On the verge of greatness

First topic message reminder :

Which players in your team are on the verge of greatness. the NZ Herald has listed Aaron Smith, Isreal Dagg, Kieran Read and Sam Whitelock are on the verge of greatness (http://www.nzherald.co.nz/best-of-sport-analysis/news/article.cfm?c_id=1502180&objectid=10830212). Apart from the pointless comparison with the 87 team it's an interesting point.

To my mind they are probably right. I'd say the likes of Carter and McCaw are the obvious greats. I'd add Tony Woodcock as being there. In addition to the players listed as potential greats I'd add Sonny Bill and Jerome Kaino (if they come back), Nonu and Jane.

So to my mind, the current team has the following:

Great AB's
Woodcock
Carter
Conrad Smith
McCaw

Potential great AB's
Dagg
Jane
Nonu
Sonny Bill Williams
Smith
Read
Kaino
Whitelock

It's probably a bit harsh on Mealamu and Hore, who are both very good All Blacks. Some of the others (e.g. Cruden) just haven't played enough rugby.

Only time will tell. What do you think? How do you see your own team?

I stand corrected.
A problem for me is I have not really watched a lot of 6 nations rugby so I tend to see BOD playing us which means his success rate (my viewing of) is not great.

I've seen bod enough times to respect him as a great player. For me he's always stood out as someone who can make a dfference to the sides he's in, partly because those around him aren't as good, partly because he knows its often up to him to make that difference. That to me makes a great player. Plus he's scored a couple of very good 'stuff you kiwis' tries against us where he took the abs on, on his own. Only the great ones tend to do that.
Hard to say how great he is given the company he's in. How would he go in a side like the ABs? Well he wouldnt go worse thats for sure.
Is he as good as Umaga, Smith etc?
Possibly.

nganboy wrote:I stand corrected.
A problem for me is I have not really watched a lot of 6 nations rugby so I tend to see BOD playing us which means his success rate (my viewing of) is not great.

there in lies the problem of how to rate a player.

Team performance is the collective of 15 guys, one can make the other look good, average or brilliant.

Hence greatness in my view is in the eye of the beholder.

Or in Meyer's case Morné Steyn is in the lap of the beholder.

kiakahaaotearoa wrote:Or in Meyer's case Morné Steyn is in the lap of the beholder.

The Bulls player's have compromising photo's of Meyer.













Problem is they aren't as compromising as his position in the eyes of the public.

So he doesn't like people watching then.

He said he didn't like the looks people gave him. Though a mitigating factor was that those looks were upside down because he was grabbing his ankles at the time.

That's about as compromising a position as a man can get into.

You would have to think history will be the judge.
The relatively recent introduction of World Cups tends to cloud our judgement in my opinion.
Just to name a few rugby legends who would have been no less great without a RWC winners medal.

Let me throw a few names at you...

Before my time ...
Barry John, Willie J McBride, Colin Meads, Frik du Preez, Hennie Mueller

Who i saw play
Andy Irvine, Phil Bennet, John Eales, Jonathon Davies(1980s version), Serge Blanco,

Aside from Richie I will reserve my judgement of greatness til they are long retired. (if any other player gets 3 IRB Player of Year award they can stand alongside Richie!)