So what did we all learn about the SH and NH teams this weekend ? ? ?

by maestegmafia Sat 09 Jun 2012, 6:00 pm

First topic message reminder :

New Zealand 42 - 10 (HT 23 - 3) Ireland

Tries:Savea 3, Thomson, Smith Tries:McFadden
Penalties:Carter 3 Penalties:Sexton
Conversions:Carter 4 Conversions:Sexton

Australia 27 - 19 (HT 10 - 3) Wales

Tries:
Higginbotham, Genia, McCabe Tries:Cuthbert
Penalties:Barnes Penalties:Halfpenny 4
Drop-goals:Barnes
Conversions:Barnes 3 Conversions:Halfpenny

South Africa 22 - 17 (HT 6 - 6) England

Tries:Steyn, de Villiers Tries:Foden
Penalties:Steyn 4 Penalties:Farrell 4

Pretty conclusive win by the Blacks over Ireland but Ireland did very well in the first half, new players looked good. But the ABs were sublime, making rugby look like the easiest game in the world.

Aussies really hit form, Wales were off colour, there is still a series here.

SA looked great in the 2nd third, made heaps of mistakes particularly goal kicking, but a strong scrum and great defending held out. This series is far from over if England can up their game, most likely be shuffling the squad for the match day team...

by maestegmafia Sun 10 Jun 2012, 9:31 am

majesticimperialman wrote:

Next week if, if, England and Wales are going to get a win, they will have to play a lot better than this week.

Some very profound stuff written there...! Its like reading an Oracle.

by **Biltong** Sun 10 Jun 2012, 9:33 am

The Oracle would also say, "I'll only tell you what you need to work out for yourself" Whistle

by thomh Sun 10 Jun 2012, 9:34 am

GeordieFalcon wrote:Elsewhere Marler showed why corbs is no.1

Care to elaborate? I thought Marler had a very good game. His side of the scrum held up well, he tackled, he carried and he won an amazing turnover on our own line.

by maestegmafia Sun 10 Jun 2012, 9:35 am

biltongbek wrote:

The Oracle would also say, "I'll only tell you what you need to work out for yourself"

Bill you are confusing an Oracle with Huggy Bear from Starsky and Hutch...

by **Biltong** Sun 10 Jun 2012, 9:45 am

by yappysnap Sun 10 Jun 2012, 9:55 am

The SH showed why they're the top three teams in the world and why we'll (the NH) only ever be scrabling for that fourth spot. Crying or Very sad

by Geordie Sun 10 Jun 2012, 9:56 am

TJ wrote:
GeordieFalcon wrote:...yet we still.nearly beat them.

.

Eh? what game wer you watching. Never looked like winning, SA were clearly the better team in all areas bar the breakdown in the first half.

England hardly created a chance and hardly made a break

Erm...the scoreline!

We were comprehensively ourmuscled but regardless we were a Couple of points shy....thats what I meant.

by **Biltong** Sun 10 Jun 2012, 10:05 am

Geordie, with all due respect, Steyn should have kicked another 5-8 points, we took a quick tap which I am sure Hougaard will be taken apart for, the scoreline was close, the match not so much.

by Geordie Sun 10 Jun 2012, 10:11 am

But he didnt....ifs and buts...
If we had a bigger pack we could have matched you.

Look ive said we were completely outplayed but for all that were still in it. Read into it,what u will...

by **Biltong** Sun 10 Jun 2012, 10:12 am

by Guest Sun 10 Jun 2012, 10:17 am

We learned that Wales need 40 mins ahead of the game to run around like headless chickens and put in some aimless kicks so that by kick off we won't be so blydi slow starters!

by maestegmafia Sun 10 Jun 2012, 10:19 am

GeordieFalcon wrote:But he didnt....ifs and buts...
If we had a bigger pack we could have matched you.

Look ive said we were completely outplayed but for all that were still in it. Read into it,what u will...

The first half England certainly were in it, second half they were only in it because Morne Steyn couldnt kick his goals.

by yappysnap Sun 10 Jun 2012, 10:21 am

maestegmafia wrote:
GeordieFalcon wrote:But he didnt....ifs and buts...
If we had a bigger pack we could have matched you.

Look ive said we were completely outplayed but for all that were still in it. Read into it,what u will...

The first half England certainly were in it, second half they were only in it because Morne Steyn couldnt kick his goals.

Or we were out of it because our backs can't pass...

by sugarNspikes Sun 10 Jun 2012, 10:23 am

maestegmafia wrote:
GeordieFalcon wrote:But he didnt....ifs and buts...
If we had a bigger pack we could have matched you.

Look ive said we were completely outplayed but for all that were still in it. Read into it,what u will...

The first half England certainly were in it, second half they were only in it because Morne Steyn couldnt kick his goals.

True to an extent. Steyn did leave a few points on the pitch. In a similar way Wales were lucky not to be 30 points down at half-time and well out of it.

It's tough for the NH over there so we have to take our chances when they are available. We're not doing that at the moment.

by ChequeredJersey Sun 10 Jun 2012, 10:25 am

Barritt and Tuilagi each passed once

by maestegmafia Sun 10 Jun 2012, 10:27 am

yappysnap wrote:
maestegmafia wrote:
GeordieFalcon wrote:But he didnt....ifs and buts...
If we had a bigger pack we could have matched you.

Look ive said we were completely outplayed but for all that were still in it. Read into it,what u will...

The first half England certainly were in it, second half they were only in it because Morne Steyn couldnt kick his goals.

Or we were out of it because our backs can't pass...

What are the better options at centre for England...???

All the players look very similar, none of whom are creative. Flood would be the best option, but he would also be the best option at flyhalf too.

I wonder if Foden might be a valuable trial at inside centre? England always looked good with a footballing creative centre like Greenwood or Catt rather than two muscular lads like Barritt and Tuilagi.

by thomh Sun 10 Jun 2012, 11:23 am

Yappysnap didn't say there were any necessarily - just that if you resort to ifs and buts then it can always be taken to extremes. If you can say 'England were only in it because Steyn missed kicks', then someone can just as fairly respond with a list of other things that England didn't do as well as they could.

by Geordie Sun 10 Jun 2012, 11:28 am

I actually like Barritt and Tuilagi.,..the problem is at 10.

A good attacking 10 like FLood would use these guys and put them into gaps...

Farrell is a MASSIVE problem at 10. Im not sure why he is being shoehorned in to every game.

If you are young enough you are good enough is my motto...BUT if your not good enough or ready.,..then you shouldnt be on the pitch.

Robshaw looked good...he is making that 7 shirt his own....

by kiakahaaotearoa Sun 10 Jun 2012, 11:54 am

I think for uncontested scrums we learnt that the call should be, crouch, touch, pause and hug. Hug

I think rankings are a fair reflection of teams' standings in world rugby. Points were on the offer and they weren't taken. You have to earn those victories though and none of the NH sides had an effective gameplan and good execution of it. But it's back to the drawing board and things can easily change. But change will be hard fought. To beat the best you need to play your best.

by doctor_grey Sun 10 Jun 2012, 12:04 pm

aucklandlaurie wrote:
And when we have uncontested scrums, why do we still have to have "crouch,touch,pause, engage'?

That's a real good point. Never thought of that before. Maybe should be "Stand, have tea, relax, come together lightly, stand politely".

by **Biltong** Sun 10 Jun 2012, 1:15 pm

Probably more something like this.

Ref" bend"
Ref"wait"
Ref" ready?"
frontrow "yes" (In a girly kinda voice)
Ref"lean"

by Heaf Sun 10 Jun 2012, 2:52 pm

GeordieFalcon wrote:But he didnt....ifs and buts...
If we had a bigger pack we could have matched you.

Look ive said we were completely outplayed but for all that were still in it. Read into it,what u will...

Precisely lots of if & buts ... Maybe if the officials had spotted the SA number 21 dropping the ball forwards a couple of phases before they went over for the first try or they had spotted the SA kick chasers being offside regularly ... Disappointing to lose of course but in the overall context of everything still plenty of things to be positive about compared to where we've been in the last few years

by **Biltong** Sun 10 Jun 2012, 3:00 pm

Oh my soul, this thread is going down hill faster than an unopened parachute.

by Bullsbok Sun 10 Jun 2012, 3:07 pm

Heaf wrote:
GeordieFalcon wrote:But he didnt....ifs and buts...
If we had a bigger pack we could have matched you.

Look ive said we were completely outplayed but for all that were still in it. Read into it,what u will...

Precisely lots of if & buts ... Maybe if the officials had spotted the SA number 21 dropping the ball forwards a couple of phases before they went over for the first try or they had spotted the SA kick chasers being offside regularly ... Disappointing to lose of course but in the overall context of everything still plenty of things to be positive about compared to where we've been in the last few years

In the same breath if only the officials had clamped down on the ridiculous flopping over the rucks by the english players. After watching 12 weeks of super rugby i had become accustomed to seeing clean efficient rucks not the messy free for all spectacle we endured yesterday. Certainly improved in the second half when Boks started flooding the rucks and going off their feet too

by **Biltong** Sun 10 Jun 2012, 3:11 pm

Ah, the belly flop.

One thing England got away with a hell of a lot yesterday was the way they negated our mauls, they would spiral in from the side, rolling along the side until they could split the maul, it worked every time and Walsh didn't penalise them once.

by kingjohn7 Sun 10 Jun 2012, 4:09 pm

Wales are flat track bullies.
Ireland need a miracle.
England need Flood.

Aus even missing a few 'star' players can play some great/clever rugby.
NZ are NZ
S.A are beasts but look a bit disjointed, I think they will improve the most out of all teams over next 2 weeks.
SH refs hate scrums.

Didnt see Argies v Italy.
Didnt see Scotland v Aus, but great result well done boys.

by Geordie Sun 10 Jun 2012, 4:21 pm

biltongbek wrote:Ah, the belly flop.

One thing England got away with a hell of a lot yesterday was the way they negated our mauls, they would spiral in from the side, rolling along the side until they could split the maul, it worked every time and Walsh didn't penalise them once.

Bilt

I truely believe he is the worst Referee...he baffled me at times with some decisions against both sides. Almost like he was making it up as he went along.

by kiakahaaotearoa Sun 10 Jun 2012, 4:28 pm

We make good rugby players but the flipside is that our refs are pretty woeful. You get the impression Steve Walsh fancies himself to play alongside the players he refs.

by **Biltong** Sun 10 Jun 2012, 4:47 pm

Geordie, I agree with you, at least the match wasn't decided by him.

Kia Bruce will not agree with you, neither will his dad. Whistle

by Geordie Sun 10 Jun 2012, 4:51 pm

Aw totally mate...i for one dont like blaming refs for defeats anyway...think its a cop out...if decisions are going against you...adapt your game so they dont go against you...

by Bullsbok Sun 10 Jun 2012, 4:51 pm

Hang on Didnt Walsh say you're doing some good fetching to Robshaw yesterday? i distinctly remember the commentators on sky having a chuckle about it Shocked

by **Biltong** Sun 10 Jun 2012, 4:56 pm

GeordieFalcon wrote:Aw totally mate...i for one dont like blaming refs for defeats anyway...think its a cop out...if decisions are going against you...adapt your game so they dont go against you...

Yeah, I don't like to use it either, did use it once though....long time ago. Whistle

by wales606 Sun 10 Jun 2012, 6:08 pm

biltongbek wrote:
GeordieFalcon wrote:Aw totally mate...i for one dont like blaming refs for defeats anyway...think its a cop out...if decisions are going against you...adapt your game so they dont go against you...

Yeah, I don't like to use it either, did use it once though....long time ago.

by **Biltong** Sun 10 Jun 2012, 6:10 pm

wales606 wrote:
biltongbek wrote:
GeordieFalcon wrote:Aw totally mate...i for one dont like blaming refs for defeats anyway...think its a cop out...if decisions are going against you...adapt your game so they dont go against you...

Yeah, I don't like to use it either, did use it once though....long time ago.

Why

you

laughing

it still hurts..

by wales606 Sun 10 Jun 2012, 6:16 pm

Bryce Lawrence still haunting your dreams?

ghost

by **Biltong** Sun 10 Jun 2012, 6:20 pm

Nah, but the revenge will be sweet in 2015. We'll simmer a little more and wait.

We did learn from it though, you complain like a housewife about the referee before he officiates your knock out match and then he leaves you be in the match. Whistle

by wales606 Sun 10 Jun 2012, 6:22 pm

Clearly we should try the same

So what did we all learn about the SH and NH teams this weekend ? ? ? - Page 2 Smiley-sport025

by **Biltong** Sun 10 Jun 2012, 6:25 pm

wales606 wrote:Clearly we should try the same

Nope , our lesson , our trick.

So what did we all learn about the SH and NH teams this weekend ? ? ? - Page 2 Smiley-taunt014

by wales606 Sun 10 Jun 2012, 6:39 pm

biltongbek wrote:
wales606 wrote:Clearly we should try the same

Nope , our lesson , our trick.

So what did we all learn about the SH and NH teams this weekend ? ? ? - Page 2 Smiley-sad055

by nganboy Mon 11 Jun 2012, 2:30 am

Why do some NH fans think SH don't like to scrum?
How often have NZ and SA or Arg hidden from the scrum? Its a weapon for us. Only Oz don't love it. Just because we use the ball when it comes out doesn't mean we don't like to scrum.

I find this silly talk so annoying.

By the way we also like defending!

by kiakahaaotearoa Mon 11 Jun 2012, 5:39 am

We also like winning. Hug

by **Biltong** Mon 11 Jun 2012, 6:42 am

And kicking Erm

by Guest Mon 11 Jun 2012, 6:45 am

Most of us do Kia

I've lost count of the number of kiwi sports journalists/radio/tv pundits that are gagging for an Irish win in the next two weeks so that the great BOD doesn't retire without an AB scalp and/or to end 100 years of Irish pain. How crazy is that?

It's like they're tired or feel guilty about winning against Ireland. One host on radiosport today was sick of 30 pt wins, what's that about!!?

by **Biltong** Mon 11 Jun 2012, 7:12 am

It's just a bit of nostalgia EBOP, it is their way of honouring an Irish great. Whistle

by Guest Mon 11 Jun 2012, 9:03 am

Nah biltong, we should send em packing with nothing but donuts to show, for old times sake thumbsup

Full respect to you though BOD, despite the spear tackle fiasco.

by anotherworldofpain Mon 11 Jun 2012, 12:40 pm

Yes and same journalists will be calling for axe to Hanson if it is happen. And they will call BOD "smug" and undeserving and criticise all blacks and not giving any credit to Ireland if is happening. There is the way journalism rugby work to New Zealand.

by The Great Aukster Mon 11 Jun 2012, 2:10 pm

EBOP wrote:Most of us do Kia

I've lost count of the number of
kiwi sports journalists/radio/tv pundits that are gagging for an Irish
win in the next two weeks so that the great BOD doesn't retire without
an AB scalp and/or to end 100 years of Irish pain. How crazy is that?

It's
like they're tired or feel guilty about winning against Ireland. One
host on radiosport today was sick of 30 pt wins, what's that
about!!?

Massive wins between 'tier one' nations show how much of a minority
sport Union is. The sport would be much healthier if there were even a
dozen competitive teams, and that would give the pundits something to
get excited about other than discussing how many points NZ will win by.
Realistically there is no logical reason to think Ireland will ever beat
the All Blacks. Ireland may have had fifteen players of All Black
quality, but the trouble is they've been spread over a hundred years!
There's no room for sentimentality in sport but it's probably fitting
the BOD ends his career knowing he was as least deemed good enough to
receive some "special" treatment.

Keith Wood was asked after a chastening defeat as Irish Captain if the
situation had become serious and he answered that the situation was
hopeless but not serious - sums it up fairly well!

by damngoodOvalball Mon 11 Jun 2012, 2:19 pm

anotherworldofpain wrote:Yes and same journalists will be calling for axe to Hanson if it is happen. And they will call BOD "smug" and undeserving and criticise all blacks and not giving any credit to Ireland if is happening. There is the way journalism rugby work to New Zealand.

That must have been so painful for you to write GG

by damngoodOvalball Mon 11 Jun 2012, 2:55 pm

We learnt that NZ and Australia (when Genia plays like that, at least) have very little to worry about and won't be losing any sleep about the rest including SA

by Ospreydragon Mon 11 Jun 2012, 4:24 pm

B Moore on Wales and TriNations sides:

"... Wales had the momentum necessary to fashion a win when they reduced the deficit to one point with more than 20 minutes to play. Whatever went before and however superior Australia had been, at that point Wales could and should have taken the game."

Source:

http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-union/union-news/trinations-sides-superior-to-home-nations-20120611-2056k.html

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