Semi-Final Thread - Djokovic V Murray

[CaledonianCraig]

First topic message reminder :

All set for the off. I hope it is a great match and best of luck Andy.

Discuss....

[LuvSports!]

what a roar from novak incredible commitment!

[barrystar]

That was way too casual with that overhead, he suddenly wondered whether to take it on the bounce and the hestitation was fatal.

[Tom_____]

Have to think if Murray loses this set then he out of there 6-2 in the 4th

I wouldn't be so sure. But anyway Murray wins the set to go two sets to one up. Are you rooting for Djokovic?

No, always preferred Murray's variety myself

[Tenez]

There's only one winner today: Nadal

Don't agree at all. If Murray wins this he won't have time to be tired for the final.

Murray has not shown yet he can win big match. He has touble putting a tired Djoko away.

[barrystar]

Oh goodness, just the precise opposite of what he needed.

[Guest]

I think if Murray wins this he will need to borrow Djokovic's recuperating egg chamber

Anyway Murray is boken in the first game of the fourth set.

[Simple_Analyst]

5th set coming.

[Guest]

I think if Murray wins this he will need to borrow Djokovic's recuperating egg chamber ...

Actually they probably both need to use it whoever wins this match. Djokovic holds to love (a Djokovic second wind?) to go 2-0 up.

[bogbrush]

Tom______ I believe it is 20 seconds not 25 seconds for grand slams.

Well your wrong, it 25s as per ATP standard rules - it was changed many many years ago.

20s was and old ITF rule since abandoned.

What? That's just plain wrong - it's in ITF event, not an ATP event. Check the ITF web-site for the rules - http://www.itftennis.com/shared/medialibrary/pdf/original/IO_54584_original.PDF

Rule 29 - Nothing about the umpire stating the score either.

The maximum time starts from the moment that one point finishes until the
first service is struck for the next point.

[erictheblueuk]

I think Novak's tiredness is just an act wheras Murray's tiredness looks genuine, cause of this I'm expecting Novak to run away with these last 2 sets.

[Guest]

Will Djokovic's long run endurance finally tell?

[Guest]

Double break to Djokovic. Anyway we know that Murray's serving has been a weakness for some time.

[Tom_____]

Tom______ I believe it is 20 seconds not 25 seconds for grand slams.

Well your wrong, it 25s as per ATP standard rules - it was changed many many years ago.

20s was and old ITF rule since abandoned.

What? That's just plain wrong - it's in ITF event, not an ATP event. Check the ITF web-site for the rules - http://www.itftennis.com/shared/medialibrary/pdf/original/IO_54584_original.PDF

Rule 29 - Nothing about the umpire stating the score either.

Its not plain wrong - as the same umpires are used for every event, the ATP rules are used everywhere.

The rules do not account for crowd noise, as i said, but the rules are 'applied' to account for it - thats why it doesn't appear there.

Naturally it does make sense to start the clock after the crowd shuts up, and i find it funny that people think that umpires would let players cheat for years, rather than try to think why players are given time.

The email clarifying this from the ATP was posted by a member who wrote to them in another forum in 2008. Unfortunately for me i think the forum has since shut down. Personally i'm comfortable with the time Djoko takes between - but if your struggling with it then write to them and ask.

[reckoner]

aaaah la misère

[bogbrush]

Amazing, Djokovic now looks completely fit and Murray looks wiped.

[luciusmann]

Just knew Djokovic would come back strong in this 4th set, see what I said earlier?!

Even though Djokovic wasn't playing his 100% he lost a close third set but now....his game has gone back up to it's higher standard, he's walking away with the set and they're only half way through...2 breaks on Murray's serve already!

[Guest]

Tactics? Does Murray save himself for the fifth set. The Djokovic serving has gone up a notch. 4 games to love fourth set. Maybe Tom____ you underestimated Murray's chances in the fourth (only losing two games) ...

[bogbrush]

Tom______ I believe it is 20 seconds not 25 seconds for grand slams.

Well your wrong, it 25s as per ATP standard rules - it was changed many many years ago.

20s was and old ITF rule since abandoned.

What? That's just plain wrong - it's in ITF event, not an ATP event. Check the ITF web-site for the rules - http://www.itftennis.com/shared/medialibrary/pdf/original/IO_54584_original.PDF

Rule 29 - Nothing about the umpire stating the score either.

Its not plain wrong - as the same umpires are used for every event, the ATP rules are used everywhere.

The rules do not account for crowd noise, as i said, but the rules are 'applied' to account for it - thats why it doesn't appear there.

Naturally it does make sense to start the clock after the crowd shuts up, and i find it funny that people think that umpires would let players cheat for years, rather than try to think why players are given time.

The email clarifying this from the ATP was posted by a member who wrote to them in another forum in 2008. Unfortunately for me i think the forum has since shut down. Personally i'm comfortable with the time Djoko takes between - but if your struggling with it then write to them and ask.

Why? Can't they breath while the crowd are shouting?

Nobody says they have to start play while they are shouting, but it's stupid to suggest the start of the break should wait for that.

And we know why they get away with it: player and sponsor power. The low ranked players get called for time warnings all the time.

[Guest]

Just knew Djokovic would come back strong in this 4th set, see what I said earlier?! ...

Yes but who would have thought that Murray would be two sets to one up at this stage rather than back in the locker room smashing his racket against Lendl's head ...

[bogbrush]

Djokovic doesn't even look like he's breathing hard any more.

Murray seizing up.

[luciusmann]

Just knew Djokovic would come back strong in this 4th set, see what I said earlier?! ...

Yes but who would have thought that Murray would be two sets to one up at this stage rather than back in the locker room smashing his racket against Lendl's head ...

That's quite true, Lendl seems to have done some great work and Murray has been impressive to take this to 5 sets...only Fed seems to push Djokovic the whole distance....and now Murray.

[JuliusHMarx]

Its not plain wrong - as the same umpires are used for every event, the ATP rules are used everywhere.

The rules do not account for crowd noise, as i said, but the rules are 'applied' to account for it - thats why it doesn't appear there.

Naturally it does make sense to start the clock after the crowd shuts up, and i find it funny that people think that umpires would let players cheat for years, rather than try to think why players are given time.

The email clarifying this from the ATP was posted by a member who wrote to them in another forum in 2008. Unfortunately for me i think the forum has since shut down. Personally i'm comfortable with the time Djoko takes between - but if your struggling with it then write to them and ask.

1. The ATP rules are used for ATP events, the ITF rules are used for ITF events. Simple as that. Umpires, I'm sure, are smart enough to remember if they're at a slam or not. So an e-mail from the ATP would not apply to an ITF event.

2. On the majority of points the crowd usually shuts up after 5 - 10 seconds. which easily allows players to serve after 20 seconds (25 for ATP events). Umpires can allow for extended crowd noise that lasts over the 20 seconds, or other factors (seagulls overhead at the AO) or distractions. But to wait for crowd noise to die down before starting the clock is not something I've ever heard mentioned. As far as I'm concerned either apply the rule as written, or change the rule.
The large majority of players can play within the rule, why can't others?

[Guest]

If Djokovic wins this in five, I think we can be certain that Djokovic will be ready for Nadal.

Djokovic wins the fourth set 6-1 (well called Tom_____).

Deciding set.

[Guest]

That was a much needed quick set from Novak

[Guest]

It will be interesting to see what Murray has left in him.

[bogbrush]

There's only one way to beat Djokovic, and that's why there's only one man who can.

[Guest]

Murray holds. Can Murray find his second wind ...

[LuvSports!]

There's only one way to beat Djokovic, and that's why there's only one man who can.

and that man is...... KEI NISHIKORI!

[Guest]

There's only one way to beat Djokovic, and that's why there's only one man who can.

and that man is...... KEI NISHIKORI!

Yes, but not in tennis.

[barrystar]

That last point was an amazing display of athleticism, but it got boring, Murray had to win it half a dozen times.

[Guest]

Is it me or is that cross on Djokovic'c chest getting bigger with each match?

Kinda like the bandage on Nadal's Knee, he'll probably wearing a plaster cast for the final

[barrystar]

I know Murray wants more, but to me whatever happens now this performance feels like a step forward from 2011. His forehand is much less passive than I've seen it.

[Guest]

Commentators are commentating on the economic value of Djokovic taking extra breathing time between points. Market forces dictate that Djokovic should go over the alloted time in order to restore the oxygen deficit, and hence his intensity of play (unless the rules are enforced).

[barrystar]

Commentators are commentating on the economic value of Djokovic taking extra breathing time between points. Market forces dictate that Djokovic should go over the alloted time in order to restore the oxygen deficit, and hence his intensity of play (unless the rules are enforced).

It's got less to do with the length of the season than with certain top players wanting their attritional playing style to be accommodated. I think Men's tennis on the eve of Federer's retirement is about to go in a very bad direction.

[Guest]

I know Murray wants more, but to me whatever happens now this performance feels like a step forward from 2011. His forehand is much less passive than I've seen it.

He just needs to improve his serving. However, he should use this match as a learning experience no matter whether he wins this match or not.

[Jahu]

Learning is done for Murray, he should be kicking the nuts of anyone in top 4.

[barrystar]

Lendl is looking super-stressed. Must be horrible being a coach and not being able to do anything when it really matters.

[Guest]

Learning is done for Murray, he should be kicking the nuts of anyone in top 4.

You're back to Luvsports! point about Kei Nishikori.

[barrystar]

This service game is turning into a pretty damn important one.

[Guest]

Lendl is looking super-stressed. Must be horrible being a coach and not being able to do anything when it really matters.

You would think if Lendl were playing and had been brought up in this era, he would work out how to beat Novak and Djokovic (as well as Nadal). Lendl was quite innovative in his era, innovations that they have built on in todays game.

[Jahu]

Got it.

[break_in_the_fifth]

Djokovic holding serve much easier.

[barrystar]

That he is - Murray is the man under more pressure as you'd expect.

[Guest]

Djokovic holding serve much easier.

Perhaps the difference between the two is only now telling. However, Murray seems to be on the path of enlightenment following the direction of the Yogi Lendl.

[break_in_the_fifth]

Love how Murray's stayed close to the baseline for this match.

[Guest]

Again Murray is poor at his challenges. He is now out of challenges.

[bogbrush]

4-2

Difficuly for Murray, he's not looked dangerous receiving this set.

[Guest]

You have to credit Djokovics lung busting display despite his injuries. His flexibility is greater than Murray.

Let's see what challenge Murray can mount on Djokovics serve at this point of the match.

[bogbrush]

You have to credit Djokovics lung busting display despite his injuries. His flexibility is greater than Murray.

Let's see what challenge Murray can mount on Djokovics serve at this point of the match.

What injury?

[barrystar]

That now should be that, but Murray has definitely improved, there's no reason to feel hang dog about this match should he lose.

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