Wallaby v All Blacks: Live Match Thread

[Pal Joey]

First topic message reminder :

1st Match: 2012 Bledisloe Cup - The Rugby Championship
Saturday 18th August, 2012.
Sydney Olympic Stadium, 8:00pm

Wallabies:

15 Kurtley Beale
14 Adam Ashley-Cooper
13 Rob Horne
12 Anthony Fainga'a
11 Digby Ioane
10 Berrick Barnes
9 Will Genia
8 Scott Higginbotham
7 David Pocock (capt)
6 Dave Dennis
5 Nathan Sharpe
4 Sitaleki Timani
3 Sekope Kepu
2 Tatafu Polota Nau
1 Benn Robinson

Reserves:
16 Stephen Moore, 17 James Slipper, 18 Rob Simmons, 19 Radike Samo, 20 Michael Hooper, 21 Nick Phipps, 22 Drew Mitchell


All Blacks:

15 Israel Dagg
14 Cory Jane
13 Ma'a Nonu
12 Sonny Bill Williams
11 Hosea Gear
10 Dan Carter
9 Aaron Smith
8 Kieran Read
7 Richie McCaw
6 Liam Messam
5 Sam Whitelock
4 Luke Romano
3 Owen Franks
2 Keven Mealamu
1 Tony Woodcock

Reserves:
16 Andrew Hore, 17 Ben Franks, 18 Victor Vito, 19 Brodie Retalick, 20 Piri Weepu, 21 Aaron Cruden, 22 Ben Smith

[ChequeredJersey]

I don't think so yet but it looks like it should be soon

[ChequeredJersey]

I think a Civil Partnership is what Portnoy is referring to?

[disneychilly]

Good luck to your son mate.

[wales606]

What, you call someone's perceived errors out and then mention his sexuality as a possible reason? I'm not a mod but there's no need for that crap. Keep anything regarding sexuality to yourself and stick to the rugby.

Ah in that case I might have written 'homo'.

I meant a ref who is prone to blow in favour of home sides.

And by 'blow' I mean his whistle.

And by 'whistle' I mean (cont'd p94)...

Comeback of the year so far........................

[Portnoy]

The ironic thing is that nobody challenged me about my contention that Owens is (in my use of the word) a 'homer'.

[ChequeredJersey]

Haven't really thought about it but if the stats backed it up I wouldn't be surprised

[rainbow-warrior]

Is it over yet? Yawn

Yep. Back to sleep sonny.

Hahahaha sonny, what a comeback so typically kiwi, humourless.
Anyway well done NZ'ers for retaining the Bledisloe Cup. Now to win this cup how many other countries did you beat?

[Pete C (Kiwireddevil)]

The ironic thing is that nobody challenged me about my contention that Owens is (in my use of the word) a 'homer'.

It's been said that he favours the home side fairly regularly Portnoy, nothing controversial there.

In NZ we would use the phrase "home-towner" to describe a ref who favours the home side - I have to admit the first couple of times I saw the NH variant used I did a double take.

Though today I don't know if the Aussies would have scored even with an "awayer" ref ...

[Pete C (Kiwireddevil)]

Is it over yet? Yawn

Yep. Back to sleep sonny.

Hahahaha sonny, what a comeback so typically kiwi, humourless.
Anyway well done NZ'ers for retaining the Bledisloe Cup. Now to win this cup how many other countries did you beat?

Speaking of humourless responses

Now can we put the bickering to rest before the obvious rejoinder about teams that can't beat Australia comes out.

[Rory_Gallagher]

Is it over yet? Yawn

Yep. Back to sleep sonny.

Hahahaha sonny, what a comeback so typically kiwi, humourless.
Anyway well done NZ'ers for retaining the Bledisloe Cup. Now to win this cup how many other countries did you beat?

Are you a welsh supporter by any chance?

[boomeranga]

Well done by the All Blacks. Just too good for us with too much power and quality.

Not many bright spots for us. I was pleased with Sita Timani, and Hooper played well for his first start. Hopefully Drew Mitchell hasn't re-damaged his bad ankle. Could be the end of him.

[rainbow-warrior]

Is it over yet? Yawn

Yep. Back to sleep sonny.

Hahahaha sonny, what a comeback so typically kiwi, humourless.
Anyway well done NZ'ers for retaining the Bledisloe Cup. Now to win this cup how many other countries did you beat?

Are you a welsh supporter by any chance?

Does it matter who I support?

The thing that makes me laugh is the way this 'Cup' is falunted like some great trophy! It's as silly are that thing the ITM cup teams play for some Caerphilly shield or summat.

[ChequeredJersey]

Is it over yet? Yawn

Yep. Back to sleep sonny.

Hahahaha sonny, what a comeback so typically kiwi, humourless.
Anyway well done NZ'ers for retaining the Bledisloe Cup. Now to win this cup how many other countries did you beat?

Are you a welsh supporter by any chance?

Does it matter who I support?

The thing that makes me laugh is the way this 'Cup' is falunted like some great trophy! It's as silly are that thing the ITM cup teams play for some Caerphilly shield or summat.

Well not really as a) it's rather historic, like the Calcutta Cup

B) it's between the official 1st and 2nd best sides in the world, 2 of the sides that have been far more dominant in rugby than any NH side in both recent and distant(ish) History

[Portnoy]

Haven't really thought about it but if the stats backed it up I wouldn't be surprised

Not stats but:
http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/sport/2012/0618/1224318139449.html
http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/letters/2012/0622/1224318456515.html
http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/sport/2012/0619/1224318193236.html

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/sport/2012/0518/1224316280348.html (not so much a criticism but the journo's use of the word 'shirty' in the title made me giggle)

http://www.irishchampion.co.nz/brave-ireland-rumbled-by-new-zealand-in-historic-test/
http://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/ireland-denied-by-referee-error-3140507.html
http://www.skysports.com/rugbyunion/match_report/0,,11069_52803_1,00.html
http://www.espnscrum.com/2011-rugby-world-cup/rugby/story/150912.html
http://www.emarketingmag.com/06-16-2012/47/England-tour-of-South-Africa-will-be-judged-a-failure-but-not-an-abject-one.php
http://mg.co.za/article/2011-10-15-warburton-card-costs-wales-while-launching-france-into-final
http://www.rugbyrefs.com/showthread.php?10820-Nigel-Owens-Positioning


All blah blah moan moan.

All I can say is that if Owens is the ref away against Tigers/England I shudder with fear. Witness his 2009 HEC final with the arm-tugging off the ball in the line-out all day long. Homer. Homer. Homer. (blah blah moan moan.)

[yappysnap]

Owens is always like that, on the plus side though he'll never be able to favour the Welsh

[rainbow-warrior]

Owens is always like that, on the plus side though he'll never be able to favour the Welsh

He could have a drug and alcohol problem, get kicked out of the Welsh ref's, go to another country and get put on their ref's list.

[aucklandlaurie]

Is it over yet? Yawn

Yep. Back to sleep sonny.

Hahahaha sonny, what a comeback so typically kiwi, humourless.
Anyway well done NZ'ers for retaining the Bledisloe Cup. Now to win this cup how many other countries did you beat?

Rainbow

The Bledisloe cup, the biggest trophy in International rugby is contested between Australia and New Zealand, who also happen to be the two highest ranked nations in World Rugby, I'd of expected even someone with bare minimal of rugby knowledge to know that.

[aucklandlaurie]

Haven't really thought about it but if the stats backed it up I wouldn't be surprised

Not stats but:
http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/sport/2012/0618/1224318139449.html
http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/letters/2012/0622/1224318456515.html
http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/sport/2012/0619/1224318193236.html

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/sport/2012/0518/1224316280348.html (not so much a criticism but the journo's use of the word 'shirty' in the title made me giggle)

http://www.irishchampion.co.nz/brave-ireland-rumbled-by-new-zealand-in-historic-test/
http://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/ireland-denied-by-referee-error-3140507.html
http://www.skysports.com/rugbyunion/match_report/0,,11069_52803_1,00.html
http://www.espnscrum.com/2011-rugby-world-cup/rugby/story/150912.html
http://www.emarketingmag.com/06-16-2012/47/England-tour-of-South-Africa-will-be-judged-a-failure-but-not-an-abject-one.php
http://mg.co.za/article/2011-10-15-warburton-card-costs-wales-while-launching-france-into-final
http://www.rugbyrefs.com/showthread.php?10820-Nigel-Owens-Positioning


All blah blah moan moan.

All I can say is that if Owens is the ref away against Tigers/England I shudder with fear. Witness his 2009 HEC final with the arm-tugging off the ball in the line-out all day long. Homer. Homer. Homer. (blah blah moan moan.)

Portnoy:
I saw you mention this homer thing earlier, Are you saying that New Zealand got some extra advantage from Owens because the game was at Eden Park? If so how do you arrive at this opinion?

[rainbow-warrior]

Is it over yet? Yawn

Yep. Back to sleep sonny.

Hahahaha sonny, what a comeback so typically kiwi, humourless.
Anyway well done NZ'ers for retaining the Bledisloe Cup. Now to win this cup how many other countries did you beat?

Rainbow

The Bledisloe cup, the biggest largest trophy in International rugby is contested between Australia and New Zealand, who also happen to be the two highest ranked nations in World Rugby, I'd of expected even someone with bare minimal of rugby knowledge to know that.

[nganboy]

ho hum troll

[Rob B]

Hard to watch that.

Just dont have a chance without an in-form first 15 taking the field.

With injuries to Pocock, Horwill, O'Connor, Kepu, Paulu, TPN, McCabe.

And with Cooper, Beale simply out of form, there's no chance this was going to be a nail biter. Have barely noticed Ioane all year.

W defence was very good leaking only 1 try but the balance of the game still showed a lot of AB dominance.

Deans is all over the place. He sticks with invisible non test standard players like Rob Horne and Ben Alexander no matter what then drops Beale after 1 bad game.

On top of that as i have said before picking half the side from the woeful Waratahs who (through Barnes and AAC) bring their brainless gameplan of kicking quality attack ball away, little wonder that performance was reminiscent of all that was wrong with the Waratahs this year: no flair in attack so let's kick the ball away! (eg Barnes on the AB's 22 booting the ball straight to an AB player). Brainless.

Deans is not helped with all the injuries which seem to keep coming every week of the season. Will be a long season for him. McKenzie will have the job by the end of the year.

[Taylorman]

Hard to watch that.

Just dont have a chance without an in-form first 15 taking the field.

With injuries to Pocock, Horwill, O'Connor, Kepu, Paulu, TPN, McCabe.

And with Cooper, Beale simply out of form, there's no chance this was going to be a nail biter. Have barely noticed Ioane all year.

W defence was very good leaking only 1 try but the balance of the game still showed a lot of AB dominance.

Deans is all over the place. He sticks with invisible non test standard players like Rob Horne and Ben Alexander no matter what then drops Beale after 1 bad game.

On top of that as i have said before picking half the side from the woeful Waratahs who (through Barnes and AAC) bring their brainless gameplan of kicking quality attack ball away, little wonder that performance was reminiscent of all that was wrong with the Waratahs this year: no flair in attack so let's kick the ball away! (eg Barnes on the AB's 22 booting the ball straight to an AB player). Brainless.

Deans is not helped with all the injuries which seem to keep coming every week of the season. Will be a long season for him. McKenzie will have the job by the end of the year.

+1 Rob, nails it overall.
Oz is unique in its positioning of rugby with all things Oz sport.

I think thats the area Deans fell down in. He came from a nation and region rich in players falling over themselves and doesnt seem to have got himself involved in the issues around youth player retention, attracting players to the game, the sxv franchis make up etc. He must have thought the talent would be on tap, and given theyre not, isnt skilled in the area to do anything about it. I don't actually know whether thats the case but it appears that way.

Ewan McKenzie has a good finger on the rugby pulse of Oz and brought his Reds side up through it to an acceptable level.

Its a big problem for Auckland and I know Henry particularly is keen to stop this under 20 league movement in the area.

In saying that the scrambling defence was remarkeable I thought. Wave after wave was relelled and the score should really have been a lot higher.

[George Carlin]

Can I ask Linebreaker, Boomer and the other Aussie folks on these boards how long they think that Dingo has left as coach? This is assuming that the beat the Pumas and get at least one win against the Bokke.

[kiakahaaotearoa]

Not an Aussie GC but I think you've highlighted the results Deans needs to retain his job. Especially if the ABs win their other games or close to it, then that helps him keep away the critics.

Lose next week against the Boks and you'd think McKenzie would be coach at the end of the year.

[gowales]

They won't fire him before the end of the 4 nations but if he loses the majority of the games left and they also play crap then he will probably be gone before the November internationals.

There needs to be a major review of rugby union in Australia as well though in my opinion. The state of the game isn't very healthy in terms of depth and competitiveness and then you add on top of that the recent 1 billion$ tv deal the NRL just got and things are looking pretty disastrous for the future.

[kiakahaaotearoa]

He'll do himself a lot of favours if he gets rid of Barnes. I don't know how much ball he kicked away aimlessly but it seemed like he was going for the World Record. If you're struggling to get the pill, you can't gift it back so quickly. Inexcusable!

[Pal Joey]

George, I reckon not too much longer the way we've been going. Agree with Kia re Barnes and the prospect of McKenzie being in the picture soon... maybe after the 4N if we can't salvage something worthwhile after a disastrous campaign thus far. I feel sorry for Robbie in a way but he seems to struggle to articulate himself in the current situation. I think it's both a player selection problem (of which he obviously plays a major part) as well as his leadership of this group of players... maybe he's hit the wall on both counts and his laid-back damage control method has simply not produced enough fruit.

The thing is gowales is that there is no equivalent to NRL in club rugby in Australia. It has always been that way.

You'll never get a situation where the 2 codes will be on parity at club level competing for the $. SXV is in a small vacuum of it's own here... miniscule following generally; but numbers pick up when a franchise does well once in a blue moon. Except for the Reds last year and this year - all the other franchises must be hemorrhaging the $ in a big way. Internationally, the irony is that union gets a few big games a year here (bigger attendances than an RL international) and the rest of the time, 99% of people would be hard pressed to name the RU clubs from which the international players originate.

It is a very, very odd situation and I am surprised that we have managed to hold our own against most countries (save for NZ and SA) most of the time - but that's the way it is. It sort of defies a rational explanation but at the same time I can see that the national obsession with the related oval football sports probably drags our RU game up to an above average level once in a while and gives us that hard to define x-factor.

[gowales]

Australia definitely punches above their weight in union when you really look into it.

[funnyExiledScot]

I still think there's a very harsh appraisal of Deans going on here.

The real test for him in this championship is staying ahead of SA, if he achieves that then he's done well. Losing to the ABs is no shame at the moment - they are as strong as they've even been. Rod MacQueens great Australia team of 1999 would struggle against this All Blacks side.

I watched the game on Saturday and could not believe how much ball Australia kicked away. That cannot have been a pre-determined tactic, not against Israel Dagg at 15, one of the best counter-attacking and kicking 15's I've seen in a while, combined with the excellent Cory Jane. Barnes was awful at 12, and Horne completely anonymous. Tell me this though - who is Deans not picking that he ought to? Personally I'd stick Beale back at 15 and let him rebuild form and confidence in the jersey. There's no-one else for that position, and AA-C is badly needed back in the centres in my view.

I'm not an avid Aussie fan and I'm sure there are deeper issues than this, but to me I think Deans is struggling (a) due to injuries to key players, (b) because the key players who are fit are off form, and (c) lack of depth in his forwards.

Too early to give him the boot. Assess things at the end of the Championship.

[bluestonevedder]

Watched the match replay last night, and thought I'd throw in my two cents.

Timani was brilliant for Australia, and god what a lump he is. Fantastic defense, and good carrying too. A real handful all day.
Hooper had a decent first cap, though teetered off from his explosive start.
Dennis is absolutely anonymous, and sewriously needs to step it up. Both games so far, he's done nothing, and has been completely outplayed.

Messam for NZ was outstanding, and is coming into his own.
Read likewise, was sublime in the second half.
Ben Smith proved what he can do on the international stage!
McCaw's still got it.
Sonny Bill Williams could offload a rugby ball if he was wearing a straight jacket.

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