How To Beat Floyd Mayweather Junior's Defense

First topic message reminder :

I was just sitting here at 7 in the morning when I thought how do you actually beat Floyd Mayweather Junior's defense? He has made a big deal at there not being a specific blueprint on how to beat him.

(By the way if this turns into a Manny Floyd debate I am gonna cry)

However he is human right? He has been caught by Sugar Shane, there was the HIS GLOVE TOUCHED DOWN REF! Against Zab Judah, but I was just wondering how you land the shots against Mayweather, because realistically the only ways that have been proven to have a chance against him so far have been outwork him. (Which works well in America considering they do look at aggression as more of a factor, take Hatton Mayweather, by my scorecard Hatton was down massively because of precise work by FMJ, however it was still relatively close because Hatton was aggressive) The other way of how to beat him would be to just have one punch knockout power and stun him if you sneak off a lucky shot.

But apart from these facts, how many guys can you say have had if at all any success at landing clean shots on FMJ regularly, also how do you go about doing this, what kind of style have you got to take, have you got to make him make the first move, what's your guys thoughts?

(Just thought it would be refreshing as this kind of thing doesn't seem to get talked about much on here)

Jukebox Timebomb wrote:Manny has a decent chance, but I think he'd get a bit carried away and try to blast out Mayweather ala Hatton. IMO against Mayweather opponents cant over commit with their shots. Floydy is too hard to hit cleanly and too good at countering. As someone has said, Calzaghes style would prob be one of the more effective. Lots of short arm punches making Mayweather work in defence without being left too open to counters. I couldn't see letting Mayweather fight off the front foot being effective at all. He's too quick and to good a boxer to walk onto anything.

Think the problem with Manny is his style is all wrong for Floyd. He throws punches in bunches and isn't a one punch ko fighter he's an accumulative puncher. Problem is though when he fought Cotto and Margarito he would land a lot of punches he would maybe land 1 punch in a flurry against Floyd and get tagged with a couple.

I think it's a bit hard on Mayweather when matching him against Hearns, Leonard and Robinson because these guys are all bigger than Mayweather and had their best years at welter whereas Mayweather for me was best at super feather. The only way Margarito beats Mayweather is if Floyd breaks both his hands on that solid head of Margarito. Anyway I think there are a few guys out there that could get through Mayweathers defence but beating him is a whole different story.

According to De La Hoya floyd has very little power and he has no idea how he stopped Hatton. How reliable is De La Hoya as a source, though?

John Bloody Wayne wrote:According to De La Hoya floyd has very little power and he has no idea how he stopped Hatton. How reliable is De La Hoya as a source, though?

The turnbuckle and the fact Hatton was running face first into punches.

Mayweather isn't a big puncher; but he does hit hard enough to discourage fighters. Mosley visibly became reluctant to attack because he was weary of all the counter right hands coming his way.

D4thincarnation wrote:

John Bloody Wayne wrote:According to De La Hoya floyd has very little power and he has no idea how he stopped Hatton. How reliable is De La Hoya as a source, though?

The turnbuckle and the fact Hatton was running face first into punches.

You keep using the turnbuckle D4 but Hatton was out before that. De La Hoya isn't a reliable source he hates FMJ.

prettyboy1304 wrote:

D4thincarnation wrote:

John Bloody Wayne wrote:According to De La Hoya floyd has very little power and he has no idea how he stopped Hatton. How reliable is De La Hoya as a source, though?

The turnbuckle and the fact Hatton was running face first into punches.

You keep using the turnbuckle D4 but Hatton was out before that. De La Hoya isn't a reliable source he hates FMJ.

http://www.viddler.com/explore/BoxingHumor/videos/20/

D4thincarnation wrote:

prettyboy1304 wrote:

D4thincarnation wrote:

John Bloody Wayne wrote:According to De La Hoya floyd has very little power and he has no idea how he stopped Hatton. How reliable is De La Hoya as a source, though?

The turnbuckle and the fact Hatton was running face first into punches.

You keep using the turnbuckle D4 but Hatton was out before that. De La Hoya isn't a reliable source he hates FMJ.

http://www.viddler.com/explore/BoxingHumor/videos/20/

Yes D4 his head hit the turnbuckle but look at his feet before he hits it they are off the ground Hatton was done.

Was an absolute peach of a punch. The speed of hand, footwork and accuracy required to slip your opponents punch, land a knock down blow and spin out of the corner in one movement cannot be understimated.

If manny threw it D4 would have told us that a hundred times. But because mayweather threw it "he needed the help of the turnbuckle". Thats what I find pathetic - not having favourites, but not giving credit where its due.

Do you not think its a cracking bit of skill D4?

Sugar Boy Sweetie wrote:Was an absolute peach of a punch. The speed of hand, footwork and accuracy required to slip your opponents punch, land a knock down blow and spin out of the corner in one movement cannot be understimated.

If manny threw it D4 would have told us that a hundred times. But because mayweather threw it "he needed the help of the turnbuckle". Thats what I find pathetic - not having favourites, but not giving credit where its due.

Do you not think its a cracking bit of skill D4?

Donaire's counter left hook is much better, and hew can throw more than once in his career. He also doesn't have to wait for his opponent to tire himself out and get frustrated y Cortez do delivery this punch. Plus his opponents are not known for running straight first into punches.

Check out the right hook counter that Pacquiao put Hatton down with, no turnbuckle required.

D4thincarnation wrote:

Sugar Boy Sweetie wrote:Was an absolute peach of a punch. The speed of hand, footwork and accuracy required to slip your opponents punch, land a knock down blow and spin out of the corner in one movement cannot be understimated.

If manny threw it D4 would have told us that a hundred times. But because mayweather threw it "he needed the help of the turnbuckle". Thats what I find pathetic - not having favourites, but not giving credit where its due.

Do you not think its a cracking bit of skill D4?

Donaire's counter left hook is much better, and hew can throw more than once in his career. He also doesn't have to wait for his opponent to tire himself out and get frustrated y Cortez do delivery this punch. Plus his opponents are not known for running straight first into punches.

Check out the right hook counter that Pacquiao put Hatton down with, no turnbuckle required.

But if hatton is known for running straight into punches as you say then pacquiaos right hook counter cant have been anything special either can it?

Well done D4, revert to type rather than discuss things sensibly - I'm one of the few on here that doesn't jump on everything you say with a barrage of abuse yet still you cant have an objective conversation when the opportunity presents itself!

D4thincarnation wrote:

Sugar Boy Sweetie wrote:Was an absolute peach of a punch. The speed of hand, footwork and accuracy required to slip your opponents punch, land a knock down blow and spin out of the corner in one movement cannot be understimated.

If manny threw it D4 would have told us that a hundred times. But because mayweather threw it "he needed the help of the turnbuckle". Thats what I find pathetic - not having favourites, but not giving credit where its due.

Do you not think its a cracking bit of skill D4?

Donaire's counter left hook is much better, and hew can throw more than once in his career. He also doesn't have to wait for his opponent to tire himself out and get frustrated y Cortez do delivery this punch. Plus his opponents are not known for running straight first into punches.

Check out the right hook counter that Pacquiao put Hatton down with, no turnbuckle required.

D4 you can have favourites but not giving a guy credit for something he does well is pathetic. What has Donaire got to do with this? That isn't the only counter left FMJ has ever thrown just proves you have watched very few of his fights. It's his opponents fault they tire out that is part of FMJs plan he dictates the pace and wants his opponent to get frustrated. It's called tactics, and he is a top athlete who is always in great shape so can fight they same way from 1st round to the 12th round.

Floyd's opponents get tired and frustrated because they cannot hit him;d due to his excellent defense and great ring generalship.

I honestly don't know a boxer around the weight class I would pick to beat FMJ. After all there is no one who really has found a blue print or really come close once floyd got in the grove. There is a blueprint for mosley, manny, berto etc...

John Bloody Wayne wrote:According to De La Hoya floyd has very little power and he has no idea how he stopped Hatton. How reliable is De La Hoya as a source, though?

Let's be honest, Oscar has fought some ferocious punchers in his time, so it's no shame if he says that. Oscar also dismissed Manny as being feather fisted after their bout. Diaz wasn't impressed either.

samevans1 wrote:Floyd's opponents get tired and frustrated because they cannot hit him;d due to his excellent defense and great ring generalship.

Hatton wasn't too happy with Cortez, Floyd turning his back and running, telling Hatton to stop holding when Floyd is the one holding and ramming his forearm in Hatton throat.

Thats why Hatton got frustrated.

Bob wrote:

John Bloody Wayne wrote:According to De La Hoya floyd has very little power and he has no idea how he stopped Hatton. How reliable is De La Hoya as a source, though?

Let's be honest, Oscar has fought some ferocious punchers in his time, so it's no shame if he says that. Oscar also dismissed Manny as being feather fisted after their bout. Diaz wasn't impressed either.

Diaz and Oscar's face's tell a different story.

Floyd Mayweather is talked amongst boxing fans much the same way people talk about Brazil. If Brazil score a goal, it magical, great skill, but if another team scores it, it was lucky a fluke.

The check hook he threw was a good punch but Donaire throws that punch much better, and Pacquiao throw the right better too.

Hatton had become slow and predictable at that stage of the fight making that punch much more easier to deliver.

D4thincarnation wrote:

Bob wrote:

John Bloody Wayne wrote:According to De La Hoya floyd has very little power and he has no idea how he stopped Hatton. How reliable is De La Hoya as a source, though?

Let's be honest, Oscar has fought some ferocious punchers in his time, so it's no shame if he says that. Oscar also dismissed Manny as being feather fisted after their bout. Diaz wasn't impressed either.

Diaz and Oscar's face's tell a different story.

Yeah. Bet Manny wishes he had the wrecking balls Forbes did.

Bob wrote:

D4thincarnation wrote:

Bob wrote:

John Bloody Wayne wrote:According to De La Hoya floyd has very little power and he has no idea how he stopped Hatton. How reliable is De La Hoya as a source, though?

Let's be honest, Oscar has fought some ferocious punchers in his time, so it's no shame if he says that. Oscar also dismissed Manny as being feather fisted after their bout. Diaz wasn't impressed either.

Diaz and Oscar's face's tell a different story.

Yeah. Bet Manny wishes he had the wrecking balls Forbes did.

Yet after the Mayweather fight he didn't look half as bad.

D4thincarnation wrote:

Bob wrote:

D4thincarnation wrote:

Bob wrote:

John Bloody Wayne wrote:According to De La Hoya floyd has very little power and he has no idea how he stopped Hatton. How reliable is De La Hoya as a source, though?

Let's be honest, Oscar has fought some ferocious punchers in his time, so it's no shame if he says that. Oscar also dismissed Manny as being feather fisted after their bout. Diaz wasn't impressed either.

Diaz and Oscar's face's tell a different story.

Yeah. Bet Manny wishes he had the wrecking balls Forbes did.

Yet after the Mayweather fight he didn't look half as bad.

I look bloody awful when I try to crash drop 20lbs, with or without being punched in the face.

D4thincarnation wrote:Floyd Mayweather is talked amongst boxing fans much the same way people talk about Brazil. If Brazil score a goal, it magical, great skill, but if another team scores it, it was lucky a fluke.

The check hook he threw was a good punch but Donaire throws that punch much better, and Pacquiao throw the right better too.

Hatton had become slow and predictable at that stage of the fight making that punch much more easier to deliver.

The point is why can't you say mayweather did something good without following it up with a "but"? Hatton was tired because mayweather had him chasing shadows for the last 6 rounds and eating clean counters for his troubles. It's called outboxing someone, you don't have to KO them in the second round to make it a good win.

And if you want to be pedantic you could always follow a compliment with a "but". Mannys KO of hatton was quality, but Martinez on Williams was better, but donaire on montiel was better than that, but Lewis on Rahman was better than that, but Hearns on Duran was better than that. Saying something was good and then immediately attempting to discredit it is just pathetic. As a supposed boxing fan and grown man I think its ridiculous that you can't bring yourself to give due credit to a pro boxer just because you don't like him.

D4 stop talking rubbish. Pacquiao who has only just developed a right hand throws a better one than FMJ? You really have no clue! Manny was a one handed fighter for nearly his whole career. If they ever meet in the ring, manny will find out just how good FMJ right hand is! Manny has barley done anything of note with his right hand he is still very left hand happy. If I recall hattons face after the fight looked like he had just been run over by a steam roller....

I for one am sick and tired of, as someone else (Sugar Boy) has put it, the 'but's. I used to hate Mayweather for his personality, but since trawling through all the pro-Manny nut-hugging I can honestly say I've been enlightened with a new-found respect for the ability of Mayweather Jr. Sure, he's been despicable outside the ring on many occasions, but inside it he's unsurpassed in his generation.

BALTIMORA wrote:I for one am sick and tired of, as someone else (Sugar Boy) has put it, the 'but's. I used to hate Mayweather for his personality, but since trawling through all the pro-Manny nut-hugging I can honestly say I've been enlightened with a new-found respect for the ability of Mayweather Jr. Sure, he's been despicable outside the ring on many occasions, but inside it he's unsurpassed in his generation.

That's the point no one can say he comes across well away from the ring. In the ring though he has at times cruised past top opposition and for it to be tarnished because he is a bit of a Muppet is unfair.

prettyboy1304 wrote:

BALTIMORA wrote:I for one am sick and tired of, as someone else (Sugar Boy) has put it, the 'but's. I used to hate Mayweather for his personality, but since trawling through all the pro-Manny nut-hugging I can honestly say I've been enlightened with a new-found respect for the ability of Mayweather Jr. Sure, he's been despicable outside the ring on many occasions, but inside it he's unsurpassed in his generation.

That's the point no one can say he comes across well away from the ring. In the ring though he has at times cruised past top opposition and for it to be tarnished because he is a bit of a Muppet is unfair.

I think both aspects have to be considered in the appropriate context. I doubt he'd ever make my list of 'desert island dinner guests', but all these pac nut-huggers have succeeded in doing is raising my awareness of the innate boxing ability which Mayweather possesses. For that, I thank them...

i think if khan keeps up his progress in 4-5 fights time he would have decent chance- better than anyone else- but not yet

The only way Khan will beat Mayweather is if he suddenly gets old. Khan is extremely quick, but his defense still is the greatest and a fight as good technically as Floyd would pick him apart piece by piece for a wide UD.

In his last two fights, the only time Marquez and Mosley landed something significant was when Floyd's shoulder roll wasn't fast enough to block the right hand. You're not going to have much success at all throwing left hooks because Floyd's right hand is always up, but you may occasionally get some success faking with the left and throwing fast with the right.

Zab had a bit more luck because Floyd started coming for him, rather than sitting back, so Zab became the counter puncher in parts of that fight. Plus Zab had the quickest hands I've seen on a light welterweight to catch him out. To beat Floyd you either have to be taller, faster or throw a load more punches. Even though he hasn't got any of those 3 on Floyd, I would have loved to have seen Cotto fight him

Bur Floyd was smart enough against Mosley to realise his mistake; watch the positioning of his hands after the scond round. He kept his hands up more and threw more jabs. He is smart enough to make subtil adjustments to his defense in order to negate the strengths of his opponents; in Mosley's case, the right hand.

samevans1 wrote:Bur Floyd was smart enough against Mosley to realise his mistake; watch the positioning of his hands after the scond round. He kept his hands up more and threw more jabs. He is smart enough to make subtil adjustments to his defense in order to negate the strengths of his opponents; in Mosley's case, the right hand.

The 17 months out of the ring showed on Mosley, he looked tight and his timing was out. His conditioning was out. In round 2 he tried to take Mayweather out throwing a lot of big punches and you could see in round 3 that it took it out of him. But rather than go back to boxing he kept on looking for the big shot.

D4

How did he look against Mora?

Punch stats:

Against Mayweather he threw 452

Against Mora he threw 508

A difference of 56, that equates to on average 4.6 punches per round. Difference in the Mora fight was that he was a LITTLE bit more active (barely) because he wasn't getting nailed and countered at every turn.

Please drop it D4, you're getting shown up again and you seem oblivious to what an idiot you are.

You're a disgrace to this fine forum.

He was comstantly being hit by a jab and or lead right hands by Mayweather after the second round.

Mayweather is a smart fighter; he adjusted, Mosley couldn't cope.

coxy0001 wrote:D4

How did he look against Mora?

Punch stats:

Against Mayweather he threw 452

Against Mora he threw 508

A difference of 56, that equates to on average 4.6 punches per round. Difference in the Mora fight was that he was a LITTLE bit more active (barely) because he wasn't getting nailed and countered at every turn.

Please drop it D4, you're getting shown up again and you seem oblivious to what an idiot you are.

You're a disgrace to this fine forum.

That because Mora decide just run all night, this was one of the rare occasion Floyd did not run, because he knew Shane's footwork was poor and chose to box him in the middle of the ring.

But you can see an upward trend in the amount of punches Mosley throws as he shakes of that ring rust. By the time he fights Pacquiao I should imagine on average he will be throwing more that 10 more punches a round.

D4thincarnation wrote:By the time he fights Pacquiao I should imagine on average he will be throwing more that 10 more punches a round.

And there'll be peace on Earth and goodwill to all mankind.

HumanWindmill wrote:

D4thincarnation wrote:By the time he fights Pacquiao I should imagine on average he will be throwing more that 10 more punches a round.

And there'll be peace on Earth and goodwill to all mankind.

They do say all the crime and violence stops in th Philippines when Pacquiao fight, maybe one day it could spread further afield.

D4thincarnation wrote:

HumanWindmill wrote:

D4thincarnation wrote:By the time he fights Pacquiao I should imagine on average he will be throwing more that 10 more punches a round.

And there'll be peace on Earth and goodwill to all mankind.

They do say all the crime and violence stops in th Philippines when Pacquiao fight, maybe one day it could spread further afield.

So long as you are Missionary - in - chief I have absolutely no doubt that it will, D4. Your tireless enthusiasm is a credit to the little man.

Nice to see D4 has dragged it off topic again.

coxy0001 wrote:Nice to see D4 has dragged it off topic again.

Haha!

Like I said, ' goodwill to all men ' ( ????? )

D4thincarnation wrote:

coxy0001 wrote:D4

How did he look against Mora?

Punch stats:

Against Mayweather he threw 452

Against Mora he threw 508

A difference of 56, that equates to on average 4.6 punches per round. Difference in the Mora fight was that he was a LITTLE bit more active (barely) because he wasn't getting nailed and countered at every turn.

Please drop it D4, you're getting shown up again and you seem oblivious to what an idiot you are.

You're a disgrace to this fine forum.

That because Mora decide just run all night, this was one of the rare occasion Floyd did not run, because he knew Shane's footwork was poor and chose to box him in the middle of the ring.

But you can see an upward trend in the amount of punches Mosley throws as he shakes of that ring rust. By the time he fights Pacquiao I should imagine on average he will be throwing more that 10 more punches a round.

Yeah by the time Mosley fights Pacquiao he'll be some kind of Tasmanian Devil-esque whirling dervish of inhuman proportion. He'll be throwing at least 1200 punches per round, have the grace of foot of Nureyev, and the foot speed of Michael Flatley on speed. Not to mention he'll be at his 30-year-old peak of physical stature, as well as being a foot taller.

HumanWindmill wrote:

coxy0001 wrote:Nice to see D4 has dragged it off topic again.

Haha!

Like I said, ' goodwill to all men ' ( ????? )

Bringing it back on topic, Pacquiao has a lot of attributes that Mayweather would struggle with. Speed, accuracy, power, footwork, southpaw, unorthodox angles, combination puncher, the straight left, the right hook counter, work rate and stamina.

Only disadvantage for Manny is that he is naturally the smaller man, shorter and shorter reach.

Is Pacquiao's accuracy really all that great though against a moving target? It's easy to look good throwing punches against Clottey or Margarito. Plus, while he IS shorter than Mayweather, didn't they both fight at the same weight at 16?

Yep will be a combination of SRR, Robocop and Darth Vader when he fights pacquiao; he will miraculously turn back the clock because he is fighting Pacquiao.

Pacuiao's wins counf ro more than other fighters. He desrves more credit for beating exactly the same fighters as others; even if they are older and weight drained. Those are just the rules, hadn't you heard?

BALTIMORA wrote:Is Pacquiao's accuracy really all that great though against a moving target? It's easy to look good throwing punches against Clottey or Margarito. Plus, while he IS shorter than Mayweather, didn't they both fight at the same weight at 16?

There not 16 now though.
I was the same height as this kid in school when I was 16, now he is 6ft 6in and around 20 stone

For someone who punches in such volume, Pacquiao's accuracy is very good, yes. He wont have the percentages of a counter puncher or potshotter but wouldn't be miles off, and for his speed and power is one of the most accurate in the sport.

Mayweather has a better defense, he is more accurate, his footwork is better, he is taller, his reach is longer, he has a greater variety of punches etc...

D4thincarnation wrote:

HumanWindmill wrote:

coxy0001 wrote:Nice to see D4 has dragged it off topic again.

Haha!

Like I said, ' goodwill to all men ' ( ????? )

Bringing it back on topic, Pacquiao has a lot of attributes that Mayweather would struggle with. Speed, accuracy, power, footwork, southpaw, unorthodox angles, combination puncher, the straight left, the right hook counter, work rate and stamina.

Only disadvantage for Manny is that he is naturally the smaller man, shorter and shorter reach.

Joking apart, I do actually believe that if anyone can upset Floyd then it must be Pacquiao. I'd favour Floyd, ( to win, that is, ) but I believe it would be a truly great fight and a hard struggle for both men.

Yep, because Mayweather is such a physically huge man!!!! Lol.

D4thincarnation wrote:

BALTIMORA wrote:Is Pacquiao's accuracy really all that great though against a moving target? It's easy to look good throwing punches against Clottey or Margarito. Plus, while he IS shorter than Mayweather, didn't they both fight at the same weight at 16?

There not 16 now though.
I was the same height as this kid in school when I was 16, now he is 6ft 6in and around 20 stone

Congratulations on spectacularly missing the point. Point is weight-wise he's not that much of the smaller man. The only reason he is is because nature doesn't impose weight stipulations.

BALTIMORA wrote:

D4thincarnation wrote:

BALTIMORA wrote:Is Pacquiao's accuracy really all that great though against a moving target? It's easy to look good throwing punches against Clottey or Margarito. Plus, while he IS shorter than Mayweather, didn't they both fight at the same weight at 16?

There not 16 now though.
I was the same height as this kid in school when I was 16, now he is 6ft 6in and around 20 stone

Congratulations on spectacularly missing the point. Point is weight-wise he's not that much of the smaller man. The only reason he is is because nature doesn't impose weight stipulations.

He is though, probably by about 10lbs at this moment