Time to man up Vitali!

Let be honest we all knew that Haye would not retire imo it was just a plan to make Wladamer fight him! Haye has said he wants to fight Vitali so now it is time for Vitali to man up and accept the challenge. The heavyweight division is boring without Haye and it needs him to beat Vitali to add excitement. Hayes fight with Chisora was better than all of the Klitchkos fights combined! So why wont Vitali fight Haye? Imo Vitali knows Haye would destroy him. Look at who the Klitchkos have been fighting they are guys that nobody has heard of?? Vitali says he is getting into politics but imo this is an excuse so he can take easy fights. He is far to old and slow and Haye would have to much speed and skill for him. If Vitali does not accept Hayes challenge he should retire because tbh no one wants to see him fight nobodies. Haye v Vitali is the fight people want to see in the heavyweights and then a rematch with Wlad after Haye destroys Vitali it would be a grudge match! I reckon Vitali could barely beat chisora and then he saw how Haye destroyed him and thought thanks but no thanks so now he is saying he will get into politics but lets be honest what does a boxer like Vitali know about politics?? So man up Vitali and accept Hayes challenge he said he wants the fight it is the fight everyone wants to see!

Waingro is cpatain's alias, the times of their departure and return are just too close. You've been caught Captain, man up and admit it.

I'm slightly suspicious myself here, Jeff. I mentioned this poster's name the other day, and lo and behold it turns up again after an aeon in purdah. I have a strong idea that this is a duplicate of another poster well known to us all.

However, I shall be keeping the ignore list in use on this occasion.

Keep to the thread lads and don't divert.

Anyway, what's he talking about?

Just a bit of sleuthing and some random connections here - but in the film Heat, the character Waingro was played by a bloke called Kevin Gage, who subsequently was busted for growing vast quantities of dagga. Now who was it among our fraternity who was particularly extolling the virtues of the weed of wisdom the other day?

Haye's had plenty of chance to fight Vitali but just went after his perceived "weaker" brother, but when he started to realise Vit Klitschko wasn't what he was he starts mouthing off to try and gain even more money despite his disgraceful showings at heavyweight. I kind of hope it happens but it wouldn't be any loss if it didn't. Haye is a disgusting man, classless.

captain carrantuohil wrote:Just a bit of sleuthing and some random connections here - but in the film Heat, the character Waingro was played by a bloke called Kevin Gage, who subsequently was busted for growing vast quantities of dagga. Now who was it among our fraternity who was particularly extolling the virtues of the weed of wisdom the other day?

CC becomes CCC. Captain 'Columbo' Carrantuohil.

i don't care whose alias waingro is, i'm just delighted to see him back.

captain, someone recently thought i was your alias. Given that such alter ego's are generally buffoon's sent to wind people up, i was somewhat put out by the assertion

i don't care whose alias waingro is, i'm just delighted to see him back for the enjoyment given to all

captain, someone recently thought i was your alias. Given that such alter ego's are generally buffoon's sent to wind people up, i was somewhat put out by the assertion

And then you go and add weight to the argument

I've missed this, Gordy seems to go away and Waingro is back for all to enjoy.

ShahenshahG wrote:And then you go and add weight to the argument

you calling me fat?

...i see the parenting brotherhood is but a distant memory

Dont know what you've done to deserve such an unfortunate comparison, milkyboy. As long as you remember to say that Ken Buchanan could do no wrong, nothing will matter too much.

milkyboy wrote:

ShahenshahG wrote:And then you go and add weight to the argument

you calling me fat?

...i see the parenting brotherhood is but a distant memory

The parental brotherhood is in full flow my friend but we tease the ones we love and sometimes people we meet on a boxing forum. Speaking of which, is the milkybar kid teething yet? My daughters found many ways to deal with the pain. Biting my arms, stabbing me with my keys and digging her claws into my face My respect for my parents is at an all time high and still growing

Vitali has nothing to prove. If he chooses to retire, then good luck to him.

Haye really should be given the fight he wants, and any woman he wants, and in fact pretty much everything he wants.

He would deserve it for being a fantastic human being.

Then after he retires he should be made the new James Bond, obviously if that is a role he would like.

I personally don't think Vitali deserves the fight, after all he only beats bums and the fact that Haye beat Chisora in a better fashion means that in everyones eyes Haye is the current champ.

Anyway, when does strictly start proper?

Tomorrow I believe Huw, I totally agree about Haye, to be honest though I am not sure what you suggests goes far enough, not even sure why he should be made to fight Vitali to win the belt surely Vitali should just give Haye the belt in recognition of the fact he would clearly beat him and is clearly superior to him and indeed everybody else in the division.

Would echo your comments re James Bond Huw, however as a committed fan of the series my only fear is given how great Haye would obviously be in the role when it came time for him to retire or move on to bigger and better things (Prime Minister, pope, god perhaps) the series would obviously have to end because it goes without say that nobody would be able to follow him

The worst thing that could ever happen would be for Haye to fight and beat Vitali.

The man would be insufferable in the aftermath, even more so than he is now. In his head, he will view himself as a heavyweight great, having beaten an old, slow Vitali at the very end of his career. He wouldn't stand a chance against a "prime" Vitali, but that wont' stop him endlessly stroking his ego and reminding us all that he beat a fighter that has, along with his brother, dominated the HW division for a long time. Beating an old, slow Vitali will somehow, in his eyes, elevate him to a great heavyweight. In reality his record looks like:

Monte Barrett - LOL!

Valuev - A freakishly large human being that is actually a pretty crap boxer in reality

Ruiz - Old, slow and at the end of his (average) career

Audley - OMG TBH MEGA LOL!

Wladimir - Pat his shants once he got in the ring and blamed it on a toe

Chisora - A decent showing against Vitali, but in reality he'd lost 3 of his last 4 fights and is a British/ Euro level fighter at best.


But somehow, in his eyes, beating an old. slow Vitali will validate his status as a heavyweight, and he'll remind us of it forever, and ever, and ever.

This fight shouldn't happen. Vitali should retire and Haye can bleat until the end of time about how he ducked him. Haye needs the fight and Vitali doesn't.

You have overlooked his masterful one round demolition of Tomasz Bonin...

Group Cpt Lionel Mandrake wrote:

Wladimir - Pat his shants

I should probably delete this as it is a blatant attempt to get round the swear filter but as it is one of the more amusing and clever attempts I'll not bother

Under a year ago I was saying that Haye would beat Vitali because Vitali, who is Wlad's brother (in honour of the thread starter) was slow, plodding and there for the taking. I was roundly criticised and attacked by all corners. Now most are saying he stands a very good chance of winning but that he doesn't deserve it.

Maybe so, but this is boxing where the undeserving get handed belts and the deserving get shafter because allegedly they don't bring money to the table.

Haye brings shed loads of money. He brings interest to the sport and some skill (with mouth and hands). His KO of Del was impressive whichever way you wanrt to look at it. Yes Del was coming of 3 losses in 4 fights. Look at those losses. One outright robbery, one where he was fat and out of shape and one against the world champ. The manner of victory was impressive in that many thought Del would walk him down and Haye would run.

Del walked him down and Haye stood his ground and flattened Del in a devestating manner. Vit didn't even shake Del yet a gut 4 stone lighter took him out. Impressive.

Lets hope the fight goes ahead and for the sake of HW boxing, Haye scores a legit KO.

Bring on the rematch and Wlad to gain more credibility in finally holding all belts and knocking out Haye (which he will).

azania wrote:Under a year ago I was saying that Haye would beat Vitali because Vitali, who is Wlad's brother (in honour of the thread starter) was slow, plodding and there for the taking. I was roundly criticised and attacked by all corners. Now most are saying he stands a very good chance of winning but that he doesn't deserve it.

What can we say, Az. Some people walk down paths, others blaze trails.

Mind the windows Tino. wrote:

azania wrote:Under a year ago I was saying that Haye would beat Vitali because Vitali, who is Wlad's brother (in honour of the thread starter) was slow, plodding and there for the taking. I was roundly criticised and attacked by all corners. Now most are saying he stands a very good chance of winning but that he doesn't deserve it.

What can we say, Az. Some people walk down paths, others blaze trails.

Az said his version of the truth over a year ago. I still say mine today. Vitali would still win against Haye and the only Klitchsko that Haye has a chance against is their mum (and only if he takes her by surprise!). Pity we'll never know the truth!

Mind the windows Tino. wrote:

azania wrote:Under a year ago I was saying that Haye would beat Vitali because Vitali, who is Wlad's brother (in honour of the thread starter) was slow, plodding and there for the taking. I was roundly criticised and attacked by all corners. Now most are saying he stands a very good chance of winning but that he doesn't deserve it.

What can we say, Az. Some people walk down paths, others blaze trails.

Follow me beaches!

azania wrote:Under a year ago I was saying that Haye would beat Vitali because Vitali, who is Wlad's brother (in honour of the thread starter) was slow, plodding and there for the taking. I was roundly criticised and attacked by all corners. Now most are saying he stands a very good chance of winning but that he doesn't deserve it.

Maybe so, but this is boxing where the undeserving get handed belts and the deserving get shafter because allegedly they don't bring money to the table.

Haye brings shed loads of money. He brings interest to the sport and some skill (with mouth and hands). His KO of Del was impressive whichever way you wanrt to look at it. Yes Del was coming of 3 losses in 4 fights. Look at those losses. One outright robbery, one where he was fat and out of shape and one against the world champ. The manner of victory was impressive in that many thought Del would walk him down and Haye would run.

Del walked him down and Haye stood his ground and flattened Del in a devestating manner. Vit didn't even shake Del yet a gut 4 stone lighter took him out. Impressive.

Lets hope the fight goes ahead and for the sake of HW boxing, Haye scores a legit KO.

Bring on the rematch and Wlad to gain more credibility in finally holding all belts and knocking out Haye (which he will).

You are right mate I have ben watching UFC and MMA more and more recently because in those sports the best fights get made and fighters are not allowed to duck other fighters shamelessly. How can people say Haye does not deserve a shot look at who the Klitchkos have been fighting lately none of these guys are anywhere near as god as Haye it is embarrassing! Imo Vitali saw how Haye destroyed Chisora and decided he did not want the fight look at how he is using politics as an excuse this shows that he knows that Haye would destroy him!

I wasn't privy to Waingros first appearances i don't think - can someone link me some classics?

Wish Gordy was here. Imagine the face off - Lewis vs Haye.

[quote="Waingro
Imo Vitali saw how Haye destroyed Chisora and decided he did not want the fight look at how he is using politics as an excuse this shows that he knows that Haye would destroy him![/quote]

Classic. Vitali engineers democracy in his country and then goes back in time several months before Haye fights Chisora to announce that he will be running in the next election he conveniently put at just the right time so as to avoid the humiliation of having to fight Haye. The old democracy election ploy. Oldest trick in the book!

Or Audley vs "Fainting" Phil Scott.

bhb001 wrote:[quote="Waingro
Imo Vitali saw how Haye destroyed Chisora and decided he did not want the fight look at how he is using politics as an excuse this shows that he knows that Haye would destroy him!

Classic. Vitali engineers democracy in his country and then goes back in time several months before Haye fights Chisora to announce that he will be running in the next election he conveniently put at just the right time so as to avoid the humiliation of having to fight Haye. The old democracy election ploy. Oldest trick in the book! [/quote]

Got to love the idea that a 41 year old bloke with knackered knees would need to concoct a political career to avoid someone. Surely he could just retire

Not to mention Vitali actually offering Haye the fight in September but using his psychic powers to realise Haye would instead take the option of Chisora in July. Its an old Klitschko classic, reminiscent of the time Wlad signed to fight Haye but used his pyschic powers to forsee Haye pulling out of the fight.

Why does Haye get abuse for wanting to fight a "past his best" Vitali when Vitali spend a large portion of his career seeking a rematch with an older, even-more-past-it(er) Lewis? A young, fit, healthy Vitali came in a fought an unmotivated, out-of-shape Lennox, gave it the good ol' college try but ultimately came up short. It's the fight which defines him.

Lewis had long since retired when Vitali returned for his second stint as Champion but it didn't stop him suggesting a 45 yr old Lewis was ducking a rematch.

If Haye want's to call out Vitali or Wlad and appear slightly ludicrous in the process...let him. If Ricky Hatton wants to fight Manny, Floyd, Bradley, Khan etc....let him.

As upsetting as it may be for some people...outside of the K Bros fighting one another (certainly on these shores) there isn't any other HW fight which generates any real interest. Even if we "know" Haye is unlikely to triumph and will undoubtedly sell masses of tickets on the promise of fistic annihilation, we will somehow still get sucked into the gravitaional pull of the fight.

Chisora v Haye was supposed to be an abomination to the memory of the great HW's who conducted themselves with distincton honour and pride but it didn't stop thread after thread being posted by people.

The same will happen with this fight

JabMachineMK2 wrote:I wasn't privy to Waingros first appearances i don't think - can someone link me some classics?

Wish Gordy was here. Imagine the face off - Lewis vs Haye.

https://www.606v2.com/sta/Waingro

take your pick mate

Vitali earned his rematch with Lewis through his performance. Haye just wants a shot based on doing the bare minimum. He even had the chance to face Vitali in September but preferred to fight Chisora. ust a case of Haye wanting a fight exactly when it suits him. He forced Wlad to give up the Chisora fight with his bogus retirement nonsense and then was unwilling to do the same when there was a fight with Vitali availably n September. Suspect he will get his fight one way or another. He always gets what he wants.

I have no real problem with Haye wanting the fight Dave it is the sense of entitlement and inference that Vitali is ducking him that goes with it that sticks in the craw. Also the willingness on Haye’s part to completely disregard the countless times the fight has been available to him in the past such as September and on the many occasions him and Wlad were struggling to strike a deal when Vitali seemed only too happy to fill the void.

rowley wrote:I have no real problem with Haye wanting the fight Dave it is the sense of entitlement and inference that Vitali is ducking him that goes with it that sticks in the craw. Also the willingness on Haye’s part to completely disregard the countless times the fight has been available to him in the past such as September and on the many occasions him and Wlad were struggling to strike a deal when Vitali seemed only too happy to fill the void.

Well put.

Vitali is ducking Haye imo. Lets be honest look at who he is fighting lately they are all nobodies. Haye has said he wanted the fight so why is Vitali not accepting Hayes challenge? Vitali is far to old and slow now and Haye would have to much speed and skill for him so this is why Vitali does not want the fight. Vitali fought some guy nobody had ever heard of in his last fight I didnt even watch it because I knew how pointless it was so how can people say that guy deserved the fight more than Haye?? If Vitali does not accept Hayes challenge then he should retire imo because he would not be a true champ.

Waingro, do you honestly think Haye deserves a shot at Vitali and why?

Because if Haye gets a pounding he can compare the beating to the wlad fight and if there is a similarity it may provide yet more proof to Waingros rogue theory that Vitali and Wladimir are brothers.

Haye is the best heavyweight who else deserves a shot? Look at how shameful Wlad was he fought Mormeck who Haye destroyed years ago and fought a guy he already schooled this is why heavyweight boxing is such a mess now because Klitchkos do not want hard fights! Can anyone say Mormeck deserved a shot more than Haye lol?

Haye has already had his shot and he made it the dullest Klitschko fight I have ever seen

But he isnt though is he. Fantastic crusier and average heavy.

A shameful performance/ butt whooped against Wlad (toe excuse doesnt wash)

Beat Audley, woop de doo.

Beat Chisora... and?

I would love nothing more for the heavyweight scene to get back to its amazing status in the past, but Haye is not the man for the job, he isnt even that much of an exciting fighter.

You obviously wont agree with that as seems to be your favourite fighter and you have an unhealthy dislike of the K'Bro's. Have to agree to disagree.

Time for clubber lang to man up!!!

After all he only had one little wupping off Balboa and we haven't seen him since...

The op has a point..I mean wouldn't you be scared of Haye after seeing him run like a thief for twelve rounds against your brother!!!

and he even managed to steal 1/12 rounds......

MAN UP VITALI !!!!!!

ShahenshahG wrote:Haye has already had his shot and he made it the dullest Klitschko fight I have ever seen

And to call the Haye fight dull (which it was) when compared to Wlad's other fights is condemnation indeed.

How can anyone bame Haye for not being exciting he is by far the most exciting out there?? Yes the Wlad fight was dull but that is because Wlad is the most boring fighter in history!

Of course Haye deserves a shot at the title. Who else is there? A Charr rematch. Helensanus? Who? ABH? Anyone But Haye? You guys are replacing objectivity with anto Waingro sentiments.

Waingro says he's 'he is best heavyweight'. love to know how he is, what has he done to deserve that title? Azania says 'who else is there' not really a reason for deserving a shot.

So i'll ask again, what has Haye done to deserve a shot? I may be old fashioned but I believe you only get something from working for it.

I'm not at all surprised to see people voicing their displeasure at Haye, or more crucially his outbursts, fanciful claims and disdain for his fellow professionals. It's par for the course and he does seem to have been taking lessons from Davina McCall in how to be truly annoying.

That said, it does surprise me that so many, seemingly, would remain totally unmoved on how they see his abilities as a fighter should he beat Vitali - which, I have to say, is a little unfair on Haye.

We're already hearing about how Vitali is washed up, how Haye only wants to fight him because he knows Vitali is their for the taking, that a win over Vitali now is pointless and something which Haye would have no right to brag about etc.

Sorry, but if Haye were to beat Vitali, it would be a very fine win and one which shouldn't be unduly marked down or lightly regarded. Certainly, the current Vitali has slipped over the past couple of years, but outside fo his brother, is there a single Heavyweight you'd make him the underdog against, even now? Of course not. Almost all of Haye's biggest critics were saying not long ago that Vitali would grind Haye's bones to make his bread if they ever shared a ring. To then give Haye no credit if he were to make light of those beliefs seems remarkably unfair and skewed, to me.

Vitali is unquestionably inside the top two Heavyweights in the world, has seldom lost more than a couple of rounds in any fight (despite him being "washed up") in the past few years and still poses serious problems for Haye with his height, reach and punching power - all of which are not the easiest thing for a man who could still make Cruiserweight if he wanted to to navigate.

On a personal level, Im no great fan of Haye, either. But let's be reasonable - a win against Vitali would be a very fine one, would confound (at least aprtially) many critics and would be a victory for which Haye would deserve to take some notable plaudits.

If the fight does go ahead and he won then sure id say it was a great win for guy. I just dont think he has some divine right to fight Vitali as he hasnt earned it.

Well he certainly has no divine right (no right at all, in fact) to demand the fight takes place in a certain country, that he deserves so-and-so split of the purse, that Vitali keeps his schedule clear just for him and the like, I'd agree there.

But in terms of having to 'earn' a fight with Vitali, again I'd have to slightly disagree with you. Haye does at least have world championship experience, has traveled to his opponent's back yard for the three most significant fights of his career and, from a technical point of view, is clearly a cut above the majority of other Heavyweights out there, too.

Let's take a few other Heavyweight contenders directly below the brothers; Fury, Povetkin, Helenius, Mitchell, Boystov etc. Of that group, how many of them, in the last fight, produced a performance as emphatic, as impressive and, in some ways, as unexpected as Haye's in his last outing against Chisora?

The Heavyweight pool is pretty shallow right now and it doesn't take all that much to put yourself in the shop window and make yourself a viable opponent. And as such, with all of the aforementioned elements combined, I see Haye's claims being no weaker than just about all others - I'd say his claims are actually stronger, for the most part. Haye-Vitali would be a perfectly legitimate and somewhat natural fight, just as Haye-Wladimir was at the time.