Kevin Mealamu

First topic message reminder :

Was exceptional good when he come on for the all blacks. It seem to be not mention by anyone. Since so many Blues player getting crucified maybe is not popular to mention.

He seem so fit and also keep up with the low body driving position and lot of energy to hit the ruck despite the age.

A true great of the game! Well done Kevin!

anotherworldofpain wrote:"British and Irish Lions coach Sir Clive Woodward admitted his side had lost to an 'outstanding' New Zealand team. The Lions were overcome 48-18 in the second Test in Wellington to go 2-0 down and lose the series. "

Yes. How arrogant.

Watch that clip as you put some salt on those words of yours mate.

I wanted to smack Woodward before he came Lions coach!

Thomond wrote:I wanted to smack Woodward before he came Lions coach!

I wanted to smack him after.

I want to smack him now after just watching that interview in that clip

disneychilly wrote:You don't want to buy a Balotelli. He's probably worth more than the AB team combined.

Oh the shirt?

Remember Graeme Hughes commentating when we stuffed Aussie. "to McCracken! McCracken will score in the corner! Ettingshausen! What a try!" Poor bugger.

Summing up the tackle IMO. It was bloody reckless and deserved a suspension. It was NOT malicious or premeditated. Nothing to do with the haka response. BOD was NOT good enough to merit that kind of attention.

Sucks that Alistair Campbell's name pops up more in talk about that series than Dan Carter. Agree with EBOP, both camps treatment of the issue left a lot to be desired.

I was hoping that Woodward would have some lemons to suck on. Couldn't believe how arrogant he was after the 48-18 rout.

. Nah I don't reckon Balotelli would be that good at rugby. Also, have you seen Carter score football goals from the corner with a rugby ball? Reckon he'd be a decent Footie player

disneychilly wrote:

anotherworldofpain wrote:"British and Irish Lions coach Sir Clive Woodward admitted his side had lost to an 'outstanding' New Zealand team. The Lions were overcome 48-18 in the second Test in Wellington to go 2-0 down and lose the series. "

Yes. How arrogant.

Watch that clip as you put some salt on those words of yours mate.

Crikey. "I don't know the final score" "The ball hitting the post was a crucial moment" "We just got on the wrong side of the score board" "They're not a better team" "We deserved more than we got".

You are right and I was wrong! What a dick.

As for Woodward, thanks for the RWC but the backseat coaching is getting tiring now. I'm sure Gatland doesn't want your advice on how to run a Lions tour, seeing as we are all getting a reminder of how the one you coached actually went (hint- is a word that begins with "a", does not mean well and rhymes with "Schmabyssmally")

Funny, those were the quotes that stand out ay AWoP. I thought the lions had won half way through that interview.

He said they'd lost key players, and fair call.

I think we all want to smack Clive.............he's eminantly smackable..........

He was lucky Martin Johnson coached that team to to win the 2003 RWC.....got him a knighthood and all !!

The tandem moment of defenseless tackling between Henson and Shane Williams at 29:10 probably was the turning moment in the whole game to my mind. They were weak links in the defensive line that kept getting exploited by Umaga, Carter, Mauger and Sivivatu.

At the start of the match, two New Zealand players picked up the B&I captain, best player and biggest threat, off the ball, turned him upside down and drove him head first into the ground. The idea that they weren't targeting him is laughable.

They didn't intend to injure him. But they did intend to rough him up, to physically intimidate the Lions by targeting their star player. It was one of the uglier incidents seen on a rugby field over the last decade. It badly injured him and obviously could have broken his neck.

I think Kiwi's have collectively demonized BOD rather than admit that what their players did didn't reflect well on the All Blacks. How dare he make the All Blacks look bad by getting so badly injured by the spear tackle. As if it's his fault.

Feckless Rogue wrote:At the start of the match, two New Zealand players picked up the B&I captain, best player and biggest threat, off the ball, turned him upside down and drove him head first into the ground. The idea that they weren't targeting him is laughable.

They didn't intend to injure him. But they did intend to rough him up, to physically intimidate the Lions by targeting their star player. It was one of the uglier incidents seen on a rugby field over the last decade. It badly injured him and obviously could have broken his neck.

I think Kiwi's have collectively demonized BOD rather than admit that what their players did didn't reflect well on the All Blacks. How dare he make the All Blacks look bad by getting so badly injured by the spear tackle. As if it's his fault.

On youtube i was actually debating with a NZ fan about this and this is what he said "i wish they had killed him" Disgraceful isnt it.

Jesus Feckless have you read any of what we've written on here? You make it sound as if we condoned it. Stop trying to tar us all with the same brush. I've read Irish posters condoning Heaslip kneeing McCaw in the head. That doesn't mean that I think the rest of you are as idiotic. LF4L you came across a very small minority there (hopefully of 1) and a minority I and I'm sure the rest of the Kiwi posters want nothing to do with.

Targeting someone and going out to take someone out of the game with injury are two completely different things. We targeted O'Connell too. Watch the first test lineout disintegrate.

BOD was not anywhere near good enough to make a difference in those games. You got three hidings. Campbell and Woodward went out of their way to cover up the incompetence of the backroom staff by demonising the All Blacks, dragging culture into it and implying it would have been a different story had BOD not been hurt.

I don't think anyone thinks that BOD could have made the tour any less of a mauling. We basically were outclassed in every facet

Feckless Rogue wrote:At the start of the match, two New Zealand players picked up the B&I captain, best player and biggest threat, off the ball, turned him upside down and drove him head first into the ground. The idea that they weren't targeting him is laughable.

They didn't intend to injure him. But they did intend to rough him up, to physically intimidate the Lions by targeting their star player. It was one of the uglier incidents seen on a rugby field over the last decade. It badly injured him and obviously could have broken his neck.

I think Kiwi's have collectively demonized BOD rather than admit that what their players did didn't reflect well on the All Blacks. How dare he make the All Blacks look bad by getting so badly injured by the spear tackle. As if it's his fault.

How LUCKY for their PLAN that BOD happened to join that first ruck of the game and his loose forwards deserted him and left him in a ruck alone with KM and TU then! Wow, did he get a copy of the script for PLAN Feckless?

Good shout AWOP.......

Are you saying Neil Back was in on it!

I would've be surprised Rodders if SCW had asked the ENG lads to leave him vulnerable to the ruck so that he might injury and Allistair Campbell could spin a story about KM & TU being some players of mass destruction and make the "Plan" story. After all, they did admitting that SCW and AC made the idea to have BOD "respond" to the Haka. That's all I am saying...

anotherworldofpain wrote:I would've be surprised Rodders if SCW had asked the ENG lads to leave him vulnerable to the ruck so that he might injury and Allistair Campbell could spin a story about KM & TU being some players of mass destruction and make the "Plan" story. After all, they did admitting that SCW and AC made the idea to have BOD "respond" to the Haka. That's all I am saying...

The Willie Anderson led Irish Teams "response" to the Haka in 1989 was the best one ive seen.....but of course the IRB have now stopped teams doing antything to upset the All Blacks
and teams must stand a certain distance away and do nothing and not advance..............i think France may have been fined for moving forward on it at the RWC Final.

Of course if teams totally ignored the "Haka" it would rid us of that silly spectacle once and for all.........but they are not allowed..........

I don't think so. The all blacks would do it anyway. Campese try to ignore it already. But clealy you get frustrate by it, so it must be work!!

anotherworldofpain wrote:I don't think so. The all blacks would do it anyway. Campese try to ignore it already. But clealy you get frustrate by it, so it must be work!!

I have a love/hate relationship with it!! Personally, i would love to see one day a team ignoring it and doing a drill at the opposite end of the field, just to see how mad everyone would get!!!

Each to their own John. You may not like it but a hell of a lot of people do. It's in the eye of the beholder but remember it is a part of NZ culture so it is a bit disrespectful to label it silly. I'm not one of those sanctimonious people who want utter reverence towards it-I don't really care what teams do (though I admit I love it when teams challenge it)-but please don't criticise culture despite how commercialised it may become.

Also remember it is the idiocy of the IRB that put in place those rules. Not us.

Aussie ignored it numerous times in the 90s. They invariably got thumped after though.

Everyone mad among the opposition fans after their team gets humped by the ABs. I've always felt winning is the best response to the haka.

I prefer they get rid of national anthems. Does any one care, I find it silly and boring and a stupid spectacle, also get rid of all the palafel of the shaking hands with dignitaries, meeting Princess Anne, being introduced to the Taoiseach, having small children escort players out to the middle, black arm bands, 5 minutes silence, marching bands, cheerleaders and all the other nonsense guff that happen before and during games.

If you make the argument, then the Haka can go, but otherwise it's just as validate as the other things and happens.

anotherworldofpain wrote:I prefer they get rid of national anthems. Does any one care, I find it silly and boring and a stupid spectacle, also get rid of all the palafel of the shaking hands with dignitaries, meeting Princess Anne, being introduced to the Taoiseach, having small children escort players out to the middle, black arm bands, 5 minutes silence, marching bands, cheerleaders and all the other nonsense guff that happen before and during games.

If you make the argument, then the Haka can go, but otherwise it's just as validate as the other things and happens.

Don't get me wrong......i want the Haka to stay if NZ want to keep doing it.
I just think the opposing teams response to it should be optional.........

Don't like stage managed stuff..........

You don't think Anthems are stage managed? Do you think teams should be freedom to "respond" to the opposition anthem?

anotherworldofpain wrote:You don't think Anthems are stage managed? Do you think teams should be freedom to "respond" to the opposition anthem?

Ive no problem with Anthems at all.........once there is one for each team - incidentally, disagree when Ireland play 2 at Home games. IRFU should have the guts to dispense with Amhran na Bhfiann and just play Irelands Call instead. I know a lot of people call for the opposite but i think that shows huge disrespect to people who are from NI and Amhran na Bhfiann is NOT their national anthem.........................

As long as the Irish PM doesn't have to walk on the grass when England come to town, I say Haka away.

John Cregan wrote:

anotherworldofpain wrote:You don't think Anthems are stage managed? Do you think teams should be freedom to "respond" to the opposition anthem?

Ive no problem with Anthems at all.........once there is one for each team - incidentally, disagree when Ireland play 2 at Home games. IRFU should have the guts to dispense with Amhran na Bhfiann and just play Irelands Call instead. I know a lot of people call for the opposite but i think that shows huge disrespect to people who are from NI and Amhran na Bhfiann is NOT their national anthem.........................

It is exactly my point that you dont have a problem with the anthems.

Can't you see how trap in your own cultural perspective you are? Nice British anthems with respectful standing in line and singing, one each and in the right order. It's a PROTOCOL that you are comfortable with because of your culture. Haka = same in that is PROTOCOL, but you don't understanding it and so instead of understand and accept you label it "silly" and want to get rid of.

anotherworldofpain wrote:

John Cregan wrote:

anotherworldofpain wrote:You don't think Anthems are stage managed? Do you think teams should be freedom to "respond" to the opposition anthem?

Ive no problem with Anthems at all.........once there is one for each team - incidentally, disagree when Ireland play 2 at Home games. IRFU should have the guts to dispense with Amhran na Bhfiann and just play Irelands Call instead. I know a lot of people call for the opposite but i think that shows huge disrespect to people who are from NI and Amhran na Bhfiann is NOT their national anthem.........................

It is exactly my point that you dont have a problem with the anthems.

Can't you see how trap in your own cultural perspective you are? Nice British anthems with respectful standing in line and singing, one each and in the right order. It's a PROTOCOL that you are comfortable with because of your culture. Haka = same in that is PROTOCOL, but you don't understanding it and so instead of understand and accept you label it "silly" and want to get rid of.

I don't want to get rid of it!!

The Anthems are 1 a side so that's fine and fair.........the Haka should be optional for the opposition as to whether they want to face it, turn their backsides to it or do their own dance if they want...........im thinking BOD in a Michael Flatley wig with O'Connell as Jean Butler doing the Riverdance hell for leather............

Anthems and being "1 aside" making them "fine and fair" is your cultural protocol. Can you understand that?

What you want to do is Europeanise the Haka until it is acceptable to you. Instead of you accepting it and understanding that your discomfort around it is derived from it's origin in a culture you don't understand.

I don't want to change the HAKA at all. if they want to do it let them off. Why do i need to keep saying that.

What i disagree with is that the IRB have told opposing teams what to do during it. If Johnny Sexton wants to spend the last few minutes before a big game discussing tactics with his scrum half he should be allowed to do so.............if he enjoys the cultural experience he thinks he'll get from the Haka, then he can watch it if he so wishes......................

You keep changing your argument. I'll take that as you accept you were wrong.

Thanks.

LOL AWOP, why on earth would you put a harmless high in tackle (Powell) in comparison with a potential career-ending, off-the-ball spear tackle? And I see you were schooled in NZ (because you said it); so why don't you drop the act now and carry on discussing your teams rugby?

If you were schooled in NZ how do you not have good English? I enjoy the Haka but agree with John if the whole point of the Haka is to intimidate people why do the players have to pay attention to it? Let them do what they want, be it watch it or kick a ball around whatever.

My point...

I thought the IRB banned teams from crossing the half way line during the haka. If Sexton wants to discuss tactics with his scrum half he can...in his own half.

I think it was a women's side in Australia that was fined.

so we've gone from discussing Keven to talking about the BOD incident, and now onto yet another haka debate.

Anyone want to bring up poaching and sealing off the ruck area? I'm sure there will be lots of takers...

Thomond wrote:If you were schooled in NZ how do you not have good English? I enjoy the Haka but agree with John if the whole point of the Haka is to intimidate people why do the players have to pay attention to it? Let them do what they want, be it watch it or kick a ball around whatever.

I was there only on 6th form and 7th form and was not spending too much time in the classroom! also there is no teaching some grammar in this level because English is not compulsory! and some clever foreign student prefer to take the other topics In life sometimes we miss the opportunity and must make the mends for it in adult life!

The Haka is not to intimidate. It is to challenge. There is protocol for Haka in the same way there is protocol for anthems. Why can't the other team go kick the ball around while they play GSTQ?

Choking too-then we've covered everything Stephen Jones wants to talk about regarding NZ rugby.

Ah Disney, you forgot Richie McCaws a cheat.

Oh the whole team is Laurie. It's not that we can play rugby or anything.

Thomond wrote:If you were schooled in NZ how do you not have good English? I enjoy the Haka but agree with John if the whole point of the Haka is to intimidate people why do the players have to pay attention to it? Let them do what they want, be it watch it or kick a ball around whatever.

A. AWOP's English has come along in leaps and bounds since he's been associating with us here,Just goes to show what a bit of hard work and committment will do, His rugby knowledge has improved immensely as well I think its got something to do with the way that he looks to the New Zealanders/ New Zealand for inspiration and guidance.

disneychilly wrote:Oh the whole team is Laurie. It's not that we can play rugby or anything.

To pass a comment on Kev the Rev, one could just about get moderated for being off topic.

Feckless Rogue wrote:At the start of the match, two New Zealand players picked up the B&I captain, best player and biggest threat, off the ball, turned him upside down and drove him head first into the ground. The idea that they weren't targeting him is laughable.

They didn't intend to injure him. But they did intend to rough him up, to physically intimidate the Lions by targeting their star player. It was one of the uglier incidents seen on a rugby field over the last decade. It badly injured him and obviously could have broken his neck.

I think Kiwi's have collectively demonized BOD rather than admit that what their players did didn't reflect well on the All Blacks. How dare he make the All Blacks look bad by getting so badly injured by the spear tackle. As if it's his fault.

Wholeheartedly agree with this.

It seems quite a few Kiwi fans seem to think Mealamu and Umaga did nothing wrong.

Humility is an alien concept though. I suppose supporting the best side in the world makes you like this.

New Zealand players can do no wrong. They don't push the laws to the limit at the breakdown and they never ever dump players on their heads.

Umaga and Mealamu: "It's not our BOD accidentally fell on his head. We were trying to bring him to the ground gently but his legs were in the air."

Beshocked
tell me if an Irish Kangaroo court could get their hands on Mealamu and Umanga, do you think they would put them before a firing squad or hang them or both?

When in the hell did we condone it Beshocked?

anotherworldofpain wrote:Anthems and being "1 aside" making them "fine and fair" is your cultural protocol. Can you understand that?

What you want to do is Europeanise the Haka until it is acceptable to you. Instead of you accepting it and understanding that your discomfort around it is derived from it's origin in a culture you don't understand.

So, by the same token, AWOP, would it in your view be PROTOCOL to not permit teams any response to the challenge laid down by the haka? That would seem a little one-sided, no? Plus isn't the haka itself an evolving tradition, in terms of how it is conducted, where it is conducted, etc.?

aucklandlaurie sigh is any criticism of two saints of Kiwi rugby allowed?

When M.Tuilagi punched C. Ashton in a more recent incident in the AP. M.Tuilagi apologised and they patched up their differences.

Did Mealamu and Umaga apologise even? I don't think they have.

An apology might not sound like much but it's an admittance of wrong doing and would show some maturity and humility.

Did Mealamu apologise when he headbutted Moody?

aucklandlaurie wrote:

Beshocked
tell me if an Irish Kangaroo court could get their hands on Mealamu and Umanga, do you think they would put them before a firing squad or hang them or both?

I wouldn't have thought it would be fairly obvious to a kangeroo court of any nationality what does and doesn't constitute dangerous and foul play.