Welsh Gloating Thread

[miteyironpaw]

I propose that Wales fully deserve some space to have a good hard gloat and generally rub some of our noses in it. Some England fans made preposterous claims that England would dish out a 33 point hiding to Wales at HQ, and those people must feel very silly about that claim now.

Wales have lead-frogged over England in the IRB rankings, closed the all-time head to head stats to just a single game, won at triple crown at Twickenham for the first time ever and won at Twickenham for the first time since 1286. After years of oppression, subjugation and false dawns if this achievement doesn't deserve a bit of consequence free blow out then I don't know what does.

In some other threads the Welsh fans are being accused of being poor winners but I think this forum should pause for a small unrestrained period of good hard Welsh gloating.

So go on knock yourselves out here and tell us all how it feels...

[idris]

France will be extremely lucky to make it to Cardiff without losing and England will struggle to beat Ireland and France in Paris.

This tournament is Wales's to lose and they shouldn't mess it up on grandslam day.

[miteyironpaw]

That's the spirit! Get in there and vent.

[iso]

No gloating from me. After all it was only one match, with one fresh keen side pitted against a fresher and keener side. There are more monkeys to remove from the back first.

If we ever beat New Zealand then I may open a bottle of the emotional good stuff and vent my joy (and even then only privately). But we are not that good, not yet anyway. I do however have hopes for the future, hence my positive and hopeful useage of the word 'yet'.

Regarding gloating, obviously the most effective post match gloats are self defacing juxtaposed to the actual result. For example, “Wales played really bad”, or “England were excellent” bearing in mind the encounter was away from home and the scoreboard still stands as a Welsh win. These are nothing more than verbal trickery shielded behind the inability of the opposition to turn back time.

For pre-encounter gloats nothing sits more arrogant than “potential banana skin” ... I remember how demeaning that felt when it was applied to ‘my’ team in the past. Mildly hurtful yes, but in reality nothing more than a simple and clumsy limbic assault to be subsequently ignored by those of us with more than a neo-mammalian brain.

So gloating? Not me. I’m not that small minded. I believe in the magnificence of elegant restraint, I’m more of a neo-cortex kind of guy.

Also the additional and obvious question: What have I personally done to earn the right to gloat? Did I actually play? No I watched it on television, how very, very heroic of me.

I enjoyed watching a fascinating and engaging game, and was pleased with the result, nothing more.

You are welcome to cast your barbed hooks as often as you wish, but please do not expect to be gawping at anything greater than a few tiddlers in your keep-net.

[Guest]

I didnt think we played particularly well, we did well enough to get a win away from home in a tough place and that's what counts in the 6 nations.

Or at least thats what the English have been saying about their results so far.

[Glas a du]

Many of our fans were embroiled in a 15 Pinter without falling over -

[Knowsit17]

I feel like wumming today, so I'm going to avoid the purpose of this thread and not gloat

England were the better side for most of the game, if only they could convert territory into tries.

[Dontheman]

We all know what you're up to Mitey. I thought one of the functions of this kind of website was to allow fans to celebrate success. Don't think we need your sneering marginalization 'get in there have a gloat get it over with'. First it was ' the moral victory for England' now this. FFS get a life

[Luckless Pedestrian]

I didnt think we played particularly well, we did well enough to get a win away from home in a tough place and that's what counts in the 6 nations.

Or at least thats what the English have been saying about their results so far.

Well played!

[miteyironpaw]

Come now Dontheman, I'm not trying to marginalise you at all (note English spelling of Marginalise, please. Appropriation of Americanisms might be fine in Wales, but not here in England I'll ask you.).

I've noted that on other threads, the Welsh have been called "poor winners" for having a little gloat.

Now I think you deserve it, and as an Englishman want you to know that letting our those feelings that have been pent up for so long is probably healthy and acceptable.

It's not a matter of keeping all the mess in one place so as to be easier to clean up later I promise you.

[doctornickolas]

I propose that as Wales are just an extremely lucky team who only wins games due to refereeing errors or/and cheating, then we should write to the 6 nations committee and refuse to accept the wins on moral grounds.

We bad.

I offer England a moral victory and a points score of say 35 - 0 with all points scored by Farrell prior to his ascension to the post of English media angel.

Wales will not turn up to any more games in case the unthinkable happens and we win a game fair and square.

[miteyironpaw]

Now you're just being silly.

[mckay1402]

I think we should have a national holiday.

[miteyironpaw]

That's more like it!

[Glas a du]

Yes, March the first, St. David's day. He's the only patron saint of the four home nations to have been born in the nation that adopted him, dontchaknow.

[miteyironpaw]

Yes, March the first, St. David's day. He's the only patron saint of the four home nations to have been born in the nation that adopted him, dontchaknow.

I'm sure there's a joke about similarities with the make up of rugby teams across the home nations too, but I'll side step that one.

[mckay1402]

yes I did know that but I was thinking more along the lines of February 25th, St Scotts day...

[RubyGuby]

Most of us feel let down by that welsh performance Mighty and I must say I'm feeling a little flat today after all the expectation - I'll get over it in time

[Newsilure]

Weren't we brilliant! Wasn't it fantastic to see the English playing as hard as they could, lifted by all the home fans to a level at least 20% above their ability. While our boys, even with some of them having a bit of an off day, probably due to a dicky English breakfast if not a straight forward attempt at poisoning, won with no trouble. What a laugh letting the chaps in white think they could win and then telling our most junior player to take the ball of one of their big maulers and skip off, happy as Dai, to score under the post, ha we all new that was comming!

Was this the type of thing you wanted Mitey?

[RubyGuby]

I'm over it

[miteyironpaw]

Weren't we brilliant! Wasn't it fantastic to see the English playing as hard as they could, lifted by all the home fans to a level at least 20% above their ability. While our boys, even with some of them having a bit of an off day, probably due to a dicky English breakfast if not a straight forward attempt at poisoning, won with no trouble. What a laugh letting the chaps in white think they could win and then telling our most junior player to take the ball of one of their big maulers and skip off, happy as Dai, to score under the post, ha we all new that was comming!

Was this the type of thing you wanted Mitey?

As long as you are letting off the steam kept under pressure since whenever it was, I'm happy for you Newsilure.

[RubyGuby]

"won at Twickenham for the first time since 1268"

were you still in a coma when we beat you at HQ in 2008 Mighty

[nobbled]

I'm not trying to marginalise you at all (note English spelling of Marginalise, please.

Can't be doing with you "modernizers". The ise ending is very Jonny come lately. Only really made popular in the 1990's by reactionary newspapers. The English were getting on just fine with the ize ending for a couple of hundred years before ise turned up some time in the 1700's.

[RubyGuby]

ize isn't everything

[Newsilure]

Actualy Mitey I havent actualy felt any pressure, after all Wales have won two grand slams since England's solitary one in this millenium and are looking a good even money bet for a third, so there wouldn't be any cause for us to be too stressed............but then again you did win a world cup and that is a hard one to ignore or get over!!

In truth I was impressed with how England played on Saturday, but I wonder how big the difference in score would have been if we had had Farrell and you had had RP.

[nobbled]

ize isn't everything

You're on form today!

[RubyGuby]

You're on form today!

Thanks - I wonder why

[nobbled]

You're on form today!

Thanks - I wonder why

Fair enough.

[RubyGuby]

Joking aside nobbled it was a game no one deserved to lose. England though after receiving a lot of plaudits have to move on from this. I'm not convinced they will in all honesty as I thought they gave it their absolute all on Saturday. The Ireland game will define their season but they need to allow themselves to develop without constant pressure

[nobbled]

I was pleased with the step-up in performance level. Hurts to lose at home, but no shame losing to a good Welsh side.

[RubyGuby]

[gregortree]

Ruby,
You must know England can and will develop from here. A green England (remember all the 'lack of caps' comparisons ?) did show some naivité, but were not far behind Wales on the day. Wales themselves have developed so well in last 18 months. England had ~ 8 first Twickenham caps on the paddock. Premature of you to write off these new boys as being unable to 'move on'. You know they have only just started.

[miteyironpaw]

Surprising how well such a young and inexperienced team of English youngsters footed it with the 4th best team in the RWC, really...

[Cymroglan]

There is no glory in a loss and that's what I hated about Welsh rugby in the past that players and fans would often claim a moral victory in a narrow loss.
That sort of thinking is not in the mindset of southern hemisphere sides a one point loss may as well be a twenty pointer.

[slartibartfast]

how's this...




YEEEEEEEEEESSSSSSSSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[irfon17]

Mitey, two questions regarding your post;

1. Who do you have mind when you say some England fans will feel silly regarding their predictions, becuase the only person I rememebr makingsilly claims pre-match was yourself (apologies if my memory is incorrect here).

2. Is it coincidence that the year you suggested for Wales' last victory at Twickenham, is just two years off the year that Wales was conquered?

[Dontheman]

Surprising how well such a young and inexperienced team of English youngsters footed it with the 4th best team in the RWC, really...

There you go again. We were the best team at the WC we just didn't win enough! All the other tier one teams bottled it at some stage but we were absolutely relentlessly playing with God given grace and but for a few kicks it could have been a lot different. People were always saying ' pity you can't close out these games, shame you don't know how to win. Don't think you can say that anymore. So. Sat we hung on never gave up and won. Same against Ireland. Now we are getting the wins and confidence is growing. So thanks for the opportunity to celebrate not gloat, Mitey

[miteyironpaw]

1. Yes. And I've already admitted I was wrong on the long and involved thread encouraging me to do so which has now been pulled by the moderators for some reason to which I'm not privvy.

2. Entirely coincidental. No historical reference intended. You know I can't condone the comparison of mere rugby to wars, the loss of life, suffering or subjugation of peoples.

[irfon17]

1. Yes. And I've already admitted I was wrong on the long and involved thread encouraging me to do so which has now been pulled by the moderators for some reason to which I'm not privvy.

2. Entirely coincidental. No historical reference intended. You know I can't condone the comparison of mere rugby to wars, the loss of life, suffering or subjugation of peoples.

I can respect that, now be honest....... did you really believe your pre-match claims or was it just intended to 'stoke debate' with some of the more 'passionate' posters (I know there is an acronym for this, but it is overused and I don't want to be perjorative).

[miteyironpaw]

No, I thought we had the players to do it. I thought Twickenham would lift us and that Lancaster had been playing overly conservatively. I thought Ashton and Foden were being held in reserve rather than genuinely being out of touch. I thought our front unit was capable of matching Wales and that the new backrow would secure better go-forward ball. Mostly I thought we'd dismantle the Welsh lineout.

I thought we'd suddenly have a flood of quick ball and possession in good territory, and get an early lead. I thought Wales would struggle to get out of their 22 and resort to rash and measures to chase the game over-believing their hype of being "too big and strong" in the mid field and out wide. I thought we'd pounce and profit from turn overs and poor execution options and get clear and then push on with a chorus of approval from the stands as Wales slowly began to doubt themselves and the weight of history would bring us home.

Of course I was wrong. Our back row is feckless, our back line equally so. Foden and Ashton need a rest. The entire coaching of our backline options needs to be urgently looked in to. Our front row struggles to hold it's own, let alone compete and the Welsh managed to minimise the number of line outs and frankly get away with a few crooked ones that took the pressure off.

[Dontheman]

I'm over it

LOVE IT

[RubyGuby]

Ruby,
You must know England can and will develop from here. A green England (remember all the 'lack of caps' comparisons ?) did show some naivité, but were not far behind Wales on the day. Wales themselves have developed so well in last 18 months. England had ~ 8 first Twickenham caps on the paddock. Premature of you to write off these new boys as being unable to 'move on'. You know they have only just started.

Gregor, I don't want to be too critical of England but I see that as a one off performance where they raised their game beyond some peoples expectations. You're also inflating this experienced welsh team. Owens was making his first start and this team has been together since August 2011 - it is also very young. I'm not convinced England will be able to raise it to that level so easy - They were desperate not to lose at Twickenham after being written off and they deserved a draw. There are so many concerns in the team, Hartley, the 2nd rows, back row, 9 and 10, Ashton? Tuilagi and Barritt along with Corbisiero and Cole are perhaps the only certain starters there. There is an inflated sense from England that "we will be ok now" and I remain unconvinced, particularly around all the eulogising of Farrell. Your season will be defined against Ireland and a failure there is likely to leave you with 2 narrow and unconvincing wins against Scotland and Italy - I may well be wrong but I still think that was a gargantuan one off performance in front of the Twickenham faithful. Only the next 2 games will tell us more about who is right or wrong. Good luck.

[thebluesmancometh]

Ruby I think your a little out there mate, although I agree with a huge performance from England, it was still a little Scotland esque, all huff and puff, but come the final whistle lacking.

I wouldn't say this England side are not as good as people think, but I would worry about the lauding of the likes of Farrell and Tuilagi, they seem to be on the same conveyer belt as Cipriani was, Ashton was, Lawes was, Vainokolo was... But I am sure that in Lancaster they have turned a corner, as long as he is allowed to nurture the team and isn't forced into win at all costs attitude like MJ constantly was!

[RubyGuby]

Bluesman - you disagree with me in your first sentence and then agree with what Ive said - I'm lost

[thebluesmancometh]

I did say a little out, not completely.

[RubyGuby]

Ok -

[Tommy David lookalike]

Congratuklations to both teams. Who says the 6 nations and northern hemisophere rugby lacks intensity? It was a cracker. I'm not neutral, but i think they would have enjoyed it to. I floated to the pub Saturday night and consolled some very gracious Englishmen with a pint

[gregortree]

Ruby,
this is the Welsh thread, so you can take comfort where you can, including in the delusion that England have somehow peaked after essentially one game at 'home'.
Me, I'll take some comfort from a more neutral observer, Kiakahaaotearoa
Kia,
hope you do not mind me nicking your quote from your fine 'fine line' thread:
"And much like Wales, this was by far (from) a complete performance. England are capable of much more and so I think there´s little to separate the sides at the moment.

[miteyironpaw]

There's no room for objectivity here Gregor, this is a space for the Welsh to have a well earned and long overdue shout about their victory over England.

[gregortree]

Mitey, yes of course, I forgot which thread I was on. It does say 'gloating', I need to return to the more balanced world of the Kia thread for objectivity.
so thanks for the reminder mate.

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