Goodbye Oh minions

First topic message reminder :

Hello



It is a sad day but alas as it has been decreed so it must come to fruition.

I am leaving the board - this will be my final post.

I debated with myself long and hard as to whether or not I should make this post, whether there was any point in outlining my reasons for leaving. In the end I decided to do so. So here goes..

I was not a big fan of Tenez. His obssessive and repetitive posts I found extremely tedious. I could sympathise with Lydian on the many occasions when he remarked that Tenez was stifling the board and not allowing other members any breathing space. It seemed every post was hijacked by his agenda, and then that agenda was forcefully reiterated again and again ad nauseum. However, Tenez was at least willing to engage in debate. He would at the very least counter the points made by an antagonist and then answer them in his own fashion. He didn't wholesale ignore the other side of the arguement, instead he countered it with his own arguements. On the whole his arguements could be quite convincing (not always). Unfortunately, as already mentioned, he did have an overbearing tendency to insist that he was right and was never willing to compromise or even agree to disagree.

With this in mind, and given the recent history of the board, it saddens me greatly to see the same tactics employed by another poster. Constantly hijacking every thread with the same distorted viewpoint. All roads essentially leading to the same conclusion. Here is an example of the dross that we've been subjected to for months now:

"It will be close as I predict every possible flavor of cupcake draw will be fed to federer between now and the end of the season as his fans in the tournament organizing committees will do their best for team Nike and toss Roger gooey cupcake after gooey cupcake to give him the best possible chance of pulling off the first stolen #1 ranking in history as Djokovic gets the death semi in every tourney, coincidentally of course."

I'm sure everyone can recognise the author of that post. And that is just one out of dozens of posts repeating the same garbage, yet unlike Tenez, when challenged, this poster does not even attempt to refute the arguements (at least not in any coherent or honest manner); he simply repeats the same. To be honest I've had enough. What's even more disconcerting is the propensity of this poster to then misquote and even alter the statements of others to suit his own agenda. Instead of engaging in honest intellectual debate, this poster has managed to turn the board into a yet another battleground, after much progress had been made.

I do not write this post to stifle freedom of expression, rather to encourage it. The problem with such obssessive tunnel vision is that it does not allow room for true intellectual exchange. It forces everyone into camps and views become entrenched with no compromise or indeed desire to compromise. The board becomes a caricature of a discussion platform; a playground were people spit and bite. What is the point of starting a discussion or contributing to one when you have absolutely no desire to even consider the counter arguements or responses to your own - why not just talk to yourself? I accept that the poster in mind is not the only one to do this, but his posts are certainly the most ubiquitious, childish, and entrenched.

So there you go..

I've said my piece..

Now I must continue my search for BOO. The hour draws near..



emancipator - intergalatctic tennis historian and eternal foe of BOO.

Indigo sometimes legend

Well if living in Oxford makes you a Toff, then me living in Brighton, well I live with a Mr LK

legendkillarV2 wrote:Well if living in Oxford makes you a Toff, then me living in Brighton, well I live with a Mr LK

I'm glad you've come clean, I thought I was going to have to drag you out of the closet

legendkillarV2 wrote: ... I can't imagine you turning the air blue TP

Oxford blues?

so droll! It must just be so much fun being you Nore. I wonder if your chuckle muscles ever get any rest? - Ah well back I trudge to my ivory tower or is that my dreaming spire

Very sad to think people don't want to be on here anymore. Do hope they will reconsider.
Points to make:
1. If you're not getting anywhere with one particular posting just give up on that one and go to another
2. Just ignore any rude or ignorant comments
3. Grow a thick skin. Remember that "real" bullying is getting beaten up behind the bike sheds or being constantly verbally abused in person.
There should be something for everyone on these boards.

Wow, wow a lot of emotions here.

Firstly I would like to point out that over the last few months this tennis forum has been extremely busy. By my count in all of 606v2, apart from Rugby Union and WWE it has been the busiest sport that has been discussed- and a lot of this is due to the hard work and dedication of the mods here- Laverfan and Julius.

Not only has this tennis forum expanded a lot, it also now has a lot more variety. There are many people with different views, with different opinions, who are not afraid to voice it. Not everyone agrees with each other, but that would be boring right.
We have fans of many different players. There are huge numbers of Federer fans, many Murray and Nadal fans. The only thing is that there is a slight lack of Djokovic fans, but he'll get more fans as time goes on I assume.

Also let's not lose sight of the picture. 606v2 is expanding rapidly, and the tennis forum has too. There have been a lot of posts on their thread, a lot of people venting their frustrations but at the end of the day I have only seen 2 members who have actually said they want to leave the site.

Emancipator:
I was very unhappy when I read this article- as I believe you are a great poster and an asset to the forum. In many arguments I believe your sense of humour can be the perfect catalyst- your posts are always interesting and has the ability to surprise. I can understand your frustration, but if the reason for you leaving is simply one poster, there is a filter. You click on their profile and click the 'add to foe' button. This means their posts essentially 'disappear' for you and you can no longer see them.
I do hope you decide to reconsider your decision, I, and many others, truly believe you are a great poster.

Lydian:
I will be sending you a PM shortly

I will get slagged no end for this statement, but I consider a poster leaving, of their own volition or otherwise, as a personal slight. It makes me feel that I have failed the poster(s) and something akin to a parental disappointment follows.

If this sounds like emotional blackmail, it is not intended to be. To each his own.

PS: I hope logic prevails over emotion in decisions with a long-term impact.

Some build bridges others burn theirs at both ends. I reckon LF the first applies to you

Well emancipator, I am sorry that you have decided to call it a day and leave the tennis forum. One thing I would say is that you should not allow someone you have never met in person to get under your skin to such an extent that you decide leave an internet forum. To say I have never allowed anything said on here to get under my skin would be hypocritical. However, I always remind myself that there is a bigger world beyond this forum and that there are real flesh and blood people who I have real relationships with. Thus, I take internet fora such as this and the people who post on them for what they are: components of a an alternate universe.

I will not comment directly on the specifics of your rift with socal, as I think it is not my place to do so. I would just caution that you remember the friendly advice that I have given you regarding allowing the opinion of others to unsettle you.

I never new cupcakes could be fatal I suppose. I for my part have been testy in the last couple of months I don't deny it, many posters like to have a go at me, so I thought they could handle little of it back. I admit that the cromagnon post is insulting, but without delving into specifics I have said my piece as to the reason for it. For my part I am happy to give you all a draw rigging moratoriom till the end of the year. I always want the forum to grow and I guess certain posters are just too sensitive to discuss the controversial topic.

Here is my oath" I socal having been a bad cupcake wielding poster promise that I will not call draws fixed or rigged or start any threads of said nature until the end of the WTF, I will allow Roger to enjoy his gooey cupcakes without complaint"!

Nore Staat wrote:Some build bridges others burn theirs at both ends. I reckon LF the first applies to you

socal1976 wrote:Here is my oath" I socal having been a bad cupcake wielding poster promise that I will not call draws fixed or rigged or start any threads of said nature until the end of the WTF, I will allow Roger to enjoy his gooey cupcakes without complaint"!

Youse da man.

Why do people do this? Why do they put a post up telling everyone that they will not post again?
I realise that posters such as emancipator contribute much more and more often to this forum than I do so Is it an attempt to improve the forum (in the eyes of the poster) by listing the reasons for their self-imposed exile in the hope that those left will heed the warning and change? Is it arrogance that they feel that their opinion is so much sought after that they ‘have’ to make the apocalyptic statement? Why don’t they just not make any more posts?

You’ll, no doubt, be happy/disappointed/utterly disinterested that this, very probably, will not be my last post

Bradman: I agree. Also, I am not a minion

I've thought a lot about this thread the last couple of days and certainly miss emancipator and lydian, but hope to see them back.

I think this forum has to be a bit careful though. I was totally against the banning of Tenez and NITB. I found Tenez very interesting, but yes slightly entrenched on one issue but nevertheless his exchanges with lydian were some of the best reads on here because they were both articulate with a knowledge of playing the game to a good standard and they both strongly disagreed with each other - I have to say I appreciate subtle things while watching matches that I hadn't noticed before after reading both of them (and it goes without saying that there many things I disagreed with). There was a vendetta against Tenez, and I don't believe it came from lydian who was sometimes passionate in his debates with T, but he was always willing to debate vigorously. There was a subtle campaign I feel by ex members who targeted a moderator pretending to be would be posters whose only reason for not joining was T - did they all suddenly evaporate into the ether, because I haven't seen a stampede to enlist after T's departure. I still can't get over seeing some of the people who lamented 606v2 with Tenez there and yet rushed straight over to that other place. Indeed I feel that some posters have an almost Mary Whitehouse like complex where they won't feel happy until all the internet sings to the tune they deem appropriate. NITB was really good bubbly internet fun. I can't possibly, and nor would I want to, comment on postings I didn't see. From my perspective, it is a real shame she and Tenez aren't still here.

I say this now because while I will miss emancipator very much, I don't like the targeting of socal in this way - it's good to have posters with a controversial point of view.

The thing I would say is that I do believe that the situation could be avoided if discussions that are so controversial that they get up over half the forum's noses are shepherded towards one thread to not bring every other thread to the same impasse. And, that maybe posts like Veejay's which were in a different league altogether from anyone else's are discouraged before a poster really has the bit between his teeth - sorry VJ if you are reading this but I don't believe most of your posts should have been allowed to stand. I wouldn't ban someone for writing unfounded accusations, but I would ask them immediately to rewrite or see their post removed.

At the end of this long bit of waffle, I would just like to ask posters whether they want a bland forum or whether they are willing to accept that freedom of speech sometimes means having the responsibility to understand you may be offended by someone else's right to exercise the same. It is not good enough to say that some of the most entrenched posters clog up the forum - there is unlimited space to create new threads, and certainly it would seem that these posters are missed even by some of their detractors.

I would like to echo one of TP's points and that I don't believe for a second that lydian was instrumental in the banning of Tenez or any other member for that matter. The guy was a founding member of another tennis forum on the net which has a high level of activity so I fail to see why he would even consider going down such a route to have members banned from another forum.

I don't like seeing posters banned or leave, but if their conduct warrants that then it is down to that individual. I am not saying in anyway that Tenez or NITB deserved their bans, but some for example like Seifer who's posting wasn't to my liking at all. He brought an intensity to disliking players and styles that I have never witnessed ever.

I don't like the singling out of posters as it does come across as a them or me blackmail situation. There are many views by posters I don't agree with, but there are many that I do. I think the best thing I have learned is to keep quiet on subjects that I know irritate me.

legendkillarV2 wrote:I don't like seeing posters banned or leave, but if their conduct warrants that then it is down to that individual. I am not saying in anyway that Tenez or NITB deserved their bans, but some for example like Seifer who's posting wasn't to my liking at all. He brought an intensity to disliking players and styles that I have never witnessed ever.

I think there are definitely posters out there who are very destructive, not only in their postings but also because they can be abusive to other forum members so that their contribution tends to have a negative value and very little positive upside.

Tenez, if we are being critical, may sometimes have been dismissive but certainly didn't fit the description above, and nor did NITB. I hope they are both happy in the other place - I did join for a while, but I wasn't so keen on the football mob that descended before and during a big tournament and I sort of only have the energy/inclination to post in one place - so you lot are stuck with me

I objected to Tenez being banned at the time - it was completely over the top and this forum hasn't been the same since. What's more there are other posters that were just as guilty of his "crimes".

TBH I've kinda given up on this forum - there's no tennis on so it has degenerated to endlessly discussing the same stale conspiracy theories - there's better things to do one feels...

TBH I've kinda given up on this forum - there's no tennis on so it has degenerated to endlessly discussing the same stale conspiracy theories - there's better things to do one feels...

Conspiracy is the word on most of the forums ATM TBH.

Let's hope the tennis can give the masses something good to discuss

Along with giving up on here Reckoner, can you also give up on Radiohead. A really dull band one must say.

Meh who cares what you think Josi

Thought you'd given up on this forum? No?

Well then, don't tell porky pies.

Learn to understand qualifiers Josie.

I too find that poster absurd and annoying, but I have contented myself with mocking and destroying his positions, and observing with amused detachment his reaction to the toppling of his hero by a player in the twilight of his career.

Very sorry of emancipator s going but I can see his point; whilst not formally retiring from the board I have become sufficiently bored by that poster to find plenty of other things to do recently.