The Dew Drop Inn Virtual Rugby Pub, Bridgend

by Pete C (Kiwireddevil) Thu Jul 19, 2012 3:47 pm

First topic message reminder :

Hello and welcome to the Dew Drop Inn, a place where you can come in for a sly beverage and discuss whatever's on your mind, or just eavesdrop on the regulars if you fancy a break from all the rugby chat.

This week the pub has set up in Bridgend, the birthplace of ex Wales and Lions centre Dr. Jack Matthews, who has sadly passed away.

The only rule in this pub is one of mutual respect for everyone in it, oh and no tampering with the pictures of Dr Jack Matthews and his Welsh centres partner Bleddyn Williams.

Ale

Previous Pub: https://www.606v2.com/t32320p950-the-dew-drop-inn-virtual-antananarivo-arms-madagascar

by WillyGilly Sat Jul 21, 2012 5:55 am

Jeez lads it got heavy in here last night.

Up with larks this morning for another 6am shift. Up with the snails as well if we want to get poetical, aren't they quoted as being early risers? Hang on 2 secs...

The are indeed. Robert Browning, Pippa passes (1841). Oooooooh get me trying to bring a bit of culture to this place.

Anyhow morning all, I'll start the bacon.

by Glas a du Sat Jul 21, 2012 7:10 am

Slap a sausage on.

by Hound_of_Harrow Sat Jul 21, 2012 9:24 am

Marnin' all.

Excellent day down in Canterbury yesterday with some very good friends. Good company and good conversation (+ Ale

) is all you need for entertainment.

Smile

by MBTGOG Sat Jul 21, 2012 9:39 am

Morning all,

Up for the first round of the Super Rugby playoffs. Should be two exciting games.

Didn't overly enjoy Dark Knight last night. Not to say it ain't a good movie but I'll wait to give my opinions once more people have watched it.

I'll steer clear of the guns discussion but I really don't believe people should be allowed them, I really don't see a good reason.

by **Pal Joey** Sat Jul 21, 2012 9:51 am

Good Morning Pub... coffee

Yes Munsty, some good Super XV contests tonight.
NZ Warriors are off to a flying start in the NRL against the Knights... 12-0.

We had the guns buy-back scheme about a decade ago (after the massacre in Port Arthur)... yet this week the police raided a licensed gun dealer (strict controls for clubs & farmers) and they find mortars, grenade launchers, huge amount of semi-automatic firearms.... so even with gun control there is always an evil black market operating with the worst people carrying weapons and using them for criminal purposes.

by Hound_of_Harrow Sat Jul 21, 2012 10:27 am

Listen to Saturday Night Special by Lynyrd Skynyrd. That sums up my feelings about civilians having guns. I do get very angry when I hear about things like the Denver shootings.

The Utoye island massacre last year was sickening. If Breivik did not have access to guns that could not have happened.

by Glas a du Sat Jul 21, 2012 10:31 am

Banning guns does not deny bad people access only good people.

by Hound_of_Harrow Sat Jul 21, 2012 10:36 am

I'm well aware of that.

by MBTGOG Sat Jul 21, 2012 10:42 am

The problem is people using guns for self defence when a lot of the time, something that powerful is not needed.

by MBTGOG Sat Jul 21, 2012 10:52 am

Someone might correct me on this but I think the big culture shock for a lot of Irish people (from the Republic) have when they go abroad is seeing police with guns and being more than a little intimidated by it.

One of the great things I like about the Gardaí here is they don't use guns.

by MBTGOG Sat Jul 21, 2012 10:58 am

Breaker,

I see Luke Lewis has signed for Cronulla and they have also signed Michael Gordon. They really are putting together a strong squad there aren't they?

by ChequeredJersey Sat Jul 21, 2012 11:04 am

Head hurts. So much...

by **Pal Joey** Sat Jul 21, 2012 11:05 am

Good signings for the Sharks... I wouldn't mind seeing them win it one day.

Warriors now trail the Knights 24-19 after 71 mins.

by MBTGOG Sat Jul 21, 2012 11:15 am

Breaker,

Who do you predict to win the whole thing?

by Luckless Pedestrian Sat Jul 21, 2012 11:20 am

Bore da pawb / good morning all, Virgin Media are giving all their customers free Sky Sports this weekend, so I've just watched the Crusaders - Bulls match (well I wasn't paying full attention really). Not long 'til the cricket starts though, so thank you, Richard Branson! Very Happy

Robert Browning, Willy? You've just gone up in my estimation!

by **rodders** Sat Jul 21, 2012 11:23 am

MBTGOG wrote:Someone might correct me on this but I think the big culture shock for a lot of Irish people (from the Republic) have when they go abroad is seeing police with guns and being more than a little intimidated by it.

err not if you're from NI Munsty Whistle

... My GF got a shock when she 1st came over here and saw Police walking round with Machine guns. Thankfully things have changed remarkably since then. Personally I don't think any civilian should have access to firearms, other than farmers.

Dropped the GF at the airport at 6.30 then went for an early morning run, beautiful morning here. Shattered now but think I'll drive to Belshaft in a bit.

Hope every one has a great day.... especially those who are going to watch the Dark Knight Rises Smile

by **rodders** Sat Jul 21, 2012 11:33 am

Glas a du wrote:Banning guns does not deny bad people access only good people.

And why would a good person want a gun? Firearms are designed to kill and destroy their targets, I don't see what good or positive reason there is for anyone to want to own a gun, bar livestock farmers who have genuine cause but thats a different debate. In an Urban enviroment there is absolutely no logical or reasonable excuse for owning a gun imo.

In terms of self defence, well to me thats a straw man argument because if there were no guns in circulation then a gun wouldn't be needed for self defence. It's a bit like the idea of using nuclear weapons as deterent to war. It's nonsensical.

by Thomond Sat Jul 21, 2012 11:42 am

PJHolybloke wrote:
Thomond wrote:They were owned legally, the laws on guns in public and concealed weapons are tissue. A universal tolerance of no arms in public should be adopted, guns don't kill people. People kill people. I'm with Rory, if a guy wants to t kill someone they will do it the choice of weapon is irrelevant.

At that, I leave you to go to bed might pick it up tomorrow.

Given the choice of mass murder weapons T, if I wanted to kill a bucket load of people I'd pick the assault rifle, auto-load shotgun and Desert Eagle over a steak knife and an Aunt Bessie rolling pin.

Apparently he bought all of his weapons legally over the internet in the last couple of weeks...

Two people were arrested in Manchester this week because they had materials and/or instructions for the purpose of bomb-making; "some crushed-up firelighters, some peroxide, some wires AND a BATTERY"

I bet we've all got batterys at home, but I'd rather our security services concentrate on those that have AK47's first, when they've wheedled those out, take down the firelighter/fertilser/peroxide/wire-owning battery nutters.

Rory is right to a degree, a nutter is a nutter, but I'm a lot happier knowing MY nutter is unlikely to have anything worse to hurt me with than a knife or a broken bottle...

The USA is a hypocritical toilet of holier-than-thou pulpit-bashing bullshine, the quicker the rest of the world turns its back on the dollar, the better-off we'll al become.

They've never been first in to any kind of world threat unless it's threatened them first, they let Hitler have his "fun" until the Japs bombed Pearl Harbour, and it was a full 3 years into WWII till they started to make an effort in Europe, and they were only able to make an impression then because the RAF won the Battle of Britain.

"Yeeeaaah, Hitler? That's your war that is. Oh shoite! The Japs bombed Pearl Harbour, we're in... but only in the Pacific! The Jew-burners are your problem..."

Yep, majestic, thanks for that.

Lest we forget.

PJ, a lot of what you are doing is blaming the Us and Obama, as you probably know, there are two types of law in America, Federal and State. You can say that Sate laws weild more power in a lot of ways. Colorado has surprisingly lax gun laws given ists history with Columbine and everything.

There is no state permit required for the purchase of any rifle, shotgun or handgun. Dealers are required to keep a record on the retail sale, rental, or exchange of handguns. The record shall include the name of the person to whom the handgun is transferred, his or her age, occupation and residence, and the make, caliber, finish and serial number of the handgun, and the date of the transfer and name of employee making the transfer. The record book shall be open at all times to the inspection of any duly authorized police officer.

That's the rules on purchasing a gun, next to know background check, there's a waiting period called the Brady Handgun Violence prevention Act (came about after the Reagan assassination attempt) that's pretty much it when it comes to buying a gun in Colorado, in other states (California I'm certain has incredibly strict gun laws)

Here's the laws on having concealed weapons (carrying it in public but hidden)

Who is a legal resident of the state.

Is at least twenty-one.

Does not chronically and habitually abuse alcohol.

Demonstrates competency with a firearm.

Who is a legal resident of the state.

Is at least twenty-one.

Is not ineligible to possess a firearm, has not been convicted of perjury in relation to an application for a concealed weapon permit.

Is not an unlawful user of or addicted to a controlled substance as provided in federal law and regulations.

Is not subject to a restraining order in effect at the time the application is submitted, or a permanent restraining order, or a temporary restraining order in effect at the time the application is submitted.

Bascially, you don't drink or do drugs you're grand. You don't get away with that in a lot of other states. Rodders, what a lot of people fail to understand is guns and shooting is a sport for a lot of Americans. We head to the pub to watch Ireland play, they go to the range and fire off a couple of rounds. I have been to a shooting range twice, the guys there are by and large decent people, some cops ,retired cops and a few guys who just like shooting. Heck I would probably tell you right now, if I lived over in America I could see myself going to a shooting range every few months and firing a few rounds.

by **Pal Joey** Sat Jul 21, 2012 11:44 am

MBTGOG wrote:Breaker,

Who do you predict to win the whole thing?

Currently it looks like Canterbury, Melbourne are the favourites.... however you can never write off the Broncos. I hope Souths do well for once. Even though they've won the most Premierships (20) they haven't won since 1971. and then there's Manly of course. Two losses in two weeks doesn't help but maybe they can be in with a shot but they can't afford any more injuries or suspensions...or losses Wink

Newcastle beat the Warriors 24-19... a bit of an upset and puts a dent in their chances to make the final 8. Tigers, if they win will be a very dangerous side in the final rounds.

Parramatta have already scored against the Storm.

by **Notch** Sat Jul 21, 2012 11:46 am

rodders wrote:
Glas a du wrote:Banning guns does not deny bad people access only good people.

And why would a good person want a gun? Firearms are designed to kill and destroy their targets, I don't see what good or positive reason there is for anyone to want to own a gun, bar livestock farmers who have genuine cause but thats a different debate. In an Urban enviroment there is absolutely no logical or reasonable excuse for owning a gun imo.

In terms of self defence, well to me thats a straw man argument because if there were no guns in circulation then a gun wouldn't be needed for self defence. It's a bit like the idea of using nuclear weapons as deterent to war. It's nonsensical.

<NRA mode>Yeah, and what if the King of England comes over and starts trying to push you around eh? What'll you do then?</NRA mode>

I agree with Rodders. I understand the cultural reasons that explain why some Americans have an attachment to their guns, but tighter control can only help make tragedies like this less frequent.

by MBTGOG Sat Jul 21, 2012 11:53 am

If the Tigers don't do it, I'd like to see the Rabbitohs pull it off. I saw the highlights for that game against the Roosters and that is one of the best finishes to a game I've seen.

Sharks have just scored a try. Fantastic build up. It was the two bursts up the left hand side which did the damage and there was just too much space out wide and Pietersen scores.

by **Pal Joey** Sat Jul 21, 2012 11:58 am

Yeah Munsty... the commentator nearly turned into porridge calling those last 2 tries.

Souths leading Saints 10-4, Parra now lead Melbourne 10-0 after 20 mins.

(I also forgot to mention the Cronulla Sharks above... maybe too much for them this year but as you've suggested... they'll be even stronger next season)

by **rodders** Sat Jul 21, 2012 12:00 pm

I understand that owning a gun is a big part of American culture too and that shooting is a popular and legitimate past time. However I still don't agree with it. Glorification of violence and firearms is not a good thing and there is no excuse for it in a modern democratic society. There is nothing good or positive about guns, they are tools of destruction not sporting apparatus.

Don't get me wrong I'm not a pacifist or naive enough to believe we have a world which firearms are unecessary but you have to draw the line somewhere and the less guns and weapons in circulation the better for everyone.

zen

by MBTGOG Sat Jul 21, 2012 12:04 pm

What I think is ironic about all of this is I think Holy's point is that he didn't like the hypocrisy of American's judging the rest of the world yet they still have all these problems in their own country.

Now we are all bashing them yet look at the problems in our own respective nations.

Back to rugby and this game is much more enjoyable than the last one. Both teams really willing to run this ball. JP Pietersen must be in line for player of the year.

by Suspicious lurker Sat Jul 21, 2012 12:05 pm

"no good person should own a gun"

I used to clay pigeon a fair but when I was back home, why shouldn't I be allowed to own my own shotgun??

by MBTGOG Sat Jul 21, 2012 12:06 pm

Just as I say it, the Sharks score a stunner of a second try through the centre, Paul Jordaan. Wonderful hands in the ten metre channel out on the right to put him through and he then puts a wonderful step on Ioane to leave him for dead.

by Thomond Sat Jul 21, 2012 12:06 pm

Concealed weapons is the main issue I think Rodders, there have been more incidents involving that, not just yesterday.

It's the laws that are the main problem not the guns. I'm not bashing them Munsty, it's not a problem in America as a whole, it's certain states where it's a problem, the laws are too loose. As I posted above Colorado's are utterly ridiculous given it's history some other states also have loose laws. Some strict, you can't exactly blame the president here, it's state law that is the main issue here.

by **Notch** Sat Jul 21, 2012 12:07 pm

Great game isn't it Munsty? Fast and furious.

by **Pal Joey** Sat Jul 21, 2012 12:10 pm

MBTGOG wrote:Just as I say it, the Sharks score a stunner of a second try through the centre, Paul Jordaan. Wonderful hands in the ten metre channel out on the right to put him through and he then puts a wonderful step on Ioane to leave him for dead.

Great foray down that right hand side. 17-0 now. Bad luck about Lucas' injury but the Reds are struggling big time.

by MBTGOG Sat Jul 21, 2012 12:12 pm

I know you're not T.

Notch,

It is very good. Sharks have planned this game very well and it's their forwards doing all the damage especially in the wider channels. Coetzee has been excellent.

Breaker,

I'll tell you something, I think if Nathan Charles played for the Reds, he'd be ahead of Faingaa for the Wallabies.

by red_stag Sat Jul 21, 2012 12:12 pm

Hi all. I see that new Munster coach Rob Penney sat down with Declan Kidneyfor an ' honest and robust' discussion about Irish rugby. Excellent.

Should have Elwood Anscombe and Schmidt involved too

by **rodders** Sat Jul 21, 2012 12:14 pm

Hoog wrote:"no good person should own a gun"

I used to clay pigeon a fair but when I was back home, why shouldn't I be allowed to own my own shotgun??

Because I don't think recreational enjoyment is a sufficient or legitimate reason to own a tool which can end someone or something elses life with the pull of a trigger.

If the gun is purely for clay pidgeon shooting then there is no reason for it to leave the firing range.

by MBTGOG Sat Jul 21, 2012 12:15 pm

Hoog wrote:"no good person should own a gun"

I used to clay pigeon a fair but when I was back home, why shouldn't I be allowed to own my own shotgun??

Do you really need a real gun?

by Thomond Sat Jul 21, 2012 12:16 pm

Rodders, I think that is an odd arguement. Couldn't you say that any thing that could be used as a weapon shouldn't be at home so? I shouldn't own a hurley because you can batter someone with it? Or a Hammer or Axe or something like that?

by **Pal Joey** Sat Jul 21, 2012 12:16 pm

Greg Inglis in big trouble. A huge forearm pole-axing Dean Young as he was falling in a tackle from Farrell. Collected him right in the head. It looked awful. He'll get a few weeks (at least) for sure. 16-4 to the Bunnies.

by MBTGOG Sat Jul 21, 2012 12:18 pm

Thomond wrote:Rodders, I think that is an odd arguement. Couldn't you say that any thing that could be used as a weapon shouldn't be at home so? I shouldn't own a hurley because you can batter someone with it? Or a Hammer or Axe or something like that?

None of those were intended as weapons when they were created and their primary uses still aren't weapons. There is the difference.

by MBTGOG Sat Jul 21, 2012 12:20 pm

And the Reds respond through Will Genia.

by Suspicious lurker Sat Jul 21, 2012 12:20 pm

rodders wrote:
Hoog wrote:"no good person should own a gun"

I used to clay pigeon a fair but when I was back home, why shouldn't I be allowed to own my own shotgun??

Because I don't think recreational enjoyment is a sufficient or legitimate reason to own a tool which can end someone or something elses life with the pull of a trigger.

If the gun is purely for clay pidgeon shooting then there is no reason for it to leave the firing range.

With one swing of my arm I can stab someone with my chopping knife. Where will I have to keep that so rodders??

by Suspicious lurker Sat Jul 21, 2012 12:21 pm

MBTGOG wrote:
Hoog wrote:"no good person should own a gun"

I used to clay pigeon a fair but when I was back home, why shouldn't I be allowed to own my own shotgun??

Do you really need a real gun?

??

I'm confused munsty, are you asking me if you use a real gun for clay pigeon shooting??

by Thomond Sat Jul 21, 2012 12:22 pm

Hoog, if I were you I would keep it in a safe. You know that way no one will get hurt.

I know we have no American football fans in here but I'm going to plug this anyway: https://www.606v2.com/t32816-jerry-kramer-to-the-hall-of-fame-qa#1410532

by **Pal Joey** Sat Jul 21, 2012 12:24 pm

MBTGOG wrote:
Breaker,

I'll tell you something, I think if Nathan Charles played for the Reds, he'd be ahead of Faingaa for the Wallabies.

Good call mate. He's played very well in a struggling team whilst Anthony Fainga'a has had an average season and is over-rated, imo.
His bro is alright though.

by **rodders** Sat Jul 21, 2012 12:26 pm

Maybe there is no compromise in my view in this because I grew up and still live in a society where people with firearms terrorise their own communities. Cowards and thugs who would be nothing without the weapons they wield. I walk past these people in the street and they are nothing, not hard or dangerous or scary. Cross them and they pick up their guns blow your kneecaps out, if you are lucky.

Its the same in areas of the US and mainland Britain would be the same if the gun laws were relaxed.

People say its not the guns, its the people. Well I say bad people exist everywhere but that it's the guns that empower them to carry out actions they wouldn't otherwise be able to.

by Thomond Sat Jul 21, 2012 12:28 pm

Rodders, in the south of Ireland people do the same thing. They use a knife. Different weapons. Bad people are bad people, they will still commit an act like this if they want to, they mightn't cause as much damage but they will cause some.

by **rodders** Sat Jul 21, 2012 12:29 pm

MBTGOG wrote:
Thomond wrote:Rodders, I think that is an odd arguement. Couldn't you say that any thing that could be used as a weapon shouldn't be at home so? I shouldn't own a hurley because you can batter someone with it? Or a Hammer or Axe or something like that?

None of those were intended as weapons when they were created and their primary uses still aren't weapons. There is the difference.

+1

same with the chopping knife, they have a functional purpose other than a weapon. I have Ice axes which would cut through flesh like a knife through butter but that isn't their purpose. Its different. Anything can be a weapon but a gun can only be a weapon.

by Thomond Sat Jul 21, 2012 12:31 pm

It can be used for sport but yes it's main purpose it harm.

by **rodders** Sat Jul 21, 2012 12:32 pm

Thomond wrote:Rodders, in the south of Ireland people do the same thing. They use a knife. Different weapons. Bad people are bad people, they will still commit an act like this if they want to, they mightn't cause as much damage but they will cause some.

Trust me Thom if you've been confronted with a knife and confronted with a gun then you will know the difference. Against a knife you have a chance against a gun and someone who can use it you have none.

by Suspicious lurker Sat Jul 21, 2012 12:33 pm

Thomond wrote:Hoog, if I were you I would keep it in a safe. You know that way no one will get hurt.

I know we have no American football fans in here but I'm going to plug this anyway: https://www.606v2.com/t32816-jerry-kramer-to-the-hall-of-fame-qa#1410532

There is no question about that T, it would always be in a lock box, however that wasn't the point that was made. The original point was that no good person should own a gun. Which I believe is wrong. Also that I shouldn't own something that is primarily deigned to kill. This I disagree with as well. My shotgun is designed to shoot clay pigeons however if someone had the intent to use it as something else they could. Now the same could be said for the pen in my hand, its designed got writing however of someone had the intent to use for something else they easily do that as well.

So really what I'm trying to say is, its not the gun that's the problem its the mindset of the holder

by MBTGOG Sat Jul 21, 2012 12:33 pm

Hoog,

I mean the idea is trying to see how accurate you are right?

If that is the case, using a real firearm is not necessary, right?

by MBTGOG Sat Jul 21, 2012 12:35 pm

Thomond wrote:Rodders, in the south of Ireland people do the same thing. They use a knife. Different weapons. Bad people are bad people, they will still commit an act like this if they want to, they mightn't cause as much damage but they will cause some.

So why not try to remove as much damage as possible?

by MBTGOG Sat Jul 21, 2012 12:37 pm

Thomond,

Excuse me, but I an Eagles fan here and I think you may have forgotten that. I certainly don't follow it as much now though as I just don't have the time.

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