Ospreys v Scarlets - Bonfire Night, (Saturday 05/11/11) BOOM!

First topic message reminder :

Liberty Stadium, Swansea. Kick off 6.30 pm. Live on S4C from 6:10pm. Match coverage repeated from 9:00am on S4C Sunday 06/11/11.

Roll up! Roll up! It's the West Wales derby Part One - can the Scarlets beat the Ospreys for the first time at the Liberty since 2007 or will the Ospreys determination to make up for the loss they incurred last week in the Rabo spoil the Scarlets party? Their previous meetings have looked like this:

27/12/10 Ospreys 60 - 17 Scarlets
02/10/10 Scarlets 18 - 21 Ospreys
02/04/10 Ospreys 27 - 19 Scarlets

It should be a very exciting encounter, and I can't wait to be there Let the banter begin!

OSPREYS
15 Richard Fussell
14 Tommy Bowe
13 Andrew Bishop
12 Ashley Beck
11 Eli Walker
10 Dan Biggar
9 Kahn Fotuali'i

1 Duncan Jones
2 Richard Hibbard
3 Cai Griffiths
4 Alun Wyn Jones (Capt)
5 Ian Evans
6 Joe Bearman
7 Justin Tipuric
8 Jonathan Thomas

Replacements:

16 Huw Bennett
17 Ryan Bevington
18 Aaron Jarvis
19 Ryan Jones
20 Tom Smith
21 George Stowers
22 Rhys Webb
23 Shane Williams

REFEREE: Mathieu Raynal (FFR)
Assistant Referees: Neil Hennessy, Jon Mason (both WRU)
Citing Commissioner : Richard Gwynn (WRU)
TMO: Tony Rowlands (WRU)

SCARLETS
15 Daniel Evans
14 Liam Williams
13 Adam Warren
12 Scott Williams
11 Sean Lamont
10 Stephen Jones
9 Tavis Knoyle

1 Iestyn Thomas
2 Matthew Rees (capt)
3 Rhys Thomas
4 Dominic Day
5 Damian Welch
6 Aaron Shingler
7 Rob McCusker
8 Ben Morgan.

Replacements:

Ken Owens
Phil John
Rhodri Jones
Sione Timani
Richie Pugh
Rhodri Williams
Jon Davies
George North.

PS: There will also be a Food Fair that will get underway at 4.00pm ahead of kick off. The food suppliers confirmed for the event including Gower Cottage Brownies, La Crème Patisserie, Swansea Hog Roast, the Waffle Trailer and Welsh Premium Burgers, giving fans a real taste of Wales ahead of the big match. YUMMO!!

I didn't see either of the binning incidents....I was kind of distracted...anyway, I'll watch the TV coverage when it's repeated tomorrow and see what I missed!

ha Cari, can't imagine what was distracting you

And not that I got distracted myself either....

no way was that a spear tackle, or dump tackle as it's become known, it was Bowe's momentum that took him over, but as has been pointed out he probably will get cited and banned, it's getting ridiculous, this was the kind of tackle the law was brought in to eradicate;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W8xwHVMGEQc&feature=related

now it seems to be any tackle where the player ends up on their back before the legs come down, rugby's getting more like football every day, soon they'll get it down to those little tags in the waist like the kids wear at half-time and no contact.

It looked worse than Warburton's

The match is on again now if anyone wants to see it. S4C...

Also, those sponsor logos on the arses of the O's players shorts looked ridiculous.

Cari wrote:

Also, those sponsor logos on the arses of the O's players shorts looked ridiculous.

They really do.

What a terrible game to watch, there was no ambition shown by either side. No wonder crowds are so low at Welsh regional games if thats the standard fare. The Avviva premiership has far more running expansive rugby than the dross on display last night, hence far larger average crowds.

wrfc1980 wrote:What a terrible game to watch, there was no ambition shown by either side. No wonder crowds are so low at Welsh regional games if thats the standard fare. The Avviva premiership has far more running expansive rugby than the dross on display last night, hence far larger average crowds.

Oh take your worn out WUM elsewhere, this thread about the match nothing else.

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I know he's not popular amongst some people, but congratulations have to go to Dan Biggar who became the highest points scorer of all time for the Ospreys, so well done him.

Love that you can hear all the Scarlets fans making a lot of noise

Yeah their singing was fun....just like rugby should be.

yep!

Those missed kicks from both have been pretty poor ones so far....

Scarlets are so slow at securing the ball at the breakdown we're so bloomin predictable to watch at times. Annoying!

Missed dodgy tackle on Beck there.

OK just seen the tackle on Tommy....instant ban Only joking! It didn't look as bad as Warburtons, it was the same as a tackle Tommy did in the Heino in 2009 for which he was binned at the time. He was cited for it, but cleared at the subsequent disciplinary hearing. I don't think Wellies should get any more than that.

Me neither Cari, think that the speed of the collision took all control out of the situation.

Reckon Rob Gog might get cited too for his tackle on Beck, but at least he made sure he landed properly and on his back. That might swing things in his favour.

With regards to the tackle on Beck - a binning would've sufficed there I think, but the ref missed it.

Ian Evans you donkey! If he wasn't so hesitant and ran forward, he could've scored there!

Dreamer - that no.14 of yours was feisty - he's had a few handbags and with AWJ of all people!

hahaha I know, that's Liam 'Sanjay' Williams, he's only 19 - just a babi!

Bloody kids today - all walking asbo's....

I think both 10s ruined that game. Poor kicking and lack of imagination.

ha mckay I think it was both 9's personally. Dreadful service from both.

Both packs set out to play a spoiling game, resulting in boths ides getting slow ball. It was never going to be a try thriller with both playing that way. Poor service from the 9's didn't help things though. Both sides very disjointed with their internationals coming back but there was a high intensity to the match which should help going into next week.

Both need a massive improvement though.

You can't extrapolate anything from that match. They are not going to chuck it about with such a poor ref in a local derby. The Heino is a different animal. You can't even compare this match with the Irish derby. It is a stand alone match. For proof of that look at the Boxing Day match.

Would it have been possible to have awarded the MOM to George North?he looked the only class on the field

he certainly seemed to be the only player to really make an impact Chris. Last 15 mins as well he was brilliant.

I really enjoyed the game last night. We had a hell of a shock walking to the stadium because normally the Harvester outside the stadium is jam packed with Ospreys, but last night it was a sea of red with Sospan Fach ringing out from it, they kicked us out of our pub!

We took our normal seats and right in front of us was what I guess was the Scarlets hard core.

These guys were singing and having fun all match and generating a fantastic atmosphere (I'm top left). I have been chatting to some of them on the Scarlet Fever forum. They were singing the whole game and having some real banter with the Ospreys supporters around them. Lovely people to be honest.

The game itself was basically 2 teams with the same game plan, try and put pressure on the opposition and try to capitalise on an error.
Don't take risks and don't make mistakes, the result was a low scoring game of trench warfare, with 2 teams cancelling each other out.

rugbydreamer wrote:Me neither Cari, think that the speed of the collision took all control out of the situation.

Reckon Rob Gog might get cited too for his tackle on Beck, but at least he made sure he landed properly and on his back. That might swing things in his favour.

http://images4.hiboox.com/images/4411/diapoe8195b354af85ad96eac8af2046f62c0.gif

There didn't look to be much in it to be honest. If he gets banned for that then we may as well pack up and go home, because rugby can;t be a contact sport anymore.

I'd be interested to see a clip at full speed Alyn. You can see clearly in that how fast Bowe is travelling before the collision occurs and that it sends them both off balance.

Letter of the law though (as we keep hearing!) that could well have been a red. have to wait and see if the citing commissioner agrees. I think though because he didn't let him go, and was out of control himself, he did the best he could to bring Bowe to ground safely. Hope a yellow is sufficient for that.

Although I didn't agree with who got the MOTM, I still think it should've been Tommy...

Alyn - looks like you weren't too far away from us. We were in the next seats near the front (would've been to your right). I had superb views of what I needed to see

Cari wrote:Although I didn't agree with who got the MOTM, I still think it should've been Tommy...

Alyn - looks like you weren't too far away from us. We were in the next seats near the front (would've been to your right). I had superb views of what I needed to see

I'd of gone for George North myself, though you could argue for the Scarlets fans too because they were brilliant at generating an atmosphere!

You weren't one of the 2 ladies giving the Scarlets fans cheek were you Cari?
There was a blonde lady with dyed hair, and very, very attractive dark haired girl with glasses to the right of those fans, and the blonde lady was giving the Scarlets fans a lot of banter all game, it was very enjoyable.

Shame you couldn't of come to the Liberty for the game Dreamer, it would of been nice to see you down there.

I was with Dreamer Alyn, and no that wasn't us we were sat to the right of them as well. I wasn't giving anyone grief...too busy drooling...

Watched the game again this afternoon. The Welsh commentary team got on my nerves, pulling everybody down. It was an intense encounter, with a ref that was horribly inconsistent at off sides, the breakdown and scrum. Not a try fest, but good prep for tough HC matches.

Cari wrote:I was with Dreamer Alyn, and no that wasn't us we were sat to the right of them as well. I wasn't giving anyone grief...too busy drooling...

Dang, you were horny, I was near you, and I didn't know it!

Don't worry Alyn, she only had eyes for 1...erm, 2...6 men and you weren't one of them!

Glas That's true that. Good god even one or two of the Scarlets players look tasty in the flesh.

Just watching Scrum V and I don't think they showed Wellies yellow card only mentioned it afterwards - does that mean there's a possible citing there?

Oh OK, they've showed it now when the lads are on about it. Jiffy saying ref's are getting too soft giving harsh calls on such tackles.

Glas a du wrote:Don't worry Alyn, she only had eyes for 1...erm, 2...6 men and you weren't one of them!

I could scrub myself up a bit and look just as good as Adam Jones... maybe

Cari - I've a mind to agree with Jiffy to be honest.

And no need to sound so surprised that some of the Scarlets lads are a bit dishy

Alyn - yeah I managed to go to the game with Cari and a couple of others from on here, so glad I was sat near the singing Scarlets fans, was a great atmosphere where they were

I agree with Jiffy - he talked a lot of sense. Interesting point what he said about rugby league tackles. They also showed Tipuric's banning tackle - I didn't think it looked any worse than Wellies to be honest.

Neither did I Cari which is why I still think Stevo is going to get cited, can't say I really agree with it though, but them's the laws I guess!

rugbydreamer wrote:Alyn - yeah I managed to go to the game with Cari and a couple of others from on here, so glad I was sat near the singing Scarlets fans, was a great atmosphere where they were

Glad to hear you managed to see the game.
I hope none of you experienced the issues that have been cropping up in recent hours on the Ospreys and Scarlets fans forums, apparently there were sparodic out breaks of problems amongst the fans during the game and at the Riverside after the game.

Ah we had a bit of an idiot in front of us that was determined to just shout abuse at the Scarlets players but he quietened down in the 2nd half luckily. Everyone else around us was lovely

People have been talking about the Stephen Jones tackle but one just as bad happened in the 20th minute with Mcusker on one of our centers, and no action was taken.

that one wasn't as bad I don't think Alyn, Rob Gog was in control the whole time and made sure Beck landed on his back. I was surprised no action was taken at the time considering how it seems to be the in thing to card those tackles. Will have to wait and see if he gets cited I guess, but I don't think it was so bad.

Is it something to do with tackling technique that needs to be changed to stop this lifting of the players legs too high? Might be something needs to be done there to stop all the controversy.

I'm nopt sure how you'd stop it as the Jones tackle in particular (don't remember the McCusker one) the only reason Bowe went up and then back down was because the pace he was running, the power of the hit S Jones made on him and the fact Jones slipped as he was tackling him.

It's hard to know how you'd regulate that, as it wasn't deliberate and you have really big hits coming in all the time in tackles (it's one of the things that makes the game great), and there's no/little danger to the player (besides a few bruises). When these big hits come in, if one player is a lot lighter or taller (higher centre of gravity), and the tackler hits relatively low down then generally the tackled player goes up, and with their momentum and the fact that they twist in the air ready to place the ball, means that sometimes it turns into a tackle such as the one we saw with S Jones & Bowe. I doubt (can't know for sure) if that was S Jones' intention though, and he certainly didn't drive the player into the ground.

Agree with all of that Preist.

Was just throwing it out there, because I think in some cases it is how a player approaches the tackle that causes the lift to happen. Have already said though in the SJ case, it all happenes so quick, I don't think either player knew what was happening.

Jon Davies said an interesting thing about being spear tackled by Moriarty (sp?) and saying it taught him how to approach and ride strong tackles. Not saying I agree with spear tackles at all but there has to be strong physical tackling in the game (I mean imagine playing against Ma Nonu or North without being able to tackle aggresively).

Interesting that it was apparently Jones' 1st yellow card of his Scarlets career.

I agree with you both.

Basically this will be the equivilent to diving in football, the player with the ball puts his feet off the ground and his weight onto the tacklers body just prior to the tackler making contact, the tackler loses control of the player with the ball in the air, or worse still the player with the ball wriggles away, he falls awkwardly, a few surrounding players wave their arms into the air, and a few more start a bit of pushing and shoving.

Basically unless the IRB get control of this quickly we could see the game ruined by players deliberatly trying to get others sent off.
You could argue that this happened in the Warburton tackle if you look at the way Clerc jumps up on contact with Warburton.

This will be to rugby what diving is to football I'm sorry to say, we just haven't realised it yet.

I think it's the responsibility of the player tackling and being tackled into how they approach it to be honest.

The physicality of the sport is one of the great things about our game and I don't want us to lose that.

I think players need to be a bit more intelligent when going into a tackle, and also the laws need looking at.

Quite frankly it's all a bit of a mess at the moment. The IRB have got a lot of sorting out to do imo.

I know those all sounds like completely sweeping statements but I don't know how the mess of the tackle area at the minute is to be sorted out

Priest - that doesn't surprise me at all about Stevo, I honestly can't remember the last time (if ever) he got a yellow card.

rugbydreamer wrote:I think it's the responsibility of the player tackling and being tackled into how they approach it to be honest.

Yes that's what worries me, but if we have great English servants like Dean Richards using blood capsules. Springbok forwards who take a dive after being slapped by Samoans, Welsh full backs falling to the floor without touching a Scottish player who is doing a star jump to win a penalty, and Scottish players staying down pretending to be injured after taking a player out in the air to avoid a card, then you really have to worry about player ethics.
Season after season we are creeping towards greater unsportmanship conduct within rugby, and the IRB's poor handling of the tackle issue will accelerate that slide.

And as the risk of failure and rewards of success get higher and higher then this sort of behaviour is going to get worse and worse - I suppose it's just part and parcel of becoming a professional game. Such a shame though.

IRB are pants.