Biggest Welsh shake-up since 2003!

With the PriceWaterhouseandCooper report due soon (anyone know when?), constant articles about Cardiff/Scarlets finances, Dragons being bottom region, and Valleys and North Wales not being represented.

What chages do you realistically think the WRU will make when this is published?

No WUMS please don't be saying you think a region should be closed just because you don't like it. Just what changes you think that Pricewaterhousecooper will recommend, and which the WRU will put in place.

what constant articles about the Scarlets' finances?

The O's are due to release their accounts soon also btw, so that should add a whole other face to it.

Anyone know when the Blues are going to announce theirs?

I honestly can't see the WRU changing much to be honest.

As I have said on other threads like this, NOTHING WILL CHANGE, the Pontypridd MP and us folk in the valleys can shout as loud as we like, but the only plans for a new region are for North Wales, and they are miles away, you don't see the WRU playing any U20 games in the valleys do you ? The Scarlets for now are controlling their finances after being bailed out, and the WRU will not let the capital side go bust, we all know there is a problem and Roger Lewis has admitted this and has said that there are plans afoot to fix it, so as I have said before, if you go around the valleys in the not so distant future you will see Cardiff Blues posters and bill boards with a war time headline of "YOUR REGION NEEDS YOU" with,I don't know, say, Jamie Roberts pointing his finger towards you. We will then be expected to bandy around and go down to Leckwith to support "our" region.

Roger Lewis, WRU Group CEO, said last month;

"We are at a fundamental crossroads in the history of Welsh rugby,"

"We are at a critical stage and that's what is so exciting because if we get this right we will come up with something in world rugby that will be the envy of the world.

"We've got to think differently. We cannot think we've just got to fix what's gone on before.

"We've got to come up with something that's far more radical and is far more sustainable that will take our game forward."

If all they do is give each region an extra 'youth development officer' and a new beer tent, I'll be somewhat underwhelmed.

Casartelli wrote:Roger Lewis, WRU Group CEO, said last month;

"We are at a fundamental crossroads in the history of Welsh rugby,"

"We are at a critical stage and that's what is so exciting because if we get this right we will come up with something in world rugby that will be the envy of the world.

"We've got to think differently. We cannot think we've just got to fix what's gone on before.

"We've got to come up with something that's far more radical and is far more sustainable that will take our game forward."

If all they do is give each region an extra 'youth development officer' and a new beer tent, I'll be somewhat underwhelmed.

But this is what this man does, I swear, this man would make a cracking prime minister, he gets everybody on side, lets us all here what we want, then does exactly what he likes with no regard to what he has promised. For a start they have invested to heavily in the north with goggled cymru, and the next big thing will be to put them in the premeirship to test the water, then with a view to giving them a regional status. They will then probably tell the Blues to "embrace" your region, which will fall on deaf years as they are not interested, and we will be where we are now. . I hope I am wrong by the way, I really do, but I have seen and heard far to many negative to be positive at the moment.

Well that kind of radical statement sets the expectation bar high.

Interesting to see what the reality will be.

Pot Hale wrote:Well that kind of radical statement sets the expectation bar high.

Interesting to see what the reality will be.

The reality will be Cardiff Blues posters and bill boards all around the valleys.

P.S I hope I am wrong.

In my opion I think they will recomand reducing funding to the Welsh prem, and increase funding to the regional game.

Think they will try and take the running of the Cardiff Blues region out of Cardiff RFC hands, and replace it with a region run by all the clubs in the area.

A new plan to speed development of a North Wales region to be entered into the Pro 12 in a few years, It will enter at the expense of the Dragons who will be a development region with reduced funding in the mean time, (the extra funds going to RGC 1404 to develop).

When RGC 1404 enter Dragons will merge into the Blues/Valley region, (this process will slowly evole while RGC 1404 get ready)

This leaves us with a North, Cardiff/Valleys/Gwent, Ospreys and Scarlets regions.

Don't think any rugby club fans will be happy with this.

dreamer and Dowlais firmly in the "Roger is full of it" camp then...

In my opinion there will be no dropping of any current regions, if they do, then the WRU risk alienating a % of current supporters who will refuse to support the new teams, i can safely say i will be one of them.

If anything what we will see is some tough talk from the wru on how the regions should operate, with some fines if they aren't followed to the letter.

Roger lewis talks like a politician, and I can see him going down that route after he is finished with the WRU but we all know that politicians talk nonsense and never deliver what they promise.

We all know what we have is a dog's dinner, a compromise and a set up that no one in their right mind would conceive, other than Welsh clubs.

I don't see there being any changes. Certainly not something 'radical' as he says. Regional rugby currently represents a very small section of the Welsh population as can be seen week after week by the paltry crowds at our regions. Tinkering with names, colours or anything else similar will not change that.

There is no way the Dragons will be de-moted to a development region, this region is the only one that has run it's finances properly even if they do not accept anywhere north of cross keys as their region.

Is there anything signed between the Regions and WRU that atuomatically allows them into the Rabo.

Can the WRU revoke Rabo entry and make thier own regions run by the Clubs akin to the Valley proposal.

WRU holds all the cards as they can take away funding and criple them if they don't tow the line

i see development region marked all over the dragons unfortunately, Dowlais since when has running your finances correctly guaranteed your access to top flight rugby just look at the scarlets and now blues

If the dragons get made development will the next step be fold.

Connacht were never fully funded as far as I understand so it was fine for them.

could the Dragons last or would it be the WRU combining them with the blues by the back door to allow North Wales or Valley to have a go at being a development region

Just what changes you think that Pricewaterhousecooper will recommend, and which the WRU will put in place

I don't think PWC are recommending anything. They are just delivering the statistics, so it's up to the WRU to come up with the fixes.

Personally I don't think a lot will change. I see serious belt tightening and many higher paid players leaving. An over reliance on the academies to fill the void until there is more money available or the economic situation changes in Wales. This whole radical change statement seems unrealistic. IMO the only real radical thing they can do is completely change the regions, i.e East - West, South and North for example. I seriously doubt that will happen.

LordDowlais wrote:There is no way the Dragons will be de-moted to a development region, this region is the only one that has run it's finances properly even if they do not accept anywhere north of cross keys as their region.

Is this true?
I wouldn't know and we always seem to hear about the state of the other 3 and how much they have lost etc, but nothing about the Dragons for some reason.

I wouldn't know and we always seem to hear about the state of the other 3 and how much they have lost etc, but nothing about the Dragons for some reason

It's in case the tax man is listening

From what I have been told ALL the regions are in debt, however the Dragons is substantially less than the other 3.

well ask yourself why we have not since the days of percy montgomery (who was funded by tony brown i believe) had any real big name signings?

i dont exactly know whether we break even or not but i think our relatively small losses are covered by hazell - i think

When have you ever heard about financial truoble at the Dragons ? Also they have just revamped half of their ground with the ambition to extend the oposite side. The Dragons are moving along nicely as far as I am concerned and they are the only region who get near a full house and generate a good atmosphere at their ground. For some reason though the powers that be do not recognise this and as a result we have players leaving just to get recognised for Welsh honours. That trend was being bucked latley though with the likes of Lydyate, Faletau, Charteris and Brew, but just because the Dragons will not commit financial suicide and pay mega bucks the better players leave for more money. Seriously though, the Dragons will not become a development region, not at cost of a North Wales region anyway, if anything, the North Wales region will be a development region and will play in the premiership for time being, until they are granted regional status. This, my fellow posters, will be the BIG news roger Lewis is talking about.

i dont exactly know whether we break even or not but i think our relatively small losses are covered by hazell - i think

That's pretty much what happens GD

THE WRU are comitted to 4 regions, I cant see why the WRU would want to move them from their largest 3 cities and biggest town in West Wales.

I'd like them to go to 3 centrally contracted regions East, West and north but I can't see it happening.

LordDowlais wrote:When have you ever heard about financial truoble at the Dragons ? Also they have just revamped half of their ground with the ambition to extend the oposite side. The Dragons are moving along nicely as far as I am concerned and they are the only region who get near a full house and generate a good atmosphere at their ground. For some reason though the powers that be do not recognise this and as a result we have players leaving just to get recognised for Welsh honours. That trend was being bucked latley though with the likes of Lydyate, Faletau, Charteris and Brew, but just because the Dragons will not commit financial suicide and pay mega bucks the better players leave for more money. Seriously though, the Dragons will not become a development region, not at cost of a North Wales region anyway, if anything, the North Wales region will be a development region and will play in the premiership for time being, until they are granted regional status. This, my fellow posters, will be the BIG news roger Lewis is talking about.

Fair enough, but the other 3 have won stuff or have given a good showing in Europe on ocassions, all of which required squad investment. I'm sure the Drags would have done better if they had spent a bit more, but they've never looked like winning anything. Tis true Cardiff Blues and the O's pushed out the boat a bit too far and they are paying the price, but are now addressing this issue. Also the Scarlets seemed to have got their house in order.
As you mention it, who is paying for the new Bisley stand? Heard all sorts. Must have cost a few quid.

GavinDragon wrote:well ask yourself why we have not since the days of percy montgomery (who was funded by tony brown i believe) had any real big name signings?

i dont exactly know whether we break even or not but i think our relatively small losses are covered by hazell - i think

Agreed.

Given the parlous state of the finances in the game generally, I can see WRU getting sensible and cutting their costs through making a Connacht out of someone.

Central contracting may be suggested although that wouldn't be very original in the way that Lewis has suggested in his public remarks.

Maybe retreat more to the original clubs and fashion some structure that "appears" to abandon the regional aspect to all the Pro12 teams.

Maybe abandon the Pro12 and sneak into the Premiership overnight whilst the anglos are sleeping......

Impossible Standards wrote:

I wouldn't know and we always seem to hear about the state of the other 3 and how much they have lost etc, but nothing about the Dragons for some reason

It's in case the tax man is listening

From what I have been told ALL the regions are in debt, however the Dragons is substantially less than the other 3.

I would estimate that Cardiff Blues must be at least £6m or £7m in debt. Most probably more actually.
CCS is proving to be a massive failure and a huge waste of money.

Pot Hale wrote:Given the parlous state of the finances in the game generally, I can see WRU getting sensible and cutting their costs through making a Connacht out of someone.

Central contracting may be suggested although that wouldn't be very original in the way that Lewis has suggested in his public remarks.

Maybe retreat more to the original clubs and fashion some structure that "appears" to abandon the regional aspect to all the Pro12 teams.

Maybe abandon the Pro12 and sneak into the Premiership overnight whilst the anglos are sleeping......

The WRU were asked to do this by the RFU when they first went pro in the early nineties, but the people at the top in the WRU at the time feared for their status. If we were in this situation again the WRU would probably rip the RFU's arm off to take the chance. Because although at the moment the regions are not working if they put the clubs in the English system, the away fans that the English clubs alone would bring to the clubs would boost the profits, that then will encourage more fans to come and support from within the towns and cities of Wales.

Tony Brown paid for the Bisley didn't he? Hence the name. I do believe that the Dragons aren't in debt, as proven by our slow rate of developing the stadium (we don't develop anything till we can afford it eg no roof on the North Terrace).

Risca Rev wrote:Tony Brown paid for the Bisley didn't he? Hence the name. I do believe that the Dragons aren't in debt, as proven by our slow rate of developing the stadium (we don't develop anything till we can afford it eg no roof on the North Terrace).

Like improving your home; do it up bit by bit. Makes perfect sense. That's what Cardiff Blues should have done at CAP.
Who's paying back Tony Brown? Surely he didn't build it for nothing.

I can't see much change, you are already aware of the salary cap aren't you? Hopefully the changes are the WRU giving out some type of central contracts to players and taking over the Blues then actually make them a Region.

Morgannwg wrote:I can't see much change, you are already aware of the salary cap aren't you? Hopefully the changes are the WRU giving out some type of central contracts to players and taking over the Blues then actually make them a Region.

Good call.

Why would the Dragons be a development region??? Doesn't Gwent have the most clubs in Wales? Just because we haven't had the money men, doesn't mean we should be a development region. The Ospreys brought in sooo many of their welsh stars from other regions. Byrne, Phillips, Rhian Jones, Bennett, Gough etc all came from other clubs. Yes they have produced a lot of talent, but there's no doubt that the Scarlets lead the way with developing the best welsh players. Who have the Nlues brought through?? Roberts and Warburton are truly great players, but Martyn Williams, Halfpenny and Gethin Jenkins all came from other regions or clubs and I won't accept the likes of Czekaj. Never international class.
Don't get me wrong, at the Dragons, we haven't really brought through our share of players, but we struggle to hold on to them. Look at Tovey. Going to the Blues to improve his international chances. I'd have peed myself if the Blues ended up in the Amlin. But no doubt Tovey will get capped now and will get more recognition playing for the Capital club. I never understand this. How can one region be more fashionable than another??? We only have 4!!!

Forget Noth Wales. You can't lose a region in the south just please a few. It doesn't make sense. Clearly the problem is a lack of money, but the product is poor too. The Rabies is an awful competition that just doesn't get the casual fan interested. It'll get worse next season with the regions drastically weakened. As the legend JPR Williams said. Welsh rugby wasn't built on regions. It was built on the club game. I'd be more excited watching Newport play Aberavon tomorrow than going to see the Deagons play Treviso. Unfortunately I'm going to the game, but just to have a beer with my mates. I know the stuff on the pitch will be urine poor!!!

Maybe they'll let us play our top 4 clubs in the (as everyone concedes) dire Rabo (we could have promotion to and from the Premiership) - and then pick three proper regional teams (South, West and North Wales, for example) for the European competition?

That would be brilliant. Those that like the parochial 'tribal' stuff can get their fix from the celtic league and those that want to see us send some relevant and competitive sides into the HC have something to look forward to.

Is this Roger's masterplan???

manofgwent wrote:

Forget Noth Wales. You can't lose a region in the south just please a few. It doesn't make sense. Clearly the problem is a lack of money, but the product is poor too. The Rabies is an awful competition that just doesn't get the casual fan interested. It'll get worse next season with the regions drastically weakened. As the legend JPR Williams said. Welsh rugby wasn't built on regions. It was built on the club game. I'd be more excited watching Newport play Aberavon tomorrow than going to see the Deagons play Treviso. Unfortunately I'm going to the game, but just to have a beer with my mates. I know the stuff on the pitch will be urine poor!!!

We have forgotten North Wales for a 100 years. Only now are the WRU trying to help them create a rugby base from which to grow. And who's idea was that again? A kiwi with half a heel is your clue...

Am I missing something as to how the Regions will be drastically weakened next season?

We should never forgot about how all the clubs came together to form the Welsh Rugby Union at castle hotel in Neath; Wrexham were there too. But times change and you have to adapt. This happens in all walks of life and not just Rugby. You and JPR need to realise this.

The regions will be drastically weakened next season in terms of player quality. Every region are losing players to overseas teams. The Welsh game will be without a lot of top welsh talent.
I've had the North Wales debate on here a couple of times. North Wales has barely produced Amy international players. If you had a region, 30 players would have to travel to Wrexham. Taken from current regions. What's the point in that. Have north Wales got a few good players to base a region around???

manofgwent wrote:The regions will be drastically weakened next season in terms of player quality. Every region are losing players to overseas teams. The Welsh game will be without a lot of top welsh talent.
I've had the North Wales debate on here a couple of times. North Wales has barely produced Amy international players. If you had a region, 30 players would have to travel to Wrexham. Taken from current regions. What's the point in that. Have north Wales got a few good players to base a region around???

North Wales has produced George North and Rob McCusker in the last two years that's pretty good for a region without a professional set-up

We've lost a few to French clubs but not enough to the extent it is going to 'drastically weaken' the Regions. Which top talent is going?

Yes I did read your North Wales debate. You don't come across as too smart when discussing it tbh, especially when you can't work out how they haven't had the chance to produce many international players. Just look at the Rebels in Australia mog, that might give you an idea of how to build a new team.

Build from wha?? Wed ship 30 players up north!! What's the point???

Welsh players going of note
Brew
Charteris
Bennett
Gethin Jenkins??
Richie Rees
Yapp
Stephen jones

To mention a few and more will follow. The Scarlets look ok, but the Ospreys, Blues and Dragons are all losing top players. You could even look at the likes of Laulala and Bowe leaving too.
Take a look at the talent that the valleys produce. What on earth are the north doing??
If 4 or 5 north Wales players were playing at the 4 regions, you could have a case, but you can't have George North and 29 others from the south. Senseless!!

mog, you really aren't bright , at all. The valleys have clubs, they used to have top flight clubs, something the North didn't. They now go into Regional academies, sometimes they go from the clubs into their Region. Something else the North doesn't have. And like I said, look at how the Rebels formed. A north wales region won't be implemented anytime soon, that's obvious. There will never be a valleys region, that is also obvious, well to the brighter ones.

I can't believe that's the list of top welsh talent you could come up with. Yapp and Richie Rees! ! Blues still have Warburton, Davies, Roberts, Halfpenny. Gethin will be missed. Dragons have signed Prydie and are looking for other Welsh players to bring in. It was the right time for Bennet and Jones to move, unless you were expecting them to start for Wales next season? So the 'top welsh talent' isn't going anywhere.

Ummmm. Phillips, Byrne, Hook are already out there. The Dragons will lose Faletau and Lydiate when their contracts expire. Again probably to France. Adam Jones has said he'll probably leave in 2 years too. That's nearly a welsh tam!!! The Dragons won't replace Martyn Thomas, Tovey, Brew and Charteris easily. You don't see a problem with players leaving the Welsh game???
You can try and take a pop at me, but you are watching from afar. If you think the north will replicate the Rebels then you really are deluded. I won't take dogs at your knowledge just to try and win an argument, but suffice to say that north Wales will never have a region and rightly so.

Ummmm, Byrne and Hook can't even make the starting XV. Phillips, well, I rate him highly. But he was soon replaced at his former region. The Ospreys have a team full of Welsh players, I can't see too much fuss over losing those three. In fact, there wasn't any. Most players leave for France after a world cup or in their thirties anyway. Now you said we were losing a host of welsh players this year, not in two years time silly. The Dragons have already signed a replacement for thomas, they have one for Tovey, they are getting one for Brew. Second row is an issue but the Premiership is a reliable feeder. I don't see these as a problem. The problem is you believing what you read in the papers about there being a mass exodus to France.

And you really should learn to read. I didn't say they should replicate the Rebels. I asked you to look at how they formed so you could get an idea of how a new team is created in an area that doesn't have a rugby set-up. Honestly, how can someone be this dull? You've got to be the dumbest poster on here, up there with the likes of maj!

Mate. Seriously you haven't a clue . No idea whatsoever.
We need a hooker. We need 2 2nd rows. If we had 2 in the prem we'd have picked them this season., but we're stuck with Sidoli and Adam Jones . Way past it!! Nice of you to tell me what my region needs. We've replaced Tovey?? We may well be signing a South African 10. Personally I'd rather of stuck with the one we'd been producing!! I love Steffan Jones. He's going to be better than Tovey, but we'll develop him for 3 or 4 years and if he makes the grade, he'll move on. We're getting a replacement for Brew and Thomas are we?? I know we're getting Prydie, but that's only because nobody else wants him. We pick up the dreggs!!! We won't be as strong next season. Simple as that. Nor will the Blues or the Ospreys. In the last 2 years the Ospreys have lost Hook, Byrne, Phillips, Collins, Bowe, Holah, Bennett and Walker and they're not weaker. I'm not just talking about losing 1st Welsh starters, I'm talking about top talent. How will the Ospreys attract the same crowds and compete as well with so many players leaving or left. Yes the Blues have Warburton and Roberts, but how many game do they actually play for their regions??

Morgannwg wrote:mog, you really aren't bright , at all. The valleys have clubs, they used to have top flight clubs, something the North didn't. They now go into Regional academies, sometimes they go from the clubs into their Region. Something else the North doesn't have. And like I said, look at how the Rebels formed. A north wales region won't be implemented anytime soon, that's obvious. There will never be a valleys region, that is also obvious, well to the brighter ones.

I can't believe that's the list of top welsh talent you could come up with. Yapp and Richie Rees! ! Blues still have Warburton, Davies, Roberts, Halfpenny. Gethin will be missed. Dragons have signed Prydie and are looking for other Welsh players to bring in. It was the right time for Bennet and Jones to move, unless you were expecting them to start for Wales next season? So the 'top welsh talent' isn't going anywhere.

Yapp and Richie (and there are more) are the sort of players we should be keeping hold of since they are not away with Wales for half a season and just as importantly, they are experienced which helps to bring on the younger players.

manofgwent wrote:Mate. Seriously you haven't a clue . No idea whatsoever.
We need a hooker. We need 2 2nd rows. If we had 2 in the prem we'd have picked them this season., but we're stuck with Sidoli and Adam Jones . Way past it!! Nice of you to tell me what my region needs. We've replaced Tovey?? We may well be signing a South African 10. Personally I'd rather of stuck with the one we'd been producing!! I love Steffan Jones. He's going to be better than Tovey, but we'll develop him for 3 or 4 years and if he makes the grade, he'll move on. We're getting a replacement for Brew and Thomas are we?? I know we're getting Prydie, but that's only because nobody else wants him. We pick up the dreggs!!! We won't be as strong next season. Simple as that. Nor will the Blues or the Ospreys. In the last 2 years the Ospreys have lost Hook, Byrne, Phillips, Collins, Bowe, Holah, Bennett and Walker and they're not weaker. I'm not just talking about losing 1st Welsh starters, I'm talking about top talent. How will the Ospreys attract the same crowds and compete as well with so many players leaving or left. Yes the Blues have Warburton and Roberts, but how many game do they actually play for their regions??

mog, it's getting boring again.
We didn't need a hooker until 2 weeks ago. Darren Edwards is apparently looking at the former Neath hooker at Cross Keys, and a 2nd row from Aberavon I think seeing as the Scarlets will be swooping in for Dan Hodge. We have Steffan Jones and Lewis Robling, I rate Jones very highly. Peter Grant is the rumoured one and it makes sense. Good experienced player who can also play 12, should provide some cover. Jones is injured right now btw, get it? I don't class Prydie as a reject, he's a quality player. As is Dan Evans. I for one certainly hope we aren't chasing other regions rejects again (Deniol Jones anyone?). I don't think any Region will be stronger but nor will they be weaker.

Cardiff Dave wrote:

Morgannwg wrote:mog, you really aren't bright , at all. The valleys have clubs, they used to have top flight clubs, something the North didn't. They now go into Regional academies, sometimes they go from the clubs into their Region. Something else the North doesn't have. And like I said, look at how the Rebels formed. A north wales region won't be implemented anytime soon, that's obvious. There will never be a valleys region, that is also obvious, well to the brighter ones.

I can't believe that's the list of top welsh talent you could come up with. Yapp and Richie Rees! ! Blues still have Warburton, Davies, Roberts, Halfpenny. Gethin will be missed. Dragons have signed Prydie and are looking for other Welsh players to bring in. It was the right time for Bennet and Jones to move, unless you were expecting them to start for Wales next season? So the 'top welsh talent' isn't going anywhere.

Yapp and Richie (and there are more) are the sort of players we should be keeping hold of since they are not away with Wales for half a season and just as importantly, they are experienced which helps to bring on the younger players.

Hold onto Yapp? Yeah says just you. Fair one on Rees, but I only laughed because mog described him as top welsh talent joining some mass exodus that isn't taking place. Shouldn't you be more concerned with who are coming through to replace them? The problem Blues have is holding onto these crap players for too long, look where it has got you. The academies is where it's at .

The regions will be weaker. Never said Prydie was a reject. I know Steff is injured. I was at the Keys game!!!!!!
We didnt need a hooker until 2 weeks ago?? Willis retired. Jaffa 34 and their were rumpled about Burns a while ago. We needed a hooker anyway. I would still rather have kept Tovey than bring in an overseas 10. Steff's the man and I think will surpass Tovey. We desperately need more depth in our front 5.
Enjoy the canapés!!!

Morgannwg wrote:

Hold onto Yapp? Yeah says just you. Fair one on Rees, but I only laughed because mog described him as top welsh talent joining some mass exodus that isn't taking place. Shouldn't you be more concerned with who are coming through to replace them? The problem Blues have is holding onto these crap players for too long, look where it has got you. The academies is where it's at .

I am concerned who will replace them because the Cardiff Blues academy aint that great at present. The majority tend to turn out for Cardiff RFC and haven't had a very good season so far. As for new recruits, who can tell.
Yapp is a seasoned pro and a half decent LH who will do well at Edinburgh in my opinion.
Why refer to them as "crap players"? That's a bit unfair isn't it?

Rees is alright but it's quite accurate for Yapp and some others you have.

Exactly Dave. They may not be top stars, but it weakens the regions. The Dragons never replaced Rhys Thomas and I don't know how we'll replace Charteis. You don't just replace a top 2nd row that easily. On one hand it does give youth a chance, but young sides playing against poor Rabo teams doesn't pull in the linters!!

Morgannwg wrote:Rees is alright but it's quite accurate for Yapp and some others you have.

Players such as Yapp and Richie provide strength in depth too.
No you are not accurate with regards to Yapp. If he can discover his form from a few years ago before he was experimented on at TH, then Edinburgh will benefit.