Definite starters for Lions 2013

First topic message reminder :

15.
14.
13.
12.
11.
10. Priestland

9.
8.
7.
6.
5.
4.
3.
2.
1.

By 2013 the FBs will be Halfpenny and Hogg and the 10s will be Priestland and Weir !

Visser on the wing - have a look at the edinburgh games on iplayer.

Felix Jones will be the 15 guys as soon as he returns from his injury, you will get to see his talent!

It's Foden for me, if it was being picked today.

tom_watson wrote:A Team

15. Kearney (Ireland)
14. Ashton (England)
13. Bowe (Ireland)
12. Roberts (Wales)
11. North (Wales)
10. Sexton (Ireland)
09. Youngs (England)
08. O'Brien (Ireland)
07. Warburton (Wales)
06. Robshaw (England)
05. Gray (Scotland)
04. Wyn-Jones (Wales)
03. Ross (Ireland)
02. Ford (Scotland)
01. Healy (Ireland)

B Team

15. Foden (England)
14. Evans (Scotland)
13. Tuilagi (England)
12. Henson (Wales)
11. Visser (Scotland)
10. Priestland (Wales)
09. Phillips (Wales)
08. Haskell (England
07. Barclay (Scotland)
06. Ferris (Ireland)
05. Charteris (Wales)
04. Lawes (England)
03. Jones (Wales)
02. Hartley (England)
01. Jenkins (Wales)

Way off

Jenkins
Best
Jones
Charteris and Gray
Warbs, O'Brien and Faletau
Philipps
Priestland
Ashton
Roberts
Tuilagi
North
Halfpenny

Hilarious. Why would anyone suggest a side of mostly Welsh players that lost 3 games at the recent RWC and finshed 4th in the most recent 6N

You're quite right it is a bit strange.

Except,

If you accept that Wales' style of play was effective then what you may do is look at the Welsh team as your basis and bring in players from the other three countries who execute that style of play better than any given Welsh player. You could just as easily do this with the Irish team as I believe it is their coaches that lost them the quarter final, not the players.

If you don't accept that, then you could even base the team on England and their style of play. It will be interesting to see how that develops over the next 18 months.

It is too early for this thread in all honesty. It's after the HC final on 2013 that the jigsaw pieces will be known.

Wales style of pay was so effective that they lost 3 games in 7 matches....

As you say, it's far too early to be picking a side for matches that will take place in over 18 months time.

Wales did the best at the RWC out of the Home Nations that make up the Lions their regions are also doing very well in the HEC.

Therefor you would have to presume that it would be likely that if a Lions team was drawn up now, it would be predominantly made up of Welsh players.

maestegmafia wrote:Wales did the best at the RWC out of the Home Nations that make up the Lions their regions are also doing very well in the HEC.

Therefor you would have to presume that it would be likely that if a Lions team was drawn up now, it would be predominantly made up of Welsh players.

Just ignore the WUM.

Another one...!

maestegmafia wrote:Wales did the best at the RWC out of the Home Nations that make up the Lions their regions are also doing very well in the HEC.

Therefor you would have to presume that it would be likely that if a Lions team was drawn up now, it would be predominantly made up of Welsh players.

But the Lions team isn't being drawn up now.

As for Wales "did the best" at the RWC, they still lost their last two matches, their last one against Australia. England and Ireland have both won their last matches against Australia......

And I'm not quite sure what regions doing well in the HEC has to do with Lions squad selection.

England rugby fan wrote:

maestegmafia wrote:Wales did the best at the RWC out of the Home Nations that make up the Lions their regions are also doing very well in the HEC.

Therefor you would have to presume that it would be likely that if a Lions team was drawn up now, it would be predominantly made up of Welsh players.

And I'm not quite sure what regions doing well in the HEC has to do with Lions squad selection.

The answer is - A lot

Players tend to be selected more for their club form than their international form.

Starting to see what you mean...! Not very interested in rugby...

Talking of club form, Munster and Edinburgh are both doing well for the Scots and Irish.

Interesting to see Vissers name touted about.

He has certainly been a top winger for Edinburgh for a good few seasons and I guess if he isnt already attached to his native Holland then he may appear with a thistle on his chest and possibly a Lions crest in a few seasons time.

Visser has not played for the Netherlands - he becomes Scotland qualified in the summer. I am pretty sure he wants to play for Scotland

He is the best winger int eh northern hemisphere - top scorer i teh rabobank pro 12 despite playing for one of the weaker teams who don't score a lot of tries.

a complete all round player unlike Ashton and the finished article unlike North. i different sort of player to williams

You shouldbe able to find edinburgh games on iplayer.

a few clips. He is quick, he is strong, he can step, he read the game

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HLaWLyOY5JI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QWK5-tysb3I
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xbKWBsa6yUc

England rugby fan wrote:Hilarious. Why would anyone suggest a side of mostly Welsh players that lost 3 games at the recent RWC and finshed 4th in the most recent 6N

You forgot to mention they also finished 4th in the most recent World Cup. That was a better finish than England.

Morgannwg wrote:

England rugby fan wrote:Hilarious. Why would anyone suggest a side of mostly Welsh players that lost 3 games at the recent RWC and finshed 4th in the most recent 6N

You forgot to mention they also finished 4th in the most recent World Cup. That was a better finish than England.

4th might as well have been last. It seems it's only the Welsh who remember when they come 4th.

Don't reply to wums or we will soon go the same way as the old 606.
If you think that somebody is a persistent wum just simply ignore them.

Once you have put somebody on ignore the only message you will then see is something like this.

This post was made by England rugby fan who is currently on your ignore list.

England rugby fan wrote:Wales style of pay was so effective that they lost 3 games in 7 matches....

As you say, it's far too early to be picking a side for matches that will take place in over 18 months time.

you are right we should pick all english cos they only lost 1 game.

Gatts wrote:

England rugby fan wrote:Wales style of pay was so effective that they lost 3 games in 7 matches....

As you say, it's far too early to be picking a side for matches that will take place in over 18 months time.

you are right we should pick all english cos they only lost 1 game.

Where has anyone suggested "we should pick all English" ? All that has been said is that the side shouldn't be mostly Welsh players.

wales606 wrote:

England rugby fan wrote:I'm not quite sure what regions doing well in the HEC has to do with Lions squad selection.

The answer is - A lot

Players tend to be selected more for their club form than their international form.

Yes, but not two years out from a tour.

England rugby fan wrote:
4th might as well have been last. It seems it's only the Welsh who remember when they come 4th.

It was better than Englands finish though. England rugby is currently in a right mess. Can you not post a comment without bringing your anti-welsh bias to the fore?

Cymroglan wrote:
This post was made by England rugby fan who is currently on your ignore list.

You are correct. I think England rugby embarrassment might find himself on a lot of ignore lists.

Morgannwg wrote:

England rugby fan wrote:
4th might as well have been last. It seems it's only the Welsh who remember when they come 4th.

It was better than Englands finish though. England rugby is currently in a right mess. Can you not post a comment without bringing your anti-welsh bias to the fore?

Can't you see that the first part of your reply makes the second part a bit pot-and-kettle?

luckless, just a method of pointing out the hypocrisies in all of "fans" posts.

Oh, you mean like punching someone to show that violence is wrong?

TJ wrote:

He is the best winger int eh northern hemisphere

hyperbole at it's best! how can he be the best in the NH without playing International rugby? I'd say the best would be one of three, Chris Ashton, Tommy Bowe or George North. Visser may well be good, but no-one knows if he'll be that good until he plays International rugby.

I think you're onto something that I call Morg's Perception there luckless, basically "it's lead by example." . I'm glad we had this discussion.

Turkster wrote:hyperbole at it's best! how can he be the best in the NH without playing International rugby? I'd say the best would be one of three, Chris Ashton, Tommy Bowe or George North. Visser may well be good, but no-one knows if he'll be that good until he plays International rugby.

Scored 2 for the Baa Baas against England earlier in the year

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:

Turkster wrote:hyperbole at it's best! how can he be the best in the NH without playing International rugby? I'd say the best would be one of three, Chris Ashton, Tommy Bowe or George North. Visser may well be good, but no-one knows if he'll be that good until he plays International rugby.

Scored 2 for the Baa Baas against England earlier in the year

well, he must be the best in the NH!



oh wait, didn't George North score 2 against England as well, so he must be the best in the NH?



oh damn, hasn't Tommy Bowe scored against England too, best in the NH must be!


Just unlucky for Chris Ashton he doesn't get to play against England, especially in a mean-nothing exhibition match, he of course is relegated to 4th in the NH now, poor Chris.

Turkster wrote:

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:

Turkster wrote:hyperbole at it's best! how can he be the best in the NH without playing International rugby? I'd say the best would be one of three, Chris Ashton, Tommy Bowe or George North. Visser may well be good, but no-one knows if he'll be that good until he plays International rugby.

Scored 2 for the Baa Baas against England earlier in the year

well, he must be the best in the NH!



oh wait, didn't George North score 2 against England as well, so he must be the best in the NH?



oh damn, hasn't Tommy Bowe scored against England too, best in the NH must be!


Just unlucky for Chris Ashton he doesn't get to play against England, especially in a mean-nothing exhibition match, he of course is relegated to 4th in the NH now, poor Chris.

And he has been the top scorer in the Magners/rabo Pro 12 2 years running and is well on his way to the Accolade again this year...... Currently he is arguably the form winger in the UK & Ireland at the moment. It's not really an something that can be argued against when considering his club form is all we have to go on. You are right in saying we won't know untill he plays in the Navy Blue but at the moment he is playing very well.

Try not to be so condescending next time mate. I'm here to debate not be made to look like a numpty!

as someone who gets fed up of the hyperbole coming from Welsh fans it's a shock to see it coming from a Scot, fair enough that sarcasm should have been directed at TJ not you though.

Have you seen Visser play?

He really is very good indeed. To be the top scorer in the magners / rabo 12 playing for a team that does not score many tries nor win many games shows something special

North still has a lot to prove, Ashton is a good but limited player, Bowe is a good player no doubt.

did yo have look at the youtube lips?

so North still has a lot to prove, but Visser hasn't? and he's yet to play a competitive international. Oh and by the way, have a look at Chris Ashton's international scoring record before you call him 'good but limited'.

Yup - thats right.

Ashton is good but limited - his defense is not he best and look how he gave up when he knocked on in a recent game allowing a try. he is not the all round player by any means

North may well prove to be the best of the lot but he is yet young and is not the finished article.

Having actually watched Visser play I am confident in just how good he is - have a look at the youtube clips.

Of course he may prove to be one of those players who cannot step up in the international arena but I doubt it.

Have you seen him play? have you even bothered to look at the clips I linked to?

1 Jenkins
2 Rees
3 A. Jones
4 Gray
5 Lawes
6 O'Brien
7 Warburton
8 Heaslip
9 Youngs
10 Priestland
11 North
12 Roberts
13 Tuilagi
14 Ashton
15 Foden

One thing's for sure. If McGeechan takes charge of the the tour the Ashton Swan Dive will be decommissioned.

TJ wrote:Yup - thats right.

Ashton is good but limited - his defense is not he best and look how he gave up when he knocked on in a recent game allowing a try. he is not the all round player by any means

North may well prove to be the best of the lot but he is yet young and is not the finished article.

Having actually watched Visser play I am confident in just how good he is - have a look at the youtube clips.

Of course he may prove to be one of those players who cannot step up in the international arena but I doubt it.

Have you seen him play? have you even bothered to look at the clips I linked to?

yes, I've seen him play, yes I watched those clips, and do you know, I think you're right, I don't think George North holds a candle to him, Ashton's try scoring record is nothing compared to those 3 clips, Tommy Bowe? who is he? Tim Visser might just be the best in the world, not just the entire Northern Hemisphere............seriously, look at what you're writing, it's complete and utter hyperbole.

Not that I actually said those things.

If yo think Ashton is a better all round player you know little about rugby. there is more to the game than being a superb poacher.

Visser is the top scorer in the Rabo / Magners two seasons running - so more tries than Bowe or North despite playing for a worse team.

its only an opinion adn in two years a lot can change.

TJ wrote:Not that I actually said those things.

If yo think Ashton is a better all round player you know little about rugby. there is more to the game than being a superb poacher.

Visser is the top scorer in the Rabo / Magners two seasons running - so more tries than Bowe or North despite playing for a worse team.

its only an opinion adn in two years a lot can change.

Aled Brew was 2nd on that try scoring list...but for some reason he isnt in anyones Lions team,...or Welsh team.

Jonathon Davies was high up on that list for most of the season, despite playing very few games - but internationally, he is in Jamie Roberts shadow.

TJ wrote:Not that I actually said those things.

If yo think Ashton is a better all round player you know little about rugby. there is more to the game than being a superb poacher.

Visser is the top scorer in the Rabo / Magners two seasons running - so more tries than Bowe or North despite playing for a worse team.

its only an opinion adn in two years a lot can change.

you said

He is the best winger int eh northern hemisphere

and you also said

a complete all round player unlike Ashton and the finished article unlike North.

so where did I get what you meant wrong?

oh, and you seemed to miss Tommy Bowe out altogether, so you obviously don't rate him.

I loathe these 'Lions starters' threads, especially as the tour is nigh on 2 YEARS AWAY! It just brings the tedious old arguements over which country this player is from etc. Lets ban these topics until post 2013 6 nations.

Breadvan wrote:I loathe these 'Lions starters' threads, especially as the tour is nigh on 2 YEARS AWAY! It just brings the tedious old arguements over which country this player is from etc. Lets ban these topics until post 2013 6 nations.

Breadvan wrote:I loathe these 'Lions starters' threads, especially as the tour is nigh on 2 YEARS AWAY! It just brings the tedious old arguements over which country this player is from etc. Lets ban these topics until post 2013 6 nations.

Have to agree with you there pal. I'm sure if we all ask dreamer nicely he would do just that.

Morgannwg

"SHE" not he

Breadvan wrote:I loathe these 'Lions starters' threads, especially as the tour is nigh on 2 YEARS AWAY! It just brings the tedious old arguements over which country this player is from etc. Lets ban these topics until post 2013 6 nations.

There is a ridiculousness to arguing about who will be in a team to play in 18 months time when we dont even know the squads for the 2012 6N let alone the 2013 6N. Player on form now may be in poor form in a couple of months or worse, injured. Players who havent broken through to the international team yet could be in contention for the 6N.

Not having these threads is wishful thinking, limiting a thread to who would be in the Lions if it was going to tour in a month would be more sensible. You'll still of course have people pushing for their own country's players though.

Its a good job no one forces anyone to contribute to threads that they don't want to...

I can't resist it -a hat trick for Visser and another man of the match

We cant even agree on what a test side should be when we know the squad trying to do it 18 months out - No Chance lol

Dan Norton from England 7s team needs to be fast tracked into the Lions

stnick88 wrote:1 Jenkins
2 Rees
3 A. Jones
4 Gray
5 Lawes
6 O'Brien
7 Warburton
8 Heaslip
9 Youngs
10 Priestland
11 North
12 Roberts
13 Tuilagi
14 Ashton
15 Foden

a few too many welsh in that team....we need a team that is going to actually beat the aussies.