Aviva Premiership Round 2

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Friday 7th September

Harlequins v London Welsh

Preview

Harlequins Team
15. Mike Brown, 14. Tom Williams,13. George Lowe,12. Jordan Turner-Hall,11. UgoMonye,10. Nick Evans,9. Karl Dickson
1. Joe Marler,2. Joe Gray,3. James Johnston,4. Olly Kohn,5. George Robson,6. MaurieFa'asavalu,7. Chris Robshaw ©,8. Tom Guest

16. Rob Buchanan,17. Darryl Marfo,18. Kyle Sinckler,19. Charlie Matthews,20. Nick Easter,21. Danny Care,22. Ben Botica,23. Matt Hopper


London Welsh Team:
15. Tom Arscott, 14. Phil Mackenzie*, 13. Sonny Parker*, 12. Hudson Tonga’uiha*, 11. Joe Ajuwa, 10. Gordon Ross*, 9. Tyson Keats,
1. Frank Montanella*, 2. Neil Briggs, 3. Paulica Ion*, 4 Jonathan Mills ©, 5. Matt Corker, 6. Daniel Browne, 7. Mike Denbee, 8. Ed Jackson.

16. Dan George, 17. Tom Bristow, 18. Arthur Joly, 19. Kirill Kulemin*, 20. Alfie To’oala*, 21. Nick Runciman, 22. Seb Jewell, 23. Nick Scott.



Saturday 8th September

Bath v London Wasps 14:15 ESPN

Preview

Bath Team:
Abendanon; Eastmond, Hipkiss, Banahan, Biggs: Barkley, Claassens
Catt, Mears, Wilson; Hooper (capt), Day, Taylor, Fearns, Skirving.

Batty, James, Palma-Newport, Attwood, Ovens, McMillan, Devoto, Cuthbert.


Wasps Team:
Southwell (capt); Varndell, Daly, C Bell, Wade; Robinson, Simpson;
Payne, Lindsay, Stainbano; Palmer, Wentzel; Haskell, Poff, Vunipola.

Rhys Thomas, McIntyre, Taulafo, Launchbury, Johnson, Davies, T Bell, Mayor.


Leicester Tigers v Worcester Warriors

Preview

Leicester:
Murphy (capt); Hamilton, Tuilagi, Allen, Goneva; Flood, Harrison; Stankovich, T Youngs, Castrogiovanni; Kitchener, Parling; Mafi, Salvi, Waldrom.

Replacements: Hawkins, Mulipola, Cole, Andrew, Crane, Phibbs, Ford, Smith.


Worcester:
Pennell; Drauniniu, Grove, Matavesi, Lemi; Goode, Perry; Mullan, Lutui, Andress, Percival, Schofield (capt); C Jones, Betty, Taulava.

Replacements: Hayes, C Jones, Currie, Gillies, Kvesic, Arr, Carlisle, Howard.


London Irish v Gloucester

Preview

London Irish:
Homer; Ojo, Joseph, Tagicakibau, Yarde; Shingler, O'Leary; Lahiff, Lawson, Halavatau; Skivington, Evans; Danaher (capt), Treviranus, Fisher.

Replacements: Blaney, Aulika, Ryan, Low, Gray, Watson, Geraghty, Moates.


Gloucester:
May; Sharples, Trinder, Twelvetrees, Simpson-Daniel; Burns, Robson; Wood, Dawidiuk, Knight; James, Hamilton (capt); Savage, Hazell, Morgan.

Replacements: Edmonds, Murphy, Harden, Kalamafoni, Qera, Lewis, Tindall, Thomas.


Sale Sharks v Saracens 16:30 ESPN

Preview

Sale:
Miller; Addison, Leota, Tuitupou, Cueto; Cipriani, Peel; Lewis-Roberts, Ward, Cobilas; Gray, Myall; Gaskell, Seymour (capt), Vernon.

Replacements: Taylor, Dickinson, Thomas, McKenzie, Easter, Cliff, Macleod, Uys.


Saracens:
Goode; Ashton, Tomkins, Barritt, Wyles; Hodgson, Wigglesworth; Vunipola, Brits, du Plessis, Borthwick (capt), Botha, Brown, Fraser, Joubert

Replacements: George, Saunders, Nieto, Hargreaves, Wray, De Kock, Farrell, Short.



Sunday 9th September

Northampton Saints v Exeter Chiefs 15:00 Sky

Preview

Northampton:
Foden; K Pisi, G Pisi, Waldouck, Artemyev; Lamb, Dickson; Tonga'uiha, Hartley (c), Mujati; Manoa, Day; Dowson, Wood, van Velze.

Replacements: Haywood, Waller, Mercey, Sorenson, Oakley, Roberts, Myler, Burrell.

Exeter Chiefs Team:
15 Luke Arscott 14 Josh Tatupu 13 Ian Whitten 12 Phil Dollman 11 Matt Jess 10 Ignacio Mieres 9 Will Chudley;
1 Brett Sturgess 2 Chris Whitehead 3 Craig Mitchell 4 Tom Hayes (capt) 5 Aly Muldowney 6 Tom Johnson 7 James Scaysbrook 8 Richard Baxter

16 Simon Alcott 17 Ben Moon 18 Chris Budgen 19 James Hanks 20 James Phillips 21 Kevin Barrett 22 Gareth Steenson 23 Sireli Naqelevuki

no yellows though?

Tigers going for the push over

not looking good for bananaman

Barkley pings last minute penalty for the second week in a row.

Bath 30 Wasps 20

Wasps have penalty to salvage losing BP, last kick of the game.

Robinson nails it for a well deserved LBP.

Final score at the Rec:

Bath 30 - Wasps 23.

Happy with that. Plenty of positives but still some short-comings that will get exploited by the top teams if they're not fixed soon.

PJHolybloke wrote:Barkley pings last minute penalty for the second week in a row.

Bath 30 Wasps 20

Wasps have penalty to salvage losing BP, last kick of the game.

not a good result for me!

Good win Bath. Banahan was huge. Hope he's ok. He got his side moving forward today. As did Abendanon. Think Wasps deserved that LBP.

Try for the Tigers at the start of the second half by Goneva.

22 - 9 to the Tigers.

Banahan did what he does best at 12 Gibbo, breaks the gainline, draws in defenders and makes space around him, the new coaching team have worked on his kicking game with some success.

Bendy was man of the match for me, Barkley was imperious with the boot again, Eastmond showed glimpses of magic and Claasens managed the tempo brilliantly.

However, Louw's absence is really hurting and apart from Fearns, the Bath back row were largely anonymous. Skirving is cover and Taylor just isn't in the mix for me.

Try for Worcester (Lemi) after Tigers mistake.

22 - 16 to the Tigers.

lots of little errors by the Tigers as per usual.

another yellow Worcester, perry(9) not sure why yet.

Penalty try for the Tigers or the bonus point.

29 - 16 to the Tigers.

Hawkins coming on, good to see him make his return.

Try for Tigers (Kitchener)

34 - 19 to the Tigers

Looking at the Sale game, the grand stand is disappointingly empty. But they are asking 45 quid a ticket to sit there...

It would make sense to near half that price, Cumbrian. 25 quid. Better than empty seats. But they will build the home-crowd, if they get some kind of success on the field. That must happen, now they have invested in a 25 year contract for the stadium. They have bought in well also. I hope they have a good season, as they are really making the effort.

Gibson wrote:It would make sense to near half that price, Cumbrian. 25 quid. Better than empty seats. But they will build the home-crowd, if they get some kind of success on the field. That must happen, now they have invested in a 25 year contract for the stadium. They have bought in well also. I hope they have a good season, as they are really making the effort.

Agreed, always better to have a bum on a seat, even if it is for less wonga. As a supporter of northern rugby I really want them to do well too and I think they are going in the right direction. I think I'll drop in to catch a game on my way home to the lake district at some point. Fingers crossed for them.

What about the recruitment of Rob Andrew in the second row? Leicester already have Louis Deacon, Geoff Parling, Graham Kitchener, Ed Slater and Steve Mafi as first teamers who can play there. Why wouldn't they give one of their academy second rowers like Harry Wells (England U20), Tom Price (England U20) or Joe Cain a chance to play back up?

Deacon is a long term injury problem, Parling is now an England regular, Slater is struggling with his knee injury and Kitchener is an England Saxon. Call ups and injuries could easily leave us with no available experienced second row. Mafi is 22 and a poor second row, he is only cover *much like Croft is only lock cover) and a much better backrower. Price is also out injured, Wells is likely to be a long term 6 ala Croft and all three of the academy locks are slowly bulking up and getting the required physicality. Currently known of them are viable enforcers. Hence we signed the big Bok Andrew to add some chunky squad cover.

I'm generally of the opinion that more chances should be given to the academy players but in this instance I think bringing in Andrew was a good call. I'd happily select all of the other 4 senior locks ahead of him and I want to see Price and Cain pair up in the second row in the LV Cup (with Wells on the blindside) but we needed a back up enforcer who could play in the HEC if required so Andrew was worth signing.

Incidentally we've seen Cockers promote players from the academy into back up positions in the squad (prop, centre, 9, 10, wing) ahead of this season. Just as Tigers have done with Cole and Smith the academy players have to force their way through over time. Cockers believes shirts need to be earned over time not just gifted which tends to breed quality but is smaller numbers from the academy than say Quins but it's worth noting that Quins have roughly the same number of players in the England squad and less in the first team.

Geoff Parling and Deacon I'll give you. I'll bow to you greater knowledge on Mafi, (but at 6ft 7in and 17 ½ stone+ and prior experience of the position, I'm sure he could make a fair fist of it) I'm assuming that Slater's injury isn't career threatening? So he is likely to be back pretty soon you'd have though (Certainly in time for A.I call ups)? Kitchener may be in the Saxons squad, but there doesn't actually appear to be any Saxons games any time soon. Added to the fact that those two are better than a lot of teams first choice pairings.

I don't want to get on Cockers' back unnecessarily, but I hate to see journeymen in premiership teams.


I'll agree with earlier comment too though, I'm more concerned about Sale's EQP figures.

I'm assuming that Slater's injury isn't career threatening? So he is likely to be back pretty soon you'd have though (Certainly in time for A.I call ups)? Kitchener may be in the Saxons squad, but there doesn't actually appear to be any Saxons games any time soon.

If Parling or one of the other first team locks picks up an injury I would imagine that Kitchener would be a prime candidate for a call up as he is a Saxon and went on the tour to SA. He strikes up a good partnership with Parling over the next month or two and Lancaster will be tempted to see if they can provide the consistentcy England need in the second row.

As for Slater he missed the end of last season, had surgery and was supposed to be fit for the start of the season. That has now been put back a month. There's been little news on it but as Slater and Deacon are much needed to add the physicality in the tight (Slater is a big lad) in order for the Tigers set piece heavy game plan to work it is a blow.

Btw Mafi is half a stone + lighter than Deacon, Slater and Andrew. He isn't really the grunt merchant, maul and scrum engine Tigers require their 4 to be. He makes a brilliant 6 mind, which is where I think Wells will end up as he has a damn good tackle count and makes a great additional lineout option. Cain at 19 could be the next to follow on as a mobile enforcer but I'd rather we built him up over the next two years and then released Andrew in time to promote Cain in behind Slater as the two first choice enforcers (as sadly I believe Deacon will have retired by then).

Now if you'd questioned why Tigers have handed an extension to Niall Morris a slightly average but well rounded Irish full back or brought in the explosive but defensively poor Goneva on the wing rather than giving Lewington more game time I'd be with you all the way.

Glaws have finally won!!

It's been a long time coming, but we're hopefully back on track. Our forwards were excellent today and the likes of Savage and Morgan were outstanding. The backs are still too rusty, but as long as we're winning it will come. The Irish backs were excellent today especially Ojo, Yarde and Joseph.

I do have a question for Ozzy and other Irish fans. The attendance today was 5,800. I would have expected far more for the first home game of the season but is this the norm? Surely this level of attendance can't be could for balancing the books.

HKC,

Did the return of Hamilton help. I also notice there were significant changes in the back row from the match with Saints.

Finally, how did 36 do?

LT, Jim played and led the team well. The backrow were far better. Tom Savage was oustanding and Ben Morgan had a cracking game too. Hazell was a bit quiet at the breakdown, but did well in defence. Have Q & K to come on from the bench helped too.

The backs weren't great and 36 didn't have the best of games. They still haven't got the understanding of how each other plays, but it'll come so I'm not concerned.

Some good games yesterday - nobody side playing outstandingly well yet but that will come and there was plenty of entertainment. I think professional rugbyin the NH should seriously consider switching to the summer.

Cumbrian wrote:Looking at the Sale game, the grand stand is disappointingly empty. But they are asking 45 quid a ticket to sit there...

Attendance was just short of the 7500 break even figure they need, so not too bad.

nobody side playing outstandingly well yet but that will come and there was plenty of entertainment. I think professional rugbyin the NH should seriously consider switching to the summer.

No, there'd be all manner of problems specifically the costs of maintaining pitches that aren't rock solid. The water bills would be hefty. There's also the issues surrounding the clashes with the RL season and those teams sharing with football clubs would suddenly be left without a team during the season in which to reseed etc the pitches. You'd also have to get all the different unions to agree and whilst the Rabo lot would probably jump at the chance I can see the RFU and French Union being very much against the change.

Any Wasps fans out there who can cast any light on Wellies (Stephen Jones). You guys seem to be experiencing narrow losses and he is the expert at closing out games.

He was carrying and injury thoughout last season but still played well enough to get into the Wales Grand Slam match day squad. Why isn't he playing, is he injured or is he on a pay for play deal so not being picked to save money?

I think he's injured Seagultaf, the young 10 Tommy Bell who is on the bench is unlikely to be keeping him out of the team at the minute. With Masi injured in the first game as well I would imagine Dai Young will be keen to bring more experience into the side rather than sit someone with his experience in the stands.

LondonTiger wrote:

Cumbrian wrote:Looking at the Sale game, the grand stand is disappointingly empty. But they are asking 45 quid a ticket to sit there...

Attendance was just short of the 7500 break even figure they need, so not too bad.

Fair enough, I suppose I was expecting a sell out because it was the first time they'd played in their new home. Mind you, they normally play on a Friday night, so I think that will be the true acid test.

Just saw the Kyle Eastmond try for Bath against Wasps, that was a bit special!

TBP for Saints - yet chiefs are still in it. JP Doyle has had some interesting interpretation on what is allowed at ruck time, which Chief's have capitalised on.

How can it be wheeling when both props on the penalised team moved forwards?

Exeter are being robbed here!!!

8 shouldve been red carded for a pretty obvious tip/spear, Exeter scored a try but deemed short, from the resulting ruck dickson dives offside to knock the ball out of a hand, and from that penalty a quick tap 3 yards out not one defender was near the try line...

IMO Exeter have been robbed!

I agree No 8 should have seen red (and Waldouck yellow) but other than that I reckon Exeter have got away with a shedload. That is coming from someone with no love for Saints.

Exeter always get away with shedloads, thats just part of their game.

Cracking try for exeter, LBP minimum.

I don't like either team particularly but exeter have been on the rough end of some big calls!

Northampton probably deserved the win, just but Exeter deserve that point!

I thought it should have been a red and I'll admit I didn't particularly like the new Northampton no.8 on first viewing. But I also agree that Exeter got away with murder at the break down and in the maul, particularly in the first half. They constantly had players in at the side and lying on the wrong side/ not rolling away.

Well that was a good round for me on superbru, sadly it will be downhill from here on in.

LT, when do we meet you guys this season? Already can't wait

Two weeks time, up at WR

We have Sarries first though. Going from the two worst teams to (excluding us) the two best. An interesting month

Fairplay to Saints, already beaten the best two sides.

formerly known as Sam wrote:

I think professional rugbyin the NH should seriously consider switching to the summer.

No, there'd be all manner of problems specifically the costs of maintaining pitches that aren't rock solid. The water bills would be hefty. There's also the issues surrounding the clashes with the RL season and those teams sharing with football clubs would suddenly be left without a team during the season in which to reseed etc the pitches. You'd also have to get all the different unions to agree and whilst the Rabo lot would probably jump at the chance I can see the RFU and French Union being very much against the change.

There are no problems which RL hasn't had to face and overcome. There is already a clash with RL for a couple of months of the season which doesn't seem to cause much in the way of trouble. AP sides should be moving away from playing at football grounds anyway, and the primacy of tenure review on-going may force this anyway.

Getting all the unions to agree may well not be possible, but summer professional rugby would be a better product.

DaveM wrote:Getting all the unions to agree may well not be possible, but summer professional rugby would be a better product.

It would end up being a different game - and get even closer to looking like RL. Each to their own as to whether it would be better.

Seeing a steaming pack on a bitterly cold night or a scrum dominate in torrential rain for me is just as good, if not better, than free flowing backs. The beauty of the current system is that we get both and I'd definitely want it to stay that way.

One things for sure, the Saints need to sort out there discipline. 4 yellows in 2 matches.

nathan wrote:One things for sure, the Saints need to sort out there discipline. 4 yellows in 2 matches.

I do not know about the game v Glaws, but certainly yesterday the second card left me baffled. Mind you Waldouck should have seen a YC for the most cyncical killing of the ball I have seen. I would have been tempted to award a Penalty Try.


All in all, an interesting start to the season. Most teams are looking to play the ball quickly and attack seems to have the upper hand over defence (for now). 64 tries in 12 matches makes for very sad defence coaches

Interesting difference in the way refs are handling the 'play it' law at rucks. So say "play in" as soon as the ball is available and then the team has 5 seconds. Others wait until the SH leaves it for a bit...then says "use it"...then gives them 5 seconds. It makes quite a bit of difference. I prefer the former.

It sometimes seemed that Shaun Perry was allowed to handle the ball first before the ref started the count.

At one Worcester defensive ruck we started counting when he "adjusted" the ball. He then looked up, had a chat with Andy Goode before passing it as the count reached 10. Thing is they did this too often in attack as well. Tigers would have struggled if he had moved it quickly.

LondonTiger wrote:

nathan wrote:One things for sure, the Saints need to sort out there discipline. 4 yellows in 2 matches.

I do not know about the game v Glaws, but certainly yesterday the second card left me baffled. Mind you Waldouck should have seen a YC for the most cyncical killing of the ball I have seen. I would have been tempted to award a Penalty Try.


All in all, an interesting start to the season. Most teams are looking to play the ball quickly and attack seems to have the upper hand over defence (for now). 64 tries in 12 matches makes for very sad defence coaches

They came to Kingsholm with the intent to kill the ball and in fairness to them it worked. There first yellow was after about the 3rd final warning. The offence was minimal but was a team yellow. PDJ was binned for persistent collapsing of the scrum

nathan wrote:One things for sure, the Saints need to sort out there discipline. 4 yellows in 2 matches.

And one of those could easily have been a red - wonder if we might see a citing for the 'tip'?