The Dew Drop Inn Virtual Rugby Pub, Oxford

First topic message reminder :

Hello and welcome to the Virtual Rugby Pub - a place where you can come in for a sly beverage and discuss whatever's on your mind, or just eavesdrop on the regulars if you fancy a break from all the rugby chat.

The Pub has made it's way to Oxford - the new location for newly promoted London Welsh.

The only rule in this pub is one of mutual respect for everyone in it, oh and no tampering with the montage of pictures of Lyn Jones above the bar.




Old Pub: https://www.606v2.com/t31486-the-dew-drop-inn-virtual-rugby-pub-beal-feirste

Don’t hate Monday’s, make Monday’s hate YOU!

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/phoenix-park-stabbings-man-to-appear-in-court-today-charged-with-attacks-that-left-9-wounded-3161867.html

Didn't hear any reports of fighting at Florence and the Machine/Snow Patrol last night. Not surprised there was trouble at this one though, i hear (the bad) half of Tallaght was at it.

One for the wall:

https://www.606v2.com/t32246-driving-music#1381562

Morning all!! Already in lovely Risca this morning for a meeting with KFC, wonder if Rev'll make an appearance for chicken....

Be careful up there Prop, you might catch something.

I've got a gas mask on don't worry lucky!!

I don't usually mind mondays but I actually had to punch myself this morning to shift myself from under the duvet. I shouldn't have worried, the schools are off and there is a severe lack of 4x4's being badly driven on the roads, all is well

This doesn't make good reading:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-18765754

ah Lucky, welcome to all Scarlet supporters' worlds. You'll get articles like this from time to time but I shouldn't worry about it too much.

Dragons are a lot closer to breaking even then any of the other regions and as the articles says a lot of your loss is due to the building of the new stand. You guys will be fine

although I',m not quite sure why they have Scarlets down as being £5.5million in debt when we really aren't. The inaccuracies of the Beeb!

And morning all hope everyone's well

Pete/Ozzie, I saw this and thought of you

Spoiler:

I'm very well thanks, Dreamer, although I don't know what I'll do with myself later on. No football, no tennis - no nothing!

Weird feeling isn't it? I've still got the TdF today (although it's started already so will be over early on I think) but tomorrow is their rest day which means - no sport!

WillyGilly wrote:I'm absolutely gutted. Flip Roger Federer.

I felt for Murray in the end even though I was watching on time delay, I think that fall hurt him a bit but you have to wonder about his conditioning and fitness coaches, he gave a lot in the first two sets and he looked absolutely spent in the 4th set. Fedex is 7 years older than him like, and he was fine. Murray played very well in the first 2 sets, and should his class he just couldn't maintain it, it might be partially a fitness issue who knows. Federer looked in trouble in the second set and then bang wins the set unreal. He coasted there after, watched it on time delay, due to a soccer match and all I will say is we were robbed by "de Boez", feicing joke.

Thomond, Andrew 'Sometimes sorry makes everything okay'* Castle was saying in commentary in the first or second set that Federer looked tired, and that there was 'no chance' of Murray getting tired because of his conditioning regime. Now I don't believe in jinxing, but it was a stupid thing to say so early in the match.

* - a line from the injury claims advert he's 'starring' in at the moment.

Mickado wrote:http://www.independent.ie/national-news/phoenix-park-stabbings-man-to-appear-in-court-today-charged-with-attacks-that-left-9-wounded-3161867.html

Didn't hear any reports of fighting at Florence and the Machine/Snow Patrol last night. Not surprised there was trouble at this one though, i hear (the bad) half of Tallaght was at it.

My brother was at the concert Micko, he and his mates are alright thankfully, dsaid there was a fair bit of hassle, drink and drugs all over the place and a fair bit of fighting. I suppose dance music attracts that sort a bit. I would have gone to see Snoop Dogg though!

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:Thomond, Andrew 'Sometimes sorry makes everything okay'* Castle was saying in commentary in the first or second set that Federer looked tired, and that there was 'no chance' of Murray getting tired because of his conditioning regime. Now I don't believe in jinxing, but it was a stupid thing to say so early in the match.

* - a line from the injury claims advert he's 'starring' in at the moment.

Not convinced either way. I watched the match, when the commentator made those remarks Murray was in the ascendancy. He looked fresh and Federer looked tired, although nowhere near as much as the hysterical and hyperbolic BBC commentator seemed to think. In the fourth set he was being dominated and the roles were reversed.

Overcoming fatigue is a mental challenge as well as a physical one. It's a lot harder when you're losing. Not convinced there's anything wrong with Murrays conditioning programme or that Federer is in anything less than the best possible shape he could be for a 31-year old athlete. I would say the mental side of things had as much of an impact on the fine balance as any training regime.

Thomond wrote:

WillyGilly wrote:I'm absolutely gutted. Flip Roger Federer.

I felt for Murray in the end even though I was watching on time delay, I think that fall hurt him a bit but you have to wonder about his conditioning and fitness coaches, he gave a lot in the first two sets and he looked absolutely spent in the 4th set. Fedex is 7 years older than him like, and he was fine. Murray played very well in the first 2 sets, and should his class he just couldn't maintain it, it might be partially a fitness issue who knows. Federer looked in trouble in the second set and then bang wins the set unreal. He coasted there after, watched it on time delay, due to a soccer match and all I will say is we were robbed by "de Boez", feicing joke.

Funny you should say that, I was at the Physio this morning and he was convinced that from the way he was climbing the steps he had an ankle problem and that the heavy strapping was limiting his stability.

Thomond wrote:

Mickado wrote:http://www.independent.ie/national-news/phoenix-park-stabbings-man-to-appear-in-court-today-charged-with-attacks-that-left-9-wounded-3161867.html

Didn't hear any reports of fighting at Florence and the Machine/Snow Patrol last night. Not surprised there was trouble at this one though, i hear (the bad) half of Tallaght was at it.

My brother was at the concert Micko, he and his mates are alright thankfully, dsaid there was a fair bit of hassle, drink and drugs all over the place and a fair bit of fighting. I suppose dance music attracts that sort a bit. I would have gone to see Snoop Dogg though!

I've seen clips on youtube of lads brawling at it, couldn't enjoy myself in that kind of atmosphere. I could hear it from my apartment (about 10km away) though!! Heard Florence and Snow Patrol last night too.

Fed deserves a lot of praise, he was dynamite from those 2 points in the second set. He winded Murray down after the first set moved him aroudn the court. Federer was exceptional at the net yesterday he had something like 78% of his points at the net at one stage.


You're right Notch, it's not all down to fitness and conditioning but I think it would be wrong to say it didn't play a part.


Mick, my brother was a fair bit away from the serious hassle but he said it was hard enough to enjoy with the shoite going on around him

I would rather just say it was down to an exceptional champion, one of the greatest sportsmen of our era in fact

He is certainly tennis GOAT. A lot come close but I think he takes it. Notch, you feel for Murray, ten years ago he would have about 5 by now, I don't know if there has been an era with so many great stars who are great on most surfaces.

I know, I do. I really have for a while and would love him to win at least one Slam. Not for the BBC. Not for his mother. Not for Middle England and the Daily Mail or for his country or countries. I want him to win a Slam for himself, as a sportsman, because sometimes it's nice to see all that hard work and passion rewarded in sport.

Those on twitter may have seen this already but for those who aren't I'm going to share a video with you, some say Spain and Barca's dominance ends with the retirement of Xavi and Iniesta, for those who say that, watch this, it's Barcelona playing Arsenal in an U-11 match. Look at the precision, the poise, the finesse, the technique, the movement. It's astounding, you rarely see fluidity of that calibre from some English and Irish sides at the top level, this is truely amazing. They have almost created the kid's abiility to see passes and given them vision and creativity amazing. It's an American team run by Barca coaches apparently. You can do this with any country if you do it young enough.

Spoiler:

I certainly feel for him and the weight of expectation he carries, it's worse than what Henman dealt with.

There's a grace about the way Federer plays tennis. It's how he's won his titles as much as how many he's won. Sporting beauty doesn't always lead to success but it has in Federer's case. You could apply the same thing to how Spain played in the Euro final recently.

IFs and BUTs but if Murray had of held out and won that second set and the roof hadn't of been closed then I believe he'd be wimbledon champion by now.

He had Fed at 6s and 7s for a set and a half, he just took his foot of the gas, allowed Fed a lifeline in the second and when the roof closed it was a different game, Federer was nigh on unplayable. He had Murray like a puppet on a string for 2 sets.

In any other era Murray would be a multi GS winner by now. He's just unlucky to be playing 3 of the best players of all time in every GS.

Murray should be proud of another great tournament for him but that 2nd set was a turning point and he'll be pretty disappointed. He'll fancy his chances in the US open though.

I think a lot has been made of the roof, but are very good indoor guys so I don't think it made a huge difference. Murray needed the break anyway he looked like he was on his feet. He should have taken the second set, Fed was decent during it but Murray didn't finsih off break points that's how it goes.



Saw a fella in Cork the other day heading towards the gneral direction of Deccie's house with a crossbow wasn't you Rodders?

rodders wrote:In any other era Murray would be a multi GS winner by now. He's just unlucky to be playing 3 of the best players of all time in every GS.

I wonder about this. Is it concidence that there are THREE best players of all time at the minute and Murray who would be a "multi GS winner".

I really don't buy it. Either tennis has got more professional increasing the standard right across the board or else its just a handy go-to excuse.

Most international class rugby players of today would be truly great talents in any other era as their superior fitness, dedicated and professionalism would be factors.

Stag, it's a bit of both. Tne years ago there wasn't the talent in tennis there is now. Tennis seems to be one of those sports where fitness and conditioning aren't a huge factor. Strength can be, like having a powerful serve, you need to be an all round guy to be really successful. Djoko, Nadal and Federer have all these great qualities, Murray lacks some of them. The talent wasn't there ten years ago.

Thomond wrote:Saw a fella in Cork the other day heading towards the gneral direction of Deccie's house with a crossbow wasn't you Rodders?

Aw flip I thought that was ROGs house.....

I think the roof definetly helped Fed, he was striking the ball so much better when it closed. The longer rallies favoured Murray and Murray dominating Fed and forcing him to go for the backhand winners in the first set which he was repeadedly missing. Fed was struggling to hold serve every service game.

When the roof closed Murray could barely keep the ball in play Fed was striking the ball so well. He was hitting winner after winner and Murray was all over the place trying to hang on.

The match was shifting towards Fed before the roof closed but I think that made a huge difference.

I feel Fed would have won with or without the roof. Some of what you're saying doesn't really make a difference with the roof open or closed. Federer would have probably hit those winners even with the roof open.

red_stag wrote:

rodders wrote:In any other era Murray would be a multi GS winner by now. He's just unlucky to be playing 3 of the best players of all time in every GS.

I wonder about this. Is it concidence that there are THREE best players of all time at the minute and Murray who would be a "multi GS winner".

I don't stag. I've been watching Tennis for 20 years and Federer, Nadal and possibly Djockivic are all time greats for sure. The former 2, without doubt 2 of the best players ever.

Sampras and Agassi were too but behind them there wasn't the same depth and although Agassi won all the slams players then weren't good across all the surfaces the way they are now.

Henman wouldn't get near the top 10 now and the likes of Roddick, Hewitt, Rafter, Rios, Stich, Ivanisavic etc. would have little chance of lifting GSs now imo.

By contrast there are so many players now like who would have picked up a few a decade ago. Murray is leading that pack for sure.

Thomond wrote:I feel Fed would have won with or without the roof. Some of what you're saying doesn't really make a difference with the roof open or closed. Federer would have probably hit those winners even with the roof open.

No I don't agree, Murray was too strong from the back, Fed couldn't live with him over the longer rallys. Murray had him onto his back hand and he was really struggling to stay in the match. Murray was holding serve easily whereas Federer was struggling in every game.

If the roof had of stayed open I think Murray would have beaten him. Maybe even in 3 sets.

Nadal needs to equal Sampras' total to take the tag for sure. In some people's eyes he is better as he has don the Golden Slam (Wimbledon, USO, FO, Australia, Olympics) which Agassi is the only one to have done (Fed has a doubles gold). Nadal is certainly a great, his injuries could cause him hassle though.


I disagree, Fed was growing and Murray was leaving shots for Fed attack. It was a set each when the roof closed no? Fed was starting to ascertain dominance as the roof closed.

rodders wrote: If the roof had of stayed open I think Murray would have beaten him. Maybe even in 3 sets.

Jeez, 'kids' today !! If the roof had stayed open, they'd have both got soaked

Glas a du wrote:

Thomond wrote:

WillyGilly wrote:I'm absolutely gutted. Flip Roger Federer.

I felt for Murray in the end even though I was watching on time delay, I think that fall hurt him a bit but you have to wonder about his conditioning and fitness coaches, he gave a lot in the first two sets and he looked absolutely spent in the 4th set. Fedex is 7 years older than him like, and he was fine. Murray played very well in the first 2 sets, and should his class he just couldn't maintain it, it might be partially a fitness issue who knows. Federer looked in trouble in the second set and then bang wins the set unreal. He coasted there after, watched it on time delay, due to a soccer match and all I will say is we were robbed by "de Boez", feicing joke.

Funny you should say that, I was at the Physio this morning and he was convinced that from the way he was climbing the steps he had an ankle problem and that the heavy strapping was limiting his stability.

Murray injured his ankle badly (either at Queens or Wimbledon) when he was about 18/19 yrs old, and he's had to wear it heavily strapped ever since whenever he plays. He also has a split patela in one or both of his knees so you often see those get taped up to (as in the Baghdatis match). This his ankle will always have a weakness though, he certainly falls over on his left ankle a lot anyways.

Thomond wrote:
I disagree, Fed was growing and Murray was leaving shots for Fed attack. It was a set each when the roof closed no? Fed was starting to ascertain dominance as the roof closed.

Was the second set over at that point? No I agree the match was swinging towards Federer at that stage but it was still anyones game. The roof closing totally changed the dynamics and gave Federer the edge.

Like I say its ifs and buts but I do believe that if Murray had of won the second set he'd have won the match. Murray dropped a break and then the momentum swung, the roof closing swung it further.

Thomond wrote:I feel Fed would have won with or without the roof. Some of what you're saying doesn't really make a difference with the roof open or closed. Federer would have probably hit those winners even with the roof open.

I agree.

rodders wrote:

red_stag wrote:

rodders wrote:In any other era Murray would be a multi GS winner by now. He's just unlucky to be playing 3 of the best players of all time in every GS.

I wonder about this. Is it concidence that there are THREE best players of all time at the minute and Murray who would be a "multi GS winner".

I don't stag. I've been watching Tennis for 20 years and Federer, Nadal and possibly Djockivic are all time greats for sure. The former 2, without doubt 2 of the best players ever.

Sampras and Agassi were too but behind them there wasn't the same depth and although Agassi won all the slams players then weren't good across all the surfaces the way they are now.

Henman wouldn't get near the top 10 now and the likes of Roddick, Hewitt, Rafter, Rios, Stich, Ivanisavic etc. would have little chance of lifting GSs now imo.

By contrast there are so many players now like who would have picked up a few a decade ago. Murray is leading that pack for sure.

I agree.

PenfroPete wrote:

rodders wrote: If the roof had of stayed open I think Murray would have beaten him. Maybe even in 3 sets.

Jeez, 'kids' today !! If the roof had stayed open, they'd have both got soaked

I agree.

I must be sober

Rava wrote:I must be sober

I disagree.

rodders wrote:

Thomond wrote:
I disagree, Fed was growing and Murray was leaving shots for Fed attack. It was a set each when the roof closed no? Fed was starting to ascertain dominance as the roof closed.

Was the second set over at that point? No I agree the match was swinging towards Federer at that stage but it was still anyones game. The roof closing totally changed the dynamics and gave Federer the edge.

Like I say its ifs and buts but I do believe that if Murray had of won the second set he'd have won the match. Murray dropped a break and then the momentum swung, the roof closing swung it further.

Yeah I think the 3rd set had started with Fed 40-0 up on his serve. The second set was the pivotal point, Federer was motoring along ,just managing to hold off some sever pressure from Murray who didn't take chances he had on break point. Federer comes up with the two shots of match then, back to back. Unreal stuff. Both guys have to live with the roof closed, both have great indoor records, the roof couldn;'t have really stayed open, could it? Wsn't it lashing rain for most of the day? Fed stepped up as Murray faded a bit. Federer deserves credit for showing great bottle and will to stay in a match by all rights he shouldn't have been in. Murray deserves great credit for the way he played in the opening two sets and that had Federer not produced some of his magic, he could have been two sets to the good.

Fed deserves huge credit, he turned the match around when he was getting pounded for an hour. That shows how hungry he is even at this stage of his career. Unbelievable.

I think there's been so much focus on Murray, Federer maybe hasn't got the attention hes deserved.

To come back and win Wimbledon at 30, 2 years after his last slam, and return to no 1 in the rankings when he looked on the wane for a couple of years is incredible.

Both the Male and female winners were 30+ this year, anyone know when that last happened?

You can see the touches of class in between the poor moments, sad in some ways to see such a great decline but he still has his moments and maybe another one or two in him.

It was in 1912, Rodders. Fanny Osgood was 32 and Dick Whisp was a sprightly 44.

Thomond wrote:You can see the touches of class in between the poor moments, sad in some ways to see such a great decline but he still has his moments and maybe another one or two in him.

I actually don't think he ever declined that much Thom, rather he was overhauled by Nadal and then Djoc. His game doesn't match well against Nadals, in the same way Nadals doesn't match well against Djocs.

The 3 way rivalry between those 3 is as good as anything I've ever seen in any sport. Its been a real golden era for mens tennis.

Murray is unfortunate to be the 4th man in the rivalry.

He has declined a bit, you can see now he misses shots he wouldn't before. Nadal is his big downfall, sometimes he just gets overpowered by him, the guy is a feicing monster with knee problems (ring any bells?) Djokovic had a great year last year and he will be raring to get back and prove he wasn't just a one year wonder (some year though!) can see him winning the US Open. I'm predicting a Federer v Djokovic final with Novak winning in 5.

2 years with Djokovic wasn't it? 6/7 Grandslams? I don't think he's a 1 year wonder! He's totally dominated Nadal on every surface bar clay for 2 years.

I don't think he is but some have said that. Before 2011 he only had one slam. He has won 4 since.

Prop and Lucky

Not sure what to make of that Dragons news. The way they report it is as if we are better off, but we are in trouble. Obviously we aren't well off, but all we hear out of RP is we live within our means, thus with extra revenue from football etc, surely we'll be okay?

Who knows? They put in another season like last and I'd gladly see them go up the wall

This coming season really is crucial. Darren Edwards can just about get away with saying that last season's problems were down to 'new structures' and all that, but that won't wash if there's no improvement. In fairness, it's worth remembering that we lost a few close matches we could just as easily have won.