The IRB rankings are a crock of you know what! ;o)

First topic message reminder :

Wales win the grand slam - beat everyone in front of them, yet England beat Ireland by a large score (well done on that by the way) and are above us

http://www.irb.com/rankings/index.html

I realise that most people don't pay much attention to them, but surely there is something fundamentally wrong when you are lower in the rankings than a team you beat?

Are England better? Me thinks not!

english warrior wrote:Kiwiredevil-

'If Ireland manage to turn their form around and pinch a match in NZ'


Que, eh?? what? If they manage to pinch a game in NZ? Look, did you see Ireland at the weekend, they couldn't pinch a game if it was stolen to order, Dear, dear me, do you have any knowledge of what you administrate?

I said "if". I didn't say I thought it was likely . I'd put the chances in the "possible* but unlikely" box.


*Steve Hansen in charge of NZ. <Shudder>

Kiwireddevil wrote:

english warrior wrote:If Wales were to lose all their games coming up in the summer( Snigger, chortle and guffaw) , where could they end up in the rankings? which i know will be more managable for them and their fans, as a lot are suffering from vertigo and nose bleeds now they are up to the dizzying heights of 5th!!

It sort of depends on other results EW. England are likely to lose all 3 to South Africa, so if Wales lose 3-0 the two teams will drop about the same amount. If Ireland manage to turn their form around and pinch a match in NZ they'll skyrocket up, but I think the important series rankings wise is Argentina vs France - either side could make a move.

England will drop more than Wales ( as their opponents are rated well below Aus), and are only a tiny anmount ahead of Wales at the moment. If the results in those series are all in the same bracket ( eg both visiting teams lose all 3 games by 1-15 ) then Wales will leapfrog England.
Its hard at this point to know which of England and Wales have the bigger challenge ahead of them. As an England fan Im usually more confident of the teams ability to take on Aus than SA. I fancy Wales to be ranked above England by the end of the tours.


Where they actually end up is another question as you say Kiwi, dependant on other results.

I know a lot of Kiwis are down on their " tranisitional" team at the moment but it would still be a miracle for Ireland to nick a game there.

Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:

Kiwireddevil wrote:

english warrior wrote:If Wales were to lose all their games coming up in the summer( Snigger, chortle and guffaw) , where could they end up in the rankings? which i know will be more managable for them and their fans, as a lot are suffering from vertigo and nose bleeds now they are up to the dizzying heights of 5th!!

It sort of depends on other results EW. England are likely to lose all 3 to South Africa, so if Wales lose 3-0 the two teams will drop about the same amount. If Ireland manage to turn their form around and pinch a match in NZ they'll skyrocket up, but I think the important series rankings wise is Argentina vs France - either side could make a move.

England will drop more than Wales ( as their opponents are rated well below Aus), and are only a tiny anmount ahead of Wales at the moment. If the results in those series are all in the same bracket ( eg both visiting teams lose all 3 games by 1-15 ) then Wales will leapfrog England.
Its hard at this point to know which of England and Wales have the bigger challenge ahead of them. As an England fan Im usually more confident of the teams ability to take on Aus than SA. I fancy Wales to be ranked above England by the end of the tours.


Where they actually end up is another question as you say Kiwi, dependant on other results.

I know a lot of Kiwis are down on their " tranisitional" team at the moment but it would still be a miracle for Ireland to nick a game there.

I feel very nervous about Steve Hansen. And replacing Kaino and Thorn will be tough. I won't be surprised if we drop a game or two in the AIs.

SA v England and Aus v Wales are traditionally both clashes between teams of similar styles, meaning the results come down to execution. And over the past few years the 2 SH teams have had a 10-20% better execution rate.

Kiwireddevil wrote: I feel very nervous about Steve Hansen. And replacing Kaino and Thorn will be tough. I won't be surprised if we drop a game or two in the AIs.

SA v England and Aus v Wales are traditionally both clashes between teams of similar styles, meaning the results come down to execution. And over the past few years the 2 SH teams have had a 10-20% better execution rate.

England look equipped to execute better than in the last couple of years though. Whilst not a lot of attacking flair was shown, a lot of ability to stick to a gameplan and to grind things out was, and if the same can be done in South Africa against a team that will also be in transition then I think we have a chance. I am more optimistic than I was 9 weeks ago.

Yes Ozzy I agree. Its new starts in ways for both sides so that 'who's got the best new team' question will be put to the test in SA.

How about Oz? Injuries and depth will be your ongoing problem. We hear stories here non pro club players are being brought through to fill in sxv positions on a fairly regular basis.

Gotta be a concern given Wales have 2 or 3 now fighting for most positions. But both teams are also on similar paths- probably the 2 most settled sides in World rugby given theyve done their 'new players/ cosch' thing for a good 203 years now.

This series has a real exciting look to it.

3N champs vs 6N champs and both coached by Kiwi's where neither team is ours.

Geez...

Taylorman wrote:
How about Oz? Injuries and depth will be your ongoing problem. We hear stories here non pro club players are being brought through to fill in sxv positions on a fairly regular basis.

Gotta be a concern given Wales have 2 or 3 now fighting for most positions. But both teams are also on similar paths- probably the 2 most settled sides in World rugby given theyve done their 'new players/ cosch' thing for a good 203 years now.

Aus don't have any clubs though do they? They have the Super XV provinces (are they provincial?) but I think they lack something below preparing them for that level.

I'm not sure if we have as much depth. We have players in 3 or 4 key players in certain positions who if cropped will affect the team. There was no opportunity in the 6 Nations for their replacements. Craig Mitchell and James Hook should have seen some game time in their preferred positions. As for Aus, I'm not sure how their injury list is right now. But I think their player pool is still larger than ours and the ones they bring on through are very good players. O'Connor and Ashley-Cooper are two of my favourite Aussies for the fact that they can slot in anywhere in the backline and still look world class.

Adult male players Australia = 57,766
Adult male players Wales = 12,000

Australia Clubs = 767
Wales Clubs = 314

Yeah Australia beat us just a bit....

Alyn, I used to think Aus only had about 5 million people live there but it turns out it's something like 20 million.. And to get from one side of Adelaide to the other takes 10 hours (same amount of time it takes to get from Eastern Australia to Western).

Morgannwg wrote:

Taylorman wrote:
How about Oz? Injuries and depth will be your ongoing problem. We hear stories here non pro club players are being brought through to fill in sxv positions on a fairly regular basis.

Gotta be a concern given Wales have 2 or 3 now fighting for most positions. But both teams are also on similar paths- probably the 2 most settled sides in World rugby given theyve done their 'new players/ cosch' thing for a good 203 years now.

Aus don't have any clubs though do they? They have the Super XV provinces (are they provincial?) but I think they lack something below preparing them for that level.

I'm not sure if we have as much depth. We have players in 3 or 4 key players in certain positions who if cropped will affect the team. There was no opportunity in the 6 Nations for their replacements. Craig Mitchell and James Hook should have seen some game time in their preferred positions. As for Aus, I'm not sure how their injury list is right now. But I think their player pool is still larger than ours and the ones they bring on through are very good players. O'Connor and Ashley-Cooper are two of my favourite Aussies for the fact that they can slot in anywhere in the backline and still look world class.

Sure they do. Each region has their own club competition, of which the Shute Shield (NSW) and Queensland Premier Rugby are the big dogs and see the most players promoted from their ranks.

They full time or semi-pro? Must have been recently brought back, as last I heard they couldn't fund any club competition. Pretty good idea to play it in each region though instead of the whole country.

Erm .... aren't the ranking rules the same for everyone ?!

Or does England somehow have an unfair advantage. I knew it .... conspiracy !

Morgannwg wrote:They full time or semi-pro? Must have been recently brought back, as last I heard they couldn't fund any club competition. Pretty good idea to play it in each region though instead of the whole country.

Most of those clubs will be semi-pro at best, or amateur. They did try to set up a national club competition below the state teams to mirror NPC and Curry Cup, but ran out of money

If England were to lose all their games coming up in the summer( Snigger, chortle and guffaw) , where could they end up in the rankings? which i know will be more managable for them and their fans, as a lot are suffering from vertigo and nose bleeds now they are up to the dizzying heights of 4th!!

That would be amsuing and have merit as an entertaining WUM Woodstock were it not for the fact that we have previously been higher than forth and therefore couldn't in all honesty call it a dizzying height.

Poor attempt mate, can't give you more than 2/10 for that one, but please feel free to have another go. The stage is yours.

Ozzy3213 wrote:That would be amsuing and have merit as an entertaining WUM Woodstock were it not for the fact that we have previously been higher than forth and therefore couldn't in all honesty call it a dizzying height.

Poor attempt mate, can't give you more than 2/10 for that one, but please feel free to have another go. The stage is yours.

I like your style Ozzie.

But like everything else in england it is ancient history and as meaningless as a map coloured red !

Noticed the headlines on the Rugby Weekly here in NZ, fullpage to Jock and bold words in Bottom right......WALES WIN 6 NATIONS. Oddly enough no materhow bloody hard I tried I could see nothing to the effect of 'england rocket to 4th in IRB rankings' In fact I have looked all over and apart from te IRB website nothing to celebrate englands huge 2012 sucess! Damn those media types aye!! I am sure the SUN will sow a couple of england players on page 3 this morning though

I have visions of you sat in your lounge Woodstock jumping up and down and waving your arms around like that little smiley as you percieve some sort of victory over those horrible English types. It is making I quite a bit to be honest.

It is interesting that you put little store in the world rankings, yet continually post on this thread. Odd.

Congratulations on the 6 Nations win mate, your team is developing nicely, hopefully you'll pick up a win against Australia this summer to continue your development and ensure that you don't start sliding down the rankings that you hate so mcuh.

Not half as much as I at you lot being so chuffed with something so trivial. Let me know when the IRB ranking have kudos and I will be so interested in them. My enjoyment comes from the poor english souls who had to find something to rant about and save red faces.

To be honest I am really happy with the Triple Crown, Championship, Grand Slam and best player in the 6 Nations. If we can do this at 5th why do we need to go higher??

Perhaps we should take the smiley's away from woodstock.

I would be like taking meat off a S African

Woodstock wrote:I would be like taking meat off a S African

no need to take it off a south african, the meat is walking around freely, all you need to do is slaughter the animal yourself.

biltongbek wrote:

Woodstock wrote:I would be like taking meat off a S African

no need to take it off a south african, the meat is walking around freely, all you need to do is slaughter the animal yourself.

Dry it out and HEY PRESTO

biltong

You can actually taste the accent

eirebilly wrote:

biltongbek wrote:

Woodstock wrote:I would be like taking meat off a S African

no need to take it off a south african, the meat is walking around freely, all you need to do is slaughter the animal yourself.

Dry it out and HEY PRESTO

biltong

well you do need to add a little spice.

And salt to dry the meat well

and no fat Billy or its not nice. Got a great butcher who does it extra hot wonderful.

Damn, i am all hungry now and craving a beer

Well you need to be careful with the salt, otherwise it gets to salty, I personally like mine with some chilli flakes and some cuman pepper, the spicier the better.

However Woodstock, if you haven't had a beef chilli stick with a little fat on, you haven't had the best chilli biltong yet, that little piece of fat is extremely tasty and ever so juicy.

Fear not, Woodstock will be back under the rock from whence he came when Wales bomb in the Summer, Autumn and finish 4th in their traditional post GS 6N slot.

Equo - You enjoy that runners up spot - well deserved, no need to be bitter, your lads performed well in a couple of games

Yes a bit of fat is always lovely

I do love the extra salty biltong though

Equo Troiano wrote:Fear not, Woodstock will be back under the rock from whence he came when Wales bomb in the Summer, Autumn and finish 4th in their traditional post GS 6N slot.

Nah dude still be here long after you have gone. Us Welsh have the ability to construct HOUSES with ROOFS and we can WALK. Wikkiforidiots.com will give you a comprehensive guide to using the correct WORDS.

Come on lads, lets not let threads drop to such levels

Dah Billy a good pork boil up with puha and some watercress fried in butter, choice Maori mean Maori feed bro. Chur

eirebilly wrote:Come on lads, lets not let threads drop to such levels

I know he comes along and drops the level so far down the food chain......and things were almost becoming friendly

I once had a Hungi (spelling?) in Rotorua done by some local Maori's. It took a long time to cook but it was delish

Woodstock wrote:Dah Billy a good pork boil up with puha and some watercress fried in butter, choice Maori mean Maori feed bro. Chur

Sounds almost like pork crackling, love it, but not very healthy at all.

Woodstock wrote:

eirebilly wrote:Come on lads, lets not let threads drop to such levels

I know he comes along and drops the level so far down the food chain......and things were almost becoming friendly

Yeah, so let us focus on that then.

HANGI....hole in the ground, rocks and some good old Maori flair and a magical meal. There is a guy in Waitangi does them often and sells them out of his take away van primo but I wonder why I cannot get into my Welsh shirts and this damnd stone is too bloody small to get under grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

we had a junior team that is coached by an academy. Ian Mcdonald legendary flanker of the Lions and Louis Koen not so legendary from the Stormers take these boys to NZ at the end of the academy and they showed how a traditional Maori meal is cooked in a hole in the ground, I can't remember what they called it, but it was lamb and vegetables etc.

The boys loved it, they said it reminded them of Potjiekos (pot food) here in SA.

O, Hangi, just saw that.

biltongbek wrote:we had a junior team that is coached by an academy. Ian Mcdonald legendary flanker of the Lions and Louis Koen not so legendary from the Stormers take these boys to NZ at the end of the academy and they showed how a traditional Maori meal is cooked in a hole in the ground, I can't remember what they called it, but it was lamb and vegetables etc.

The boys loved it, they said it reminded them of Potjiekos (pot food) here in SA.

That's hangi all right

Great kai.






(kai is Maori for food)

Woodstock wrote:HANGI....hole in the ground, rocks and some good old Maori flair and a magical meal. There is a guy in Waitangi does them often and sells them out of his take away van primo but I wonder why I cannot get into my Welsh shirts and this damnd stone is too bloody small to get under grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

Thats the one

I loved the meat, it was delish. It was such a shame that Rotorua was not the most attractive smelling place

.......and a puku is what you get after eating to much hangi and Lion Red hahahaha

Never get your Hangi mistaken with your hongi that could end up in a fight hahaha

Rotorua or Rotovegas as it is better known here is a niceplace, I enjoy a vist and will be there next week oddly enough. 2 great Irish pubs there with draught Murphys and Caffreys in one and Guinnuss in the other. Then down to Taupo and Wellington for the Welsh pubs, ahhh the joy of being on holiday for 3 weeks.

The locals all called it Rottonrua when i was there

It was an attractive place, just smelled a bit

Well when you build a town on top of a volcano you put up with the smell!!! I am there for the weekend and then I am gone hahaha anyway you cannot smell it in the pub.

The smell did grow on you after a while though

Cracking locals as well, if not a little excessive in their alcohol consumption... I fitted in well

Woodstock wrote: 2 great Irish pubs there with draught Murphys and Caffreys in one and Guinnuss in the other.

Youll probably get a great pint of bitter there at the moment