might be all he'll need to get Wlad hurt and in panic mode.

I think Haye knows this. He's fairly astute. He'll run like a thief - burning his limited stamina in double quick time and look to explode with leaping overhand rights.

If he doesn't catch Wlad in the first 6 minutes, he's toast.

Can't say I agree with that Bamber, only takes one punch to change a fight, and I can see this happening any time upto say round 8, after that he may indeed be toast...

Sean, Windy I think its a fair assessment, however I've got a sneaky feeling Wlad might not be so forthcoming in letting his jab, right cross go. Evertime anyone rushes Wlad he seems to go into panic stations, I'm anticipating an extremely cagey even tepid affair. Wlad has all the tools to make it an easy night, but I'm not sure his capable of using them.

Rodders

In truth, I cannot see David Haye winning this as both Kliches are a class above anyone else at present. I hope I am proven wrong and will be rooting for Haye, but if I had to bet, the money would go on Wlad

coxy0001 wrote:Sam

What on earth were you doing up at 4.38am?!!

But anyway!

Haye has to figure out a way to get past one of the best jabs in boxing, be interesting to see if he decides to pile the pressure on to Wlad and try to get him out of there early. Might be his best chance as otherwise he could simply keep getting pummelled by the jab and lose a decision, probably not in the same manor as Wlad's recent foes but i think the only way he wins is by stoppage. Not exactly a human windmiller in terms of punch output, probably because he gasses...

Apparently it's gonna be in Germany, sadly won't be going across as i'm planning a holiday in Mexico mixing it with the drug dealers. If it was here i'd be there in a shot!

Coxy, I live In China mate; so 4 in the morning for you is lunch time for me!

Klitschko's main asset will be his jab. Haye knows this so his strategy will focus on taking his jab away. I think his strategy will revolve around feints/threats to make Wlad think he is about to unload, draw the jab and slip it to get inside to land his powershots. This will make it a very cagey opening to the fight, as Haye's often are (and Wlad's almost always are) when he is fearful of the other guy's power; Enzo, Harrison etc. The fight centres around range control. Klitschko controls distance well with a powerful jab and large reach, with short shots inside (usually the overhand right) to punish you if you rush in carelessly, or clinching.

This clinching may be a large part of Wlad's gameplan. As the larger man he may try to wear Haye down by holding, as Haye's stamina is questioned, rightly or wrongly after gassing against Thompson so long ago. His fights have rarely gone far so it's hard to assess whether his stamina has improved. I can't see this being too important; Haye landed so many powershots against Thompson it was a miracle he was standing. The lateral movement will tire him but he will be in condition and wont have an effect unless he gets caught too often.

It's highly likely there will be a knockdown; body have questionable resistance and good power. Make no mistake, Haye has Heavyweight power, Ruiz has rarely been down in his career and Haye put him on his bum moving backward, and even staggered man mountain Valuev. However, Haye has shown me he is better able to cope with adversity. Against Mormeck he got tagged, but sensibly took a knee and regained his composure. Against Barrett he started sloppy and was put down but got back up to win. Contrast to Wlad who doesn't seem able to clear his head after getting knocked down, and Haye is the better finisher.

A jab is a lot more effective against a static target, as so many of Wladimir's opponents have been. But if Haye gets caught, you can expect the sledgehammer of a straight right following it. The fight will be more open than the bigger guy would like, and I can see him in trouble at times. But I can see his power making Haye wary enough that the opportunities aren't regular enough for Haye to earn a decision. and pick Wlad to be standing at the final bell. Ask me tomorrow I may change my mind though, I am edging towards Haye.

After Chisora twice missing out, I'm still doubtful the fight with Haye will happen.

Wlad's last 5 opponents have been Samuel Peter, Eddie Chambers, Ruslan Chagaev, Tony Thompson and Sultan Ibragimov. Wouldn't say its a great list of opponents. Peter was faded, not really competing at the top level and close to useless anyway. Chambers (weighed in at 208 lbs) and Chagaev are to small to be top level HWs. I've unfortuanatly watched the Ibragimov fight, it rendered the first 3 rounds of Harrison vs Haye 'The War'. Fine, he held a title, but Ibragimov not really convincing. Marches forward with a week side-on jab, largely inactive, slow.

I'd rank Haye above the fighters mentioned. He's athletic for one thing, has speed, can vary styles, lands powerful combinations. As a former CW, he's probably used to fighting quicker opponents and knows the eastern european style. Wlad offensively primarily fires out the left jab, wouldn't classify it as a monster punch. When feeling confident he races forward and releases the right, but only a couple of times a round. Its not a complex style to work around. Wlad is fairly quick on his feet for a big man, but his handspeed isn't especially fast. I can se Haye being able to dodge and avoid a number of them. Its rare for Wlad to KO an opponent early even if he lands a few shots, so I reckon Haye can absorb a few jabs. Its a fight Haye is able to win. Conversely to some, I'd call a points win.

Looks like Wlad will be a pretty good price at this rate

[quote="ArchBritishchris"] I've unfortuanatly watched the Ibragimov fight, it rendered the first 3 rounds of Harrison vs Haye 'The War'.

Ha, brilliant stuff, made me smirk did that one.

ArchBritishchris wrote:After Chisora twice missing out, I'm still doubtful the fight with Haye will happen.

Wlad's last 5 opponents have been Samuel Peter, Eddie Chambers, Ruslan Chagaev, Tony Thompson and Sultan Ibragimov. Wouldn't say its a great list of opponents. Peter was faded, not really competing at the top level and close to useless anyway. Chambers (weighed in at 208 lbs) and Chagaev are to small to be top level HWs. I've unfortuanatly watched the Ibragimov fight, it rendered the first 3 rounds of Harrison vs Haye 'The War'. Fine, he held a title, but Ibragimov not really convincing. Marches forward with a week side-on jab, largely inactive, slow.

I'd rank Haye above the fighters mentioned. He's athletic for one thing, has speed, can vary styles, lands powerful combinations. As a former CW, he's probably used to fighting quicker opponents and knows the eastern european style. Wlad offensively primarily fires out the left jab, wouldn't classify it as a monster punch. When feeling confident he races forward and releases the right, but only a couple of times a round. Its not a complex style to work around. Wlad is fairly quick on his feet for a big man, but his handspeed isn't especially fast. I can se Haye being able to dodge and avoid a number of them. Its rare for Wlad to KO an opponent early even if he lands a few shots, so I reckon Haye can absorb a few jabs. Its a fight Haye is able to win. Conversely to some, I'd call a points win.

Given the division I think Wlads last 5 opponents have been pretty good. Outstanding compared to any other heavyweight in the division anyway.

Did you watch the Valuev fight? Haye only narrowly beat him on the outside. Haye barely landed much shots of note at all on the biggest slowest target in the HW division. I find it hard to be confident on that performance that Haye can win on points against a much better fighter in Wlad. The only way I see him taking a decision is if he sends Wlad down several times for 10-8 rounds but cant KO him and wins it that way. I think if Haye is able to get to Wlad regularly then he should win by KO. If he isnt the Wlad takes a decision or stoppage win himself.

Haye did what he had to do. It would have been like me fighting a 12 year old boy.

hmm not convinced by david hayes chances, to win i agree he has to fight in bursts and catch wlad with big clean shots, use his lateral movement and jus hit him with counters etc.

that is the only way haye will win, hes not going to outbox wlad, apart from his power haye hasnt got the tools to do this. heres why: yes he has stamina issues and large ones at that, hes looked tired in every HW fight iv seen him in and that is against poor opposition who havnt pressed him or make him move that much. wlad and vitali are built to go 12 rounds and are in much better condition. if he has trouble keeping up the pace against valuev for 12 rounds hows he going to do it working 10 times harder against wlad!? it wont happen. hayes conditioning is poor for a boxer, his body shape and tone is all wrong, his body looks great but its not a boxers body, i belive this has something to do with his poor stamina, he looks more like a model than a boxer am i the only one who thinks this? its in his abs u notice it the most anybody who knows anything about sport/fitness knows you need to strengthen the are around the abs if you have a perfect 6 pac it looks nice but is a weakness. look at klits mid section or mannys and you will see the diffrence, they dont look like abercrombie and finch models like david.

i just dont think he can fight 12 rounds at a high enough intensity infact i know that he cant! he has a chance of KO'ing wlad but thats it if it gets past round 5 its game over for haye i really think his stamina is that bad. am i being to harsh? i want haye to win but i cant see it, hes overrated plain and simple at heavyweight he has done nothing to show me he can do anything other than bang and fight poor opposition. his lack of defense is alarming and ruiz harrison and valuev aint going to punish him for it, wlad will, wlad is accurate clever and quick and haye drops his hands to often and is poor at judging range something wlad is excellent at.

haye with his speed and power may be allwrong for wlad, but his lack of defense and his inability to box at 100% for 12 rounds makes wlad all wrong for him

http://www.eastsideboxing.com/news.php?p=27191&more=1

Comments from both sides. Notice how wlad says he's happy that a klitschko v haye is happening, he and his brother have wanted the title for so long, haye has avoided us before blah blah blah. And people say they don't have a tag team mentality??? Wlad has not once said that HE will be fighting haye, but that haye will be fighting a klitschko. With it contracted that haye will face vitali if wlad doesn't overcome his injury, I will seriously not be surprised if haye ends up in the ring with vitali rather than wlad at this event. I'm not convinced wlad fancies it with haye, I got the impression before that K2 were trying to engineer haye toward vitali instead, and wlad is yet to make direct reference to it being him that will fight haye, just 'a klitschko'. Hmmmm.

I agree with your assessment Cheikitout.

Although I've not given his physique as much 'scrutiny' as you

It seems to me that people are desperate to find reasons Wlad is ducking the fight with Haye.

The contract that Vitali steps in if Wlad is injured makes sense to me.

The fight wasnt even going to happen until Wlad cancelled Chisora so if Wlad really didnt want it he could have just kept with Chisora.

He signed to fight Haye before and mst have somehow foresaw Haye pulling out. Then it was he set up Chisora to duck Haye. Then he cancels it and hes still supposed to be ducking Haye.

The contract doesnt say its Vitali or Wlad to fight Haye. It say its Wlad to fight Haye unless he is injured and if that happens Vitali will step in as a replacement under the original terms of the contract. Given the magnitude of the fight and Hayes own strict deadline this makes complete sense to me and avoids another arduos renegotiation should the worst happen.

If Wlad suffers an injury a week before the fight then by all means he can be questioned but unless hes anticipated a full year out of the ring I think his track record and willingness to fight Haye in the past deserves the benefit of the doubt.

Haye has the skills to beat Wlad, Wlad will just jab, frightened to takes risks. Haye has to rile him up, and try to turn in into the war. Wlad is a one trick pony, get round that jab and it is game over.

Lets hope Wlad doesn't get scared again and sends in his big brother to protect him.

D4thincarnation wrote:Haye has the skills to beat Wlad, Wlad will just jab, frightened to takes risks. Haye has to rile him up, and try to turn in into the war. Wlad is a one trick pony, get round that jab and it is game over.

Lets hope Wlad doesn't get scared again and sends in his big brother to protect him.

Thats why I reckon Haye will lose. Wlad will not take chances. If it goes 12 rounds there is no way on this green earth that Haye wins a decision. Haye will have to commit and he hasn't got that in him. He is a pot shotter and Wlad will not allow that to happen. Wlad by mid round KO as Haye tires.

If Haye wins a UD or SD I'll streak at Wimbledon behind Sue Barker!!!

azania wrote:

D4thincarnation wrote:Haye has the skills to beat Wlad, Wlad will just jab, frightened to takes risks. Haye has to rile him up, and try to turn in into the war. Wlad is a one trick pony, get round that jab and it is game over.

Lets hope Wlad doesn't get scared again and sends in his big brother to protect him.

Thats why I reckon Haye will lose. Wlad will not take chances. If it goes 12 rounds there is no way on this green earth that Haye wins a decision. Haye will have to commit and he hasn't got that in him. He is a pot shotter and Wlad will not allow that to happen. Wlad by mid round KO as Haye tires.

If Haye wins a UD or SD I'll streak at Wimbledon behind Sue Barker!!!

The only reason why Haye will not win a decision is because it will be in Germany. Funny how the K brothers ruled out fighting in the UK but Haye is willing to fight in Germany.

Wlad won't be able to cope with Haye's speed and will cower infront of his power.

Very plausible that Haye get DQ in this fight, being it is in Germany.

D4thincarnation wrote:

azania wrote:

D4thincarnation wrote:Haye has the skills to beat Wlad, Wlad will just jab, frightened to takes risks. Haye has to rile him up, and try to turn in into the war. Wlad is a one trick pony, get round that jab and it is game over.

Lets hope Wlad doesn't get scared again and sends in his big brother to protect him.

Thats why I reckon Haye will lose. Wlad will not take chances. If it goes 12 rounds there is no way on this green earth that Haye wins a decision. Haye will have to commit and he hasn't got that in him. He is a pot shotter and Wlad will not allow that to happen. Wlad by mid round KO as Haye tires.

If Haye wins a UD or SD I'll streak at Wimbledon behind Sue Barker!!!

The only reason why Haye will not win a decision is because it will be in Germany. Funny how the K brothers ruled out fighting in the UK but Haye is willing to fight in Germany.

Wlad won't be able to cope with Haye's speed and will cower infront of his power.

Very plausible that Haye get DQ in this fight, being it is in Germany.

Wlad is the recognised champ so he should pic where to fight. Personally they should fight in a neutral venue. But wherever it is, its still 2 men in the ring. I do agree that in Germany you have to KO them to get a draw. Haye is just not busy enough for me. I hope he does win and win with style. But it wont happen. I see a Wlad KO by 8.

fearlessBamber wrote:I agree with your assessment Cheikitout.

Although I've not given his physique as much 'scrutiny' as you

haha im just very into my boxing

as for the venue being in germany it doesnt matter haye is nowhere near busy enough to take a decision unless hes just landing at will. people say wlad is a one trick pony and their wrong his skills are excellent, footwork, body position and his powerful straight punches, he uses his jab better than any HW apart from holmes. hes definatly got a softer chin than vitali but his defense is so sound these days i cant see anything getting through.

if haye could be non stop busy fighting at 110% for 12 rounds id say he has a great chance but he physically cant do that he just hasnt got it in him. a brave effort from haye it will be but wlad will start quicker and set the tempo, haye will give it his all but will start to tire and wlad will just hammer into submission. like i said before hayes lack of defence etc etc makes him so vunerable. haye is exciting and fans will be hoping he can land one of his famous haye makers and it will be lights out, not likely but possible, just like Evander holyfield being the next undisputed HW champion