Brive v Scarlets

First topic message reminder :

Looking forward to this game, how do you guys see this one going?
Scarlets really have a good chance to take this one I think.

If you are going to move Rhodri to tighthead then definitely bring in Samson Lee! There's our back-up props sorted for the world cup . Also which hooker are you letting go to the other Regions?

smiler: didn't have a great game yesterday, and is currently out of form.

ken: on form - having now tasted international rugby, he'll want to be playing as much regional rugby as possible.

emyr phillips: rate really highly, shame he plays in the one position we are blessed in.

kirby myhill: plenty of potential, but can't see him having much game time next season apart from in the LV Cup.

dragons are well stocked on hookers too. ospreys might be in the market for a hooker if they are losing bennett, baldwin? and mefin. it's only the blues who could really do with adding depth to their hooking dept.

Yeah the Blues could do with a hooker and should probably look at Phillips or Myhill. There's a good hooker playing for Cross Keys too, along with a set of big scrummaging props. Poor Keys, I can imagine them having half their team taken by the Regions next year!

Havent seen the game but still surprised by the outcome. One dimensional brive getting a better result than castres! Ruined my SG predictions...At least it seems that some promising youngsters got their chance ( french u20 loosehead for instance) : a nice change

Pioden - whose the 2 new locks for next season?

Am really annoyed that it was missed kicks that lost it for us again in a tight game - as said above P Edwards is only good enough for regional rugby, but then saying that as he was only meant to come on for 20mins. Can't believe how Gardiner has gone backwards since he looked so good when he came in last season.

But if Iestyn doesn't retire and we keep Manu I think our scrum will continue to improve next season

priest:

apparently it's a waiting game for the 2 x locks. we've spoken to a few agents who represent SH locks about their terms, but need to wait until the french clubs have finished their summer shopping. then we'll see who's still available and at what price we can get them at.

Well fingers crossed we can get them and Samson Lee develops well next season, then we'll have a decent front 5 and will have the backs (once they have a decent rest before the start of the season) to compete with most teams.

pioden gorllewin wrote:priest:

apparently it's a waiting game for the 2 x locks. we've spoken to a few agents who represent SH locks about their terms, but need to wait until the french clubs have finished their summer shopping. then we'll see who's still available and at what price we can get them at.

I just hope we have learnt our lessons about the SH not necessarily being better than our lot purely based on the grounds of them being SH. Marling was dire (and Meeuws was no real gain either, but a different position I know), and I really prey that we don't make the same mistake again by signing someone based on their NZ caps as opposed to their ability to fit in and play the rugby that we want from them (I would rather a Manu/Timani than a Meeuws/Marling).

SS, Manu has been a loyal servant to you. Timani was my MOTM against Brive. It could have went to Davies or L.Williams too though, and it did go to Liam.

Morgannwg wrote:SS, Manu has been a loyal servant to you. Timani was my MOTM against Brive. It could have went to Davies or L.Williams too though, and it did go to Liam.

Both Manu and Timani have been really good signngs for us, but to be honest I hadn't really heard of either of them prior to them signing (or rumours of their signing), and IMO that is the sort of NWQ players that seem to fit in with the Scarlets as opposed to some that have come with big reputations and been aweful.

Timani did stand out during the Brive match and he gave it his all, and put in some thumping tackles. If he were MOTM I would not have been suprised. I guess Liam got it as he did a good job finishing that try.

spiderman:

know what your saying - remember hottie louw the capped south african we signed from ASM Clermont-Auvergne?big bruising second row playing in the french league he sounded at the time like he was going to be a fantastic signing, but ended up being a waste of money.

nigel will really need to do his homework on the second rows he brings in this summer. but i guess like every other signing there is an element of risk.

I forgot Hottie, he was alright, but he was a lump and that was about it, I guess we had one good one bad that season cos wasn't that when we signed Anoki Afiaki (I can't remember how to spell that).

awww Afiaki (not sure on spelling either but I think it's close to that!). I absolutely loved him when he was with us.

totally forgot about Inoke Afekai - wasn't he the tongan captain or something? phil davies made some interesting signings! (he was one of phil's?)

like you mentioned above reputations/caps/previous clubs aren't always a recipe for success. two of our best imports in my opinion were salesi finau and american dave hodges. both practically unheard of before they signed, but great value for money.

Just had chance to watch the game and that is the worst I've seen Scarlets play this season. Barnes gave them the rub of the green and they really did squander their chances.

Geraghty looked good for Brive though.

we were a bit dreadful weren't we Sam? yet we still had a chance to win.

Still feeling pretty about it all to be honest.

Have to disagree Sam - In no way did we have the rub of the green, Barnes was very inconsistent for both sides with the ruck and people flopping over, but Brive were very cynical whenever we got into their 22 and killed the ball or illegally stole it on a number of occasions and didn't even get a warning but effectively stopped a few good opportunities for 7 points.

Poor game and am annoyed at the Scarlets for loosing in spite of all of that and P Edwards being battered in the scrum

Two things - I defy anybody not to be battered with Welch and Timani behind them in the scrum and Morgan leaning on at best. Secondly, Brive were pushing before the ball came in and Barnes was like a drip.

As to the rucks, we were taught a lesson by a good team in how to expoit a ref. He wasn't inconsistent, anything but. However we didn't realise that he would give the first man a go at a steal before the ruck formed. We fanned out and didn't try it.

I'm losing patience with J Edwards. Turnbull at 7 and Welch or Timani at 6 if they have to play.

Turnbull isn't a 7 Glas. He just doesn't have that skill set. He's a brilliant 6 though. Reckon we might need to see Timani at 8 for some of next season, if we manage to buy in a couple of decent locks as is needed.

Agree with you about Brive's early hits at the scrum though.

Do Scarlets lack a no.7? What do you think of Shingler being moved to play there? I think McCusker is your best blindside. Edwards and Turnbull were good when they burst onto the Regional scene but now they are just 2nd rate.

Turnbull is anything but 2nd rate, he's a great 6 not a 7, but did loose some form after an injury layoff

Yeah don't answer any of my questions then Smirnoff, it's fine.

Scarlets have Dan Thomas coming through (he really shone at the U20's in the 6N's) so reckon we might play him a bit next season.

Turnbull is still trying to get back some form. He was v good against the Blues but was lacking a bit against Brive. He's not 2nd rate though.

And Shings is an excellent 6 (another one that we have!) guess he can do a job at 7 but I wouldn't like to see us move him there full time.

Dan Thomas is a great shout. He did shine in a very poor team so fairplay to the lad. With him, Turnbull, Edwards, Shingler, McCusker, Gilbert and Murphy there seems to be a bit of traffic in the back row and only one 7 who is an U20.

think our game plan showed a bit of naivety. going to france with a weakend pack and only committing one or two players to the breakdown. like glas said we seemed to fan out, and lost the breakdown battle. not sure why nigel didn't give instruction to committ more players to the breakdown. unfortunately j edwards doesn't have the physicality at the highest level.

we also have richie pugh who is a 7

we did commit players to the breakdown, but just for 4, 5 phases maximum. we then seemed to think, to a man, that it was time to get the ball to the backs and our forwards stopped supporting and hitting the breakdown. Ridiculous.

Morgannwg wrote:Yeah don't answer any of my questions then Smirnoff, it's fine.

Apologies I was rushing to leave work so put a short answer.

I can only hope that my longer answer surfice's and meets your high standards

Edwards is our main 7, but is a penalty machine and is definately a weak link compared to the rest of our backrow forwards. Pugh is in the squad and is def a 7.

McCusker (who I really like) and Turnbull are both 6's and are both coming back after injury problems (Mcgog is still injured I think).

Shingler can play 7 but is more of a 6 as well, but when on form we've done quite well with more of 2 6.5's in Turnbull and McCusker

I thought Turnbull was the first choice 7 for big/euro games

nah, when he's first choice starting for us, he plays at 6

Pugh is with the Sevens team a lot. I can't remember when he last played for the Scarlets.

rugbydreamer wrote:nah, when he's first choice starting for us, he plays at 6

In fairness when we have our fit players available he does tend to start at 7, as we seem to play left and right flankers as opposed to open and blind. IMO the first choice backrow is
6.McCusker/Shingler - 7. Turnbull - 8. Morgan (Murphy/Timani/McCusker next season?)

I was thinking more back to last season SS, as we haven't had all of our backrow players fully fit at the same time this season!

He was definitely a 6 last season.

He can do a job at 7, but he's no where near as good there than he is at 6 imo.

Have to disagree Sam - In no way did we have the rub of the green, Barnes was very inconsistent for both sides with the ruck and people flopping over, but Brive were very cynical whenever we got into their 22 and killed the ball or illegally stole it on a number of occasions and didn't even get a warning but effectively stopped a few good opportunities for 7 points.

I thought he was pretty kind to the Scarlets at scrum time, allowing them to get the ball out after their front row had stood up and he did gave them quite a few free kicks for early engagement/push. He was very whistle happy in regards to the Brive team and really didn't let them flop over. Scarlets conceded so many turnovers because their defenders left their feet at the ruck or just didn't committ enough numbers which added to the slow delivery of the scrum half made the ruck an easy target.

There was also the Geraghty YC which removed Brive's best attacking threat from the game for 10 mins despite his tackle being almost identicle to the one from the Scarlets 15 on the Brive winger towards the end of the first half. The only difference being the Brive winger had already knocked on before the fb hit him. Got to say I thought that was inconsistent but rather fortunate, as was the double movement for the Scarlets try.

From what I saw Brive were worse at flopping over on the ruck or going off their feet - and the Brive Hooker was standing up at scrum time throughout (the scrum was a mess anyway you look at it and wasn't dealt with by Barnes).

Brive were lucky IMO not to have a yellow card for cynically sealing off the ball when the Scarlets were on the Brive tryline with men outside. And while the Geraghty yellow was fairly innocuous I got the feeling (maybe wrong) that the ref was tired of their fouling and decided to card them for the next offence.

The one that got me miffed, was when we stood Brive up in the scrum (which they got a pen for when they did it) it was reset, and then they turned up (which we had a pen against us for) and Barnes said the scrum had gone 90 and it was a Brive put in.

But personally I just think that Barnes is a poor ref and does weird calls both ways. I assume the IRB agree with me and that is why he was dropped from the Elite Ref group recently.

I agree Barnes has made some weird calls in his time and is a poor ref - in this game he made weird calls for both sides

I often think with Barnes that he's box ticking on an internal check list and he wants to cover one of every infringement. Which leads to him jumping on fairly innocuous things.