Ireland Team (Announced) vs Wales - 6Nations 2012 Round 1

First topic message reminder :

Here we go...

IRELAND Team & Replacements (v Wales, RBS 6 Nations Championship 2012, Aviva Stadium, Sunday, February 5th, kick-off 3pm):

15 -Rob Kearney (UCD/Leinster)
14 - Tommy Bowe (Ospreys)
13 - Keith Earls (Young Munster/Munster)
12 - Gordon D'Arcy (Lansdowne/Leinster)
11 - Andrew Trimble (Ballymena/Ulster)
10 - Jonathan Sexton (St. Mary's College/Leinster)
9 - Conor Murray (Garryowen/Munster)
1 - Cian Healy (Clontarf/Leinster)
2 - Rory Best (Banbridge/Ulster)
3 - Mike Ross (Clontarf/Leinster)
4 - Donncha O'Callaghan (Cork Constitution/Munster)
5 - Paul O'Connell (Young Munster/Munster) Captain
6 - Stephen Ferris (Dungannon/Ulster)
7 - Sean O'Brien (Clontarf/Leinster)
8 - Jamie Heaslip (Naas/Leinster)

Replacements:

16 -Sean Cronin (St. Mary's College/Leinster)
17 - Tom Court (Malone/Ulster)
18 - Donnacha Ryan (Shannon/Munster)
19 - Peter O'Mahony (Cork Constitution/Munster)*
20 - Eoin Reddan (Lansdowne/Leinster)
21 - Ronan O'Gara (Cork Constitution/Munster)
22 - Fergus McFadden (Old Belvedere/Leinster)

*Denotes uncapped player



ORIGINAL: So the Declan Kidney will be naming his team to face Wales at lunchtime today. In preparation for complete meltdown of 606v2 as is customary for all Ireland team selections I suggest that we keep everything to one thread, namely here.

I'm assuming this one will be broadcast live on irishrugby.ie and as such, I'll be posting that link here before the announcement is made.

Helmets at the ready folks, this could get ugly.

Feckless Rogue wrote:

dublin_dave wrote:i think we can really get at their lineout!

But Wales won't kick the ball out. They'll keep it in play, kicking it down the middle if necessary, but they won't kick it out.

Wales will run it down the 12 channel. Their game is built around Jamie Roberts that is why Gatland has delayed naming the side until Friday. Him and Priestland are vital and if they are out Wales will need to adjust and play a more expansive game...however don't believe the hype Wales aren't very good at playing expansively these day and tend to drift across the field when they try that offloading game.

Now the old me would point out that neither D'arcy or Earls are particularly good front on tacklers and that if Roberts runs at them then we are fooked.....but that was the old me and I'm sure Kidney has a plan for this...I'm just not sure what it is....

So a 1 st choice Irish side vs a much depleted Welsh side - and in Dublin.

No pressure lads, lucky you start strong in the Six Nations.

munkian wrote:So a 1 st choice Irish side vs a much depleted Welsh side - and in Dublin.

No pressure lads, lucky you start strong in the Six Nations.

Yep get the excuses in now..

Should be a good game nonetheless.

No excuses. It will be interesting to see if the pressure of HC expereience will transfer to the national game

munkian wrote:So a 1 st choice Irish side vs a much depleted Welsh side - and in Dublin.

No pressure lads, lucky you start strong in the Six Nations.

Getting the excuses in early if you lose?

munkian wrote:So a 1 st choice Irish side vs a much depleted Welsh side - and in Dublin.

No pressure lads, lucky you start strong in the Six Nations.

Isn't every starting 15 first choice?

roddersm wrote: [Now the old me would point out that neither D'arcy or Earls are particularly good front on tacklers and that if Roberts runs at them then we are fooked.....but that was the old me and I'm sure Kidney has a plan for this...I'm just not sure what it is....

Why do you think Ferris lined up at 12 for Ulster away to Aironi.

All part of Deccie's master plan to not only stop Roberts but to pick him and dump him 10 years behind the gain line

In Deccie we trust

"Getting the excuses in early if you lose?"

If we end up playing without Gethin J, Rees, AWJ, Charteris, Lydiate, Priestland and Roberts, that is enough front line players out that realistically it is going to make quite a difference. If we keep Roberts and Priestland, in particular, it's not game over yet (so long as Bennett has an unusually good day throwing in).

probably right, they are a bit too canny for that. quite streetwise this welsh team and they kick well well have done the last 2 times they played us

i think we will stick it up the jumper big time and take it to their front 5. lots of mauls off lineouts pick and drives etc. as long as we do it with at a fast pace and it sucks in defenders it could work

The genuine threat for Wales this game I think will be Faletau.

geoff998rugby wrote:

roddersm wrote: [Now the old me would point out that neither D'arcy or Earls are particularly good front on tacklers and that if Roberts runs at them then we are fooked.....but that was the old me and I'm sure Kidney has a plan for this...I'm just not sure what it is....

Why do you think Ferris lined up at 12 for Ulster away to Aironi.

All part of Deccie's master plan to not only stop Roberts but to pick him and dump him 10 years behind the gain line

In Deccie we trust

You're a genius Geoff!

Rory_Gallagher wrote:The genuine threat for Wales this game I think will be Faletau.

He can't do much damage when he's in Stevie Ferris's pocket Rory....

how many players can ferris fit in his pockets lads?????

i reckon he can at least fit faletau and roberts. that will create lots of space for sob to wreak havoc.

Yeah I was thinking that Ferris may be forced to make a lot of tackles in this game! Faletau links up so well with the backs, and will probably add to attacking the mid-channel. I said on another thread the 3 in-form backrowers in the 6 nations this year, are Picamoles, Faletau and Ferris. I think the 3 of them are going to really tear the place up.

roddersm wrote:

Rory_Gallagher wrote:The genuine threat for Wales this game I think will be Faletau.

He can't do much damage when he's in Stevie Ferris's pocket Rory....

Sigh, its only been 4 months, surely the Irish back row don't need putting in their place again so soon ? Heaslip must be bored of being bundled into touch by now

Sigh, its only one world cup that Wales do pretty well in (but not THAT well, considering the only team of note they beat was Ireland, oh and Fiji apparently..) and now they are suddenly world beaters.

You do realise in the first half, Warburton and co were virtually anonymous and we were winning at the breakdown? It wasn't until the second half that our back-row started to tire and really get nailed to the floor. Ferris/SOB was our only game-plan and it was embarrassing, it simply did not work. I feel they will be much more effective now. I will agree that Heaslip had an awful game (and world cup in general).

It is dangerous and high risk but Wales thrive on their defence and being able to turn the ball over quick and running it back with interest. It's a simple tactic but in Warburton we have a class act at the breakdown and he may well win us a few penaltys. This will be like a mad game of chess out there

Warburton has looked pretty average lately I thought.

I wouldnt have said anything if wasn't the second time in a row Irish fans were bigging up their back row to herculean heights.

Boast after boast of how they were going to dominate us and it didn't happen.

You should have just said nothing full stop.

munkian wrote:
Sigh, its only been 4 months, surely the Irish back row don't need putting in their place again so soon ? Heaslip must be bored of being bundled into touch by now

It's strange how so many people believe the Welsh backrow outplayed the Irish one in that game,they were tackling machines all game and di well but the Irish lads outperformed them in every other facet of the game.

It was the 10-12-13 positions that made the difference in that game.

All welsh players look average for the regions. But internationals is were they step up, perhaps unlike our celtic cousins across the Irish Sea

munkian we were a huge fan of either walking in straight lines at a tackler or shoveling the ball across the pitch and getting knocked out of play.

rest assured we have lured you into a false sense of security my sheep shearing friend.

our backs, under the command of our kicking coach and defense coach, will be galvanised and will run rings around your collection of giants in the backs. mc fadden will come on as sub and actually run under cuthberts legs for the 5th try. be afraid very very afraid

munkian wrote:I wouldnt have said anything if wasn't the second time in a row Irish fans were bigging up their back row to herculean heights.

That's nonsence munkian... Hercules wouldn't even get a spot on our bench.

So, without going through, the 4 pages of stuff are we happy? I'm not thrilled with DOC playing but he won't let us down and will have a very good game. I can ee why he is playing as the lineout is a target for Ireland and he is a great operator. O'Mahony on the bench is a surprise.

I agree with the Welsh lads...we are talking ourselves up again and our backrow got spanked the last time. Hopefully the tactics will be different and I think that Warburton has been playing well in a poor Cardiff team.

With the changes to the Welsh team we should win (as we are at home) but am sure Gatland will have a few tricks up his sleeve.

In that case lets see how our average back row and the misfiring Warburton cope against this super human back row again - Surely its another mismatch

roddersm wrote:

munkian wrote:I wouldnt have said anything if wasn't the second time in a row Irish fans were bigging up their back row to herculean heights.

That's nonsence munkian... Hercules wouldn't even get a spot on our bench.

He might be useful as TH cover.

Rory_Gallagher wrote:You should have just said nothing full stop.

Theres been 4 pages so far of Irish fans saying 'nothing'

If our centres are our best weapon and your centres are the chink in your armour - especially as you are now missing a player who has carried you on several occassions, why all the noise ?

Faletau has looked monstrous for the Dragons though.

Also just to say about the irish backrow. Ferris was thrown straight into the world cup after being out of rugby from january, with doubts if he would ever play again. Heaslip was in woeful form, and SOB had to adjust to his new position (7). Then when Ireland basically use SOB/Ferris as battering rams all game, obviously it wasn't going to work and we were going to be bested. Schoolboy rugby tactics won't work on the world stage.

I feel it will be a totally different story this time round. SOB has made the 7 shirt his own with fantastic play at the breakdown, which I think will surprise you welsh fans. Ferris has been better than ever since the world cup, and moved on from his injury. Heaslip has been playing much better lately, and I think that has to do with SOB's great openside play these days.

RubyGuby wrote:In that case lets see how our average back row and the misfiring Warburton cope against this super human back row again - Surely its another mismatch

If the game was 3 a side yeah but there are 12 others who contribute as well.

Nobody has saidthe Welsh backrow are average,don't be so sensitive we're just very confident of our own players ability.

RubyGuby wrote:In that case lets see how our average back row and the misfiring Warburton cope against this super human back row again - Surely its another mismatch

Putting words in peoples mouths and twisting things. Good job

Well if they've all been playing better Rory it should be a closer game this time around - looking forward

I actually think your strongest backrow would be something like:
6 Ferris
7 O'Mahony/Wallace (if not injured)
8 O'Brein

munkian wrote:

Rory_Gallagher wrote:You should have just said nothing full stop.

Theres been 4 pages so far of Irish fans saying 'nothing'

If our centres are our best weapon and your centres are the chink in your armour - especially as you are now missing a player who has carried you on several occassions, why all the noise ?

He certainly hasn't carried us lately, as he did not look fit at the world cup at all. D'Arcy has been crap for ages now. Earls I feel will add much more to the centres this time round however.

Funnily enough SOB at 7 is my one concern. When he plays(ed) at 6 for Leinster he is much more destructive. I dont find him to be as effective as a 7 when compared to Warburton for example. He is definitely improving in the role but like Wallace I dont think he will ever be the complete groundhog. Still like Wallace he brings other attributes to the position.

asoreleftshoulder wrote:[

Nobody has saidthe Welsh backrow are average,don't be so sensitive we're just very confident of our own players ability.

. Re: Ireland Team (Announced) vs Wales - 6Nations 2012 Round 1
by Rory_Gallagher Today at 14:42

.Warburton has looked pretty average lately I thought.

gowales wrote:I actually think your strongest backrow would be something like:
6 Ferris
7 O'Mahony/Wallace (if not injured)
8 O'Brein

Once again, I don't know why POM is being bigged up as a 7 when he isn't a clever breakdown player, but a highly aggressive one. He gives away plenty of penalties and doesn't turn over much ball, but he does slow it down and he does knock people about. SOB is doing fantastic at the breakdown at 7, leave him there. If POM wants to break into this squad, he should replace Heaslip yes, but at 8. I feel he may come on for Ferris mostly this 6 nations though, due to Ferris' previous injury record.

You boys doth protest too much which is quite revealing - sounds to me like you're shoiting yourselves - Take a lesson from eirebilly who knows how to post and respects the opposition - Let's hope the best team wins (again)

RubyGuby wrote:

asoreleftshoulder wrote:[

Nobody has saidthe Welsh backrow are average,don't be so sensitive we're just very confident of our own players ability.

. Re: Ireland Team (Announced) vs Wales - 6Nations 2012 Round 1
by Rory_Gallagher Today at 14:42

.Warburton has looked pretty average lately I thought.

And he has. One of your backrow players out of a possible 3, apparently meaning I said your whole backrow is average. Nice try

RubyGuby wrote:

asoreleftshoulder wrote:[

Nobody has saidthe Welsh backrow are average,don't be so sensitive we're just very confident of our own players ability.

. Re: Ireland Team (Announced) vs Wales - 6Nations 2012 Round 1
by Rory_Gallagher Today at 14:42

.Warburton has looked pretty average lately I thought.

Warburton is not the Wales backrow and saying he has looked average lately is very different from saying he's an average player.Don't take things out of context just because you want something to get offended about.

Its just from watching SOB in last years HC i thought he was much more effective than he has been this year. When he was playing 6. I feel his greatest strengths are his running and tackle breaking.
I don't rate POM but a lot Irish fans do.
If you were to play a real grafter at 7 then it would leave SOB free to be at his rampaging best.

Actually, I am very confident about this game. I think this 6 nations Wales will be shown up for being very overrated lately due to a pretty good world cup where they beat Ireland. I think they will still do pretty well, but not as well as some people think.

Rory_Gallagher wrote:

munkian wrote:

Rory_Gallagher wrote:You should have just said nothing full stop.

Theres been 4 pages so far of Irish fans saying 'nothing'

If our centres are our best weapon and your centres are the chink in your armour - especially as you are now missing a player who has carried you on several occassions, why all the noise ?

He certainly hasn't carried us lately, as he did not look fit at the world cup at all. D'Arcy has been crap for ages now. Earls I feel will add much more to the centres this time round however.

Earles tried to tackle Roberts and got a concussion. DOC was little more than a speed bump. If Roberts isn't fit beck is very big strong and has a massive burst of speed on him. Earles isn't even a great wing let alone an international centre.

Cue DOD/Sin. I will leave them to argue that one.

EDIT: Though I will say he was one of the top try scorers in the world cup. Is that average?

I don't understand why the Welsh think their backrow dominated the Irish one in the last game. Ireland had more territory and possession which suggests the opposite. It's what the Welsh did with their possession (and what the Irish didn't do with theirs) that won Wales the game. That's why we're more concerned with the likes of Roberts, Phillips and North than we are with the Welsh backrow. They're the ones that inflicted the damage.

The Welsh backrow did tackle like demons alright. They were very good in defence. But their 2nd row were even better. Their work rate and tackle count were unbelievable. And they're both injured now.

Ruby, we know this isn't a walkover, it is going to be a very tense and tight affair. Ireland had a good HC campaign so we may be a bit brash but we do know Wales can beat us they have done it twice in the last 12 months and deservedly so both times. Wales will not be taken lightly.

gowales wrote:Its just from watching SOB in last years HC i thought he was much more effective than he has been this year. When he was playing 6. I feel his greatest strengths are his running and tackle breaking.
I don't rate POM but a lot Irish fans do.
If you were to play a real grafter at 7 then it would leave SOB free to be at his rampaging best.

A lot of people would agree with you. I think though that SOB has been more subtle these days not only because he is at 7 doing his thing, but I feel he is being marked much more. It always goes like this. Most big runners are very effective to start with but not just as much as their career progresses. They still present a great option, but they are not used as much in that role. I think SOB, while not just as spectacular individually as he was last year, is really adding to the backrow as a unit. Which to me is much more important.

Warburton's been one of the most consistant members of a poor Blues lineup, every time I see him play he's still making at least two or three vital turnovers per game. I'm sure, based on their last two encounters at this level, he's relishing resuming the individual battle against O'Brien

No big surprises overall in this Irish team, DOC over Ryan maybe not what was expected but hardly issue of the century considering the former's past contribution.