IRB advise Steven Shingler ineligible to play for Scotland

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/welsh/16428283.stm

Steve Shingler is ineligible to play for any other country than Wales, the International Rugby Board has advised.

The 20-year-old fly-half was named in Scotland's Six Nations squad despite playing for Wales Under-20s against France in the 2011 Six Nations.

Shingler's eligibility to play for Scotland was examined by the IRB after it was questioned by the WRU.

"He is tied to Wales and ineligible to play for any other Union," a IRB statement advised.

But the IRB statement went on to say: "The SRU and WRU may wish the IRB Regulations Committee to consider this matter formally in accordance with IRB Regulation Two.

"The Unions are aware of the requirements of such a review."

The IRB ruling was made despite Shingler saying he "declined to sign a declaration" committing to Wales.

The IRB investigated after being contacted by both Wales and Scotland.

Continue reading the main story
Steven has informed us that he made it clear that he wished to leave open his international eligibility as he was also eligible to represent Scotland and England as well as Wales
Scottish Rugby statement
Wales believed that playing for their Under-20s against France Under-20s in 2011 means that he could only represent them in the future.

Neither Wales nor France run an A side and under IRB regulation eight meant that in 2011 their Under-20 teams were also considered to be their 2nd XVs.

And as the match was sanctioned by the IRB as a "next senior XV-a-side national representative team", any player on the field would have committed his future to that country for the rest of his international career.


Scotland were confident that Shingler, who has a Dumfries-born mother, was eligible to play for them despite playing full-back for Wales Under-20s.

They cited the example of two players who represented Wales Under-20s against France Under-20s in 2010 but subsequently declared for Ireland.

However, Wales claimed the situation was different with Shingler because the game in 2011 had a different status to the one the year before.

On 6 January the WRU said they had written to the IRB to outline how they had informed relevant players, including Shingler, that they were entitled "only to selection for Wales" following the Under-20 match against France.

And 24 hours earlier the Welsh board said: "Shingler was told by the U20 team management that if he played in the game he would become a Wales qualified player and therefore ineligible for selection for any other nation."


However, Shingler claimed he "declined to sign a declaration" and is therefore able to choose to play for Scotland.

The SRU said: "Steven has informed us that he made it clear that he wished to leave open his international eligibility as he was also eligible to represent Scotland and England as well as Wales."

It added that when picking Shingler it had taken into account the ruling by the IRB last year that former Wales Under-20s players James Loxton and Matthew Jarvis are eligible to play for Ireland, despite facing France Under-20s in 2010.

Well looks the WRU won this one!

At least it seems they have got their asses covered now after the Loxton and Jarvis shambles.

I think this is the correct decision based upon the rules and for once the IRB have got it right.

However, I still think the IRB needs to take another look at this rule because it is a crazy situation.

Shingler has played 14 times for the U20's but it is only this one game against France in 2011 that has brought about this situation, the other 13 games wouldn't have made any difference (including against France in 2010), which quite frankly is a crazy situation.

What a fiasco, I wonder if this will be challenged further by the player himself if he feels he was misled. Wouldn't like to be him now, probably alienated himself from the whole of Wales.

The SRU are taking their case to the IRB Regs Committee now. Doubt the outcome will be different. They've proper screwed this kid's international career.

doctornickolas wrote:I think this is the correct decision based upon the rules and for once the IRB have got it right.

However, I still think the IRB needs to take another look at this rule because it is a crazy situation.

Shingler has played 14 times for the U20's but it is only this one game against France in 2011 that has brought about this situation, the other 13 games wouldn't have made any difference (including against France in 2010), which quite frankly is a crazy situation.

I agree I think it should be ANY capped U20 game so we all know where we are.

Scot Abroad wrote:The SRU are taking their case to the IRB Regs Committee now. Doubt the outcome will be different. They've proper screwed this kid's international career.

Not really, but they have made themselves look very stupid, why announce the guy is in the Scotland squad when they weren't totally sure, they must of known the WRU would object, and why risk upsetting them anyway?
After all the WRU has looked after Scotland pretty well since 1999 even going to war with their own clubs to have them included in the Welsh/Scottish league when none of our clubs wanted to travel there. It's a bit like accepting a bed for the night, having a free breakfest then slapping the person who did that to you across the face. The WRU are well known for holding grudges.

AlynDavies wrote:

doctornickolas wrote:I think this is the correct decision based upon the rules and for once the IRB have got it right.

However, I still think the IRB needs to take another look at this rule because it is a crazy situation.

Shingler has played 14 times for the U20's but it is only this one game against France in 2011 that has brought about this situation, the other 13 games wouldn't have made any difference (including against France in 2010), which quite frankly is a crazy situation.

I agree I think it should be ANY capped U20 game so we all know where we are.

I disagree, I think Wales and France should have an official A team. Even if it's technically the U20, it should be called the A team. Remove the confusion.

AlynDavies wrote:

doctornickolas wrote:I think this is the correct decision based upon the rules and for once the IRB have got it right.

However, I still think the IRB needs to take another look at this rule because it is a crazy situation.

Shingler has played 14 times for the U20's but it is only this one game against France in 2011 that has brought about this situation, the other 13 games wouldn't have made any difference (including against France in 2010), which quite frankly is a crazy situation.

I agree I think it should be ANY capped U20 game so we all know where we are.

Scot Abroad wrote:The SRU are taking their case to the IRB Regs Committee now. Doubt the outcome will be different. They've proper screwed this kid's international career.

Not really, but they have made themselves look very stupid, why announce the guy is in the Scotland squad when they weren't totally sure, they must of known the WRU would object, and why risk upsetting them anyway?
After all the WRU has looked after Scotland pretty well since 1999 even going to war with their own clubs to have them included in the Welsh/Scottish league when none of our clubs wanted to travel there. It's a bit like accepting a bed for the night, having a free breakfest then slapping the person who did that to you across the face. The WRU are well known for holding grudges.

Yep, I agree, all U20 games should count.

Scot Abroad wrote:I agree I think it should be ANY capped U20 game so we all know where we are.

I disagree, I think Wales and France should have an official A team. Even if it's technically the U20, it should be called the A team. Remove the confusion.[/quote]

But very few countries actually have an A side anyway.
Juniour All Blacks
Fiji Warriors
England Saxons
Argentina Jaguars, etc, etc, I think it's only Scotland and Ireland who have an A team.

IRB Regulation Two.
The Council shall appoint on an annual basis a committee of
representatives (“the Regulations Committee”) from Unions and/or
Associations represented on the Council. The Regulations Committee
shall rule on matters of interpretation and/or implementation of these
Regulations referred to it by the CEO. The quorum of the Committee shall
be three. Upon referral of a matter to it the Committee shall be entitled to
regulate its own procedures save that the rulings of the Committee shall be
made by majority.
2.2.2 In the event of any dispute or uncertainty in respect of the interpretation or
implementation of these Regulations, a Union or Association may make a
written request for clarification to the CEO. On receipt of such a request,
the CEO must (1), whether personally or through a designee attempt to
resolve the dispute or uncertainty by a ruling to the satisfaction of the
parties concerned; or (2) refer the matter to the Regulations Committee for
a ruling; or (3) refer the matter to a Judicial Officer or Judicial Committee
for adjudication under Regulation 18.2(d). If the CEO or his designee fails
to resolve the dispute or uncertainty to the satisfaction of the parties within
28 days of receipt of the request, the CEO shall refer the matter to the
Regulations Committee in accordance with (2) above or to a Judicial
Officer or Judicial Committee in accordance with (3) above.
2.2.3 Any ruling made by the Regulations Committee, the CEO or his designee
shall, be intimated in writing to the Union or Association concerned
giving full reasons for the Committee or CEO or designee’s decision or
ruling as soon as it is made, subject to any appeal under 2.2.4 below bind
all Unions and Associations unless and until otherwise determined at a
meeting of the Council.
2.2.4 Appeals - A Union/Association which has been the subject of a decision
or ruling by the Regulations Committee or by the CEO shall have the right
of appeal against such a decision to the Council of the International Rugby
Board (which body for this appeal hearing may not include any member of
the Regulations Committee which heard the original matter), but only if a
Notice of Appeal is lodged with the CEO within 14 days of receipt of
notification by the Union or Association of the decision of the Regulations
Committee.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
You can work it out.

The Scots will just have to go back to picking second-rate Aussies and Kiwis.

http://www.irb.com/newsmedia/mediazone/pressrelease/newsid=2060955.html#shingler+eligibility+clarification

The International Rugby Board has been requested by the Scottish Rugby Union and Welsh Rugby Union to clarify the eligibility status of Steven Shingler.

Under IRB Regulation 8 a player is tied to a country if he or she has played for the senior national fifteen-a-side national representative team or the next senior national representative team or the senior national representative Sevens team against opposition of the same designation. The national Under 20 team can be designated as the next senior national team under the Regulation.

It is the right of a Union to choose whatever team it wishes to be designated as its next senior national representative team. It is also the sole responsibility of a Union to ensure that players selected to play for the teams designated with IRB Regulation 8 are eligible to do so.

The IRB has reiterated to both Unions that during 2011 both Wales and France officially designated their Under 20 team to be the next senior national team. As the IRB has been advised that Shingler represented Wales Under 20 against France Under 20 in 2011 it would therefore indicate that he is tied to Wales and ineligible to play for any other Union.

The SRU and WRU may wish the IRB Regulations Committee to consider this matter formally in accordance with IRB Regulation 2. The Unions are aware of the requirements of such a review.

AlynDavies wrote:Well looks the WRU won this one!

At least it seems they have got their asses covered now after the Loxton and Jarvis shambles.

AD, no, nobody "won" this one, least of all the player

Was a players International carreer taken out this morning and shot?
Isa Nacewa.

AlynDavies wrote:

Scot Abroad wrote:

I disagree, I think Wales and France should have an official A team. Even if it's technically the U20, it should be called the A team. Remove the confusion.

But very few countries actually have an A side anyway.
Juniour All Blacks
Fiji Warriors
England Saxons
Argentina Jaguars, etc, etc, I think it's only Scotland and Ireland who have an A team.

But they are all called something other than the U20. Italy is the other team that has one. Even Georgia has an A team, so the WRU can't use money as an excuse. I'm not saying call it Wales A, you can use whatever name. The confusion is arising because Wales and France are playing their second nominated team in a competition where other countries are not. This is the problem and that needs to be fixed.

how can an age grade team be designated the next SENIOR representative team. By very definition, it is not senior.

Countries should either have an A team, or no next representative senior side. Declaring whatever team you want as one which locks players in is ridiculous. Might aswell declare the schools team as the next senior representative team.

It appears too late for Shingler, but as this is not the first dispute, the regulations need to be reviewed and possibly ammended to stop this happening again.

Yeah its weird, i think think that a countries second team should be a mens teams. U20's is a junior side technically.

WRU Statement:

WELSH RUGBY UNION STATEMENT IN RESPONSE TO IRB DECISION

The WRU welcomes the IRB announcement which confirms that proper procedures
were followed when informing the 2011 Wales U20 team to play France they
would be solely Wales qualified at senior level after taking part in the
game.

It is important that all players informed of their potential senior
selection status now or in future are left in no doubt about the authority
of the regulations and protocols in place.

The case of Steven Shingler being named as an RBS 6 Nations Scotland squad
player could not be left untested because of the impact on all other
players.

The person at the centre of this isnt the SRU, WRU or Shingler. Its the agent giving the lad advice that tried to chance his arm.

Will Shingler be named in the Welsh Squad now?

I don't think that U20 team should be able to count as a 2nd team for any country, if a country decides not to have an A team and are going to lose players because of it then that is their own problem
U20 is an age grade team so surely it can't be selected as the next SENIOR representitave team
Feel for Shingler in all of this

So basically the IRB takes nearly a week to point out the obvious about the Wales under 20 team and suggests the SRU and WRU may want the "IRB Regulations Committee to consider the matter formally in accordance wiith IRB Regulation 2." Which is what the SRU are going to do...

"And the Scottish Rugby Union have vowed to defend their stance by referring the matter to the IRB's Regulations Committee so the case can be considered "formally." "We remain fully supportive of the player and his sincere desire to represent Scotland," added the SRU statement." (BBC Website)

Well... that cleared that one up!

Does that mean that under 20s should not be selected for A sides.
A sides tie in players so there is no difference, Wales just like any other country could fill their A side with youngsters.
What Shingler should have done was make himself unavailable to play against France in 2011.

The problem with under 20's is that,that could include players as young as 18 or even 17,and then they shift to another country on the other side of the World...its nuts..

Even if Shingler was selected by Wales,could he really in his heart play for not only a country that he doesnt want to play for,but also a country that has just grassed him up to the cops?

aucklandlaurie
Are you aware that Shingler recently has gone on record several times stating his desire to play for Wales.
A sides can also tie in youngsters.
Grassed him up... Wales would have no option Wales would have broken the rules if they had not informed the IRB that he was ineligible to play for another country and also to ensure the rest of the squad would not be poached.

Who said he didn't want to play for us? He was saying quite the contrary less than two months back. He's been pretty rash and indecisive by all means but provided he grows up, gets his head down and plays, he'll be given his fair chance.

Cymroglan wrote:aucklandlaurie
Are you aware that Shingler recently has gone on record several times stating his desire to play for Wales.
A sides can also tie in youngsters.
Grassed him up... Wales would have no option Wales would have broken the rules if they had not informed the IRB that he was ineligible to play for another country and also to ensure the rest of the squad would not be poached.

Agreed, a precedent will have been set when the official verdict goes down in our favour. As has been said, nobody will nick our players.

Cymroglan wrote:Does that mean that under 20s should not be selected for A sides.
A sides tie in players so there is no difference, Wales just like any other country could fill their A side with youngsters.
What Shingler should have done was make himself unavailable to play against France in 2011.

The thing is at that time Shingler actually wanted to play for Wales, as shown by a number of quotes from a variety of newspapers. When he realised he might be further down the pecking order than he first thought he decided to go for a cheap, easy cap with Scotland where he should have just knuckled down and tried to work towards a Welsh cap. That's the thing now, if a player see's his path to international stardom blocked by someone else they jump ship and go for caps elsewhere. It's stupid, I think pulling on an international shirt at any age grade or sevens should tie you to that nation.

Cymro
No I wasnt aware that he had said that he wanted to play for Wales,So why didnt he just declare his unavailability to Scotland?
The point I was making regarding 17/18 year old is that that is far too young to have to committ to one nation.
I did not know that Wales were duty bound to raise the matter with the IRB?
Point is...Is it really that much skin off Wales's nose that they have to worry about poaching? It can work both ways...I dont belive that wales are that hard up for young players.

for me, this smacks of lack of national pride.

If he felt he was Scottish, he should have played for Scotland A/ U20.

He didnt.

He is no more Scottish than he is English. He wants to play in front of a huge crowd at international level (nothing wrong with that).

He doesnt care who its for (a lot wrong with that IMO).

I hope he becomes good enough to play for Wales as he obviously wants to play for a national team. Hope he also comes out and explains why he acccepted the Scottish offer.

What Shingler should have done was make himself unavailable to play against France in 2011.

Of course with hindsight this would have kept his eligibilty open and would have prevented the problem but he obviously thought by not signing the declaration he would not end up in this situation.

At the end of the day I think most people agree the regulations need amended to make it clearer and fairer. It's unfortunate this may only happen now that a player with a lot of potential has realisticallylost out on the chance to play international rugby. I really feel sorry for Shingler, regardless of the reasons behind his decision.

aucklandlaurie
I believe that his agent gave him the wrong advice he filled his head with nonsense so that he could line his own pocket.

It's not a case of being hard up but we can ill afford to give players away that we have financed to go through the academies.

Coymro
If it was the agent/manager giving dodgy advice,then that is very similar to Isa Nacewa scenario.when he played sevens for Fiji...
I can understand unions being concious of the returns they get for money spent in acadamies but really is it that big an issue if the odd player jumps the fence?nothing is perfect, sometimes players have time and money spent on them but they just dont turn out as good as maybe originally anticipated.

Its been overdone man. Check the main article. Since merged with other articles.

I, personally, hope the EU overrule the IRB and give him his freedom. That would put the IRB back into its disorganised box. Love to see that happen. Then, they would have to set clear & strict rules from the outset.

And, put the French in their place. Their shifting of their own rules - is a joke.

See Bosman. See trouble for the IRB. They need to be brought to heel.

If they had let him go then the other 21 in the match day squad would also be vulnerable to poaching.

gee cymro I didnt appreciate that poaching was that prevalent up there,Maybe wales should poach players off other countries as well then everything would be even....

Adam D wrote:I hope he becomes good enough to play for Wales as he obviously wants to play for a national team. Hope he also comes out and explains why he acccepted the Scottish offer.

I think you're being too harsh on him. I grew up in Aus but i'm Scottish, and when you have that sort of division of nationality then it becomes difficult to choose which one you really are. Most of my mates reckon i'm more Aussie than Scottish but I still have a fierce pride for Scotland, brought on by my Scottish relatives. If I was in his sort of pickle about Aus vs Scotland I'd be pretty annoyed if fans were demanding I must choose Australia becuase that's where I grew up.

Adam D wrote:for me, this smacks of lack of national pride.

If he felt he was Scottish, he should have played for Scotland A/ U20.

He didnt.

He is no more Scottish than he is English. He wants to play in front of a huge crowd at international level (nothing wrong with that).

He doesnt care who its for (a lot wrong with that IMO).

I hope he becomes good enough to play for Wales as he obviously wants to play for a national team. Hope he also comes out and explains why he acccepted the Scottish offer.

I bet there was an Agent involved. Was the boy swayed? Rugby turning into soccer?

Im moving over to girlie beach-volleyball if that happens. In fact...

He should have been advised from the start. All young players should be given a copy of the rules and made sign them. Bad enough as they are right now.

The IRB is a disgrace. I hope this lad is a test case for change . A Bosman. To enforce clear rules. And overrule any National (French or otherwise) irregularities.

This situation should never have arisen in the first place.

Didn't Manu Tuilagi get capped by England A (Saxons) at the age of 18? Surely this is too young for him to make that decision. What if, at the age of 20, he wanted to represent Samoa? But it's OK because it's an A team, right? Cristian Wade did the same thing by playing 7s for England at the age of 18. In fact, England Saxons, like other A teams, often cap young players as the first step towards full international honours, don't they?

I do feel a bit sorry for Shingler here because it looks like he's been caught out on a technicality. However, he played for Wales 14 times so you'd think that that would count for something. Hardly a one cap wonder, even if it is at the age of 18-20.

[quote="bsando"]

Adam D wrote:I hope he becomes good enough to play for Wales as he obviously wants to play for a national team. Hope he also comes out and explains why he acccepted the Scottish offer.

I think you're being too harsh on him. I grew up in Aus but i'm Scottish, and when you have that sort of division of nationality then it becomes difficult to choose which one you really are. Most of my mates reckon i'm more Aussie than Scottish but I still have a fierce pride for Scotland, brought on by my Scottish relatives. If I was in his sort of pickle about Aus vs Scotland I'd be pretty annoyed if fans were demanding I must choose Australia becuase that's where I grew up. [/quote
My family moved to England when I was 13.I was Welsh before we moved,I am still Welsh and I cannot see how/why this should/would change.I just dont get it.

Griff wrote:Didn't Manu Tuilagi get capped by England A (Saxons) at the age of 18? Surely this is too young for him to make that decision. What if, at the age of 20, he wanted to represent Samoa? But it's OK because it's an A team, right? Cristian Wade did the same thing by playing 7s for England at the age of 18. In fact, England Saxons, like other A teams, often cap young players as the first step towards full international honours, don't they?

I do feel a bit sorry for Shingler here because it looks like he's been caught out on a technicality. However, he played for Wales 14 times so you'd think that that would count for something. Hardly a one cap wonder, even if it is at the age of 18-20.

True Griff. So he is Welsh. But, why did this even happen?

The Welsh not having an A team contributed and the French deciding between their A's and their U20 side, to alter the rules on the run - is also a joke. This is not just about Shingler.
The implications are HUGE.

Apologies for stuffing up my last post.It seems that loyalty has gone out of fashion these days.Whem we moved to the midlands I took Wolverhampton Wanderers as my footie team.I have stuck with them through thin and thin for the last 45 years even though I have no biological/geograhical tie.I could have changed allegiance but that would have been plain wrong.

Griff, he did play for Welsh age group sides 14 times, but by his own actions he did not believe this committed him at the senior level - he explicitly acted in a way that he believed left his options open. His words (about ambitions to be a Welsh senior player) may be cheap, but his actions spoke - you can't argue with that.

Also, I'm not clear why folks think that his agent was behind all this and that his agent's motivation was money? I'm not getting the link - can someone pls explain?

[quote="Taffineastbourne"]

bsando wrote:

Adam D wrote:I hope he becomes good enough to play for Wales as he obviously wants to play for a national team. Hope he also comes out and explains why he acccepted the Scottish offer.

I think you're being too harsh on him. I grew up in Aus but i'm Scottish, and when you have that sort of division of nationality then it becomes difficult to choose which one you really are. Most of my mates reckon i'm more Aussie than Scottish but I still have a fierce pride for Scotland, brought on by my Scottish relatives. If I was in his sort of pickle about Aus vs Scotland I'd be pretty annoyed if fans were demanding I must choose Australia becuase that's where I grew up. [/quote
My family moved to England when I was 13.I was Welsh before we moved,I am still Welsh and I cannot see how/why this should/would change.I just dont get it.

TaffinE, it's great that the issue is so clear cut for you, but what if it wasn't for Shingler?

AsLongAsBut100ofUs

"As far as we are aware - and there is some stuff around from his agent - Steve Shingler is qualified for Scotland and will be taking up that unless he is advised or informed by the IRB not to do so

"His agent and him are taking legal advice about the whole situation and I've just told Steve to concentrate on what he does week in and week out."
http://www1.skysports.com/rugby-union/news/12331/7418924/Shingler-row-a-distraction-

Taffineastbourne wrote:Apologies for stuffing up my last post.It seems that loyalty has gone out of fashion these days.Whem we moved to the midlands I took Wolverhampton Wanderers as my footie team.I have stuck with them through thin and thin for the last 45 years even though I have no biological/geograhical tie.I could have changed allegiance but that would have been plain wrong.

TaffinE, I suspect that your definition of loyalty and mine are pretty similar, but is it not possible that Shingler's is different - cant we just accept that possibility? English father, Scots mum, born in Wales, raised in Wales - I can see he could be confuddled. By his actions, altho not his words, he clearly thought he was keeping his options open. Maybe it is just possible that he felt sufficient affinity to any one of the 3 countries for which he is eligible to play for them? He doesn't have to think like us

[quote="AsLongAsBut100ofUs"]

Taffineastbourne wrote:

bsando wrote:

Adam D wrote:I hope he becomes good enough to play for Wales as he obviously wants to play for a national team. Hope he also comes out and explains why he acccepted the Scottish offer.

I think you're being too harsh on him. I grew up in Aus but i'm Scottish, and when you have that sort of division of nationality then it becomes difficult to choose which one you really are. Most of my mates reckon i'm more Aussie than Scottish but I still have a fierce pride for Scotland, brought on by my Scottish relatives. If I was in his sort of pickle about Aus vs Scotland I'd be pretty annoyed if fans were demanding I must choose Australia becuase that's where I grew up. [/quote
My family moved to England when I was 13.I was Welsh before we moved,I am still Welsh and I cannot see how/why this should/would change.I just dont get it.

TaffinE, it's great that the issue is so clear cut for you, but what if it wasn't for Shingler?

I think that it is very sad on a number of levels.I just hope that Wales are "big" enough to select him if/when he becomes good enough and they let bygones be bygones.

C, I might also turn to my advisor/agent if I was a top sportsman dealing with an issue with which I didn't feel comfortable. Nothing wrong with that. Someone is making the leap that his agent had some Machiavellian motive behind turning him from the dragon to the thistle which may not be the case at all?

Would you employ such a clueless agent ? I would bet my bottom $ that it was the agent that approached Scotland this is what agents do.
During the world cup Gatland put a ban on agents approaching players.

Gibson wrote:

Griff wrote:Didn't Manu Tuilagi get capped by England A (Saxons) at the age of 18? Surely this is too young for him to make that decision. What if, at the age of 20, he wanted to represent Samoa? But it's OK because it's an A team, right? Cristian Wade did the same thing by playing 7s for England at the age of 18. In fact, England Saxons, like other A teams, often cap young players as the first step towards full international honours, don't they?

I do feel a bit sorry for Shingler here because it looks like he's been caught out on a technicality. However, he played for Wales 14 times so you'd think that that would count for something. Hardly a one cap wonder, even if it is at the age of 18-20.

True Griff. So he is Welsh. But, why did this even happen?

The Welsh not having an A team contributed and the French deciding between their A's and their U20 side, to alter the rules on the run - is also a joke. This is not just about Shingler.
The implications are HUGE.

I guess the reason why this has happened is because IRB protection has back fired. I'm guessing, but I reckon at some point they thought "we're protecting teams from poaching with the '1 cap and you're tied policy', but what about those without an A side?". I'm theory, before these laws poorer nations without A sides could go to the under 20s world cup, put their players on the world stage, and then lose them to bigger richer nations who fancied some of their dual qualified players. My guess is that's why they brought in the U20s as a second team of there is no A team. Unfortunately, it's backfired a bit because this issue has surfaced in a nation that isn't one of the 'poorer' nations and so doesn't need the protection that other poorer nations may need. Still, you can't have one rule for them and one for us so they had to stick by it in this case.

It is ridiculous though I agree. They should decide tomorrow: All U20s are capped or only Senior games are capped. But, that does pose a problem for some smaller nations with no A team, so we're back to the IRBs original conundrum.