Mayweather - "I look at Cotto as an undefeated fighter"

... and saying he wants Cotto at his best.

Said this at the press conference in New York, obviously referring to Margarito, who cheated, and Pac who used a catchweight.

Does he have a point?

And how much credit, if any does he get if he defeats Cotto well @ 154?

There is no proof Margarito cheated in that fight

If catchweight creates such a disadvantage why did Cotto take the fight in the first place

Good spin by Mayweather to sell the fight though to be fair

MArgaritos fights should all be questioned or struck off but you are right there is no proof but nearly everyone thinks he did it anyway. Catchweight is a bitch for pacquiao - I'm sure he didnt need it and just did it as a fail safe - but its a stick hes going to be beaten with forever - so Mayweather having a sly dig is probably just that. I don't think he needs to spin this fight though.

Having another dig at Pacquiao, it's boring. It's just like saying his win over Hatton is questionable, the referee never let Hatton do nothing, well if you want to call that fat fame hungry clown Cortez a referee.

Talking more rubbish. He is taking on a fighter that is clearly not as good as he used to be, but trying to hype it as it is.

He would not be fighting him if he was a genuine threat to his 0.

Its rubbish, how can he dismiss what Manny has done?, does he really think Cotto is a better fighter?, with a better record?

Please..

C'mon tunes they are both as bad as each other, I remember when PBF was going to fight SSM camp Pac where saying how SSM was past it but he was a good opponent for them 12 months later.

All fighters say things to make their nearest rival look bad.

Is he not referring to the fact he reckons Pac was on PEDs?

That was my initial thought.

tunes666 wrote:Talking more rubbish. He is taking on a fighter that is clearly not as good as he used to be, but trying to hype it as it is.

He would not be fighting him if he was a genuine threat to his 0.

Its rubbish, how can he dismiss what Manny has done?, does he really think Cotto is a better fighter?, with a better record?

Please..

Yawn zzzzzzzz..Mayweather is facing Cotto at a comfortable 154 pounds no catchweight...Why did Pacquiao blantantly duck Mosley till Mayweather shut him out and Mora draw? Roach is on video saying Mosley is "too good at 147".

Mayweather takes on more challenges than Pacquiao who had 3 sham fights in a row in Mosley, Clottey and Margarito...He thought Marquez was old and would be no threat at a higher weight as well.

Floyd Mayweather last 4 fights:

Ortiz - Number 2 welterweight in the world, young lion coming off a career best win over Berto
Mosley - Pound for pound top 5 and number ONE welterweight in the world and percieved as a BIG threat.
Marquez - Number 2 pound for pound embarassed him who beat Pacquiao 3 times now.
Hatton - top 10 pound for pound unbeaten and his prime.

Yeah Floyd Mayweather never takes on any challenges.

Young lion - lmao, that one never gets old.

The genius of PBF wrote:

Yawn zzzzzzzz..Mayweather is facing Cotto at a comfortable 154 pounds no catchweight...

Did Cotto have a gun to his head?, he kn ew the score before he took the fight and got completely beaten. Manny is the pound for pound king. Cotto moves to a catch weight and its poor Cotto?

Why did Pacquiao blantantly duck Mosley till Mayweather shut him out and Mora draw? Roach is on video saying Mosley is "too good at 147".

Styles make fights.. Remember that Manny is smaller that both FMW and Mosley... Why risk fighting a world class opponent at a weight you are not sure about? And FMW fought Mosley when he had not fought for over a year.. he did not exactly go after him at his prime..

Mayweather takes on more challenges than Pacquiao who had 3 sham fights in a row in Mosley, Clottey and Margarito...

Love sacks, the best challenge to date that FMW had was against DLH, which was a close fight... and why is Margarito in his come back mission a sham?, I would say it was a hard fight. One thing about FMW fans is they seem to have this fantasy that once Floyd has beaten someone they can no longer fight.... Love sacks.

Floyd Mayweather last 4 fights:

Ortiz - Number 2 welterweight in the world, young lion coming off a career best win over Berto

Knocked him out while he was talking to the reff. Beaten by Maidana, and drew with Peterson, my word FMW really risked it all here!

Mosley - Pound for pound top 5 and number ONE welterweight in the world and percieved as a BIG threat.

The Guy Cotto beat back then... (why did he not face cotto?) .. and Mosley beating Margerto there was all the fuss about his hand raps... and Mosley not having been in the ring for nearly 1 1/2 years, Mosley clearly slow on his feet during the fight.

Marquez - Number 2 pound for pound embarassed him who beat Pacquiao 3 times now.

cowpat does not cut it . He has actually lost twice and drew one, admittedly one being unlucky for Marquez (the last fight).. but irrelevant, styles make fights and Manny does not have the size advantage that FMW has over him, not to mention FMW came in heavy and paid Marquez off.

But if Marquez is so much better than Floyd why did Floyd not ask Manny for a fight on his return?... I guess he wanted to reach higher and be more impressive with his Merquez win!

Hatton - top 10 pound for pound unbeaten and his prime.

Fighting at 145 for the first time. always a big ask for Hatton who clearly was better at a lower weight.

Yeah Floyd Mayweather never takes on any challenges.

Indeed.

What a load of crap that post is.

Imperial Ghosty wrote:What a load of crap that post is.

I know that is why I can't be bothered to reply back to him...Something I would expect from D4...My favourite part is his excuse for Pacquiao not facing Mosley.

Im pretty happy with my post

tunes666 wrote:Fighting at 145 for the first time. always a big ask for Hatton who clearly was better at a lower weight.

I would go and check this as it was his second fight at the weight, oh it's 147 not 145. Think you've got Mannys catchweights confussed with actual weights.

tunes666 wrote:Im pretty happy with my post

You would make D4 proud.

hampo171 wrote:

tunes666 wrote:Fighting at 145 for the first time. always a big ask for Hatton who clearly was better at a lower weight.

I would go and check this as it was his second fight at the weight, oh it's 147 not 145. Think you've got Mannys catchweights confussed with actual weights.

ok, well then he fought at 147 twice...

if mayweather had fought cotto a few years ago, he would have been undefeated and been a serious challenge to him. this just sounds like sour grapes, he knows hes fighting him way too late to prove anything. of course cotto is still a huge draw though, so overall its a great fight for flloyd.

Floyd's hinting at the sports supplements and Pacquiao.

Arum is not involved and this fight gets made...amazing init?

Funny how Cotto never says Mayweather ducked him...he knows Mayweather wanted the fight years back.

Perhaps rather than taking pathetic pot shots at each other, we could all discuss boxing instead?

Ortiz was not the number 2 welterweight in the world - as whilst Pacquiao and Floyd continue to refuse to fight - it pushes all other challengers to the #3 position. Marquez at 147 was not much of a challenge, either - and Hatton at 147 had always struggled.

However - Hatton was undefeated and in his best training years with Graham.

The Hatton that Pacquiao fought was at his prime weight, coming off a rejuvenation win - however, there are questions over how shopworn he was and Floyd Mayweather was a hopeless excuse for a trainer.

As for why Mosley-Mayweather didn't happen when it would have been more meaningful - I believe that Mosley bears more blame there than Floyd.

As for Cotto speaking on Mayweather - one of the best things about Cotto is how respectful he is of opponents (excepting Margarito - who many believe cheated). He seldom calls anybody out.

oxring wrote:Perhaps rather than taking pathetic pot shots at each other, we could all discuss boxing instead?

Ortiz was not the number 2 welterweight in the world - as whilst Pacquiao and Floyd continue to refuse to fight - it pushes all other challengers to the #3 position. Marquez at 147 was not much of a challenge, either - and Hatton at 147 had always struggled.

However - Hatton was undefeated and in his best training years with Graham.

The Hatton that Pacquiao fought was at his prime weight, coming off a rejuvenation win - however, there are questions over how shopworn he was and Floyd Mayweather was a hopeless excuse for a trainer.

As for why Mosley-Mayweather didn't happen when it would have been more meaningful - I believe that Mosley bears more blame there than Floyd.

As for Cotto speaking on Mayweather - one of the best things about Cotto is how respectful he is of opponents (excepting Margarito - who many believe cheated). He seldom calls anybody out.

He schooled the supposed number one welterweight and pound for pound number one in Pacquiao 9-2-1...Shock horror oxring discredits one of Floyd Mayweather best wins.

How can you say he was not a challenge when he beat the greatest of all time Pacquiao there...Hatton only had one fight at 147, Collazo would have given him a tough fight at 140 as well...Hatton said Mayweather beat the better version and that is good enough for me.

Ortiz was number 2 in the world at the time...better than the 3 sham fights Pacquiao had in a row.

Cotto retweeted De La Hoya saying Arum prevents the big fights happening...Cotto knows Mayweather never avoided him.

The genius of PBF wrote:

Ortiz was number 2 in the world at the time...better than the 3 sham fights Pacquiao had in a row.

He may have been number 2, but he looked awful against Mayweather.

Group Cpt Lionel Mandrake wrote:

The genius of PBF wrote:

Ortiz was number 2 in the world at the time...better than the 3 sham fights Pacquiao had in a row.

He may have been number 2, but he looked awful against Mayweather.

Floyd Mayweather makes great fighters look ordinary.

The genius of PBF wrote:

Group Cpt Lionel Mandrake wrote:

The genius of PBF wrote:

Ortiz was number 2 in the world at the time...better than the 3 sham fights Pacquiao had in a row.

He may have been number 2, but he looked awful against Mayweather.

Floyd Mayweather makes great fighters look ordinary.

Agreed. Ortiz looked powerless against him. Just before the headbutt Ortiz was trying to unload on him in the corner but they looked like little kiddie punches

To be partisan, we'd point out that Mayweather made Marquez step up 2 weights, for his first outing around the WW division for a catchweight that he couldn't be bother to make himself.

Further - if you think that Ortiz was the number 2 welterweight - either you can't count - or you think that Ortiz is better than either Pacquiao or Floyd. Which, sir, makes you either a tool and a troll - or a WUM.

Doubtless you will come up with some petty snipe about how all this makes Floyd a superior boxer and human being.

oxring wrote:To be partisan, we'd point out that Mayweather made Marquez step up 2 weights, for his first outing around the WW division for a catchweight that he couldn't be bother to make himself.

Further - if you think that Ortiz was the number 2 welterweight - either you can't count - or you think that Ortiz is better than either Pacquiao or Floyd. Which, sir, makes you either a tool and a troll - or a WUM.

Doubtless you will come up with some petty snipe about how all this makes Floyd a superior boxer and human being.

Awww but it was alright when Pacquiao made Marquez step up 2 weights...as the 3rd fight showed that the weight did not make the difference and skill did...Mayweather embarassed Marquez...As long as Mayweather weighed as a welterweight the fight was legit.

Pacquiao could not make the light middleweight limit and then called himself the light middleweight champion...Mayweather did not fight for 18 months so Ortiz was quite rightly rated as the number 2 welterweight in the world.

Much better than Clottey and Mosley coming off loses and draws...As for me being a "tool", "troll", "WUM" all I can point out is you scoring the 3rd fight to Pacquiao which in the eyes of many a blatant robbery.

The genius of PBF wrote:

all I can point out is you scoring the 3rd fight to Pacquiao which in the eyes of many a blatant robbery.

And for the purpose of balance, plenty scored it to Pacman. A very subjective fight and could easily have went either way, but ultimately it didn't.

I've watched Felix Sturm win and draw his last two fights, which I had his opponent winning. Poopie happens.

Plenty of people who I spoke to without wearing Pacquiao glasses scored it by wide decision for Marquez.

It wasn't a close fight Marquez dominated it very easily.

oxring wrote:Perhaps rather than taking pathetic pot shots at each other, we could all discuss boxing instead?

Ortiz was not the number 2 welterweight in the world - as whilst Pacquiao and Floyd continue to refuse to fight - it pushes all other challengers to the #3 position. Marquez at 147 was not much of a challenge, either - and Hatton at 147 had always struggled.

However - Hatton was undefeated and in his best training years with Graham.

The Hatton that Pacquiao fought was at his prime weight, coming off a rejuvenation win - however, there are questions over how shopworn he was and Floyd Mayweather was a hopeless excuse for a trainer.

As for why Mosley-Mayweather didn't happen when it would have been more meaningful - I believe that Mosley bears more blame there than Floyd.

As for Cotto speaking on Mayweather - one of the best things about Cotto is how respectful he is of opponents (excepting Margarito - who many believe cheated). He seldom calls anybody out.

He was a good challenge at 144. What is a couple of pounds? That excuse is always made to legitimise Paq's win over Cotto, but used to discredit Floyd's better win over JMM.

any top class boxer should be able to out box marg and stay out of trouble loaded gloves or not. cotto lost that fight as he wasnt able to sustain his game plan for the whole 12 rounds. after six onwards he sat back on the ropes and invited marg on.

compelling and rich wrote:any top class boxer should be able to out box marg and stay out of trouble loaded gloves or not. cotto lost that fight as he wasnt able to sustain his game plan for the whole 12 rounds. after six onwards he sat back on the ropes and invited marg on.

Maybe the loaded gloves had a greater effect.

azania wrote:

compelling and rich wrote:any top class boxer should be able to out box marg and stay out of trouble loaded gloves or not. cotto lost that fight as he wasnt able to sustain his game plan for the whole 12 rounds. after six onwards he sat back on the ropes and invited marg on.

Maybe the loaded gloves had a greater effect.

cotto being far too easy to hit was more of the problem, there is no proof on the loaded gloves for this one. but i reckon even without the way cotto sat back from 6 onwards and invited the pressure and the way he was getting hit by everything marg threw he was always going to lose loaded gloves or not. cotto very overated, he nearly did exactly the same against clottey who's even more crude than marg. suppose clottey had loaded gloves aswell??

compelling and rich wrote:

azania wrote:

compelling and rich wrote:any top class boxer should be able to out box marg and stay out of trouble loaded gloves or not. cotto lost that fight as he wasnt able to sustain his game plan for the whole 12 rounds. after six onwards he sat back on the ropes and invited marg on.

Maybe the loaded gloves had a greater effect.

cotto being far too easy to hit was more of the problem, there is no proof on the loaded gloves for this one. but i reckon even without the way cotto sat back from 6 onwards and invited the pressure and the way he was getting hit by everything marg threw he was always going to lose loaded gloves or not. cotto very overated, he nearly did exactly the same against clottey who's even more crude than marg. suppose clottey had loaded gloves aswell??

I'm not argying that Cotto fought badly in that fight. My point was what you said that loaded gloves or not any top class boxer should be able to outbox marg. That is patently not accurate. In fact its quite a stupid comment.

azania wrote:

compelling and rich wrote:

azania wrote:

compelling and rich wrote:any top class boxer should be able to out box marg and stay out of trouble loaded gloves or not. cotto lost that fight as he wasnt able to sustain his game plan for the whole 12 rounds. after six onwards he sat back on the ropes and invited marg on.

Maybe the loaded gloves had a greater effect.

cotto being far too easy to hit was more of the problem, there is no proof on the loaded gloves for this one. but i reckon even without the way cotto sat back from 6 onwards and invited the pressure and the way he was getting hit by everything marg threw he was always going to lose loaded gloves or not. cotto very overated, he nearly did exactly the same against clottey who's even more crude than marg. suppose clottey had loaded gloves aswell??

I'm not argying that Cotto fought badly in that fight. My point was what you said that loaded gloves or not any top class boxer should be able to outbox marg. That is patently not accurate. In fact its quite a stupid comment.

since when does loading your gloves make you the next SRL??? it makes your punches hurt more but does not change your boxing style/ability, so therefore a top class boxer should still be able to out box marg loaded gloves or not. who's looking stupid now az?

compelling and rich wrote:

azania wrote:

compelling and rich wrote:

azania wrote:

compelling and rich wrote:any top class boxer should be able to out box marg and stay out of trouble loaded gloves or not. cotto lost that fight as he wasnt able to sustain his game plan for the whole 12 rounds. after six onwards he sat back on the ropes and invited marg on.

Maybe the loaded gloves had a greater effect.

cotto being far too easy to hit was more of the problem, there is no proof on the loaded gloves for this one. but i reckon even without the way cotto sat back from 6 onwards and invited the pressure and the way he was getting hit by everything marg threw he was always going to lose loaded gloves or not. cotto very overated, he nearly did exactly the same against clottey who's even more crude than marg. suppose clottey had loaded gloves aswell??

I'm not argying that Cotto fought badly in that fight. My point was what you said that loaded gloves or not any top class boxer should be able to outbox marg. That is patently not accurate. In fact its quite a stupid comment.

since when does loading your gloves make you the next SRL??? it makes your punches hurt more but does not change your boxing style/ability, so therefore a top class boxer should still be able to out box marg loaded gloves or not. who's looking stupid now az?

Getting hit with loaded gloves will stop SRL from being SRL. It has a more damaging effect on facial features that non loaded gloves and yes it hurts more and therefore plays on the boxer's mind. Do you think that if he had loaded gloves against SSM, the result would have been the same? I doubt that. I suppose Richardson should have allowed them. After all SSM was a superior boxer and wouldn't have had any effect.

WHere did I say it wouldnt have any effect? Not buying that facing a crude boxer with possible dogdy hand wraps changes a boxers skill set

compelling and rich wrote:WHere did I say it wouldnt have any effect? Not buying that facing a crude boxer with possible dogdy hand wraps changes a boxers skill set

I'm buying into the fact that a crude (but effective) brawler will have a game changer if his gloves are loaded.

It does tire them out though C & R - especially body shots - which slows down the boxer and makes him sloppy. Boxer is still the more skilled but hes weary and hurting and those blows to the body are wearing you out.

I'd say that if Marg had loaded gloved against Paq, he would have won.

azania wrote:

oxring wrote:Perhaps rather than taking pathetic pot shots at each other, we could all discuss boxing instead?

Ortiz was not the number 2 welterweight in the world - as whilst Pacquiao and Floyd continue to refuse to fight - it pushes all other challengers to the #3 position. Marquez at 147 was not much of a challenge, either - and Hatton at 147 had always struggled.

However - Hatton was undefeated and in his best training years with Graham.

The Hatton that Pacquiao fought was at his prime weight, coming off a rejuvenation win - however, there are questions over how shopworn he was and Floyd Mayweather was a hopeless excuse for a trainer.

As for why Mosley-Mayweather didn't happen when it would have been more meaningful - I believe that Mosley bears more blame there than Floyd.

As for Cotto speaking on Mayweather - one of the best things about Cotto is how respectful he is of opponents (excepting Margarito - who many believe cheated). He seldom calls anybody out.

He was a good challenge at 144. What is a couple of pounds? That excuse is always made to legitimise Paq's win over Cotto, but used to discredit Floyd's better win over JMM.

Perhaps its more that Mayweather and Marquez weren't even fighting at the same weight...

As for someone called "the genius of pbf" - frankly - hardly likely to be the soul of unbiased comment. Further, someone who would prefer to follow other posters making snide comments rather than contributing to debate.

This on the back of a previous history of being banned for the same offence.

And on the back of these articles and posts:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/606/A83413082
http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/606/A82264179

And then begging to get back on here for several months.

All this in summation? I can't think of anyone on here with less credibility than you, pbf and I'd strongly advise trying to stay within house rules for other posters. Whilst extremely irritating, I can live with you following me like a foul stench - but it won't be tolerated for other posters.

They were fighting in the same weight division. As far as I can recall, the WW division is below 147 and above 140. JMM came in above 140 and below 147. Floyd I believe came in at 146. A pound above the Cotto weight which many have argued made no difference. Ho hum.

ShahenshahG wrote:It does tire them out though C & R - especially body shots - which slows down the boxer and makes him sloppy. Boxer is still the more skilled but hes weary and hurting and those blows to the body are wearing you out.

I'd give that theory alot more credit if cotto had not done the exact same thing against clottey to get away with a sd. I remember watching the fight and thinking what cotto was playing at, fighting right into marg hands. If cotto fought like he did in there second fight he wins whether hand wraps or not. What good are hand wraps when you can't hit your oppenent

compelling and rich wrote:

ShahenshahG wrote:It does tire them out though C & R - especially body shots - which slows down the boxer and makes him sloppy. Boxer is still the more skilled but hes weary and hurting and those blows to the body are wearing you out.

I'd give that theory alot more credit if cotto had not done the exact same thing against clottey to get away with a sd. I remember watching the fight and thinking what cotto was playing at, fighting right into marg hands. If cotto fought like he did in there second fight he wins whether hand wraps or not. What good are hand wraps when you can't hit your oppenent

Marg was better in their first fight and would have landed more with loaded gloves. Even in their rematch, with loaded gloves the fight would have been more competitive and Marg did hit Cotto often. It just wasn't enough and with little effect.

Are you slowly losing your grasp on sanity? Margarito lost every round of his fight against Cotto (2).

And suggesting that he'd have won "with loaded gloves" is shabby, mendacious apologism.

I'm sure that Khan would beat Mayweather if armed with a baseball bat.

And that Haye could beat Wladi-K if Wlad if Haye was allowed to tie Wlad's left wrist to his waistband.

Both are against the rules - so its an irrelevant and ridiculous line of argument.

You can do better, big man. Try harder.

oxring wrote:Are you slowly losing your grasp on sanity? Margarito lost every round of his fight against Cotto (2).

And suggesting that he'd have won "with loaded gloves" is shabby, mendacious apologism.

I'm sure that Khan would beat Mayweather if armed with a baseball bat.

And that Haye could beat Wladi-K if Wlad if Haye was allowed to tie Wlad's left wrist to his waistband.

Both are against the rules - so its an irrelevant and ridiculous line of argument.

You can do better, big man. Try harder.

I hope this is not directed towards my good self. Because if it is it just shows that your command of the written word is superb, but the same cannot be said of your comprehension.

azania wrote:Marg was better in their first fight and would have landed more with loaded gloves. Even in their rematch, with loaded gloves the fight would have been more competitive and Marg did hit Cotto often. It just wasn't enough and with little effect.

azania wrote:I'd say that if Marg had loaded gloved against Paq, he would have won.

Yep - its directed against you.

I'm thinking of a great slew of fights that would have had different outcomes with cheating. Gunn to have beaten Maccarinelli if armed with a real gun. Or Audley to have beaten Haye if armed with a chainsaw (although it would be close - as Haye said when he saw that video of Audley with the axe - what use is a weapon if you're too afraid to throw it...)

oxring wrote:

azania wrote:Marg was better in their first fight and would have landed more with loaded gloves. Even in their rematch, with loaded gloves the fight would have been more competitive and Marg did hit Cotto often. It just wasn't enough and with little effect.

azania wrote:I'd say that if Marg had loaded gloved against Paq, he would have won.

Yep - its directed against you.

I'm thinking of a great slew of fights that would have had different outcomes with cheating. Gunn to have beaten Maccarinelli if armed with a real gun. Or Audley to have beaten Haye if armed with a chainsaw (although it would be close - as Haye said when he saw that video of Audley with the axe - what use is a weapon if you're too afraid to throw it...)

The difference between the Cotto (2) fight and Paq fight is that Paq got his more often that Cotto did. The punches with loaded gloves would have taken its toll against Paq. Of course you are of the opinion that some boxers are impervious ot pain. Collins was thought of as a huge prospect until he met Resto. Resto's gloves had the padding removed. It was akin to being hit with fists. Not as dangerous as having plastercast with sets as hard as cement. The effects with fewer punches would be more impactful in my opinion.

Can you also quit with the stupid exaggerations. Or carry on playing to the gallery and arm wavery.

I'm trying to highlight the idiocy of the statement az.

Surely you can see that saying "if 1 guy cheated, the other guy would have lost" adds nothing and is a relatively illogical and pointless thing to say.

Frankly - I'd back that Margarito to have beaten mayweather with his loaded gloves as well.

In fact - there are few fighters in history who would survive that assault.

oxring wrote:I'm trying to highlight the idiocy of the statement az.

Surely you can see that saying "if 1 guy cheated, the other guy would have lost" adds nothing and is a relatively illogical and pointless thing to say.

Frankly - I'd back that Margarito to have beaten mayweather with his loaded gloves as well.

In fact - there are few fighters in history who would survive that assault.

You're confused. I suggest you take the issue up with compelling and rich who stated that regardless of the loaded gloves, any decent boxer would have beaten Marg.