SA vs England 3rd test: Build up, announcements and match thread.

by **Biltong** Wed 20 Jun 2012, 11:08 am

First topic message reminder :

England

A Goode; C Ashton, J Joseph, M Tuilagi, B Foden; T Flood, D Care; A Corbisiero, D Hartley (capt), D Cole, T Palmer, G Parling, T Johnson, J Haskell, T Waldrom.

Replacements : L Mears, J Marler, M Botha, P Dowson, L Dickson, O Farrell, B Barritt.

Lancaster said: “I am really pleased for Alex [Goode]. He has worked hard in training and has been pushing Mike Brown and Ben Foden close so we are looking forward to him bringing his footballing skills to this Test. Danny Care likewise has bided his time in a very competitive position, knuckled down and deserves his chance, as has James Haskell, who has played this season for the Highlanders at No 7.

“We felt that the pack got some momentum in the second half last week so we have gone for Alex [Corbisiero] and Tom [Palmer], but I am sure Joe Marler and Mo Botha can make an impact from the bench.

“The guys did the shirt proud in Potchefstroom on Tuesday and I have no doubt that the 22 involved on Saturday will rise to this final challenge as we look to end this almost 12-month season on a high.”

South Africa

Gio Aplon, JP Pietersen, Jean de Villiers, Wynand Olivier, Bryan Habana, Morne Steyn, Francois Hougaard; Tendai Mtawarira, Bismarck du Plessis, Jannie du Plessis, Eben Etzebeth, Juandre Kruger, Marcell Coetzee, Jaques Potgieter, Pierre Spies

Replacements: Adriaan Strauss, Werner Kruger, Flip van der Merwe, Ryan Kankowski, Ruan Pienaar, Elton Jantjies, Bjorn Basson

Looking at this team it loses a lot of physicality.

Comparing a first choice backrow of Schalk Burger, Juan smith and Willem Alberts to Jaque Potgieter, Marcell Coetzee and Pierre Spies it is clear that South Africa will have to play wider and take less contact in the ruck situation, if not England will easily be able to dominate the contest at the breakdown.

Looking at the midfield combination of Frans Steyn and Jean de Villiers compared to Wynand Olivier and Jean de Villiers it will be far inferior due to no creativity at all between the two midfielders, but also no kicking out of hand and defensively Olivier is weak.

Aplon at the back does add some creativity at 15, yet even though he is as gutsy as hell at 75 kg, he will be targeted by big runners.

All in all this will be a litmus test for this Bok team. One I sincerely hope they pass.

Problem is looking at the players out of this match be it injuries weddings etc. not having Coenie Oosthuizen, Andries Bekker, Willem Alberts, Schalk Burger, Juan Smith, Frans Steyn and Patrick Lambie makes this a decidedly easier test for England.

by thebluesmancometh Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:32 pm

Why is it SA, as Aus were are allowed a 3 second hanging on of the ball at every breakdown!!!

3 rucks in a row they should've been pinged there!!!

by Guest Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:32 pm

Is Chris Farley the new SA Hooker?

by nathan Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:33 pm

surely in at the side?

by trebellbobaggins Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:33 pm

It's as if they have twenty men on the pitch. They are so good they have multiple men every time we get the ball. It's masterwork, impossible to break down for us.

by thebluesmancometh Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:34 pm

AGAIN! Walsh you are watching 2 SA players off their feet holding the ball screaming at you... PENALISE THEM!

by trebellbobaggins Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:35 pm

Seems like Walsh has his orders.

Rugby is turning into a sham.

Safas are a machine Without him, they do not need him and it demeans them helping them.

by Rory_Gallagher Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:35 pm

It just shown the replay for the Kankowski tackle. He CLEARLY used both arms guys.

by nathan Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:35 pm

thebluesmancometh wrote:AGAIN! Walsh you are watching 2 SA players off their feet holding the ball screaming at you... PENALISE THEM!

He was looking the other way and when Ashton had a word with him, Walsh told him to shut up. Remind me again why he's allowed to ref international level.

by thebluesmancometh Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:36 pm

I am truly baffled, how can the NH teams compete when the SH teams are given so much freedom at the breakdown?!

by thebluesmancometh Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:37 pm

nathan

I thought I heard that too, but the 2 SA forwards are on their backs, holding the ball and have eye contact with Walsh, why does he think they are legal?!

by Rory_Gallagher Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:38 pm

thebluesmancometh wrote:I am truly baffled, how can the NH teams compete when the SH teams are given so much freedom at the breakdown?!

Seriously, it is just as bad for both sides. Referees do not show bias, and they are human, so they are prone to inconsistency. This isn't a NH vs SH thing though. I am sick to death of the referees getting blamed on these forums.

by nathan Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:39 pm

Rory_Gallagher wrote:
thebluesmancometh wrote:I am truly baffled, how can the NH teams compete when the SH teams are given so much freedom at the breakdown?!

Seriously, it is just as bad for both sides. Referees do not show bias, and they are human, so they are prone to inconsistency. This isn't a NH vs SH thing though. I am sick to death of the referees getting blamed on these forums.

lol, never thought i'd hear the day someone sticks up for Walsh

by timhen Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:40 pm

I don't want to see us just try and hang on here, we've got to do more than try and pull the shutters down. I can live with losing if we give it our all.

by trebellbobaggins Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:40 pm

Oh Walsh is pathetic, come off it, worse out there.

Other refs maybe but come on,

by thebluesmancometh Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:41 pm

Rory

Bull!!! The SH refs play to their own bias, and the SH teams very much enjoy the better of the breakdown under them. There is a case of us not getting to grips with them also, but even as a neutral I am baffled by the majority of the decisions!

by GLove39 Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:41 pm

Steyn misses a drop gaol. That's 14 ponts he's missed today

by Rory_Gallagher Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:41 pm

This isn't sticking up for Walsh, you are reading what you want to read. The idea that a referee is biased towards ANY side is ludicrous. If you saw the Ireland match, McCaw was playing on the wrong side of the law for most of the game, but that is just how it goes. He is the master of it. Referees are inconsistent (Walsh especially) but he is bad for BOTH teams.

by maestegmafia Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:42 pm

14-14 game on

by Rory_Gallagher Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:42 pm

I can't believe people honestly think there is bias here from the referee. picard

by trebellbobaggins Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:42 pm

Bad error from eng there.

by thebluesmancometh Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:43 pm

Of course theres a bias! Their interpretations of the laws is their bias!!!!

Don't be so niaive Rory!

by nathan Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:43 pm

Come on England!

by maestegmafia Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:43 pm

On a knife edge here..!

by mystiroakey Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:44 pm

Sweet come on England get a chance at drop goal

by trebellbobaggins Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:45 pm

Safa defence is like a mountain, massive respect to them.

by Rory_Gallagher Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:45 pm

thebluesmancometh wrote:Of course theres a bias! Their interpretations of the laws is their bias!!!!

Don't be so niaive Rory!

Their interpretations of the law apply for BOTH teams though. There is no flipping bias.

It isn't me being naive here. I think it is extremely foolish to genuinely believe a referee is biased towards a team.

by nathan Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:45 pm

how many SA players on the wrong side!!

by nathan Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:46 pm

chip over the top!

by nathan Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:46 pm

awful farrell

by Rory_Gallagher Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:47 pm

Wow. That was.. not a good kick.

by nathan Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:48 pm

Rory_Gallagher wrote:
thebluesmancometh wrote:Of course theres a bias! Their interpretations of the laws is their bias!!!!

Don't be so niaive Rory!

Their interpretations of the law apply for BOTH teams though. There is no flipping bias.

It isn't me being naive here. I think it is extremely foolish to genuinely believe a referee is biased towards a team.

i think bias isnt the right word. A SA ref ref's the game differently to NH refs.

by Guest Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:48 pm

14-14

Good draw for England there clap

a huge improvement from last week and that was a tough old battle out there. I enjoyed it

Just a comment about SA though - specifically Morne Steyn: what the hell has happened to his kicking?? 14 points he left out there on the pitch today!

by Hood83 Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:48 pm

Much better from the ball carriers...Farrell, bar the nice dummy and break, was exactly as I feared...abject.

by maestegmafia Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:48 pm

14-14 all what a disappointment...!

by welshy6 Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:48 pm

boring match, steyn shocking with the boot, should have let pienar kick when he came on, 2nd test match was the highlight of this series

by mystiroakey Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:48 pm

Ermm .England should have done that really..

by thebluesmancometh Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:49 pm

Of course the Sh teams are getting the rub of the green! I generally don't like to talk about refs but the last few weeks have been absolutely shocking! Their bias has given the SH teams near domination at the breakdown!

A bit of a whimper from England there to finish, should've just kept plugging away!

Poor end but decent result from England.

by nathan Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:49 pm

maestegmafia wrote:14-14 all what a disappointment...!

i'd take 60-0 is more of a disappointment! Yahoo

by timhen Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:50 pm

Not a great game, sloppy play and errors abound from both sides. We did front up better than previous weeks and the draw is better than a loss, but plenty to work on.

by doctornickolas Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:50 pm

well a draw was a fair result in the end ..... both sides were equally inept!

South Africa were dreadful and made so many uncharacteristic mistakes and Steyn had his worst game ever. They were lucky they were only playing England.

by maestegmafia Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:51 pm

How many points did SA miss at goal?

Reading through the live text the South Africans must be very annoyed.

Well done England for staying in there...!

by Duty281 Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:51 pm

England, the best team in the NH, have battled to a highly credible draw, Disappointing that we lost 2-0 but the lads are inexperienced. When the AIs roll around, I think we can beat Australia and South Africa.

by **Biltong** Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:51 pm

Congratulations to England, your forwards were massive today, in my view you dominated the breakdowns, we never got quick ball, Alberts was seriously missed, but it just shows Spies can only operate in Space, Potgieter didn't impress at all

by wales606 Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:52 pm

I said last week that Pienaar should have started for his place kicking, looks like I was right.

Morne Steyn has gone from winning SA games with his boot, to losing them. The coaches should not have let him carry on kicking in the 3rd test.

Very dull game for a neutral, neither side deserved to win in the end. SA missed Alberts and Frans, and taking Bismark off was another stupid decision. England replaced Youngs and Robshaw better than SA replaced Alberts.

by Hood83 Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:53 pm

Who would the Boks fans like to see at 10?

by thebluesmancometh Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:53 pm

England, the best team in the NH

in my view you dominated the breakdowns

WTF?!

Firstly the best team in the NH is Wales. SA were allowed anything they wanted at the breakdown, how did England dominate?!

by stormers1 Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:54 pm

Well played England, you deserved to win this.

by nathan Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:54 pm

nice comment there. England played really well, we played rubbish...

by trebellbobaggins Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:54 pm

Farrell can't do drop goals.

Shame but a draw can be very respected down there.

Well done England and Lancaster.

Lots of promise for the future right now.

by timhen Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:54 pm

Jesus, is the guy interviewing Buzzsaw from The Running Man?

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Who will win and by how much?