Gatland gets Lions job

by maestegmafia Sun 25 Mar 2012, 3:33 am

First topic message reminder :

It is understood that Gatland, who has guided Wales to the Six Nations Grand Slam this season, has been offered the job following an interview for the position in London on Wednesday.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/international/britishandirishlionsrugby/9165345/Wales-coach-Warren-Gatland-offered-Lions-job-for-2013.html

by maestegmafia Mon 26 Mar 2012, 10:08 am

BigTrevsbigmac wrote:
maestegmafia wrote:
biltongbek wrote:
BigTrevsbigmac wrote:
I understand your point but Gatts had barely 3 months from taking over Wales to the start of the 6Ns & very little time with his squad of players so one can fairly assume he had little influence other than motivational to mould a team to his liking.
He would have had time to change things around thereafter & as I said previously it went very flat for Wales during this period.

Bigmac, that is often all that is required. When you look at the Springboks of 1995. Kitch Christie had 3 months with the players when he started coaching them for the world cup. Francois Pienaar said last year he believes a three month period is all that is required for a coach to prepare a team for a tournament. I think it helps to focus the squad and short term goals are often much easier to focus on that longterm sustainability.

Big Trev if you can make that assumption you can see why I think that Lancaster had little to do with England coming second in this years six nations.

Gatland in 08 changed the Welsh defence, and encouraged a more conservative game plan. Pretty much what Andy Farrell just did for England. The difference was Wales still manufactured and scored plenty of tries.

Was it Gatland or Edwards though?

It still doesn't explain what happened thereafter when he had more time with the squad & the subsequent & continued downturn. So much so there were murmurings about the direction of the national team culminating in a try drought in the 2011 6 nations.

This continued until a key set of young players happened to come through at the same time last year.

Lots of injuries were the main issue.

Can't blame that on a coach. Strengthened up our squad massively by capping the back up players. Now we are in good stead for the future.

Anyhow you are diverging the thread away from its theme.

I take it you don't rate Gatland as you are trying to find a number of reasons that might show him to be a poor coach?

by RubyGuby Mon 26 Mar 2012, 10:18 am

eirebilly wrote:So who will oversee the 6N for Wales if Gatland doesnt?

There are a few messages on my phone this weekend that I haven't checked yet Whistle

Get back to you later thumbsup

by **Biltong** Mon 26 Mar 2012, 10:25 am

RubyGuby wrote:
eirebilly wrote:So who will oversee the 6N for Wales if Gatland doesnt?

There are a few messages on my phone this weekend that I haven't checked yet Get back to you later

by munkian Mon 26 Mar 2012, 11:47 am

RubyGuby wrote:
eirebilly wrote:So who will oversee the 6N for Wales if Gatland doesnt?

There are a few messages on my phone this weekend that I haven't checked yet Get back to you later

Could be for the England job...

by RubyGuby Mon 26 Mar 2012, 11:55 am

So what you saying, I'm not in contention for the Lions Whistle

I'm gonna check the messages, one's from Cardiff and one from London so you never know - Give me a few minutes thumbsup

by Rava Mon 26 Mar 2012, 11:56 am

I think Gatland should stick with Wales. The job of Lions coach should go to Eddie O'Sullivan. He's looking for work at the minute Run

by Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler Mon 26 Mar 2012, 12:18 pm

BigTrevsbigmac wrote:

Was it Gatland or Edwards though?

.

Does it matter? Hell have Edwards on his staff anyway so long as the Irish dont have a problem with him.

The only thing that couldve stood between Gatland and the Lions job was his availability. They had talked about wanting someone fulltime in the role for a year, we'll have atpo wait and see what the deal with Gatland is and how that will affect Wales.

by Comfort Mon 26 Mar 2012, 1:07 pm

As a welsh fan, im pretty bitter and disappointed Gatlandsbeen offered the role to be honest.

by Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler Mon 26 Mar 2012, 1:17 pm

Comfort wrote:As a welsh fan, im pretty bitter

You and the rest of them

by maestegmafia Mon 26 Mar 2012, 1:22 pm

Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:
Comfort wrote:As a welsh fan, im pretty bitter

You and the rest of them

That's not true at all.

Some are not happy others welcome it as it has benefits:

1. Gatland and Edwards improve their experience

2. Howley and McBride, the likely coaches to assume leading Wales to hopefully a second consecutive GS in 2013 will gain huge amounts of experience at the helm.

In my and many other opinion it is very good for welsh rugby.

by **Biltong** Mon 26 Mar 2012, 1:25 pm

I am also bitter about it, they could have given me the job. Rolling Eyes

by Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler Mon 26 Mar 2012, 1:27 pm

maestegmafia wrote:
Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:
Comfort wrote:As a welsh fan, im pretty bitter

You and the rest of them
That's not true at all.

Some are not happy others welcome it as it has benefits:

1. Gatland and Edwards improve their experience

2. Howley and McBride, the likely coaches to assume leading Wales to hopefully a second consecutive GS in 2013 will gain huge amounts of experience at the helm.

In my and many other opinion it is very good for welsh rugby.

I meant it in a general sense Maest.

If he hadnt got the job I think there would be a lot more negative comments and slating of whoever did get the post.

Lets wait and see what the balance is between his commitments to the Lions and Wales are beofre worrying too much about the damage to either job being done to its fullest potential, but I suspect one will suffer.

by Comfort Mon 26 Mar 2012, 1:29 pm

Pete, you are right, there would have been moaning and complaints either way, and it makes sense to wait for the details and Gat's commitments to be released before making our minds up.

But in the meantime.....

bah

by thebluesmancometh Mon 26 Mar 2012, 1:33 pm

Peter

Of course there would be questioning anyone else in the job, who is worthy? Robinson, Deccie or Lancaster. After this tourny it was only ever going to one man, infact I think his name was on the job before the world cup.

by funnyExiledScot Mon 26 Mar 2012, 1:34 pm

Gatland is the right choice. There isn't really a sensible alternative. He knows the players, coaches what will surely be the backbone of the squad, is successful (and has been in several posts during his career) and has experience with the Lions previously.

No brainer.

by funnyExiledScot Mon 26 Mar 2012, 1:36 pm

thebluesmancometh wrote:Peter

Of course there would be questioning anyone else in the job, who is worthy? Robinson, Deccie or Lancaster. After this tourny it was only ever going to one man, infact I think his name was on the job before the world cup.

Actually, now you mention it, Robinson would be a superb appointment. He should be appointed immediately and taken away from Scottish rugby. He should have the whole year off prior, and in fact I'd give him a year or two off afterwards, just to recover.

You know it makes sense. He's coached a World Cup winning side you know. He's a winner. He always wins things and installs a winning mentality. Winner.

by propdavid_london Mon 26 Mar 2012, 2:37 pm

So, what are the chances that the Lions squad will be exposed to a rigorous training regimen and a little trip to Poland.

by Sin é Mon 26 Mar 2012, 2:44 pm

propdavid_london wrote:So, what are the chances that the Lions squad will be exposed to a rigorous training regimen and a little trip to Poland.

Highly unlikely. They will all be knackered after a tough season, especially the teams that make the knockouts of the various tournaments.

by Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler Mon 26 Mar 2012, 2:48 pm

Sin é wrote:
propdavid_london wrote:So, what are the chances that the Lions squad will be exposed to a rigorous training regimen and a little trip to Poland.

Highly unlikely. They will all be knackered after a tough season, especially the teams that make the knockouts of the various tournaments.

Well since the Lions will mostly be Welsh players the club tournament knockouts wont be an issue.

Gatland took his chaps off there pre 6 nations when they hadnt had a proper break for 18 months.

by Sin é Mon 26 Mar 2012, 2:50 pm

funnyExiledScot wrote:Gatland is the right choice. There isn't really a sensible alternative. He knows the players, coaches what will surely be the backbone of the squad, is successful (and has been in several posts during his career) and has experience with the Lions previously.

No brainer.

He is a big mouth though and is always putting his foot in it. Hate the way he carries on about refs. I wonder has he apologised to Alain Rolland yet? (said he would if he got the warburton decision correctly).

He also has a grudge against the Irish and he is a bitter, bitter man. Hopefully that means there will be few Irish players on it (though if BOD wants to go, I hope he makes it).

by Sin é Mon 26 Mar 2012, 2:54 pm

Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:
Sin é wrote:
propdavid_london wrote:So, what are the chances that the Lions squad will be exposed to a rigorous training regimen and a little trip to Poland.

Highly unlikely. They will all be knackered after a tough season, especially the teams that make the knockouts of the various tournaments.

Well since the Lions will mostly be Welsh players the club tournament knockouts wont be an issue.

Gatland took his chaps off there pre 6 nations when they hadnt had a proper break for 18 months.

the welsh players were very unfit though. A former Irish fitness coach who went to the Ospreys said about 2 years ago that the Welsh players were at about 80% the fitness levels of the Irish players.

It should also be said that the Irish team under Eddie O'Sullivan used to go to Spala every year (2003-2007) until the players turned completely against it. Munster sent their academy there a couple of years ago and they haven't been back since! Very Happy

Chances are the welsh players will eventually revolt.

by pontylad Mon 26 Mar 2012, 2:55 pm

Gatland -yes from the Lions point of view he is the right man.

The Lions -yes I love them .It's great to make all the other nations wear red-shirts and cheer the same team for once .

From a Welsh point of view the official line is that it develops Gatland further and Rob Howley and the others left in charge of Wales also gain valuable experience .

Graham Henry lost the trust of some of the Welsh players when he did it of course so there is the potential for a banana skin . Marginally for Wales sake I would perhaps prefer the coach to concentrate on one job and that's getting us ready for the next World cup , however I can't see how Gatland could be held back from it though so I accept the decision.

by munkian Mon 26 Mar 2012, 2:57 pm

Sin é wrote:
funnyExiledScot wrote:Gatland is the right choice. There isn't really a sensible alternative. He knows the players, coaches what will surely be the backbone of the squad, is successful (and has been in several posts during his career) and has experience with the Lions previously.

No brainer.

He is a big mouth though and is always putting his foot in it. Hate the way he carries on about refs. I wonder has he apologised to Alain Rolland yet? (said he would if he got the warburton decision correctly).

He also has a grudge against the Irish and he is a bitter, bitter man. Hopefully that means there will be few Irish players on it (though if BOD wants to go, I hope he makes it).

Mr Pot, meet Mr Kettle Shocked

by Sin é Mon 26 Mar 2012, 3:07 pm

munkian wrote:
Sin é wrote:
funnyExiledScot wrote:Gatland is the right choice. There isn't really a sensible alternative. He knows the players, coaches what will surely be the backbone of the squad, is successful (and has been in several posts during his career) and has experience with the Lions previously.

No brainer.

He is a big mouth though and is always putting his foot in it. Hate the way he carries on about refs. I wonder has he apologised to Alain Rolland yet? (said he would if he got the warburton decision correctly).

He also has a grudge against the Irish and he is a bitter, bitter man. Hopefully that means there will be few Irish players on it (though if BOD wants to go, I hope he makes it).

Mr Pot, meet Mr Kettle

If I was the Wales coach (who had not had his contract renewed by Ireland), I hope that I'd be able to keep my mouth shut about it in public and not try and stir up trouble for my players (i.e., his statement that the Welsh players hated the Irish players).

by munkian Mon 26 Mar 2012, 3:21 pm

He didn't say that exactly and it was ages ago. We've beaten you 3 times on the bounce since then anyway, move on sweetie kiss

by Sin é Mon 26 Mar 2012, 3:39 pm

munkian wrote:He didn't say that exactly and it was ages ago. We've beaten you 3 times on the bounce since then anyway, move on sweetie

Yep, with dodgy ref calls.

And the "move on sweetie" remark could could be made to Wales fans with regard to Rolland's call for the red card at the world cup. He is still an elite ref. Rolling Eyes

by RubyGuby Mon 26 Mar 2012, 3:49 pm

We'll always keep a welcome in the hillsides for Mr Rollaind the elite ref Hug

by Sin é Mon 26 Mar 2012, 3:52 pm

RubyGuby wrote:We'll always keep a welcome in the hillsides for Mr Rollaind the elite ref

Isn't South Wales the 'valleys' Wink

Not much rugby up in North Wales.

by RubyGuby Mon 26 Mar 2012, 3:57 pm

What's that got to do with anything? - We also have an affectionate welsh name for him in the hillsides thumbsup

by munkian Mon 26 Mar 2012, 4:00 pm

Sin is still hurting about Shane retiring. He hoped to see him score the winning try against Leinster on Friday but it wasn't to be Hug

by RubyGuby Mon 26 Mar 2012, 4:02 pm

Shane who?

by munkian Mon 26 Mar 2012, 4:03 pm

RubyGuby wrote:Shane who?

by Sin é Mon 26 Mar 2012, 4:17 pm

munkian wrote:Sin is still hurting about Shane retiring. He hoped to see him score the winning try against Leinster on Friday but it wasn't to be

Eh, I wanted Leinster to win thumbsup

by HERSH Mon 26 Mar 2012, 4:26 pm

Let’s hope the British & Irish Lions don't play negative rugby like Wales. Whistle

by RubyGuby Mon 26 Mar 2012, 4:36 pm

Come on Hersh - what do 2 -ves make ?? thumbsup

by Knowsit17 Mon 26 Mar 2012, 4:42 pm

More importantly let's hope they play winning rugby like Wales Cool

by RubyGuby Mon 26 Mar 2012, 4:44 pm

I dont think Rollaind is reffing any of the Lions games so we'll be fine thumbsup

by thebluesmancometh Mon 26 Mar 2012, 4:45 pm

If negative rugby is winning rugby... I know what your secretly hoping for HERSH!!!

by Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler Mon 26 Mar 2012, 5:17 pm

Knowsit17 wrote:More importantly let's hope they play winning rugby like Wales

Theyve lost a higher percentage of their games since Gatlands been in charge than England or Ireland have

Just saying like....

by gelodge Mon 26 Mar 2012, 5:43 pm

“I remember at Wasps we would have some early morning one-on-one power endurance sessions in the forwards,” he said.

“We would be split into mini groups and pitted against each other over eight sets of eight exercises in the gym and then straight away afterwards five sets of five exercises outside, like wrestling, shuttles, tyre flips etc.

“I would often be paired against the King of Wasps Lawrence Dallaglio.

“Gats would, without fail, have a word in Lawrence’s ear and say I had been trash-talking him and that I thought I was better.

“Unbeknown to Lawrence, he would then come up to me and say, ‘Lol, has been saying you’re too young, weak and that you aren’t tough enough.’

“The end result is two players go all out against each other, trade a few blows no doubt, but ultimately push one another to their max.

“I am sure in the hard trips to Poland with Wales, Warren would be loving creating that competitive edge, and when players smash each other in training, especially young against old, he would actively talk the young guys up."

I hope that isn't a tactic he will use with the Lions. Yes you need good competition and players driving each other on, but although it might work in a club or country environment, I don't think those sort of divisive tactics would be good for a squad that is only together for a short period and needs its different camps fused together very quickly.

by HERSH Mon 26 Mar 2012, 8:16 pm

After last seasons 4th place effort in the 6 nations I seem to remember people wanting Gatland & Edwards heads! Headscratch

Just goes to show what can happen if people are given a little bit more time, or maybe they fluked another GS Whistle

I'm so confused must be the heat.

by Smirnoffpriest Mon 26 Mar 2012, 8:43 pm

Maybe Johnson could have the GS this season if given time... Whistle

by offload Mon 26 Mar 2012, 8:51 pm

HERSH wrote:After last seasons 4th place effort in the 6 nations I seem to remember people wanting Gatland & Edwards heads!

Just goes to show what can happen if people are given a little bit more time, or maybe they fluked another GS I'm so confused must be the heat.

No offense intended, but I think your posting record suggests you are equally confused when it's cold too. Wink

by majesticimperialman Mon 26 Mar 2012, 9:05 pm

With Gatland getting the Lions job, just how will it affect, the Lions, and Wales in general.

With Gatland being incharge surely he will want the best Welsh player/s to play for the lions!!

So how many of the Welsh squad right now will be left for the Wales 6ns squad?

Surley Gatland will want the best player/s from all nations not just Wales, but the other nations will atleast have their ( head coaches ) still in charge of their countrys team.

It will be intersting to see how 2013 6ns will play out for Wales, more than any other team.

by maestegmafia Mon 26 Mar 2012, 9:19 pm

majesticimperialman wrote:With Gatland getting the Lions job, just how will it affect, the Lions, and Wales in general.

With Gatland being incharge surely he will want the best Welsh player/s to play for the lions!!

So how many of the Welsh squad right now will be left for the Wales 6ns squad?

Surley Gatland will want the best player/s from all nations not just Wales, but the other nations will atleast have their ( head coaches ) still in charge of their countrys team.

It will be intersting to see how 2013 6ns will play out for Wales, more than any other team.

Can you explain this again, it makes little sense?

by munkian Mon 26 Mar 2012, 9:22 pm

offload wrote:
HERSH wrote:After last seasons 4th place effort in the 6 nations I seem to remember people wanting Gatland & Edwards heads!

Just goes to show what can happen if people are given a little bit more time, or maybe they fluked another GS I'm so confused must be the heat.

No offense intended, but I think your posting record suggests you are equally confused when it's cold too.

by maestegmafia Mon 26 Mar 2012, 9:27 pm

munkian wrote:
offload wrote:
HERSH wrote:After last seasons 4th place effort in the 6 nations I seem to remember people wanting Gatland & Edwards heads!

Just goes to show what can happen if people are given a little bit more time, or maybe they fluked another GS I'm so confused must be the heat.

No offense intended, but I think your posting record suggests you are equally confused when it's cold too.

There is always one line with HERSH, England good, Wales Bad...!

by majesticimperialman Mon 26 Mar 2012, 10:10 pm

maestegmafia wrote:
majesticimperialman wrote:With Gatland getting the Lions job, just how will it affect, the Lions, and Wales in general.

With Gatland being incharge surely he will want the best Welsh player/s to play for the lions!!

So how many of the Welsh squad right now will be left for the Wales 6ns squad?

Surley Gatland will want the best player/s from all nations not just Wales, but the other nations will atleast have their ( head coaches ) still in charge of their countrys team.

It will be intersting to see how 2013 6ns will play out for Wales, more than any other team.

Can you explain this again, it makes little sense?

Let me try and explain. Gatland has taken charge of the Lions for next year right.?

So will he be getting the Lions team together before the 6ns, or after. If it is (BEFORE) the 6ns they surely he (GATLAND) WILL WANT TO TAKE WITH HIM, on the Lions tour the BEST players that Wales have, WHICH HAS SOME ONE POINTED OUT THE OTHER DAY IS THE SAME TEAM THAT WON THE GRAND SLAM.

So what effect will that have the Welsh team FOR THE 6ns?.

Is that better for you maes? thumbsup

by Sin é Mon 26 Mar 2012, 10:16 pm

majesticimperialman wrote:
maestegmafia wrote:
majesticimperialman wrote:With Gatland getting the Lions job, just how will it affect, the Lions, and Wales in general.

With Gatland being incharge surely he will want the best Welsh player/s to play for the lions!!

So how many of the Welsh squad right now will be left for the Wales 6ns squad?

Surley Gatland will want the best player/s from all nations not just Wales, but the other nations will atleast have their ( head coaches ) still in charge of their countrys team.

It will be intersting to see how 2013 6ns will play out for Wales, more than any other team.

Can you explain this again, it makes little sense?

Let me try and explain. Gatland has taken charge of the Lions for next year right.?

So will he be getting the Lions team together before the 6ns, or after. If it is (BEFORE) the 6ns they surely he (GATLAND) WILL WANT TO TAKE WITH HIM, on the Lions tour the BEST players that Wales have, WHICH HAS SOME ONE POINTED OUT THE OTHER DAY IS THE SAME TEAM THAT WON THE GRAND SLAM.

So what effect will that have the Welsh team FOR THE 6ns?.

Is that better for you maes?

The squad was picked after the 6Ns last time. Wales will need to win the Slam again without Gatland to make the tour Smile

or that is what Gatland should be saying to them. This time 4 years ago, Ryan Jones was touted as being the Lions Captain, he wouldn't have made the Lions except for injury (and he turned up injured)1

by SecretFly Mon 26 Mar 2012, 10:17 pm

majesticimperialman wrote:but the other nations will at least have their ( head coaches ) still in charge of their countrys team.

You make that sound so positive, majestic. From where I'm sitting (in Ireland) it's almost depressing Wink

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