Isle of Muck hailed as rugby world champions...

First topic message reminder :

Stephen Jones claim yesterday that the Isle of Muck are rugby world champions based on per-capita basis. But he provide no clear working of his methodology to arrive at this conclusion.


http://i.stuff.co.nz/sport/olympics/7437138/Stephen-Jones-is-an-Olympic-Kiwi-baiting-champ

Can anybody suggest how is working might have been carried out? or was it just a clumsy two-pronged attack on NZ that would have been a weak WUM even by 606 standards?

Bad news for ENG and WAL however if this were true, because they would slipping down and out of the RWC seeded spots!

In the Olympics New Zealand athletes were competing against other athletes from almost every country on the planet, Not just Wales.

In rugby, when the All Blacks play a test against Wales, no other countrys are involved

I am not trying to excuse our media, they are big and ugly enough to look after them selves, Further,I wouldnt be so churlish as to suggest that China or the USA out performed Great Britain at the Olympics, nor would the New Zealand media so it would seem.

No but you were all over the Aussies when you had the chance.

You arent special cases.

Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:No but you were all over the Aussies when you had the chance.

You arent special cases.

We all knew that the Aussies had quite a number of events to come, in which they were entitled to be very confident in getting podium places.

Laurie, there must be some examples of people who've left New Zealand and now work in other countries, e.g. Australia, as journalists? Do their views represent the whole of New Zealand, or even those of their new country?

I still can't believe you're holding a whole nation (Wales) accountable for the words of one ex resident.

Griff
I really struggle to think of a New Zealand journalist, that has moved overseas and carried on a crusade against any another country, like Stephen Jones has done.

Sprio Zavos, might come close, as he like all New Zealanders is very proud of what the All Blacks continually achieve, and he often reflects that sentiment. Spiros does have to be educated on some of the finer points of rugby every now and then, and on those occasions he is prepared to take on board advice that he is given or at least discuss it.

Who is this NZ journalist? I am personally offended by him and now think that all New Zealanders think this way. I can't believe all New Zealanders are like this, who'd have thought it?

http://m.smh.com.au/world/kiwi-says-australian-wwi-soldiers-were-bludgers-and-thieves-20120423-1xfzi.html

Kiwi says Australian WWI soldiers were 'bludgers and thieves'
April 23, 2012
The Anzac spirit has taken a knock following a Kiwi journalist's comments that Australian World War I soldiers were bludgers and thieves.
The comments, by journalist Jock Anderson, were made during a Radio New Zealand panel discussion about a new book by former Australian Army officer and Department of Veterans Affairs historian Graham Wilson.
In Bully Beef and Balderdash, Wilson questions myths surrounding Australia's all-volunteer forces who fought in WWI and WWII - including the legend of the Australian bushman who transformed into natural warrior on the battlefield.
Advertisement

Anderson said that was absolutely a myth.
"The Aussies have been reluctant soldiers at the best of times, and they've been essentially bludgers, some of them - excellent black-marketeers, scavengers, poachers and thieves," he said.
"Occasionally, they've actually been quite good soldiers, but there was no way that they can hold a candle, in my opinion, to the Kiwis."
Fellow panelist Josie McNaught said she was sick of hearing the claim Australia's national identity was forged on the battlefields of WWI, calling it a "ridiculous cliche" which was "based on very little".
Queensland Returned and Services League chief executive Chis McHugh, a former Royal Australian Air Force navigator, said Anderson's comments were offensive.
However, "Australians have thick skins" and he didn't think anyone would be really hurt by the opinions of one man, Mr McHugh told Paul Henry on Network Ten's Breakfast program on Monday.
When Henry said there'd been a suggestion that Australia's official war historian Charles Bean had "essentially made yarns up", Mr McHugh said Bean's historical accounts had stood the test of time and it remained to be seen whether Wilson's book would.
"Jock's made those comments and his co-host made those comments and they need to support what they're saying, rather than basically having a go at people like me," Mr McHugh said.
"I've served with New Zealanders. I thought they were great and they thought we were great."
AAP

Griff

No, of course Anderson doesnt express the opinion of all New Zealanders, and this point was made abundantly clear by our Prime Minister, John key on 23 April 2012.

Key said he found Andersons opinion offensive.

Has the Prime Minister of Wales ever come out and said that any of the many Stephen Jones venomous comments over the years about the All Blacks, New Zealand and New Zealanders are offensive?

My point is that we all have d*ck heads in our nation. They say stuff the rest of us don't agree with. But that's free speech I guess. What can you do? You certainly don't blame the whole population as you seem to be doing. Ease up on the Welsh nation and target the individual instead. Hell, write a letter to his pay masters if it makes you feel better (although I expect you've already done this).

The comments Stephen Jones has written over the years have been rubbish, but not bad enough to get the prime minister (the UK prime minister that is; we don't have a Welsh prime minister as such. It's complicated.) to make a statement.

Griff wrote:My point is that we all have d*ck heads in our nation. They say stuff the rest of us don't agree with. But that's free speech I guess. What can you do? You certainly don't blame the whole population as you seem to be doing. Ease up on the Welsh nation and target the individual instead. Hell, write a letter to his pay masters if it makes you feel better (although I expect you've already done this).

The comments Stephen Jones has written over the years have been rubbish, but not bad enough to get the prime minister (the UK prime minister that is; we don't have a Welsh prime minister as such. It's complicated.) to make a statement.

+1

Griff wrote:My point is that we all have d*ck heads in our nation. They say stuff the rest of us don't agree with. But that's free speech I guess. What can you do? You certainly don't blame the whole population as you seem to be doing. Ease up on the Welsh nation and target the individual instead. Hell, write a letter to his pay masters if it makes you feel better (although I expect you've already done this).

The comments Stephen Jones has written over the years have been rubbish, but not bad enough to get the prime minister (the UK prime minister that is; we don't have a Welsh prime minister as such. It's complicated.) to make a statement.

Clearly on the money. The man is a fool.

By the way, the UK Prime Minister - my Prime Minister - wears those stretchy bicycle pants with the extra cushion on the bum. Hopefully only when he is on his bicycle and not under his clothes though I wonder at times. Not sure he knows what a Rugby ball looks like or reads about Rugby in the papers.

griff
If wales hosted the WC who would be the official representative of the Welsh people? Would it be the UK prime minister?

I hasten to add Its an innocent question.

Gav

Her Madge, gawd bless her!

aucklandlaurie wrote:
griff
If wales hosted the WC who would be the official representative of the Welsh people? Would it be the UK prime minister?

I hasten to add Its an innocent question.

Hi Laurie,

I'm not sure who'd do it to be honest. It would probably be Carwyn Jones the First Minister for Wales. Tony Blair (UK PM at the time) certainly wasn't involved at the 1999 world cup in Wales. I was just pointing out that we don't have our own prime minister as only a few areas of policy are devolved to Wales. I wouldn't expect those from other countries to realise or understand because it's so complicated, so I was just pointing that out.

In terms of our First Minister, I don't know if he would have the 'jurisdiction' to come out and question something written outside of Wales. He certainly couldn't influence it. If it was really serious then obvious yes he would say something. But I'm not sure this can be classed as that, even if it is 'venemous'.

Tom Jones.

No, surely it would have to be Max Boyce at the Millenium ?
If he still around ?

Griff wrote:

aucklandlaurie wrote:
griff
If wales hosted the WC who would be the official representative of the Welsh people? Would it be the UK prime minister?

I hasten to add Its an innocent question.

Hi Laurie,

I'm not sure who'd do it to be honest. It would probably be Carwyn Jones the First Minister for Wales. Tony Blair (UK PM at the time) certainly wasn't involved at the 1999 world cup in Wales. I was just pointing out that we don't have our own prime minister as only a few areas of policy are devolved to Wales. I wouldn't expect those from other countries to realise or understand because it's so complicated, so I was just pointing that out.

In terms of our First Minister, I don't know if he would have the 'jurisdiction' to come out and question something written outside of Wales. He certainly couldn't influence it. If it was really serious then obvious yes he would say something. But I'm not sure this can be classed as that, even if it is 'venemous'.

I have a feeling that it would be Prince William, as he is the Patron of the WRU. Personally I would rather he wasn't as he is about as welsh as those green men who live on mars, but he is, and as such I think he would open a RWC in Wlaes.

The Queen is the patron and William is Vice Royal Patron according to the WRU site, so I guess it would be one of those two.

Don't forget, it's a British monarchy (not English).

In that case it would be Harry (Henry) who is Prince of Wales now.

Griff wrote:In that case it would be Harry (Henry) who is Prince of Wales now.

Harry is not prince of wales, he is Henry Of Wales. Charlie is Prince of Wales.

William is Vice-Patron of the WRU ( http://www.wru.co.uk/eng/thewru/history/patrons.php ), so it would be him, as the RWC is the WRU not the WAG (Welsh Assembly Government).

(p.s. I would rather see bloody Gavin Henson do it as at least he is welsh)

Sorry, yes. What I meant (and I may be wrong) is that Harry has taken over the 'Welsh' duties from William???

But to answer the OP, the head of state for Wales (1st Minister) would probably be involved, as Rhodri Jones used to do when he had the job.

Thanks Griff, I now see the problem you face.

A country needs to have a leader.

aucklandlaurie wrote:

Has the Prime Minister of Wales ever come out

No but Alfie did

This has been a great read. Can't say the same for Stephen Jones. Thankfully timesonline is no longer free to read which is why I guess he feels the need to make these obnoxious comments to drum up some more readers.

Doc, I remember talking to Jason Leonard and he said SJ doesn't even bother going to the games. If you believe he's on the money about his rugby comments it's because he never makes any specific ones to criticise. It's all soundbite and hot air. Have you seen the teams he comes up with for England?

Sadly, there is so much news today that we are inundated with banal, inane stories. Players are given media training to not give ammunition to the opposition. It's all so dull and predictable. Sometimes I feel as if I'm not missing out on much with zero rugby press where I live. Indeed, I think it's a blessing.

Its not that long ago (just before the World Cup) that Stephen Jones was saying that the All Black forwards were not as good with the inclusion of Brad Thorn, and that Graham Henry was either very brave or very stupid by including SBW in the midfield and breaking up the Nonu/Smith combination.

hardly a great bastion of rugby knowledge?

aucklandlaurie wrote:

Thanks Griff, I now see the problem you face.

A country needs to have a leader.

A country needs a leader??? We have, the UK has a prime minister and a queen.

So maybe the Queen or the Prime Minister could go round to Stephen Jones' house and give him a slap and tell him to pull his head in as he is giving all the Welsh people an unfair bad name.

In other words step up like our PM did with the incident you correctly cited above.

If you dont have a leader, the citizens will all start running amuck, and next thing you know the whole joint disintergrates into bedlam.

But the incident I cited was pretty big. The Stephen Jones thing is not that big. Where's your prime minister coming out in the press to denounce Stephen Jones? He's not, because it's not that big. Just as the Prime Minister didn't come out to denounce Chris Rattue for his comments.

Calling the war hereos of a whole country theives and bludgers is a worse 'crime' IMO, hence the difference in reaction from the heads of state.

Yes Griff, I agree the Anderson incident was far more serious,insullting and embarrassing, and far worse than anything Jones has done over his 20 year anti New Zealand campaign.


You were the one that raised it (and correctly so), all I did was merely point out how New Zealand dealt with it.

aucklandlaurie wrote:

Thanks Griff, I now see the problem you face.

A country needs to have a leader.

Yeah but they still won't hand all the power over to me!

kiakahaaotearoa wrote: Have you seen the teams he comes up with for England?

Have you seen the teams that Stuart Lancaster comes up with?

aucklandlaurie wrote:
So maybe the Queen or the Prime Minister could go round to Stephen Jones' house and give him a slap and tell him to pull his head in as he is giving all the Welsh people an unfair bad name.

In other words step up like our PM did with the incident you correctly cited above.

If you dont have a leader, the citizens will all start running amuck, and next thing you know the whole joint disintergrates into bedlam.

Youve seen what happens when they put a welshman in charge, the first thing he does is try to drop a frenchman on his head.

Mind Nick Griffin is welsh isnt he....

May be they could make Xavier Prime minister he must know all the petrol stations that are open at 2am in Cardiff by now.