Tennis Players

The mutual respect and friendship between Rafael Nadal and Roger Federer is well documented. Nadal gets on well with both Djokovic and Murray off court and Murray and Djokovic have a friendship dating back to junior days. In fact most of the top players appear to get on pretty well - the odd spat excepted. There have been a lot of doubles partnerships, I know that Murray has partnered Hewitt, Djokovic and Baghdatis amongst others in recent years. A recent article on V2 spoke excitedly of the potential of a Fedal doubles partnership later on in their careers -although I don't know if the players themselves have considered this.

The point is that, given that the players clearly get on well, why on earth don't a lot of their supporters??? Support who you want to, allow others to do the same, debate with respect and let history sort out who will be remembered for what.

Anyway rant over, just needed to get it off my chest! I feel like I need a tin hat before entering some of the threads recently.

We do not want to be the section with the locked threads!

+1

Not going to happen.

djlovesyou wrote:Not going to happen.

Probably not, but I feel better anyway - it was quite cathartic

Haha. Well that's certainly a positive thing.

The problem is that there are a number of people who despise one player more than they like the others.

That's why most threads are negative and those that are not negative gravitate that way.

The forum would benefit from aggressive moderation. The athletics board was great before the admins got involved.

The athletics board had nothing to do with the Admins DJ.
The problem with the athletics section was that there was a mod who deleted comments he disagreed with (and which didn't break site rules)

Would you like me to start deleting your comments that I dont agree with (but do not break any rules)?

There is always a common denominator that attracts trouble and on this forum there happens to be two.

Same applied on the old 606.

You don't have to be a Rocket Scientist to figure them out so no prizes.

Completely disagree SL.

The problem is that some are unable to ignore comments and decide to kick off and attack the poster instead.

Y I Man wrote:Completely disagree SL.

The problem is that some are unable to ignore comments and decide to kick off and attack the poster instead.

Good luck in attracting new members, and not just Federer fans.

In fairness Y I Man, it had everything to do with the admins.

Before it was pretty much thriving (without political nonsense), after the 'involvement' it died.

Tennis isn't going to die without proper moderation, but it will degenerate into a constant slanging match. The problem is the single-minded relentlessness of the people involved, people are always going to react to it. It needs nipping in the bud dictator style or we have anarchy. But they stay within 'house rules' so it's fine.

This is how our forum works. Posts that do not break site rules do not get deleted. It is up to the member to either debate it, or ignore it. It is really that simple. Our members in all the others sections are ok with that, why not in tennis?

And we do attract new members, I think the fact we have gained over 3,700 members and currently have 523 users online proves that.

ok, there haven't been that many new members in the tennis section, but that is because I simply haven't had the time to push for it in the same way the boxing and rugby admins have pushed their sections.

But as mentioned previously on my promotion thread, I plan to early on this year.

djlovesyou wrote:In fairness Y I Man, it had everything to do with the admins.

Again I disagree with that. The problem was a rogue mod who deleted comments he didnt agree with.
But If that principle is acceptable with you, is it then ok to delete your comment when you are blaming the Admins because I dont agree with it?
Or would you cry freedom of speech?

You see the problem here?
That is why we have our site rules. If a post doesn't break site rules, it stays, and that will never change.

Rogue mod. Funny stuff.

It had nothing to do with comments he didn't agree with.

It was only that 606 was a mess because of the political arguments. This is different from most sport sections because these people who were arguing were people relatively high up in the sport.

He decided that the section should be all about the discussion about the sport of athletics, and not a campaigning site about how well or badly the NGB was performing.

It just feels like, no matter what the thread is originally about, ends up in an argument and it is not all one way traffic. That's not even including articles with a clear negative agenda from the get-go.

I just don't understand the repetitiveness. It's not as if posters that have previously disagreed are suddenly going to go "It's all clear now, thank you for explaining it" because a 95th article with the same agenda is written. Variety is the spice of life, it would be nice to see a bit more here at times.

BTW this is NOT a comment directed at any single poster or group of posters. I have seen some great positive stuff written by all posters on here but there just seems to be too much negativity lately. As I am not a pro tennis player or employed in the industry tennis is pure escapism for me and I come on the boards to share my enjoyment of it with others. We need more joy on here!!!

carrieg4 wrote:The point is that, given that the players clearly get on well, why on earth don't a lot of their supporters??? Support who you want to, allow others to do the same, debate with respect and let history sort out who will be remembered for what.

1 - We do not know for sure Rafa and Roger get along that well. Afa I know they have not booked Hols together.
2 - When they fight on court, they fight. One doesn't even play according to the rule. When we debate against each other we debate. I try to keep my posting to the players and tennis. Problems is some posters don't and attack other posters.
3 - Unlike some, I post on many subjects about tennis. Some here only post when the sh@te hit the fan (they know who they are).
4 - And finally before some fanatics joined recently, this forum was not about Rafa, not about Roger or Nole it was about tennis. It's because some are so biased (or polarised) towards their idol that they see the rest of us completely biased.

v2 is good but it has lost a bit of its spirit it had before Xmas...sadly.

But that's the point though DJ, it wasn't up to him to decide how this forum should be run. He didn't make it, he didn't advertise it, he didn't put his money into it out of his own pocket. The Admins did.
He deleted stuff that he didn't agree with, and he had no right to.

Y I Man wrote:But that's the point though DJ, it wasn't up to him to decide how this forum should be run. He didn't make it, he didn't advertise it, he didn't put his money into it out of his own pocket. The Admins did.
He deleted stuff that he didn't agree with, and he had no right to.

Out of curiosity who was that mod?

Im not going to name him Tenez, but he is no longer an active member here.

carrieg4

The thing is if you write positive stuff about one player. "Player X is playing so well they must be favoutite for the AO". The implication is that Player X is going to beat player Y or do better than them. Someone that believes Player Y is playing really well and wants to be positive about them will object to what your saying. They will see you as being negative...

I agree with the escapism bit but player X and player Y can't both win.

Tenez wrote:Out of curiosity who was that mod?

I can assure you, it was not me.

carrieg4, I agree we need more joy on here, but it is up to you (the big you, not just you haha) as the members to do that and everyone needs to play their part.

But in any debate, if it is started off positive you are bound to get the opposite (negative) in a counter debate. But if it is done in a reasonable manner without the pot shots and the sly digs it will make for a much better atmosphere in the section.

Im am looking into doing a Hall of Fame for the tennis section which should give you something new and long time to chat about. (Just checking out the logistics of it all)

hawkeye wrote:I agree with the escapism bit but player X and player Y can't both win.

This is a prediction, correct? Player X or Player Y? Only a time machine or after the tournament can one say definitively.

laverfan wrote:

hawkeye wrote:I agree with the escapism bit but player X and player Y can't both win.

This is a prediction, correct? Player X or Player Y? Only a time machine or after the tournament can one say definitively.

I think player Z is better anyways

hawkeye wrote:Someone that believes Player Y is playing really well and wants to be positive about them will object to what your saying. They will see you as being negative...

Instead of objecting, the civil course would be to clearly articulate the case for player X or player Y or player Z.

Y I Man wrote:But that's the point though DJ, it wasn't up to him to decide how this forum should be run. He didn't make it, he didn't advertise it, he didn't put his money into it out of his own pocket. The Admins did.
He deleted stuff that he didn't agree with, and he had no right to.

So you feel the athletics section is doing better or worse without this 'rogue mod'?

Tenez wrote:

When we debate against each other we debate. I try to keep my posting to the players and tennis. Problems is some posters don't and attack other posters.

OK then.

Later on you comment:

Tenez wrote:
4 - And finally before some fanatics joined recently ... some are so biased (or polarised) towards their idol

Earlier today:

Tenez wrote:
Gosh - Life must be boring on MTL. There are some good posters there but they must have kicked the worst ones out.

It's a bit unfortnate for V2 which had an excellent tennis forum before some weirdos joined in.

...
I think that's me you're talking about, and that later comment meant that that respective thread had to be locked- after YI Man warned that there should be no personal attacks.

There are enough examples to go around on all sides, Amritia. Let us not regurgitate history.

Going back to the OP. I agree Carrie, as Lennon would say, Imagine (World Peace).

laverfan wrote:There are enough example to go around on all sides, Amritia. Let us not regurgitate history.

Yes but I didn't specifically say:
'I try to keep my posting to the players and tennis. Problems is some posters don't and attack other posters' and then go on to attack other posters in the same post.

Tenez wrote:1 - We do not know for sure Rafa and Roger get along that well. Afa I know they have not booked Hols together.
2 - When they fight on court, they fight. One doesn't even play according to the rule. When we debate against each other we debate. I try to keep my posting to the players and tennis. Problems is some posters don't and attack other posters.
3 - Unlike some, I post on many subjects about tennis. Some here only post when the sh@te hit the fan (they know who they are).
4 - And finally before some fanatics joined recently, this forum was not about Rafa, not about Roger or Nole it was about tennis. It's because some are so biased (or polarised) towards their idol that they see the rest of us completely biased.

v2 is good but it has lost a bit of its spirit it had before Xmas...sadly.

1. Have you seen that video on YouTube where they both laugh for 5 mins...seems very natural to me. Booking hols is abit extreme a point, no?
2. Tenez...come on. We all know your focus is almost exclusively on the denigration of Rafa's achievements, wrapped up in slightly different approaches but with the same thrust. Its been this way for many years across multiple forums. Many on here remember you from 606...
3. So why is it that nearly all "arguments" seem to involve you? Do you not think you're relentless posts on Nadal wind people up...including me...? People get sick of reading the same opinionated stuff, and it causes arguments.
4. This forum was very heavily pro-Federer for quite some time. All the Rafa fans left...remember the invasion of their section of the website to denigrate Nadal and them by you and BB...drop the holier than thou approach hey?

hawkeye wrote:carrieg4

The thing is if you write positive stuff about one player. "Player X is playing so well they must be favoutite for the AO". The implication is that Player X is going to beat player Y or do better than them. Someone that believes yPlayer Y is playing really well and wants to be positive about them will object to what your saying. They will see you as being negative...

I agree with the escapism bit but player X and player Y can't both win.

I agree to an extent hawkeye but there are ways and means. Of course writing a positive article will mean saying that you think player x will beat player y but that is the nature of debate and not negative in itself. Expressing the opinion that someone is the favourite for a tournament is fine and, although others may disagree, you would have to be pretty touchy to perceive it as an attack ( I have read a few such claims recently that made me chuckle). The negative bit comes in when posters supporting player x seek to denigrate player y's skills or personality excessively. This is embodied in the use of negative nicknames or the writing of certain articles which show little respect for other posters let alone the players.

laverfan wrote:There are enough examples to go around on all sides, Amritia. Let us not regurgitate history.

Agreed, it would be nice to think we could put all this behind us and move on from here. I won't remove the tin hat just yet though

lydian wrote:

Tenez wrote:1 - We do not know for sure Rafa and Roger get along that well. Afa I know they have not booked Hols together.
2 - When they fight on court, they fight. One doesn't even play according to the rule. When we debate against each other we debate. I try to keep my posting to the players and tennis. Problems is some posters don't and attack other posters.
3 - Unlike some, I post on many subjects about tennis. Some here only post when the sh@te hit the fan (they know who they are).
4 - And finally before some fanatics joined recently, this forum was not about Rafa, not about Roger or Nole it was about tennis. It's because some are so biased (or polarised) towards their idol that they see the rest of us completely biased.

v2 is good but it has lost a bit of its spirit it had before Xmas...sadly.

1. Have you seen that video on YouTube where they both laugh for 5 mins...seems very natural to me. Booking hols is abit extreme a point, no?
2. Tenez...come on. We all know your focus is almost exclusively on the denigration of Rafa's achievements, wrapped up in slightly different approaches but with the same thrust. Its been this way for many years across multiple forums. Many on here remember you from 606...
3. So why is it that nearly all "arguments" seem to involve you? Do you not think you're relentless posts on Nadal wind people up...including me...? People get sick of reading the same opinionated stuff, and it causes arguments.
4. This forum was very heavily pro-Federer for quite some time. All the Rafa fans left...remember the invasion of their section of the website to denigrate Nadal and them by you and BB...drop the holier than thou approach hey?

That pretty much sums it up. Although I did like the bit where he said 'some posters attack other posters' and then went on to attack me later on in the comment.

djlovesyou wrote:

Y I Man wrote:But that's the point though DJ, it wasn't up to him to decide how this forum should be run. He didn't make it, he didn't advertise it, he didn't put his money into it out of his own pocket. The Admins did.
He deleted stuff that he didn't agree with, and he had no right to.

So you feel the athletics section is doing better or worse without this 'rogue mod'?

It doesn't matter weather it's better or worse DJ, If they can't do their job fairly and just delete what they don't like the forum won't ever work anyway because your never be able to debate anything at all.


If i followed you around for a few weeks and deleted every comment you made you would get annoyed by it eventually and either complain to Mod/Admin or leave.

Y I Man wrote:carrieg4, I agree we need more joy on here, but it is up to you (the big you, not just you haha)

You had me worried for a sec there YI

Y I Man wrote:Im am looking into doing a Hall of Fame for the tennis section which should give you something new and long time to chat about. (Just checking out the logistics of it all)

Sounds great, can't wait

something new and long time

That should read new and long term
(typo on my behalf)

lydian wrote:3. So why is it that nearly all "arguments" seem to involve you? Do you not think you're relentless posts on Nadal wind people up...including me...? People get sick of reading the same opinionated stuff, and it causes arguments.

lydian, you don't have let it wind you up. You control your reaction. You could just go "Oh, there's another Tenez post about Nadal" and not let it wind you up. Or just not read it at all. Then you wouldn't be involved in any arguments, even if they did happen.
Any 'relentless' posts on any player by any poster are allowed as part of the forum and you can choose to join in or ignore as you see fit.

fernando wrote:

djlovesyou wrote:

Y I Man wrote:But that's the point though DJ, it wasn't up to him to decide how this forum should be run. He didn't make it, he didn't advertise it, he didn't put his money into it out of his own pocket. The Admins did.
He deleted stuff that he didn't agree with, and he had no right to.

So you feel the athletics section is doing better or worse without this 'rogue mod'?

It doesn't matter weather it's better or worse DJ, If they can't do their job fairly and just delete what they don't like the forum won't ever work anyway because your never be able to debate anything at all.


If i followed you around for a few weeks and deleted every comment you made you would get annoyed by it eventually and either complain to Mod/Admin or leave.

With the moderating we could discuss athletics.

Without the moderating we couldn't hence the death of the section. Admins felt proud of a job well done.

If it ever got popular again, it would go the same way.

Each different sport has different moderation needs. And perhaps this one needs something a bit more than 'oh be nice everyone'.

Understood JHM. But that's easier said than done when you've been reading the same points of view for 5 years - and those same viewpoints are all over this forum on a daily basis. Also, nothing else on here winds me up, and I argue with no one else. Its winds alot of people up, not just me.

DJ, you can only see what is posted on the board.
PM's have been sent, and temporary bans have been dished out previously (and will continue until members realise they cant insult others on here)

lydian wrote:Understood JHM. But that's easier said than done when you've been reading the same points of view for 5 years - and those same viewpoints are all over this forum on a daily basis. Also, nothing else on here winds me up, and I argue with no one else. Its winds alot of people up, not just me.

I think this seems to happen during a lack of tennis action.
I might be wrong, but thats the opinion I get, as obviously during a slam or an event there is certainly more to chat about.

lydian wrote:Understood JHM. But that's easier said than done when you've been reading the same points of view for 5 years - and those same viewpoints are all over this forum on a daily basis. Also, nothing else on here winds me up, and I argue with no one else. Its winds alot of people up, not just me.

I'm not wound up by Tenez because I'm not a Nadal fan. But sometimes the Federer and Murray hating group wind me up.

It's the same from all angles.

These people have one thing in mind, and that's to aggravate other posters. Freedom of speech is fine, but when it's so deliberate and relentless (but within house rules) you can see how people are getting upset. It's these people who are getting annoyed who are getting the bans, not the people who are here to disrupt.

lydian wrote:Understood JHM. But that's easier said than done when you've been reading the same points of view for 5 years - and those same viewpoints are all over this forum on a daily basis. Also, nothing else on here winds me up, and I argue with no one else. Its winds alot of people up, not just me.

But that's hilarious! What news have we read from you over the last 5 years? Did I miss something?

Why dont we have a brain storm to try to come up with stuff that is positive for the section.

We have the prediction league coming.
Im looking into doing our own Hall of Fame.
What about a legends section where we can post youtube clips (within spoiler tabs) and discuss the great players of the game in a 'Tennis Vault' where you can store information and videos.

Anything else you can think of?

Y I Man wrote:

laverfan wrote:

hawkeye wrote:I agree with the escapism bit but player X and player Y can't both win.

This is a prediction, correct? Player X or Player Y? Only a time machine or after the tournament can one say definitively.

I think player Z is better anyways

Ha ha! And then someone will come along and upset everyone...

hawkeye wrote:

Y I Man wrote:

laverfan wrote:

hawkeye wrote:I agree with the escapism bit but player X and player Y can't both win.

This is a prediction, correct? Player X or Player Y? Only a time machine or after the tournament can one say definitively.

I think player Z is better anyways

Ha ha! And then someone will come along and upset everyone...

Im coming out of retirement

Watch out for a fat man with the dodgy serve World no.1 in five years i tell you

Y I Man wrote:Why dont we have a brain storm to try to come up with stuff that is positive for the section.

We have the prediction league coming.
Im looking into doing our own Hall of Fame.
What about a legends section where we can post youtube clips (within spoiler tabs) and discuss the great players of the game in a 'Tennis Vault' where you can store information and videos.

Anything else you can think of?

All sound good YI.

The 606 tennis poster awards that LK ran last year was fun - would like that to be a regular annual feature.

Can we have an article sharing section or are there copyright problems? Would be easier than writing an article to accompany the article when time is short.

If you are copying and pasting another source, just pop a link at the bottom to the source.
Or if time is short, its ok to just post the link with a one liner saying what it is about.
As long as the source is put on the thread here, it covers copyright issues.

When you say article sharing, what type of articles?
Articles from times gone by for the 'Vault' or current articles?
If it is current, it would probably be best suited on the main section.

Im not saying we will deffo have the vault, but it is a possibility. (if you think its a good idea) I think it would be a good facility to store your favourite video clips etc in one place to share and talk about.

Y I Man wrote:When you say article sharing, what type of articles?
Articles from times gone by for the 'Vault' or current articles?
If it is current, it would probably be best suited on the main section.

Im not saying we will deffo have the vault, but it is a possibility. (if you think its a good idea) I think it would be a good facility to store your favourite video clips etc in one place to share and talk about.

I was thinking historical mostly. It could tie in nicely with the video vault which is a great idea.