I have always been told....

...that everything you say before a "but" does not count.

I will disregard that on this occasion.

South Africa have been far too powerful and I hate picking on officials BUT the sheer incompetence of Steve Walsh in not seeing the ball come straight out of the tunnel does not help. The ref has no chance of knowing, but the TJ on that side has a perfect view.


Mutter, mutter.

Rant over.

You are right of course, IMO Rolland is allowing SA far too much freedom at the breakdown too, Robshaw has been nullified by Rolland.

There were a few poor decisions by the SH refs last week, and a few areas in which only one side is allowed to compete. But in reality SA are far stronger than England, as IMO Aus were far stronger than Wales too.

The ball didn't come out the tunnel, it came out behind the lock's feet.

Billtong, it was the flanks feet, no touch by a front rower means reset.

I always get told it's just us welsh that blame the ref.. Guess I was wrong.

Here we go

It was a pretty poor decision from Walsh, but it was still ENG fault... its so bad it can't even be counted as a rookie mistake.... if I was a coach of a U14 local club side and that happened I would clobber the hooker and his pack.

In case English fans get carried away dont forget Alan Rolland let Robshaw stay off the field when he blatantly took out hougaard on the goaline . Everyone including your commentators knew that was a professional foul and yellow card but he let him stay on . so suck it up

You'd then be arrested and rightly never let near a rugby pitch again

Bullsbok

As a neutral I totally disagree, for me Hougaards hands were on the ball and he was hit as all good 7's should. Should've been a knock on!

I don't want to hear it. No more comments on this thread please, let it die its unworthy death. SA were simply better.

Bullsbok wrote:In case English fans get carried away dont forget Alan Rolland let Robshaw stay off the field when he blatantly took out hougaard on the goaline . Everyone including your commentators knew that was a professional foul and yellow card but he let him stay on . so suck it up

oh if we're playing that game what about the attempted hanging of youngs on your line?

EDIT: I should point out that SA still deserved the win.

Can we try not to spoil the result of this match as well please. It is rugby, not ballet, there were niggles from both sides.

biltongbek wrote:Can we try not to spoil the result of this match as well please. It is rugby, not ballet, there were niggles from both sides.

which point of rugby is trying to rip someones head off?

nathan wrote:

biltongbek wrote:Can we try not to spoil the result of this match as well please. It is rugby, not ballet, there were niggles from both sides.

which point of rugby is trying to rip someones head off?

The point where a big man tackles a diving little man

Tell that to Warburton!!

Bullsbok wrote:

nathan wrote:

biltongbek wrote:Can we try not to spoil the result of this match as well please. It is rugby, not ballet, there were niggles from both sides.

which point of rugby is trying to rip someones head off?

The point where a big man tackles a diving little man

around the neck, which in rugby (which is what they were playing) is illegal and dangerous. I've lost a bit of respect for the SA team after the SA coach was laughing. Not what i would call in the spirit of the game.

Of course that's nothing against the fans or the SA public. I just hope the team don't buy into that attitude.

nathan wrote:

Bullsbok wrote:

nathan wrote:

biltongbek wrote:Can we try not to spoil the result of this match as well please. It is rugby, not ballet, there were niggles from both sides.

which point of rugby is trying to rip someones head off?

The point where a big man tackles a diving little man

around the neck, which in rugby (which is what they were playing) is illegal and dangerous. I've lost a bit of respect for the SA team after the SA coach was laughing. Not what i would call in the spirit of the game.

Of course that's nothing against the fans or the SA public. I just hope the team don't buy into that attitude.

Nathan it is not a team ethos to rip someone's head off, unfortunately it has been happening at ruck time, tackles mauls etc. SA are not the only ones doing it though, Etzebeth had a neck ring during a maul as well.

nathan wrote:

Bullsbok wrote:

nathan wrote:

biltongbek wrote:Can we try not to spoil the result of this match as well please. It is rugby, not ballet, there were niggles from both sides.

which point of rugby is trying to rip someones head off?

The point where a big man tackles a diving little man

around the neck, which in rugby (which is what they were playing) is illegal and dangerous. I've lost a bit of respect for the SA team after the SA coach was laughing. Not what i would call in the spirit of the game.

Of course that's nothing against the fans or the SA public. I just hope the team don't buy into that attitude.

aargh get over yourself , Willem Alberts didnt tackle Youngs around the neck on purpose . And im sure Waldrom mouthing off to JPP earlier then getting bounced into touch like a beach ball would amuse anyone .

Looseheaded wrote:I always get told it's just us welsh that blame the ref.. Guess I was wrong.

Nah, wasn't blaming the ref. I admitted SA were too poweful for us and they were. Thje correct team won. England made too many mistakes in the first 20 minutes.

On a forum I am allowed to rant sometimes though.

LondonTiger wrote:

Looseheaded wrote:I always get told it's just us welsh that blame the ref.. Guess I was wrong.

Nah, wasn't blaming the ref. I admitted SA were too poweful for us and they were. Thje correct team won. England made too many mistakes in the first 20 minutes.

On a forum I am allowed to rant sometimes though.

LT, I don't think that first 20 minutes was down to mistakes, SA was simply brilliant and very, very physical.

They were physical and direct and everything you expect.

Irrespective of what I think of Walsh's eyesight, allowing that ball to go straight through was a schoolboy mistake. England then proceeded to lose two line-outs to gift up possession which was criminal.

It was a very fast start by SA, but a slightly tighter display from England would perhaps have conceded 10-12 points not 22 in that time. Mind you without such a big lead, SA may have kept pushing.

Both sides made a lot of mistakes but I guess I concentrate on those made by my team. Waldrom failing to control the ball at the back of the scrum, dumb kicks at the end from Foden and Joseph when 4 pts down.

Will Meyer experiment next week in prep for 4Ns?

I think he might give Lambie a go at 10, need to try another backrow combo.

Bullsbok wrote:

nathan wrote:

Bullsbok wrote:

nathan wrote:

biltongbek wrote:Can we try not to spoil the result of this match as well please. It is rugby, not ballet, there were niggles from both sides.

which point of rugby is trying to rip someones head off?

The point where a big man tackles a diving little man

around the neck, which in rugby (which is what they were playing) is illegal and dangerous. I've lost a bit of respect for the SA team after the SA coach was laughing. Not what i would call in the spirit of the game.

Of course that's nothing against the fans or the SA public. I just hope the team don't buy into that attitude.

aargh get over yourself , Willem Alberts didnt tackle Youngs around the neck on purpose . And im sure Waldrom mouthing off to JPP earlier then getting bounced into touch like a beach ball would amuse anyone .

get over myself?! grow up mate. SA have always trod a fine line on legality, today and last week they crossed it on more than one occasion.

EDIT: Should point out i'm now moving on from this as i can't be arsed

nathan wrote:

Bullsbok wrote:

nathan wrote:

Bullsbok wrote:

nathan wrote:

biltongbek wrote:Can we try not to spoil the result of this match as well please. It is rugby, not ballet, there were niggles from both sides.

which point of rugby is trying to rip someones head off?

The point where a big man tackles a diving little man

around the neck, which in rugby (which is what they were playing) is illegal and dangerous. I've lost a bit of respect for the SA team after the SA coach was laughing. Not what i would call in the spirit of the game.

Of course that's nothing against the fans or the SA public. I just hope the team don't buy into that attitude.

aargh get over yourself , Willem Alberts didnt tackle Youngs around the neck on purpose . And im sure Waldrom mouthing off to JPP earlier then getting bounced into touch like a beach ball would amuse anyone .

get over myself?! grow up mate. SA have always trod a fine line on legality, today and last week they crossed it on more than one occasion.

boo hoo big bad african bullies were mean to the English Angels

Bullsbok wrote:

nathan wrote:

Bullsbok wrote:

nathan wrote:

Bullsbok wrote:

nathan wrote:

biltongbek wrote:Can we try not to spoil the result of this match as well please. It is rugby, not ballet, there were niggles from both sides.

which point of rugby is trying to rip someones head off?

The point where a big man tackles a diving little man

around the neck, which in rugby (which is what they were playing) is illegal and dangerous. I've lost a bit of respect for the SA team after the SA coach was laughing. Not what i would call in the spirit of the game.

Of course that's nothing against the fans or the SA public. I just hope the team don't buy into that attitude.

aargh get over yourself , Willem Alberts didnt tackle Youngs around the neck on purpose . And im sure Waldrom mouthing off to JPP earlier then getting bounced into touch like a beach ball would amuse anyone .

get over myself?! grow up mate. SA have always trod a fine line on legality, today and last week they crossed it on more than one occasion.

boo hoo big bad african bullies were mean to the English Angels

and there you have it, conformation on the need to grow up.

you lost fair and square grow a chin and take the loss like a man

Bullsbok wrote:you lost fair and square grow a chin and take the loss like a man

Correct we did lose fair and square. We also highlighted some serious weaknesses in the SA team that may be capitalised on by the 3 other teams in the 4Ns. The physical confromtation in Buenos Aries will be interesting.

LondonTiger wrote:

Bullsbok wrote:you lost fair and square grow a chin and take the loss like a man

Correct we did lose fair and square. We also highlighted some serious weaknesses in the SA team that may be capitalised on by the 3 other teams in the 4Ns. The physical confromtation in Buenos Aries will be interesting.

and they too have been exposed this weekend. I'm sure boks will deal with the other nations the same way we've dealt with them over the last decade

nathan wrote:

Bullsbok wrote:

nathan wrote:

Bullsbok wrote:

nathan wrote:

biltongbek wrote:Can we try not to spoil the result of this match as well please. It is rugby, not ballet, there were niggles from both sides.

which point of rugby is trying to rip someones head off?

The point where a big man tackles a diving little man

around the neck, which in rugby (which is what they were playing) is illegal and dangerous. I've lost a bit of respect for the SA team after the SA coach was laughing. Not what i would call in the spirit of the game.

Of course that's nothing against the fans or the SA public. I just hope the team don't buy into that attitude.

aargh get over yourself , Willem Alberts didnt tackle Youngs around the neck on purpose . And im sure Waldrom mouthing off to JPP earlier then getting bounced into touch like a beach ball would amuse anyone .

get over myself?! grow up mate. SA have always trod a fine line on legality, today and last week they crossed it on more than one occasion.

EDIT: Should point out i'm now moving on from this as i can't be arsed

This type of comment always irritates the s@&t out of me. This "Only the Boks are dirty" line is bull. When teams from Northern Hemisphere do it its all of a sudden "Hard rugby" or "manning up, rar rar"

It's fine protea, don't bother fighting it, we are dirty, monsters and english rugby players look under their beds at night before they go to sleep.

Nathan

I think you should listen to the rugby god which is PDV

"Why don't we go to the nearest ballet shop, get some tutus and get a dancing shop going? There will be no eye gouging, no tackling, no nothing, and we will enjoy it"

Jokes aside, it wasn't cynical. It was a penalty and I think ENG may have had reason to have had a penalty try and a penalty at the halfway line straight after but thats it.

These things happen all the time.. especially for forwards 15cm+ taller than some players like Alberts is Youngs.

ENG as of late probably have one of the worst discipline records of late and SA is actually quite fair... so I wouldn't throw stones in glass houses.

biltongbek wrote:It's fine protea, don't bother fighting it, we are dirty, monsters and english rugby players look under their beds at night before they go to sleep.

South Africa have always played a very physical brand of rugby. At times this has (in the past please note. not this year) too often overstepped the mark from physical to thuggish and with players like Johan Le Roux to psychotic. No country are a bunch of angels, but SA have been the most violent. Usually legal violence but often not.

Based on the variety of autobiogs I have read, from Sean Fitzpatrick to Phil Vickery (passing Danie Gerber on the way) players claim the most violent country they ever played against/in was SA, followed by France.

Thankfully as a result of all the cameras at games, there is no hiding place for thuggishness. This is to the benefit of SA rugby as when your guys are disciplined and concentrate on the game you are exceedingly hard to beat.

LT, sadly every time we win and there is anything remotely dirty we are once again reminded that we are the dirtiest country in rugby.

Tuilagi last week hit JdV with an elbow in the face, he still has the cut on his face, but we said nothing, perhaps we should make bigger issues about these things?

It's alright when it's against your lot though

Absolutely.

Even as a one eyed Bok supporter I know we are not angels but other countries trying to pass as angels, I dont think so. The 2009 lions tour still leave a bitter taste...

All teams have these silly tags though, I know I'm guilty of generalising. SA are labelled dirty, so they can play fair all game but one high tackle and the knives are out. Similarly, England are labelled boring; so we can play decent rugby for 79 minutes, but go up the jumper once and we're the world's most boring team again.

Personally love the Eng v SA encounter. It's a fixture that epitomises rugby in my opinion. Everyone has their own tastes - I love it.

Unfortunately I didn't get to see the England v SA game (I haven't seen SA play now since the WC. Must rectify that soon)

But it seems to have been a good game if the scoreboard and the tiny snippets I saw are anything to go by...I was too busy trying to defend the idea that Ireland actually playing decently against the world Champions wasn't a tragedy and a disaster for us of armageddon proportions!

Which is more incompetent : missing a technicality in something that wouldnt even be the refs main focus at that point
Or the inability to put a ball into a scrum and keep it there?

biltongbek wrote:LT, sadly every time we win and there is anything remotely dirty we are once again reminded that we are the dirtiest country in rugby.

Tuilagi last week hit JdV with an elbow in the face, he still has the cut on his face, but we said nothing, perhaps we should make bigger issues about these things?

I think deliberate foul play should always be brought up. I still think it ludicrous that Rougerie got away with gouging in the RWC final for instance.

The England team of 94 refused to comment about biting by Johan le Roux, trying to sort things out themselves. This led to the incident with Fitzpatrick.

If Manu deliberatley hit JDV with an elbow, he should be banned for a very long time.