Rafael Nadal (2) vs Roger Federer (3) LIVE MATCH THREAD - Fed completes easy win

[amritia3ee]

First topic message reminder :

Match thread:

2nd semifinal-
RAFAEL NADAL (2) VS ROGER FEDERER (3)

[socal1976]

HI Nore staat, do you know why Roger didn't get tired after a set of tennis on blue clay against the talentless moonballer? I thought Rafa would exhaust Roger in the first set due to unfairly slowed conditions today.

Yes Isner played great. Tough pill to swallow as a Novak fan to lose the match when you drop serve once in three sets. But credit to Isner he had the right game plan and blasted 20 aces. Also liked how he was pressuring Novak on second serve although he didn't break him but the once it definetly paid off in the tiebreaks.

[socal1976]

Laverfan, you never seem to have a problem with the rationality of Fed extremists who claim that a ten time grandslam champion isn't talented and can't hit a tennis ball. Frankly, Roger is a great champion, been a credit to the game hell he has carried the game for a number of years. But I have never, ever, ever seen more annoying fans in any sport than a certain faction of his fans.

I repeat why didn't Federer get exhausted after one set on the blue clay like in all his other matches?

[Guest]

HI Nore staat, do you know why Roger didn't get tired after a set of tennis on blue clay against the talentless moonballer? I thought Rafa would exhaust Roger in the first set due to unfairly slowed conditions today. ...

I suspect Roger was pumped up for this match.

[Jeremy_Kyle]

@ Soc: I think you should discuss the issues you mention with those who put them forward. As for me: I think you know the way I see it.

Off to bed now.

Cheerio!

[summerblues]

socal, cheer up. Pretty much the only thing that matters to your man over the next few months is how he does at the French. Whether or not he wins that one will easily outweigh his performances - bad or good - in all the tournaments in-between. He knows it and I do not think he is too fussed about these smaller tourneys.

And why would you root against a player just because of their fans? I like Fed's game so I root for him; not so much Nadal's game, so do not root for him. I could not care less what kind of fans either of them have, nor do I care much about what kind of people the two of them are.

[Josiah Maiestas]

I shall be watching a great match tomorrow no matter the result cause it's two men playing by the rules (no coaching or time wasting) and you will be watching and praying Federer loses

[socal1976]

socal, cheer up. Pretty much the only thing that matters to your man over the next few months is how he does at the French. Whether or not he wins that one will easily outweigh his performances - bad or good - in all the tournaments in-between. He knows it and I do not think he is too fussed about these smaller tourneys.

And why would you root against a player just because of their fans? I like Fed's game so I root for him; not so much Nadal's game, so do not root for him. I could not care less what kind of fans either of them have, nor do I care much about what kind of people the two of them are.

Summer, thanks for the kind words. I actually am not that sad for Novak. Hasn't played his best tennis, but no excuses Isner deserved it. And I reiterate I don't dislike or loathe all fed fans. He has a lot of fans that are quite reasonable.

But I hope you can understand how one could get rubbed the wrong way by the unsubstantiated doping arguments and the constant down grading of other champions. Somehow when Roger wins he manages not to get tired after a set of tennis on the blue clay.

[socal1976]

I shall be watching a great match tomorrow no matter the result cause it's two men playing by the rules (no coaching or time wasting) and you will be watching and praying Federer loses

Yep, anyone but Fed from now on. Thanks to the wonderful sportsmanship of a certain faction of his fans. Only thing worse than a sore loser is a sore winner.

[Josiah Maiestas]

Why is the mods continuing to edit my comment?

Mods must love you Socal cause you can get away with any comments.

[bogbrush]

So it's true we can make you to stuff?

I'm going to practise getting you to sit, and roll over. Never had a programmable forum colleague before.

[socal1976]

JM, I have already gone to the principal's office tonight.

[socal1976]

So it's true we can make you to stuff?

I'm going to practise getting you to sit, and roll over. Never had a programmable forum colleague before.

More stream of consciousness on Acid BB, can someone read the tea leaves and tell me what this fortune cookie means?

[summerblues]

But I hope you can understand how one could get rubbed the wrong way by ... constant down grading of other champions

I can see that. And by all means, do get rubbed the wrong way and take it out on them, or perhaps us, in here (within reason ). Just seems a bit sad to carry it over to the support, or lack thereof, of the players themselves. I am thinking if I were to do that, it would spoil the enjoyment of tennis for me, so why would you let other players' fans do that to you?

[socal1976]

Well Summer good point, but I am just tired of their nonsense. When Roger loses he gets tired due to unfairly slowed conditions. And other champions are either doping, cheating, or boring. Maybe it isn't mature to root against Roger because of a certain faction of his fans.

But unfortunately I am not that self actualized that I can compartmentalize those things.

[laverfan]

Laverfan, you never seem to have a problem with the rationality of Fed extremists who claim that a ten time grandslam champion isn't talented and can't hit a tennis ball.

I do. Please see my comments on the Nadal injury thread.

Frankly, Roger is a great champion, been a credit to the game hell he has carried the game for a number of years.

Despite this, you want to be a member of the 'Anyone-but-Federer' club? Glad to see reason make a foray towards a balance.

But I have never, ever, ever seen more annoying fans in any sport than a certain faction of his fans.

Why equate a 'section of the fans' to the player himself/herself? It is a disservice to the player.

I repeat why didn't Federer get exhausted after one set on the blue clay like in all his other matches?

He did. Could not close it out while serving for the match at 5-2 and needed a break to finish the match. How is that for an 'irrational' yet 'reasonable' response?

I could give you some more reasons like a 'cold', he mentioned flying from Switzerland to NY to IW and the rapid change of climate.

BTW, I am not justifying any posters' comments.

[Josiah Maiestas]

He's trying to convert every poster in tennis to think like he does I believe it's called Cultist or something. Nobodies falling for your preaching Socal and I am off to bed now seeya.

[socal1976]

Can't help it laverfan, would be happy if Roger never won a pro tennis match again. Maybe that would hasten the departure of the fed extremist contingent, but then again they would still stick around and probably become more shrill.

They called me out after Novak lost today, well becareful for what you wish for.

And they rained on my parade after the AO, so just returning the favor. Holly Wilaboobie for tat.

[socal1976]

He's trying to convert every poster in tennis to think like he does I believe it's called Cultist or something. Nobodies falling for your preaching Socal and I am off to bed now seeya.

Night, night JM. Enjoy the next meeting of the sore winner Fed club. I could care less about converting people. As you can tell I am hardly the diplomatic type or care very much about other people's opinions. If I did I would just stroke federer like the rest of the worshippers and gain their approval.

[amritia3ee]

Laverfan I'm not sure you watched the match.
Fed didn't break to win, he served it out.

[summerblues]

I think laverfan meant the short rain delay before the match point.

[amritia3ee]

Thats a silly excuse. Fed deserved to win, it wasn't because of the rain delay.

[laverfan]

Laverfan I'm not sure you watched the match.
Fed didn't break to win, he served it out.

"With the winds picking up, Federer broke Nadal at love in the third game of the second set. A Nadal double-fault from the same end of the court set up another break point for Federer, and the Swiss took advantage to go up 5-2. Nadal prevented Federer from serving out the match at the first time of asking, but could not hold him off a second time."

http://www.atpworldtour.com/News/Tennis/2012/03/11/Indian-Wells-Saturday-Federer-Nadal-Clash.aspx

PS:

I think laverfan meant the short rain delay before the match point.

Yes.

[Tenez]

By the way, did FEderer say a "come on" on a Rafa double fault or did I imagine it?

No. THat was me.

Might go to bed and check your response tomorrow, but would you agree Federer's level suddenly dropped at 6-3 3-1? Any thoughts?

This match is a mistery to me. The way Fed played under such terrible conditions is absurd. He did not get tired cause he kept the points short. In essence he played on a slow court with gusty winds as if it was a fast court and still conditions. How did he do that? I don't know. He must have seen everything in slow-mo.

Nadal tried to take the ball early but under those conditions made many "UEs" and that helped Federer keep the rallies short. Why did Nadal try to take the ball early? I think he was tired and could not do too much running so tried to dictate as well. There was no risk of blunting that edge with long rallies for Fed.

[amritia3ee]

Why was Nadal tired?
This is getting hilarious now Tenez.

[Manojchandra]

I did not watch it, but Tenez's analysis, as always, makes sense to me. I always look forward to reading his observations.

[amritia3ee]

Did you watch the match?
The rallies were quite long in general.

[Manojchandra]

Tiredness is not always 100% physical to begin with methinks. We all sometimes start day on most Mondays, if that is our luck, not feeling most optimum.

[amritia3ee]

I don't see how that has any relation to Tenez's theory. There were long rallies, Tenez cant deny that. Each game lasted approximately 5 min which is normal in their matches.
Federer has spectacularly and ruthlessy debunked and destroyed Tenez's hapless theory.

[gallery play]

They called me out after Novak lost today, well becareful for what you wish for.

Please Socal please! have mercy on us!!

[gallery play]

This match is a mistery to me. The way Fed played under such terrible conditions is absurd.

I guess he's better than ever now. Your case is getting stronger by the week

Federer is so "match tough" at the moment, he gets himself out of every tight situation. Because despite the huge difference in quality between these two this match, there still were a few crucial moments.

I loved how Federer hit winners from balls which were jumping a yard sideways right after the bounce.

[amritia3ee]

In which way is his case getting stronger? lol
Even I said Fed is playing really well, I predicted yesterday's match perfectly while Tenez got it totally wrong.

[Tenez]

This match is a mistery to me. The way Fed played under such terrible conditions is absurd.

I guess he's better than ever now. Your case is getting stronger by the week

Federer is so "match tough" at the moment, he gets himself out of every tight situation. Because despite the huge difference in quality between these two this match, there still were a few crucial moments.

I loved how Federer hit winners from balls which were jumping a yard sideways right after the bounce.

Thanks GP.

Because despite the huge difference in quality between these two this match, there still were a few crucial moments.

Exactly. With Nadal, his opponent is never far from a complete turn around and/or collapse.

[Henman Bill]

By the way, did FEderer say a "come on" on a Rafa double fault or did I imagine it?

No. THat was me.

Might go to bed and check your response tomorrow, but would you agree Federer's level suddenly dropped at 6-3 3-1? Any thoughts?

This match is a mistery to me. The way Fed played under such terrible conditions is absurd. He did not get tired cause he kept the points short. In essence he played on a slow court with gusty winds as if it was a fast court and still conditions. How did he do that? I don't know. He must have seen everything in slow-mo.

Nadal tried to take the ball early but under those conditions made many "UEs" and that helped Federer keep the rallies short. Why did Nadal try to take the ball early? I think he was tired and could not do too much running so tried to dictate as well. There was no risk of blunting that edge with long rallies for Fed.

I thought the wind would benefit the defensive player rather than the player going for fine margin agression, but actually Nadal found it hard. Looked like a solid wind, force 5 or something, obviously very gusty in a big stadium setting.

Nadal's thoughts: "I was feeling the ball great. I felt I'm ready to compete and ready to win the match, but later the crazy wind [made it ] very difficult for me to play with a clear tactic," Nadal admitted. "I lost court, I had more mistakes, and I think he played very aggressive. He played fantastic. His serve was with high percentage, and I wasn't able to play my usual tactic against him with that conditions. He hit the balls, every one inside the court, and the weather conditions makes the topspin more difficult for me."

[summerblues]

Federer was insanely good at times last night. I did not think the conditions would affect him as badly as some others predicted, but still was surprised that Nadal seemed to be affected more than Fed (especially remembering how he did not seem to be bothered by much windier conditions against Murray a couple of years ago).

Also puzzled by how this one went. My best guess would be that this was one of those rare days where Federer just went for it and it worked. Let them play 10 matches like this, and Federer will maybe win 2-3 out of them, in the other ones the W/UE ratio will not be good enough.

[Henman Bill]

Anyone know what the W/UEs ratios were? Any link to stats?

[laverfan]

I thought the wind would benefit the defensive player rather than the player going for fine margin agression, but actually Nadal found it hard. Looked like a solid wind, force 5 or something, obviously very gusty in a big stadium setting.

Nadal's thoughts: "I was feeling the ball great. I felt I'm ready to compete and ready to win the match, but later the crazy wind [made it ] very difficult for me to play with a clear tactic," Nadal admitted. "I lost court, I had more mistakes, and I think he played very aggressive. He played fantastic. His serve was with high percentage, and I wasn't able to play my usual tactic against him with that conditions. He hit the balls, every one inside the court, and the weather conditions makes the topspin more difficult for me."

Surprised that he mentions weather conditions affecting the topspin shots - which they do not here.

Watch this clip - similar conditions (notice the towels flying around on the court surface before the match starts) and the same court - different opponent

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QlYB-eJCcvY&feature=results_video&playnext=1&list=PLD9120D127ED44CB9

[Tenez]

Also puzzled by how this one went. My best guess would be that this was one of those rare days where Federer just went for it and it worked. Let them play 10 matches like this, and Federer will maybe win 2-3 out of them, in the other ones the W/UE ratio will not be good enough.

Yes, though more realistically, he has won 1 out 3 matches v Nadal across all courts and 1 out of 2 oustide clay. So the odds are not as bad as we think.

[Tenez]

Yes we all agree that the wind should actually favour Nadal for 2 reasons:

1 - Taking teh ball later when the speed drops fast giving him an easier ball to time

2 - Simply cause his shots have a much higher margins than Federer.

However, I think (I am not sure) that Nadal was actually tired, certainly looked so , therefore stepping back like he does usually would have meant to be push from side to side by Federer forcing him to cover more ground. He chose to take the ball earlier but there his timing let him down.

I think a lot had to do with his match with Nalby and Federer simply playing amazingly well.

[noleisthebest]

Federer was insanely good at times last night. I did not think the conditions would affect him as badly as some others predicted, but still was surprised that Nadal seemed to be affected more than Fed (especially remembering how he did not seem to be bothered by much windier conditions against Murray a couple of years ago).

Also puzzled by how this one went. My best guess would be that this was one of those rare days where Federer just went for it and it worked. Let them play 10 matches like this, and Federer will maybe win 2-3 out of them, in the other ones the W/UE ratio will not be good enough.

The thing is summerblues, a lot of people don't use their own eyes to deduce the truth, they'd rather listen to what media, pundits or know-it-all think.

I have read here a lot of tripe regarding IW slow conditions, some comparing it to clay, some even saying it's SLOWER than clay. Who's in the final: the serve-from-the tree guy and a fast-court specialist.
It was frustrating, but I knew where it was coming from, no big deal.

I only saw 2 thirds of the first set and then dropped off. But from what I saw, Fed played like man possessed, esp in the first 3 games, talk about ULTRA aggressive.


He mixed it up big time switching between bludgeoning Nadal' backhand every time he could, rushing forward with venom, he was better than in his very best days in my opinion. Remember, he was not playing Youzhny or Roddick, he was playing the guy who had been savageing him for years.
He skillfully sustained bursts of Nadal's physical onslaughts not letting up mentally. That match must've taken a lot out of Fed mentally. It really is not easy to play so aggressively at THAT level, even in the best of 3.

I knew he was going to win it, because I noticed he's been playing with belief recently.

For me, it will be interesting whether he'll be able to sustain it during slams as it's there where I expect Nole and Nadal to play their best, i.e. Fed will have to beat both of them in order to win a slam.

[bogbrush]

Not if he can get to #2 before the French, which is very possible. Then he'll have a 50% chance of getting Djokovic and Nadal into the same half.

[Tenez]

Federer was insanely good at times last night. I did not think the conditions would affect him as badly as some others predicted, but still was surprised that Nadal seemed to be affected more than Fed (especially remembering how he did not seem to be bothered by much windier conditions against Murray a couple of years ago).

Also puzzled by how this one went. My best guess would be that this was one of those rare days where Federer just went for it and it worked. Let them play 10 matches like this, and Federer will maybe win 2-3 out of them, in the other ones the W/UE ratio will not be good enough.

The thing is summerblues, a lot of people don't use their own eyes to deduce the truth, they'd rather listen to what media, pundits or know-it-all think.

I have read here a lot of tripe regarding IW slow conditions, some comparing it to clay, some even saying it's SLOWER than clay. Who's in the final: the serve-from-the tree guy and a fast-court specialist.
It was frustrating, but I knew where it was coming from, no big deal.

I only saw 2 thirds of the first set and then dropped off. But from what I saw, Fed played like man possessed, esp in the first 3 games, talk about ULTRA aggressive.


He mixed it up big time switching between bludgeoning Nadal' backhand every time he could, rushing forward with venom, he was better than in his very best days in my opinion. Remember, he was not playing Youzhny or Roddick, he was playing the guy who had been savageing him for years.
He skillfully sustained bursts of Nadal's physical onslaughts not letting up mentally. That match must've taken a lot out of Fed mentally. It really is not easy to play so aggressively at THAT level, even in the best of 3.

I knew he was going to win it, because I noticed he's been playing with belief recently.

For me, it will be interesting whether he'll be able to sustain it during slams as it's there where I expect Nole and Nadal to play their best, i.e. Fed will have to beat both of them in order to win a slam.

It's not only the media but the players also who have talked about the very slow courts. Federer and Isner are in teh final but it could may well have been Djoko and Nadal. And we know that slow courts can actually help the big hitters like Isner. He has done well on clay recently, hasn't he?

[noleisthebest]

[/quote]

It's not only the media but the players also who have talked about the very slow courts. Federer and Isner are in teh final but it could may well have been Djoko and Nadal. And we know that slow courts can actually help the big hitters like Isner. He has done well on clay recently, hasn't he?[/quote]

They can, but, as you can see the don't hinder anyone's style of play, tennis was quite OK last week.

It's only Nadal Nole matches that are boring to watch. I reckon the reason while "players" talked about slowness of courts out of the blue (and I have only heard Federer complain about it) is because of the AO final and the sheer display of fitness/stamina that must have been intimidating to a lot of players.

I can guarantee yo that if it was Federer in all those finals last year, nobody would have moaned about the state of courts, just like noone did while he was dominating on those VERY SAME courts.

[Tenez]

As said I am very surprised by the last night result andin particular by teh way DJoko and Nadal played. It was good to see upset but I feel we woudl see more of those "upsets" on faster conds.

I can guarantee yo that if it was Federer in all those finals last year, nobody would have moaned about the state of courts, just like noone did while he was dominating on those VERY SAME courts.

Yes, you are probably right cause essentially that was a tennis that allowed variety and have different styles to win or even reach the finals. It made kind of sense to see Federer dominating cause it was difficult to argue against his techniques and eye/hand coordination. But I woudl never compain if he got beat by Nalbandian, Berdych, or anyone else.

What has really got me is to see the same 4 reaching systematcially the semi in all tournaments they played because the slow conds were favouring their style. ...in fact 3 of them, Federer with his SHBH being teh clear exception there.

I woudl not say Nadal Nole matches are boring...what is boring is to have them in every slam or TMS final.

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