TJ Perenara

What he has to do to make the all blacks squad?

I watch him today playing for Hurricanes of Wellington and blow away the Melbourne Rebellion and he looks like the best half back in the world today. In this area where all blacks struggle and have lacking of best player there apart from when Piri Weepu drink some Asterix potion for the world cup, then why he is not make the team?

And more important, does he have a grandmother we can find here in England and make the selection?

Perenara has definitely lifted his game since the AB squad was names. Smith was always going to make it if anything because he has the best pass. Kerr-Barlow just got in ahead of TJ partly due to good form with the Chiefs but probably also because of the 9, 10, 12 Chiefs combo of he, Cruden and SBW.

If the squad were named today TJ would probably edge Kerr-Barlow having the better form presently, though both are strong.

Foxy said TJ was definitely one for the future so its just a matter of time at this stage. Good thing is we have 3 new very good 9's so thats a blessing in itself.

Anotherworldof pain

Answer by big chief All black boss Hansen asked why Perenara no ?

dumb take 2year old to Melbourne Cup.

I think you have a fun about me

The problem is this currently there are alot of players in the 9,10,12 areas in NZ who are playing good Rugby at Super level but are.In Test Rugby unknown quantities,they will gradualy be fed into the mix but NOT yet.AT 9 the selectors know what Cowan,Weepu,or Ellis can do in a Black shirt.THAT right has to be earned first season players don`t cut it,often they are thrown in too early.Flop Coach will damn them with faint praise then drop them.Example Isaac Ross 2009 played half a season in an injury riddled side.Was dropped could`nt even get a start in his ITM side.

Yes I agree with 9. But in Cruden and SBW, who do have experience, that pushes Kerr-Barlow ahead of TJ Perenara as back up is all I meant.

I think Hansens wanting to drop Wee-pies but is stuck for a kicker.

I'm not fussed which of TJ, Smith or KB play at 9 as theyre all young and I know Ellis will only caretake the role till one puts up the higher hand.

SXV isnt test but that also doesnt mean they dont manage test level either. Some cope better than others. Some thrive, some don't. waters just gotta be tested sometimes...

The other side of the coins emack2 is that all blacks dont have a really world leading 9 for some year. And some of these new player look like the real dealers and so is not make a sense to carry on with the player "know what they can do in a black shirt" if what is know is that they are not so good!

My mind on different topic, also is Nonu must continue at 12 and not be taken in by sonny boy william. Nonu is great distributor and has amazing pass and vision to the wide channel. Sonny boy always punching the center and short offloading game. Too predictible. Too narrow.

I trumpeted the kid after his first game for Wellington in 2010. He was playing the semi final of the NPC against Canterbury and was easily the best WEllington player on the pitch that night. He was only a kid and still at school.

Glad to see him come on, but Hansen is right. Let him develop at his own pace and just see how good the kid gets. There'll be a time when he'll be too irresistable not to be picked.

One thing being predictable, another defending it. In fact Nonu couldnt be more predictable surely?
Its about the type of game Hansen wants to play and SBW offers a lot more potential now hes had a season at the top with the Chiefs.
Id be surprised if Nonu starts ahead of SBW now.

Taylorman wrote:One thing being predictable, another defending it. In fact Nonu couldnt be more predictable surely?
Its about the type of game Hansen wants to play and SBW offers a lot more potential now hes had a season at the top with the Chiefs.
Id be surprised if Nonu starts ahead of SBW now.

Yep, SBW is a definite starter for me. Nonu will come off the bench I think and maybe get a start in the Third Test. He'll be firing for the 4N thouhg, I've no doubt about that

Nonu was in good form for Auckland when he came on with high work rate and look hungry to make the impact. I don't think so he is so predictable. He manage to use himself as a decoy but either attack the line or distribute to new point of attack and his pass is always swift and accurate and his decision making of when is right to go or pass is so reliably.

True is SBW is growing into rugby player but still some years of class behind. Only think for SBW is that if Aaron Cruden is playing for good combinator.

Fair comment. I heard Nonu had a good game but Ive stopped watching the blues at the moment.

Main thing is 9 through to 15 we're playing two deep if you accept the wings are in good shape

Nonu looks like he'll be benched and that will bring out his competitiveness.

Normally for the autumn series we use three halfbacks and three hookers. I don't want to see Cowan anywhere near the team this year. He's heading off to England and his form doesn't warrant even being in the larger squad. So he goes and Weepu needs to stop thinking he's a turkey and fattening himself up for Christmas. So he's out as well. So Smith and Ellis I think Hansen will plump for (simply because he has proven test experience even though I don't think much of him) and then widening the squad to include KB for the 4N and hopefully give TJ a run in autumn and rest Ellis.

Say what you like about his age, I think finally we have good news in the halfback area and we need to make sure the in-form halfbacks get some exposure to cover the prospect of injuries and to keep away the club offers. We don't want the situation where we lost the current half back for Manu Samoa through lack of communication and encouragement for higher honours.

I think Hansens got hese 3 halfbacks just where he needs them. None is going to go overseas until his AB value is determined. Besides, it helps with your cv.

Like you Im rapt weve three very good 9's in the waiting. For me TJ is the type i prefer as he has a real go at the line. But thats only splitting hairs. Who knows which would perform better in black.

Still can't forget that Piri Weepu must be say he is responsible for save the all blacks in the world cup. In game with Argentina whole team freeze up except Weepu and he manage the game so well after injury on Colin Slade. He kick 9/10 and match his percentage of 90% before the final.

Is not possible to live on glory reflect from history but he might be now "big game player" and might be he lose interest in super rugby from bad taste in Wellington and not match the Auckland team which look like a mess.

If the squad were named today TJ would probably edge Kerr-Barlow having the better form presently, though both are strong

Had to have a double take there...thought Ken barlow had made the AB's...

Jimmy Cowan was the best DEFENSIVE Scrum half in World Rugby.NZ has always prefered the solid workman to the flashy.Andy Ellis is a much under rated 9 and has`nt been given a decent run.If Carter is fit he will start at 10 and KICK,despite Crudens recent performances.THAT is a no brainer but don`t expect him to go full 80.SBW is likely starter at 12,BUT Nonu in AllBlack Shirt is
a different animal to one in a struggling Super side.My only caveat about that is this one year at a time bit.The AllBlacks need a settled side not be messed about.
As to the ABs not having a good 9.,Cowan and Weepu/Ellis maybe not Genia or Du Preez.BUT Cowan usually had the wood on Genia most of the time and the NH ones are hardly geniuses.

The bottom line is NO AllBlack side has lost to Ireland,Hansen won`t want to be first AB Coach to do so.Also he will want to establish a strong side for the 4Ns,expect new faces for the AI`s not before.

Sorry Alan but disagree. At least as subs we'll have Savea, A Smith and at least one new lock as new AB's by the time the Irish series ends.

What happens if the AB's win by 30-40? Of course he'll put new blood out.

I wouldnt bet against Tamati Ellison getting a run either. The AB's are not stuck in the mud in that way. Its not a World Cup year and its a home series against Ireland. If Hansen doesnt have a few new caps prior to the AI's then he will have done extremely poorly.

Its about looking forward and forward is the new guys, not the dirt trackers like Cowan and Ellis and theres no way Cowan will figure- Foxy said as much. He cant even make the highlanders side, is playing poorly and is off. Why waste a cap on him?

These 3 new 9's are playing excellent rugby and deserve their chance. And its neither for you or anyone else to say they wont step up- because you don't know for sure either way.

Always is needed the balance everywhere. Rugby just like Budhism this way

Experience must be matched with youthful energy. Structure with improvisation. Restraint and aggression.

So for Hansen to secure the other win against Ireland, must the same way. Some young talent like Savea or Smith might be just make the difference.

Yep Taylorman, I agree the time to be bold is now. Start of a new cycle playing first up against a team we’ve never lost to but one we give utmost respect to.

Jimmy Cowan, as good a player that he is, was lucky to play as many tests as he did to be honest. He’s signed for Gloucester so he won’t figure for the AB’s again. On current form he would place at about 6th best in the country, maybe even 7th.

My starting lineup would be:

1 Woodcock
2 Elliott
3 Franks
4 Rettalick
5 Whitelock
6 Vito
7 McCaw
8 Read
9 Ellis
10 Carter
11 Savea
12 SBW
13 C Smith
14 B Smith
15 Dagg

16 B Franks
17 Hore
18 Williams
19 Thompson
20 A Smith
21 Nonu
22 Cruden

A balance of youth and experience there.....

However, I'd like to see someone other than Adam Thompson covering the backrow, sadly his versatility wins out over young up and comers....

Thomson is a 6,and the BEST one bar Kaino at that Luke Romano for Rettalick.Guildford for B.Smith.Hore is a certain start at Hooker never said Cowan would figure just he was`nt that bad over his career.

Read is injury so what is the back row?

Alan, I don’t think Guildford will figure first up – his indiscretions aren’t distant enough for that I think whatever anyone says about him being suspended and having done his time. They’ll go with Savea as an out and out winger and then Ben Smith as the full-wing role which Jane is the best in the world at.

Thompson doesn’t have age on his side, we need to bring through young backrowers and Vito is at the top of the tree in my opinion. His form at the Hurricanes this year has been simply outstanding, even if he is playing 8. He’s not the green rookie who was left for dead by Australia in 2010. He’s maturing at a rate of knots, he just needs his chance

Anotherworldofpain – I’m intrigued to know what your background is? You have quite a deep knowledge of all things black!

How is Wal by the way?

Not convinced about Vito at 6 mintie. I'd give you him on the bench covering 7 and 8 where his speed above all are more suited. But 6 doesn't require so much a need for speed but big hits. I agree Thomson doesn't offer that and offers more scavenge qualities and I'd prefer him to Vito at 6 simply because that's his specialist position. But I agree now is a perfect time to groom someone else and preferably an enforcer type player (I've always said Hoeata could make a good 6 even though he plays lock at the moment) who can be intimidating on defence and also bring the ball up on attack. If Read is injured then chuck in Vito by all means at 8 where he has played for the Hurricanes. Laurie told me another player for the Canes to look out for at 6 but I can't remember his name.

Alan, Cowan was made to look a lot better simply by the dearth of choice at halfback for the ABs. He was a poor man's Justin Marshall with a dog of a pass. We have some young talent coming through now and hopefully they can prove themselves at halfback for us. We simply haven't been up to standard in this position for some time and as a perfectionist, like all AB supporters, I find this intolerable.

chewed_mintie wrote:Anotherworldofpain – I’m intrigued to know what your background is? You have quite a deep knowledge of all things black!

How is Wal by the way?

I make a post one time before explain! But I know I should make to the "profile" But I find out about it later only when a kind sir mention to me I even have one to teach about myself on! So by then I am a little tired and dont making the update.

I was exchange students to new zealand from croatia after my parents moving me there before there was the war, but original I was born in Japan even though my parents not! and also I live some time to Turkey. Makes for my languages all mix up. Sometimes when I trying to learn new one and settle in the culture I get so confuse that I think I don't speaking any language at all.

So anyway was new zealand my favourite because everyone so kind and all the time just party and play the rugby and surf and drinking the beer. Only I was not so good at rugby playing because is quite complicated if you dont growing up with this (also was a bit fat and slow) and so I watching and hearing about it and make a connection there.

KIa to be pedantic ,I have seen ALL the AllBlack Scrumhalves since Vince Bevan.Most have been of the 9 forward variety Bevan,Briscoe,Marshall and Kelleher as examples.There pass was`nt there strongest point Cowan would rate with them tho lesser admittedly.Des Connor was the best i`ve seen and that was with the Wallibies 1958.Laidlaw,Loveridge[especially] and Bachop were close.Syd Going a great runner but his passing game was so/so.Brendan Leonard and Kelleher were good circa 2007,indeed Kelleher was rated best in Europe only a couple of years ago.As to wings Savea will play right,Gear or Guildford left.Smith will cover Dagg,maybe wonder if Sam Cane will get a run at 7.

kiakahaaotearoa wrote: Laurie told me another player for the Canes to look out for at 6 but I can't remember his name.

That would be Brad Shields I imagine but its far to early for him IMO. I don't really see why he was invited to the squad. He can't get past Laeve yet for the number 6 jersey.

I would like to see Vito given decent run at 6 but he probably does not have enough mongrel in him so like the idea of Hoeata with Vito covering the back 3.

Retellick or whatever his name is is getting good reviews for lock. I don't mind Vito. For one with 2 degrees he's intelligent, and for his size athletic. he's also been there a bit longer than the newbies. He Read, Thompson and the boss cover the back row enough I reckon.

Watched the matches again and geez hard to split those 3 halfbacks- Smith, KB, and TJ P. all get in the faces of the opposition and all have a go.

I'm starting towards TJ P but Kerr Barlow has some nice urgency to him that rattles the opposition, and he organises the troops well.

Sit back and watch those 3 fight it out next few years. Ellis and the rest will be gone after Ireland. these guys are good!

Nice history there Alan. Never heard of Bevan so will have to do some research on them. Recognise the others you mentioned.

I think certain countries tend to produce certain players better than others. SA seems to produce top halfbacks at will. We tend to produce opensides organically. I agree that we have never really been blessed with zippy, attacking / running halfbacks. I remember fondly Graham Bachop (another great Canterbury man.) I feel not only was he underrated but he has been our best 'modern' halfback with Marshall and Kelleher below. Our halfbacks often tend to be an extra loose forward on defence but not ones who initiate line breaks.

These young guys offer hope though and you can't ask for much more than that at this stage.

Yeah hansen must be rapt after years of chopping and changing 9's.

First position to be renewed.

With carter back, cruden sbw and nonu all back on form we're as solid at 9, 10, 12 as weve been for a while now.

For me thats half the work done. The rest will come in the backs with those 3 postions firing

Ellis and Smith I reckon...Smith to start hopefully...

http://www.allblacks.com/news/19514/Smith-takes-care-of-Cowan-now-eyes-off-Ellis