Cardiff Blues squad and off-field updates.

First topic message reminder :

It appears that the following players will be leaving the Blues at the end of the season


DEPARTURE

Gavin Henson - Sacked

TRThomas - Despite being given the captaincy a few times this season, Thomas is due to leave - He is one of the players who has been excellent for us, is available all year round and we should be building a team around him. But he is off to Wasps.

Gethin Jenkins - 1 of our 4 world class players is off to Toulon

Casey Laulaula - The second centre to go, he is off to Munster, despite being available all year round.

Dan Parks is off to Connacht

Ritchie Rees is going to Edinburgh

Deniol Jones is retired

Martyn Williams is retiring

Mamma Molitika is retiring

John Yapp is leaving to go to Edinburgh

Ben Blair has apparently been offered a contract in France, at Lyon and is leaving

Jamie Roberts will miss a large part of next season through injury

Paul Tito is retiring

Ryan Tyrell is returning to Australia

Xavier Rush has retired as a player due to injury

Justin Burnell has left with immediate effect

Richard Mustoe rumoured retirement



ARRIVING AND STAYING

Xavier Rush has become the next defence coach

Jason Tovey is the only new signing of any significance announced so far, from the Dragons

Robin Copeland is confirmed from Rotherham RFC - some good reports, a replacement for Molitika

Lou Reed is signing though from the Scarlets

And Gavin Evans has signed a new 2 year contract extension...woop

Benoit Bourrust a THP from Perpignan is arriving

Fijian LHP prop Campese Ma'afu has signed from Australian side West Harbour Pirates

Hooker Andi Kyriacou is being targeted from Ulster - confirmed

Ceri Sweeney is staying with the Blues with a contract extension

Fau Filise has signed a contract extension (Probably 1 year)

A new Director of Rugby Phil Davies has joined.

Alex Cuthbert has signed a 1 year extension

Rob Lewis confirmed coming at SH from London Welsh

Deniol Jones is now team manager

Lee Jarvis has been appointed skills coach


Squad for next season


Props
Sam Hobbs
Ma'afu Campese
Benoit Bourrust
Scott Andrews
Fau Filise
Ryan Hartford
Nathan Trevett
Thomas Davies

Hookers
Andy Kyricau
Kristian Dacey
Mark Breeze
Rhys Williams

Locks
Bradley Davies
Lou Reed
James Down
Cory Hill
McCauley Cook
Matthew Screech

Backrow
Michael Paterson
Robin Copeland
Sam Warburton
Josh Navidi
Andreus Pretorious
Ellis Jenkins
Thomas Young
Luke Hamilton


Scrum Halfs
Lloyd Williams
Rob Lewis
Lewis Jones

Fly Halfs
Jason Tovey
Ceri Sweeney
Rhys Patchell

Centres
Jamie Roberts
Daffydd Hewitt
Gavin Evans
Cory Allen
Owen Williams

Back 3
Alex Cuthbert
Tom James
Leigh Halfpenny
Dan Fish
Chris Czekaj
Harry Robinson

Well to be fair in the press, the Blues have always gotten off pretty much scott free.

The Scarlets have always been torn to shreds and they've started to turn on the O's. Will they actually turn on the Blues? I doubt it somehow.

For that milestone read the Scarlets' two court cases that ended up with us being £5million in debt that we're still paying off. We're getting through it and the Blues will too.

If the Blues do manage to find some get out clause, of if the Bluebirds let them go, that would be a huge, HUGE help. Or maybe apply for council or wru funding to help them pay for the CCS on a loan basis short term until they can figure out a better way to get out of it. I dunno. It needs to be addressed asap.

I dont think the Blues will lose Leigh Halfpenny he'd be mad to leave the Blues, he's a young kid, and needs to establish himself in Wales before going abroad. Wales have already dropped him a few times so being out of the way in France or England would probably kill his international career.

Ian Evans has another season after this one and the Ospreys have said they don't want to release him.

AlynDavies wrote:I dont think the Blues will lose Leigh Halfpenny he'd be mad to leave the Blues, he's a young kid, and needs to establish himself in Wales before going abroad. Wales have already dropped him a few times so being out of the way in France or England would probably kill his international career.

Ian Evans has another season after this one and the Ospreys have said they don't want to release him.

Halfpenny is pretty established - He was dropped for 1 game in favour of Tom Prydie 2 years ago - and look where he is now. Gatland has stated how impressed he has been with Halfpenny's recovery. He is comfortably our best FB, second best Winger and best goal kicker - If Lee Byrne and Hook can get selected from France, Halfpenny certainly can.

wales606 wrote:

AlynDavies wrote:I dont think the Blues will lose Leigh Halfpenny he'd be mad to leave the Blues, he's a young kid, and needs to establish himself in Wales before going abroad. Wales have already dropped him a few times so being out of the way in France or England would probably kill his international career.

Ian Evans has another season after this one and the Ospreys have said they don't want to release him.

Halfpenny is pretty established - He was dropped for 1 game in favour of Tom Prydie 2 years ago - and look where he is now. Gatland has stated how impressed he has been with Halfpenny's recovery. He is comfortably our best FB, second best Winger and best goal kicker - If Lee Byrne and Hook can get selected from France, Halfpenny certainly can.

Yep.

AlynDavies wrote:I dont think the Blues will lose Leigh Halfpenny he'd be mad to leave the Blues, he's a young kid, and needs to establish himself in Wales before going abroad. Wales have already dropped him a few times so being out of the way in France or England would probably kill his international career.

Ian Evans has another season after this one and the Ospreys have said they don't want to release him.

Having a 40% pay cut is a pretty big reason to leave though.

I see this as something good for Welsh rugby we have seasoned internationals moving out of the regions. I just hope they are wise enough to have a release clause in their contract.
Players leaving create a opportunity for the youngsters to show us what they can do it will also hopefully increase our strength in depth.

Cymro,

Most are going to France which for me isn't a problem, there seems to be far more negotiation and flex with the French clubs than the English and they have to be released for the minimum time anyway.

I know the greedy bar stewards at the WRU will most probably (again) arrange a 4th AI outside the windon but ok blood a few youngsters if that happens.

Cymroglan wrote:I see this as something good for Welsh rugby we have seasoned internationals moving out of the regions. I just hope they are wise enough to have a release clause in their contract.
Players leaving create a opportunity for the youngsters to show us what they can do it will also hopefully increase our strength in depth.

All very well and good for team Wales, but the superclubs/regions also require strength in depth to be competitive and replacing seasoned pros with youngsters should not be an overnight exercise. It takes time and not all younger players make the grade.
Also, there have always been opportunities for younger players to make their mark. If there weren't then Cardiff Blues wouldn't have unearthed Roberts, Halfpenny, Warburton, Brad, Cuthbert, etc.

Cardiff Dave wrote:

Cymroglan wrote:I see this as something good for Welsh rugby we have seasoned internationals moving out of the regions. I just hope they are wise enough to have a release clause in their contract.
Players leaving create a opportunity for the youngsters to show us what they can do it will also hopefully increase our strength in depth.

All very well and good for team Wales, but the superclubs/regions also require strength in depth to be competitive and replacing seasoned pros with youngsters should not be an overnight exercise. It takes time and not all younger players make the grade.
Also, there have always been opportunities for younger players to make their mark. If there weren't then Cardiff Blues wouldn't have unearthed Roberts, Halfpenny, Warburton, Brad, Cuthbert, etc.

Your examples of the quality the Blues have unearthed show that bringing the youngsters through is a good thing. It also shows that there are a number of quality internationals (and current internationals, not like saying Iestyn Thomas or TR Thomas are interenationals) at the Blues to be able to keep the ballance of experience/quality and youth/inexperience. The media want to sell their news stories, and in Wales doom and gloom sell better than good news.

it would be a shame if they let henson go. they could probably get him resonably cheeply, and he looks comfortable at the blues

dogtooth wrote:it would be a shame if they let henson go. they could probably get him resonably cheeply, and he looks comfortable at the blues

To me he looks like he is trying to play in a team whose players don't really want him there. I say that because of the amount of time he his not passed to when he is the logical option. It is as if the players don't like/turst him. That said he has shown some of his ability in the last few matches, and maybe the team will grow to accept him.

We are signing Lou Reed though. Possibly as a Tito replacement.

Found this news story while looking through the Western Mail about Dale McIntosh - http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/2012/02/27/rugby-legend-dale-mcintosh-cleared-of-violent-disorder-but-other-players-admit-affray-91466-30418684/

Doesn't sound good if he's getting into punch ups at his age/position - though it is easy to get into a punch up in Ponty's pubs and clubs on a Friday night

Smirnoffpriest wrote:Found this news story while looking through the Western Mail about Dale McIntosh - http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/2012/02/27/rugby-legend-dale-mcintosh-cleared-of-violent-disorder-but-other-players-admit-affray-91466-30418684/

Doesn't sound good if he's getting into punch ups at his age/position - though it is easy to get into a punch up in Ponty's pubs and clubs on a Friday night

Cardiff is the place to go for a punch up. The valleys trains are chocca at Cardiff central on a weekend.

Yup they are and it is manic in Cardiff but it's more diluted and there's more places to go where there's no chance of things kicking off - while in Ponty you have Angharads, spoons, Kudos and Clwb y bont...

Still back to the story it seems a bit silly of him and could damage any aspirations he has of taking over at the Blues

Doom and gloom, why is it I hear the same thing over and over, yet look at what quality players are leaving...

Jenkins is the big hurt, but with Yapp, Hobbs and the highly rated Andrews there, plus I'm hearing rumours of a wonderkid tighthead coming through (not sure myself but told by someone involved) we're not in that much trouble there.

Reed would be a decent signing but I heard he's off to England.

Ian Evans won't come!

Rees is frustrated by the lack of rugby, and probably justified, he was chosen 2nd to Williams while in the best form of his life and challenging Phillips for the 9 jersey.

Tovey will be a great signing, Parks needs to go, and Sweeney has offered us little of quality for 2 seasons!

Henson apparently is getting on well, and his form is starting to pick up, even making Gavin Evans look good.

Roberts has always said he'd love to play Super rugby, and I'm sure he will at some point, but 1/2p is going nowhere for now!

As I say all this you never know whats around the corner, with the CAP making recent appearances, and rumours of a few more young welsh signings, things could look good next week.

Just take all runours with a pinch of salt!

Does anyone know why Henson has been dropped for the Treviso game? (maybe on Gats orders as he wants him to replace Roberts in the Wales team )

I just can't believe that the Blues would choose Sweeney in the centre over Henson unless he's injured though. They really are asking for trouble...

Calf strain in training

Ahh i see cheers

Cymroglan wrote:I see this as something good for Welsh rugby we have seasoned internationals moving out of the regions. I just hope they are wise enough to have a release clause in their contract.
Players leaving create a opportunity for the youngsters to show us what they can do it will also hopefully increase our strength in depth.

The former Scottish boss McKay (or McKie??) had the same idea. Look where that got Scottish rugby. He was forced out and in came a new man who understood things better and decided to spend more and now Edinburgh are in the HEC quarter finals and expecting their biggest ever crowd for that HEC game. McKay was an accountant by trade and looked at balancing the books so making the best players play abroad was the plan. There other clubs could pay their wages. He was succeeding at that but it resulted in Scottish being stuck in a rut for years and the regional sides going nowhere.

So Welsh players leaving Wales is bad for Welsh rugby. Young players will be blooded but they'll be playing in losing sides more often.

I think the WRU will have to start compensating the regions for players who play with Wales. Either do it by central contracts or by the amount of games they miss for the regions etc. Surely the WRU can afford to do that?

profitius,

his name was Gordon McKie but you have it spot on - he did not get it and alienated many rugbu supporters in Scotland both in Glasgow and Edinburgh. A lot better now.

Profitius - The WRU already compensate the regions for access to the internationals and fully fund the academies, they then give the regions £6m split 4 ways on top.

Still I agree with you that we need to keep most of our best players within Wales - but to be honest despite what being said I don't see many 20-27 year olds going outside of Wales (like Jenkins), it'll be more the older players going for 1 big contract before coming home or players none of the other regions wanted (like Byrne, Hook, Phillips).

So I don't see it as a huge problem yet, but it is definately something to keep an eye on.

rugbydreamer wrote:Ouch.

Looks like you guys are where the Scarlets were 2008-2010.

It hurts, I'm not going to lie.

Except the Scarlets had promising youngsters where as the Blues have mostly old/past it players behind the worst front row in Europe. Hurt is putting it lightly. A great shame, because I feel the Blues can be a great team. It seems the people are purposely holding you back because I can't imagine how a good team can be so poorly run.

The young players for the Blues don't look that good either to be honest.

Andrews is a young guy, but not sure why you brought him on through. He can't scrum. Navidi is okay, perhaps just a 'clubman' though. Time to hand Sevens star Williams some game time (outside Roberts as it seems it could be a decent combo). Downes looked promising, Cook doesn't. Not sure about Hill.

Im an Ospreys supporter! But yea i agree with you. Cook doesn't impress me either, he looks lightweight. Hill is only 6'4 so i can only see him as a club man. There aren't any 10s, 6/8s or props coming through the Blues academy. Gonna be tough few years for them

I dont understand how we dont have players coming through, as we have had the best U18's for the past three seasons and the best U-16's Be it N or S, even though they just lost to the O's U16's the other day. Our HS teams have been the best for a couple of years too. And Whichurch and St.Davids have very good teams. It makes no sense.

Morgannwg wrote:

rugbydreamer wrote:Ouch.

Looks like you guys are where the Scarlets were 2008-2010.

It hurts, I'm not going to lie.

Except the Scarlets had promising youngsters where as the Blues have mostly old/past it players behind the worst front row in Europe. Hurt is putting it lightly. A great shame, because I feel the Blues can be a great team. It seems the people are purposely holding you back because I can't imagine how a good team can be so poorly run.

Yep, the Welsh team is known for being really old, because they have 5 Blues players and only 3 Scarlets. Ancient.

And im sure all the clubs in europe have a better front row. I mean the Spanish clubs are probably better - Who is that Gethin Jenkins we keep playing at LH by the way?

I think he meant next years front row will be the worst in Europe.
1.Yapp
2.Tyrell
3.Andrews
...yep thats pretty bad

gowales wrote:I think he meant next years front row will be the worst in Europe.
1.Yapp
2.Tyrell
3.Andrews
...yep thats pretty bad

Yep, only 2 internationals - I bet Connacht are laughing.

And 1 will probably be Sam Hobbs - And those 3 just imposed themselves on the Treviso scrum...but those Italians certainly aren't known for their forwards...

Well if you want to be scraping it at the bottom with Connacht and Treviso then that would do the job...

gowales wrote:Well if you want to be scraping it at the bottom with Connacht and Treviso then that would do the job...

So you agree that its not the worst front row in Europe then?

The Blues have NEVER had a competant front row - yet they are still the welsh region that has come closest to lifting the HC and the only one with European silverware.

And the Blues team next year will likely be

1. Sam Hobbs (23)
2. Ryan Tyrell (28) (/Kristian Dacey 22)
3. Scott Andrews (22)
4. James Down (24) / (Lou Reed??)
5. Bradley Davies (25)
6. Mike Paterson (26)
7. Sam Warburton (23)
8. Andries Pretorious (26)
9. Lloyd Williams (22)
10. Jason Tovey (22)
11. Chris Czekaj (26)
12. Jamie Roberts (25)
13. ? Gavin Evans ? (27)
14. Alex Cuthbert (21)
15. Leigh Halfpenny (23)

Average age of 24.2

Ancient...

If you think that to be the team, then it isn't looking so bad. Somebody posted another Blues team earlier on and I based it on that. Yapp, Tyrell and Andrews would be the worst front row in Europe, in all aspects of their play. And when I say Europe, I mean out of all the teams in the Heineken Cup.

You seem happy with medicority. I and others have mentioned that your team is capable of better yet you are willing to settle for some of said players. Looking at it from the opposing end of the spectrum, perhaps you did not lift the HC because your lack of imposing front row. It's going to fall apart when Gethin leaves.

wales606 wrote:

gowales wrote:I think he meant next years front row will be the worst in Europe.
1.Yapp
2.Tyrell
3.Andrews
...yep thats pretty bad

Yep, only 2 internationals - I bet Connacht are laughing.

And 1 will probably be Sam Hobbs - And those 3 just imposed themselves on the Treviso scrum...but those Italians certainly aren't known for their forwards...

Comparing Cardiff with Connacht.
Oh dear.

As for the Treviso 2nds front row today;

1) Ignacio Fernandez-Rouyet
2) Diego Vidal
3) Pedro di Santo

Morgannwg wrote:If you think that to be the team, then it isn't looking so bad. Somebody posted another Blues team earlier on and I based it on that. Yapp, Tyrell and Andrews would be the worst front row in Europe, in all aspects of their play. And when I say Europe, I mean out of all the teams in the Heineken Cup.

You seem happy with medicority. I and others have mentioned that your team is capable of better yet you are willing to settle for some of said players. Looking at it from the opposing end of the spectrum, perhaps you did not lift the HC because your lack of imposing front row. It's going to fall apart when Gethin leaves.

Not me as I believe Cardiff should've and could've been dining at the top table many years ago.
What we need is a return to CAP and a total clearout of those in charge.
I'm very, very rarely an optimist, but I believe this will happen in the next year or so and don't be surprised if the "Blues" regional tag is discarded also.

Morgannwg wrote:If you think that to be the team, then it isn't looking so bad. Somebody posted another Blues team earlier on and I based it on that. Yapp, Tyrell and Andrews would be the worst front row in Europe, in all aspects of their play. And when I say Europe, I mean out of all the teams in the Heineken Cup.

You seem happy with medicority. I and others have mentioned that your team is capable of better yet you are willing to settle for some of said players. Looking at it from the opposing end of the spectrum, perhaps you did not lift the HC because your lack of imposing front row. It's going to fall apart when Gethin leaves.

The front row "fell apart" when Filise turned 33.

Andrews is at least as capable as Filise in the loose, and his scrummaging is improving rapidly. With more gametime he should be able to provide some stabilty (as Filise did), Hobbs is a good young player who is also improving all the time, his loose work is very good, though his scrummaging can be improved (like a young Gethin). Tyrell is a stronger scrummager than TRT.

We will miss Gethin in the loose a lot more than in the tight, he is not the anchor for the scrum, so I don't expect it to fall apart (anymore than it has for the last 10 years) when he leaves - though he rarely plays for the Blues these days anyway.

I am not settling for mediocrity, mearly being realistic, the Blues haven't been able to afford a scrummaging TH for 10 years - there sure as hell can't afford one now.

I expect the front row to at least hold there own and get there own ball back against almost all the european teams (as the Blues have done for years) - although I expect they will struggle if up against the stronger scrummaging sided - as they have done before, like against Northampton last season.

wales606 wrote:
I am not settling for mediocrity, mearly being realistic, the Blues haven't been able to afford a scrummaging TH for 10 years - there sure as hell can't afford one now.

We should've been able to though being a capital city club with a ready made audience on its doorstep and with more than one multi-millionaire on the board.
A shame one of those stopped attending board meetings.

John Yapp is off too by the sounds of it - http://www.scotsman.com/sport/rugby/top-rugby-stories/michael-bradley-bolsters-his-edinburgh-pack-1-2177208

No props next season then.

Griff-John and Andrews... Ouch.

Cardiff Dave wrote:

wales606 wrote:
I am not settling for mediocrity, mearly being realistic, the Blues haven't been able to afford a scrummaging TH for 10 years - there sure as hell can't afford one now.

We should've been able to though being a capital city club with a ready made audience on its doorstep and with more than one multi-millionaire on the board.
A shame one of those stopped attending board meetings.

I find it odd that at least 10 other clubs in the Rabo can afford a scrummaging TH and Blues can't.

wales606 wrote:John Yapp is off too by the sounds of it - http://www.scotsman.com/sport/rugby/top-rugby-stories/michael-bradley-bolsters-his-edinburgh-pack-1-2177208

No props next season then.

I can understand Yapp leaving as he has been expected to play second fiddle pretty much fullstop at the Blues. However it is disappointing that he is off to Scotland, as I'm sure the Dragons/Scarlets would have been willing to sign him, as he is a bit of a bull in the loose.

Morgannwg wrote:Griff-John and Andrews... Ouch.

Hobbs and Andrews

Don't try and chuck Yapp at us - we've got much better props than Yapp coming through.

I've always thought that the Blues main problem in the front row is the players they had to replace their main front row.

When Geth isn't there (which is frequently) you had Yapp,
TRT - Tyrell or Breeze
Fiilse - Andrews

Now Andrews isn't bad, just young and will get better but when you compare that to the other regions
Ospreys
P James - Duncan Jones - Bevington
Hibbert - Bennett - Mefin - S Baldwin
A Jones - Jarvis - C Griffiths

Scarlets
I Thomas - R Jones
Rees - Owens - E Phillips
R Thomas - Manu - Gardiner - P Edwards

*I know some of those players are leaving/retiring, but I was basing on the back up this season.

The strength and depth is better even in a poorer scrummaging side as the Scarlets - which is a shame as the Blues have great stregth in depth coming through in the backrow and at locks and a very potent backline developing (hopefully Tovey will be able to get them clicking) - if you had bought either Bennett or S Baldwin and 1 decent prop then that would be a very good side (now that Blair is back and Henson get back to form if not fitness)

Smirnoff - you forgot Phil John (again tut tut). I was only thinking that Yapp would probably fit in with us, and if R Thomas and Manu are off, and Iestyn doesn't recover from his injury, we would probably have been happy to have Yapp join as he can cover both sides, and is pretty useful in the loose.

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Smirnoff - you forgot Phil John (again tut tut). I was only thinking that Yapp would probably fit in with us, and if R Thomas and Manu are off, and Iestyn doesn't recover from his injury, we would probably have been happy to have Yapp join as he can cover both sides, and is pretty useful in the loose.

Ahh Everytime!!! I even went to School with him (though I'm much more youthful and a few years younger) and I still forget him when making lists.

I'm still hoping we keep hold of Manu and Iestyn recovers as if not then we're screwed anyway you look at it and Yapp ain't going to make a blind bit of difference!

Smirnoffpriest wrote:Ahh Everytime!!! I even went to School with him (though I'm much more youthful and a few years younger) and I still forget him when making lists.

I'm still hoping we keep hold of Manu and Iestyn recovers as if not then we're screwed anyway you look at it and Yapp ain't going to make a blind bit of difference!

Ah so what you mean is its a personal think against Phil . Yeah I hope Manu does stay as he has really grown into a key member of our squad. Christ, who would have believed I would say that when I was blaming John Davies' bad back on having to carry Manu in the scrums when he first signed.

It could be worse Blues Dudes. You could have Gregor 'Useless' Townsend inflicted on you as a coach FFS !

Morgannwg wrote:

I find it odd that at least 10 other clubs in the Rabo can afford a scrummaging TH and Blues can't.

There have been many things "odd" at Cardiff Blues over the years.
Not ever getting a decent TH was one, an OH another, but the oddest thing of all was the move to Cardiff City's stadium.
Was it odd though? Not if you're a property developer.
Thank the Lord for the crash is all I can say.

Dave, the 'Region' seems to have always been built on sand. There was no planning for the future and there is still little of that. Now you have an average team with even worse back-up players. No noteable signings to improve the strength or depth of the team. Tovey aside, he is a very good player. The move should see him actually get a Wales cap.