Clev

First topic message reminder :

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/boxing/17448826

This is an absolute joke, world champion my arse.

Watch it ghosty you will be accused of some horrible things by criticising Cleverly. We are trolls apparently

Another awful display from warren, WBO and Nathan. He's a smart fighter, should be telling warren what he really wants. Nathan struggled with bellew so has no right to mouth off about the top guys like Hopkins.

Fact of the matter is that if he fought the mandatory now, instead of fighting this bum, he would get credit. If he's going to be protected, at least make it so that he is gradually stepping up. He should be building up a strong CV as he is t a huge draw so the like of Hopkins etc won't want to fight him if there are bigger purses elsewhere

For once I do disagree with Oxy but each to their own, we should be able to criticise a supposed world champion for clearly avoiding a decent mandatory challenger while fighting someone i've never heard of. At least with Calzaghe I knew who Eubank, Gimenez and Reid were.

Maybe Warren and Cleverly are actually genuises, and by opting to fight opposition of such a poor standard they are creating such an outrage that Cleverly is actually getting far more publicity than he would if he fought top names.........

He certinly seems to getting a huge amount of attention for a mediocre champion that fights nobodies in any event.

manos de piedra wrote:Maybe Warren and Cleverly are actually genuises, and by opting to fight opposition of such a poor standard they are creating such an outrage that Cleverly is actually getting far more publicity than he would if he fought top names.........

He certinly seems to getting a huge amount of attention for a mediocre champion that fights nobodies in any event.

That's an awful way of going about it. Yes he is getting publicity, but only here in England and Wales. He is a nobody in the states and they rate him as the most protected champion in the sport tofu and it's hard to argue against, maybe pirog.

He's getting publicity but at the end of the day no-one will watch his fights even moreso when he's hid away on boxnation

Pirog at least has some undeniable class though, not really protected but like most europeans has major management issues.

WHU_Champo_League_in_7Yrs wrote:

manos de piedra wrote:Maybe Warren and Cleverly are actually genuises, and by opting to fight opposition of such a poor standard they are creating such an outrage that Cleverly is actually getting far more publicity than he would if he fought top names.........

He certinly seems to getting a huge amount of attention for a mediocre champion that fights nobodies in any event.

That's an awful way of going about it. Yes he is getting publicity, but only here in England and Wales. He is a nobody in the states and they rate him as the most protected champion in the sport tofu and it's hard to argue against, maybe pirog.

He's getting publicity but at the end of the day no-one will watch his fights even moreso when he's hid away on boxnation

Well my comment was partially tongue in cheek.

But there does seem to be a few people that are taking Cleverlys actions almost personally. I just find it strange that any mention of him now is sufficient to bring hell, fire and brimstone given hes basically just an alphabet champ and not all that good. Nothing we havent seen before.

I think its mildly ironic that hes getting much more attention for fighting tomoto cans than he would for fighting solid opposition.

Got to say I am with Manos on this one, he is a paper champion fighting mediocre opposition, the sport is awash with them, hell even someone like me with my limited knowledge of the modern game can come up with the names of Povetkin and Chavez who do similar and I know jack about the modern game so suspect there are countless more.

Whilst I am in no means defending his actions he is a product of the system not the cause of it, if we did not have multiple governing bodies and belts a situation such as this that unambitious fighters and unscrupulous promoters could exploit would not exist. Got to say I find the response to his action a little out of proportion on here. If I did not know better I would suspect some peoples motivation was more to wind up certain other members rather than any indignation over what is a fairly widespread phenomena in the sport, but I am far too nice a guy to make such a suggestion.

My view of Clev is the same as it is with all such paper champions, I don't have to watch him or support him and for as long as he is on this path I shall do neither, however feel free to wake me up should he actually fight someone.

Dear lord, I'm going off Cleverly faster than I've ever gone off any fighter I ever at any time supported. The way these jokers have no ambition and bow to any quick cash scheme of their modern day Warren-esque promoters is genuinely making me a bit sick by now. I suppose this confirms once and for all where the WBO stands

Alright, trip to the Albert Hall coming up. Anyone care to lend their voice to the torrents of "ducker, ducker, ducker" that'll be a'flowing that evening? We said we'd do it to Chavez, well here's someone fighting cans about a quarter as dangerous as the Chavez fodder!

Let me be clear - by all means, express disapproval with Cleverly's actions and career as champion. Personally, I reckon that his opposition hasn't been at European championship level since the title. I would like him to step up and fight someone from whom he might learn something - even if he had to take a loss.

To be the worst champion fighting the worst opposition in a talent poor division like LHW is quite an achievment.

If we could all express our opinions without deliberately baiting one particular member of the board, I would be much happier. And if you want to complain - there's the pm button or the report button - as opposed to whining on the thread.

How do we do that tho Oxy when any negative sentiment towards a Welsh boxer (fair and reasonable or otherwise) and Steffan comes on and goes mental??

It was all harmless fun earlier until Stef came on and stirred it all up, that's when it all went wrong. If ignorant nationalists want to defend the indefensible nothings ever going to open to debate on here.

There is a case for cutting him out of the discussion if you think he's being unreasonable. He's part of the discussion because you're making him so by responding to his posts, say every poster participating in the debate knew better than to respond to his nationalism (unlikely as that sounds) then he's doing nought other than puffing away to himself.

Knowsit17 wrote:he's doing nought other than puffing away to himself.

No thatl be later when I log on to my favourite fetish website...

So uhh this guy is meant to prepare him for Hopkins, hahaha. Not that I would pick him to beat Hopkins anyway, but it will be several huge steps up in class from the opposition he has been facing.

Fight someone decent!

I was a huge Cleverly fan, but as I stated before even though I'm welsh Froch is my favourite UK fighter and now you know why!

alma wrote:To be fair I think even steffan is losing patience

The way Clev is going I have to admit I am. But as Rowley and others have said he is not the only paper champion doing this yet for some reason on here he is being blamed for everything from the price of UK diesel to the trouble in Syria. Discussing his current lack of appetite for the big names is fine but its just seems to be thread after thread after thread of hate everyone of them going in the same direction. Its the usual ring leaders

There are other boxing forums where you can brag about getting blocked on Twitter and hate away to your hearts content. We all knew a few weeks back when Royal Albert Hall was announced that Clevs opponent was never gonna be that good. Do we really need all these threads to tell us this? If certain members find him 'a joke' then fine but please dont troll the forum with it everyday. Im not sure Clev will be around after his next fight though. I got this vision of Reborn in a RAH box with a picture of Clev and a sniper rifle next to him. Worrying indeed...

Steffan wrote:

alma wrote:To be fair I think even steffan is losing patience

The way Clev is going I have to admit I am. But as Rowley and others have said he is not the only paper champion doing this yet for some reason on here he is being blamed for everything from the price of UK diesel to the trouble in Syria. Discussing his current lack of appetite for the big names is fine but its just seems to be thread after thread after thread of hate everyone of them going in the same direction. Its the usual ring leaders

There are other boxing forums where you can brag about getting blocked on Twitter and hate away to your hearts content. We all knew a few weeks back when Royal Albert Hall was announced that Clevs opponent was never gonna be that good. Do we really need all these threads to tell us this? If certain members find him 'a joke' then fine but please dont troll the forum with it everyday. Im not sure Clev will be around after his next fight though. I got this vision of Reborn in a RAH box with a picture of Clev and a sniper rifle next to him. Worrying indeed...

Mate give over, people aren't that bad, your blowing there comments way out of proportion. he is being criticised and rightfully so. We have not said he's individually killing boxing, or anything like it, but the fact that he's a world champion but fights people no-one knows is a crying shame and champions like him are damaging the sport.

Pirog got ripped to shreds last week in a thread and no-one defended him. Povetkin too had been bashed by people on this forum and others. The reason they don't get as muc abuse is that we don't really care about them as there not British. He is supposed to be representing us on the world stage and he's a laughing stock atm, either by his own fault or more likely warrens.

Canelo (and khan) were torn to shreds over true Mosley fight and he's 21 with a growing CV yet still gets bashed, and however bad Mosley is, he at least lost to 2 of the best

Brook is the subject of abuse because of matchmaking, but N'Dou hatton etc aren't much worse than Murat and bellew and are a lot better than this guy and karpency. He isn't even world champion.

Imperial Ghosty wrote:For once I do disagree with Oxy but each to their own, we should be able to criticise a supposed world champion for clearly avoiding a decent mandatory challenger while fighting someone i've never heard of. At least with Calzaghe I knew who Eubank, Gimenez and Reid were.

I've been trying to explain that to the anti anti Calzaghe types like Manos. Calzaghe's record is not surperb on quality but Cleverly and the Germans are scraping a seemingly bottomless barrel when it comes to the awfulness of their title fights. I won't support Cleverly any more after this. The reason he's pulled out of the Sukhotsky defence is because he thinks he'll lose. Not a world champion as far as I'm concerned.

Super D Boon wrote:

Imperial Ghosty wrote:For once I do disagree with Oxy but each to their own, we should be able to criticise a supposed world champion for clearly avoiding a decent mandatory challenger while fighting someone i've never heard of. At least with Calzaghe I knew who Eubank, Gimenez and Reid were.

I've been trying to explain that to the anti anti Calzaghe types like Manos. Calzaghe's record is not surperb on quality but Cleverly and the Germans are scraping a seemingly bottomless barrel when it comes to the awfulness of their title fights. I won't support Cleverly any more after this. The reason he's pulled out of the Sukhotsky defence is because he thinks he'll lose. Not a world champion as far as I'm concerned.

Not convinced Manos is "anti Calzaghe" - although he's hardly his biggest fan either - but he seems pretty realistic tbh.

Anyway - I can't believe that he's genuinely concerned about Sukhotsky. Alright - I confess - other than the relatively weak excuse about the money he can offer Krasniqi rather than Sukhotsky - I can't come up with a reason not to fight the mandatory. However - Sukhotsky really isn't that good. If you're going to mention the names Cloud, Dawson, Hopkins - you have to be beating Sukhotsky without a second thought.

I'm not here to troll Steffan, I'm not here to troll anyone, my hashtags were to show what i was writing on Twitter to get a response. Apologies if there was any offence taken.

To look on Clev as anything but a bit of a joke is somewhat naive though. I'm not saying he's the only person who does this, Chavez is guilty of it of course, but I only have to read stories about him here, not all over Sky Sports, BBC news, in the paper etc. its like I'm being forced to see it and that they're trying their hardest to manipulate me and it annoys me. I know Sukhotsky is the mandatory, and I also know the WBO demanded they fight within 120 days. That was the condition under which they allowed Cleverly to fight Karpency. Now all of a sudden he's allowed to fight who he wants because Frank went and argued with the WBO?

Its a bit of a joke. I use that term because it makes me laugh.

Agreed. Apologies if I misread your motivations Jabmachine.

The failure to fight Sukhotsky is really, really strange. Just a couple of fights ago, Clev was preparing to take on Braehmer - in a fight that he was expected to win.

Just a couple of years ago - Braehmer fought Sukhotsky in an entertaining affair - to summarise - Braehmer outboxed Sukhotsky for 9 rounds, Sukhotsky caught Braehmer and had him out on his feet in the 10th - fight was very nearly stopped - before the 2 men traded punches down the stretch.

Comfortable (excluding that painful 10th round) points win for Braehmer.

What is there in Sukhotsky for Clev to worry about? If he was ready to fight Braehmer - why not fight one of his victims? Sukhotsky isn't the greatest boxer in the world - he has a lot of heart and can punch a bit - although he mostly looks like he's throwing arm punches. So why the hell not face the mandatory?

Neither man is going to be "legacy building" - and Krasniqi is significantly worse.

The only reason I can think of is that Krasniqi is cheaper - but come on - at Cleverly's stage of his career he really shouldn't be thinking of saving the pennies like this. Beat Krasniqi, persuade a decent American to fight him, preferably in a no-risk-high-reward scenario and gain a name - that commands both respect AND might earn you some cash in the future.

Any theories - let me know.

As I said, I really can't see what Sukhotsky offers that would have Cleverly "running" - but am happy to be proven wrong.

Ox

I think you are wrong on both counts. Fristly I don't think Manos is realistic as Calzaghe's first four opponents at world title fights include Reid and Eubank, so far Cleverly hasn't beaten a single recognisable name at world title level and it's high time he did so he can at least be justifiably tagged as a world champion in this day and age where belts are growing ever more meaningless.

Secondly, Sukhotsky is a genuine threat. The way he had Brahmer going suggests he has very real power given that Brahmer I think has no issue with his whiskers. Also Sukotsky destroyed Mohammedi who Cleverly really struggled with.

Am not saying Sukhotsky is some world beater but it's the kind of fight Cleverly would do well in winning as Cleverly so far has not beaten a mandatory or a recognisable name. At least beating Sukotsky he can claim to beating his mandatory and be seen as legitimate champion doing what champions do - beating mandatories for example.

oxring wrote:

What is there in Sukhotsky for Clev to worry about?

Perhaps the fact he took out Mohammedi out in just two rounds? The same Mohammdi who gave Clev all kinds of problems.
Or perhaps its the fact that he's actually a pretty solid and seasoned fighter who actually would have a decent chance of beating Clev and taking his title (unlike Krasniqi)?

I think its a bit of both.

You're right in saying that Sukhotsky is not all that great. However, you wouldnt need a great fighter to beat someone as average as Clev.

Woah there D - Sukhotsky is a genuine "great"? What have you been smoking hombre?

Sure - Clev struggled with Mohammedi. Calzaghe struggled with Reid - who Lacy took out in one of the most one sided world title fights involving a Brit we've seen. If Clev doesn't want Sukhotsky because of the Mohammedi head2heads - he has no future at this level - arguably in the sport. You have to have belief as a boxer to be a champion - and that isn't good enough.

If Cleverly turned up at his best - I genuinely believe he'd beat Sukhotsky. I'd also really like to know the result - because if he can't beat Sukhotsky he really doesn't have a future at world level.

Have to say - Eubank was for the belt - he beat him soundly - So warren thought- ok, hes got a bit about him. Put him in with reid and though Flip no, ive dodged a bullet (thats what you think!). Except for clev its, he owned murat and struggled against bellew. Now hes not even being matched against people he really should beat anyway.

I'm a bit of a Calzaghe fan - his fights aren't without critique, as we compare him to other greats - however comparisons between him and Cleverly aren't really fair as Calzaghe was 5x the boxer Cleverly has shown so far at the same stage. of their careers.

I can only guess that Sukhotsky is a very real threat to Warren losing his only current champion. He blasted out Mohammedi and he did make Brahmer have issues towards the end of their fight as you correctly say. I thinK Warren had accepted Karpency was going to be easy, and because it wasn't he's looking at Cleverly and seeing a need to protect him more now than ever because he honestly can't put him in with the #1 Contender and expect a victory - Nathan has done himself no favours by seemingly hitting a ceiling in terms of performance. Thats why Warren has done what he has, because he has little faith in his champion and wants to keep him for as long as possible.

He'll allow Clev to keep spouting about Bhop and Cloud etc because it puts his name in there with other champions, generating interest in his fights, there will be the day when he can't duck and dive any more, he'll have to step up, and when he does its likely he'll fall. Yet he'll have a career high payday and Franks bank balance will get slightly bigger. If he does pull out the performance of a lifetime, he' s a proper champion, he's beaten a proper champion and the money will keep rolling in.

Its win/win for Warren and Cleverly so its astute, but its cheating the fans in such a big way its irritating because we are in essence being manipulated into believing Cleverly is something he's not and hasn't proven by any measure. He may not have asked for the title, but he certainly hasn't shown that he deserves it.

ShahenshahG wrote:Have to say - Eubank was for the belt - he beat him soundly - So warren thought- ok, hes got a bit about him. Put him in with reid and though Flip no, ive dodged a bullet (thats what you think!). Except for clev its, he owned murat and struggled against bellew. Now hes not even being matched against people he really should beat anyway.

Exactly how I see it Shah, with some nice points from Jabmachine as well. Clev really should be beating the likes of Sukhotsky - that is a bread and butter mandatory.

If he mentions the word legacy in the next 3 years I will cry with frustration.

JabMachineMK2 wrote:

I can only guess that Sukhotsky is a very real threat to Warren losing his only current champion. He blasted out Mohammedi and he did make Brahmer have issues towards the end of their fight as you correctly say. I thinK Warren had accepted Karpency was going to be easy, and because it wasn't he's looking at Cleverly and seeing a need to protect him more now than ever because he honestly can't put him in with the #1 Contender and expect a victory - Nathan has done himself no favours by seemingly hitting a ceiling in terms of performance. Thats why Warren has done what he has, because he has little faith in his champion and wants to keep him for as long as possible.

Exactly how I see it too. The Bellow and Karpency fights were harder than they should have been. Unless Clev shows some massive improvement in his next few fights than Warren will just continue to match him against nobodies who don't pose any threat.

Clev needs to get a better trainer in. His old man can still train him but Clev needs some specialist advice. He has worked with Haye and Groves so maybe Booth could get in on the act although since Hayes performance against Wlad I got my doubts about Booth but he is still probably better than Vince Cleverly

JabMachineMK2 wrote:

I can only guess that Sukhotsky is a very real threat to Warren losing his only current champion.

Surely Ricky Burns is also a Warren champion ?

Have to agree with most of the above about clev. When he was part time with his uni studies he looked a decent prospect but has really went back a few steps with recent fights. Can only hope he steps up soon and fights somebody on world level. A loss against a good fighter would not be the end of the world for him and he would potentially learn from it

Steffan wrote:Clev needs to get a better trainer in. His old man can still train him but Clev needs some specialist advice. He has worked with Haye and Groves so maybe Booth could get in on the act although since Hayes performance against Wlad I got my doubts about Booth but he is still probably better than Vince Cleverly

Can't agree more. Having relatives as trainers isn't always a great idea and generally doesn't turn out well unless in few cases like the mayweathers. The problems with family is that you don't want to give them the boot, meaning that you can be unsure of the right guy is in your corner which can hurt your performance.

Clev has quick hands an long limbs but always tries to get on the inside. He's been effective with this style so far but he doesn't have a big punch, so pressure fighting might not work vs the better guys. He needs to use his jab etc so he can get more power on his shots and save himself unnecessary punishment.

If he fought like this vs cloud or pascal he would get murdered. However, if he develops his outside game and defence these 2 are very outboxable and he could just beat them. Needs to up the competition though before we can make these assumptions

What an absolute joke.

"This is a hard test for me, he's had 39 fights with only two early points losses and hasn't been stopped before so I'm preparing for the hard twelve rounds, unless he goes early. I need to win this fight in style as I want Hopkins in Wales."

The hardest test of all will be trying to persuade anyone in their right mind to pay to watch this tripe.

"Krasniqi is a tough fight for Cleverly and it's easy to look ahead to a potential Hopkins fight," said Warren.

Unless he has his hands tied behind his back Cleverly really shouldn't have any trouble with this Lithuanian tractor salesman.

Tried hard to really give a monkey's about Clev, but he's taking the Michael now.

In other news: I'm thinking about a title fight with Wladimir Klitschko if I can make easy work of this chicken sandwich, and finish it off in style. Probably encounter as much resistance as Clev will against his Serbian pretzel-twister.

WHU_Champo_League_in_7Yrs wrote:

Steffan wrote:Clev needs to get a better trainer in. His old man can still train him but Clev needs some specialist advice. He has worked with Haye and Groves so maybe Booth could get in on the act although since Hayes performance against Wlad I got my doubts about Booth but he is still probably better than Vince Cleverly

Can't agree more. Having relatives as trainers isn't always a great idea and generally doesn't turn out well unless in few cases like the mayweathers. The problems with family is that you don't want to give them the boot, meaning that you can be unsure of the right guy is in your corner which can hurt your performance.

Clev has quick hands an long limbs but always tries to get on the inside. He's been effective with this style so far but he doesn't have a big punch, so pressure fighting might not work vs the better guys. He needs to use his jab etc so he can get more power on his shots and save himself unnecessary punishment.

If he fought like this vs cloud or pascal he would get murdered. However, if he develops his outside game and defence these 2 are very outboxable and he could just beat them. Needs to up the competition though before we can make these assumptions

Think the success of Calzaghe has blinded him somewhat. Calzaghe had a ton more in terms of talent to work with and Cleverly sr thinks that he can do the same but is blinded by a parent view of his limitations. Like you said, he needs to learn how to box on the outside and to develop a decent defense...otherwise he really isn't going to get far. Think Gallagher might be an option for him, but he needs to get a genuine pro trainer to teach him the fundamentals because he doesn't have the power to get away with this style. Also needs tougher sparring - more intensive sparring = less likely to make mistakes. I'm fairly certain he could never be a very good out-fighter but he needs to learn it anyway so he can snatch rest or formulate a plan when things aren't going his way. I do think he might need to learn a more subtle defense because he doesn't seem to be able to do anything but fight on the inside, so needs to find some way to absorb the power by slipping rather than his usual one trick of moving his head to one side and throwing a punch. Unfortunately he isn't going to learn fighting nurses and agricultural equipment salesmen. Probably going to go the way of some of his stablemates and end up with little in the way of legacy.

oxring wrote:Woah there D - Sukhotsky is a genuine "great"? What have you been smoking hombre?

Sure - Clev struggled with Mohammedi. Calzaghe struggled with Reid - who Lacy took out in one of the most one sided world title fights involving a Brit we've seen. If Clev doesn't want Sukhotsky because of the Mohammedi head2heads - he has no future at this level - arguably in the sport. You have to have belief as a boxer to be a champion - and that isn't good enough.

If Cleverly turned up at his best - I genuinely believe he'd beat Sukhotsky. I'd also really like to know the result - because if he can't beat Sukhotsky he really doesn't have a future at world level.

Oxo boy! I think it is you that may have "accidentally" inhaled something funny. Check my thread I said "threat" not "great"

Anyway, agree, if Cleverly can't beat a solid but unspectacular challenge in Sukotsky then he needs to focus more on algebra.

Super D Boon wrote:

oxring wrote:Woah there D - Sukhotsky is a genuine "great"? What have you been smoking hombre?

Sure - Clev struggled with Mohammedi. Calzaghe struggled with Reid - who Lacy took out in one of the most one sided world title fights involving a Brit we've seen. If Clev doesn't want Sukhotsky because of the Mohammedi head2heads - he has no future at this level - arguably in the sport. You have to have belief as a boxer to be a champion - and that isn't good enough.

If Cleverly turned up at his best - I genuinely believe he'd beat Sukhotsky. I'd also really like to know the result - because if he can't beat Sukhotsky he really doesn't have a future at world level.

Oxo boy! I think it is you that may have "accidentally" inhaled something funny. Check my thread I said "threat" not "great"

Anyway, agree, if Cleverly can't beat a solid but unspectacular challenge in Sukotsky then he needs to focus more on algebra.

Well that's embarrassing.

I find myself agreeing with Steffan a little here. I do believe Clev is a talented lad, but needs to get away from family trainers and FW who is looking for easy money. If he can do this, he is likely to have a better career, more money in his pocket and spend less time defending the indefensible, such as the latest choice of opponent. I do not think he will ever be the best in the world, but he can be a contender

I don't see why people are surprised. The fact is despite the hype (much of it initially generated on forums such as this) Cleverly isn't that good and hasn't really improved in any respect at all for years. He has ended up with a belt and used his MATHS degree to to do the maths. Hold onto the belt and make a few quid. He will be found out and maybe sooner than later. It wouldn't be a surprise if he lost long before a Hopkins fight was ever near signing

If he beats #4 Challenger he'll get thrown in with Bhop straight away in a summer blockbuster at the Millennium Stadium.

The fight will be boring as hell. Bhop will spoil Cleverly to within an inch of his life, butting, grabbing but scoring. He'll lose however, as Cleverly will throw a jab, and the whole stadium will erupt at his brilliance. 120 - 108 UD Cleverly.

With judges from Pontypridd, Pontypool and Newport.

Referee? Frank Warren.

JabMachineMK2 wrote:
With judges from Pontypridd, Pontypool and Newport.

Referee? Frank Warren.

Interestingly, none of which are in the same district as where Cleverly is from. With undoubted cross border rivaliries in other sports and a general hatred of someone just because they come from another county, if the judges were from such towns they'd probably score it unanimously to BHop!

its hard to get behind a seemly talented fighter when his best opponent is tony bellew. it gets boring after a while. i honestly beleive it is warrens not clevs doing but either way the fact remains his competition is worse than most stay at home champions. i think a champion at his age needs to be pushed, otherwise will become used to fighting nobodys and taper of amibition wise.

You do all know there is no obligation to watch Cleverly? If you all feel his opposition is that poor you can just ignore him, it is not like there are not enough world champions out there to follow, some weight classes have four or five. Rather than get all wound up just take the approach I have to him which is pretty much wake me up when he fights someone.

First post in. I warned you all where this thread would end up, and nearly a hundred posts later, we are still going.

But on the bright side, two Primo Carnera threads combined have nearly reached 100 posts, which is 90 posts more than expected.

the thing is i dont want to ignore him, he undoutedly has a certain talent and heart, and he does give 100%- and i have no problem with him working towards tougher fights, but he has a title and frank should at least be giving him increasing tough fights. he can be entertaining and i feel he havent seen the best of him, which is a shame.

Mind the windows Tino. wrote:First post in. I warned you all where this thread would end up, and nearly a hundred posts later, we are still going.

But on the bright side, two Primo Carnera threads combined have nearly reached 100 posts, which is 90 posts more than expected.

With the Tom Cribb post reaching double figures and the sex&thelegs post not going viral, all told this week restored my faith in 606v2's userbase.

Don't ignore him then Eddy - just ignore his claim of being a "world" champion until he's slightly higher rated in the ring's rankings.

Steffan&Jabmachine - we've gone through this too often this week - on this very same thread. Leave it.

I dont even class Clev as a world champion anyway. Theres only one champion and thats the Ring Title Holder Bernard Hopkins

The WBO, WBA, WBA Super and the KFC etc. mean nothing to me yet all fighters from these organisations call themselves 'The Champ' and its nothing new I just ignore it

i wont ignore him, i rarely watch a show based on one fight, if it has a good undercard i'd watch anyway. i'll wait and see what happens this summer as if a huge fight is made then i can accept an easy fight. but without sounding cynical i dont think anything will change, thats sadly how the sport is at the moment.

I suppose "The Ring" is the only actual champion, but that still means there are too many weight classes.

Cut it from 17 to 6.

Make them

Bantamweight - Anything from Straw to Bantamweight - just under a stone in weight difference.

Featherweight - Anything from Super bantam to Lightweight

Welterweight - anything from Light Welterweight to Super Welterweight

Middleweight - anything from Middleweight to Super Middleweight.

Light heavy - combine LHW and Cruiserweight

Heavyweight.

I think that would make much better matchups and champions. Union - are you able to work out who would be ring champion in that scenario for each weight or am I asking a cheeky question ....

HW: - Wlad
LH: - Hopkins
MW: - Martinez
WW: Vacant
FW: - Vacant
BW: - Vacant