RWC 2015 Stadium Longlist - No Welford Rd

http://www.therugbyblog.co.uk/rugby-world-cup-2015-longlist-of-venues

Can't believe some of the omissions. No Welford Rd but Leicester City Stadium gets the nod? Kingsholm, the only club rugby stadium to make it and who knows if that will even be included on the shortlist?

Congrats to Glos for having Castle Grim chosen but I fail to see which "Off-Field facilities" are deemed superior to those available at Welford Road. Very odd.

Anyone who saw the Tigers v SA game would be surprised by the omission.
Surely 24,000 capacity in a Rugby heartland has something to offer?

http://t.co/wIICi7bU explains the decision, basically the pitch isn't big enough.

I always thought we had one of the best grounds in the Aviva so i'm a little grumpy that we haven't been included.

Can't help but think there doing this purely for money making reasons as there's far more seats at the City stadium and they should be able to fill them with a fair amount of midlands supporters. Still don't think the atmosphere will be any good though.

There will be more than a few grumpy Rugby fans in soulless Soccer stadiums denied the right to drink their pint at their seat!

also a little unsure why the MS is on the list, I don't think the WRU are contributing any funds/resources to RWC2015.

On the BBC article there are some comments from people I recognise from the old BBC 606 days.



Not including Welford Road just seems daft. It can’t be because part of the ground is standing (so is Kingsholm). Is this punishment from the RFU for Tigers Chairman, Peter Wheeler, being one of the main men in PRL’s bid to reorganise the HC? The RFU are certainly not happy about what’s going on.

The price for securing the Welsh support for the RFU bid.
Wales will be at home for their pool games and have a great opportunity to progress.

1. Villa Park, Birmingham
2. Brighton Community Stadium, Brighton
3. Ashton Gate, Bristol
4. Millennium Stadium, Cardiff
5. Coventry Stadium, Coventry
6. Pride Park, Derby
7. Kingsholm, Gloucester
8. Elland Road, Leeds
9. Leicester City Stadium, Leicester
10. Olympic Stadium, London
11. Twickenham Stadium, London
12. Wembley Stadium, London
13. Old Trafford, Manchester
14. Stadiummk, Milton Keynes
15. St James' Park, Newcastle
16. St Mary's Stadium, Southampton
17. Stadium of Light, Sunderland

Pretty shocking omission leaving out Welford Road.

Real pity its going to be in soccer stadia. Would much rather watch a match in welford road than Old Trafford for example.

I just don't see the point of giving the spot to the Leicester city stadium. Why not give that spot to Welford Road? I know Leicester city has slightly bigger capacity but Kingsholm got chosen which has a lower capacity than both Leicester stadiums.

Happy about....

Twickenham Stadium, London
Millennium Stadium, Cardiff
Wembley Stadium, London
Old Trafford, Manchester
Stadiummk, Milton Keynes
Kingsholm, Gloucester

In particular not happy about....

Olympic Stadium, London (seats too far away from the pitch)
Stadium of Light, Sunderland
Pride Park, Derby
Coventry Stadium, Coventry
Leicester City Stadium, Leicester
Villa Park, Birmingham
Brighton Community Stadium, Brighton
Ashton Gate, Bristol

Rugby is massive in the midlands, the south-west and south east. Absolutely shocked Leicester City stadium has been chosen ahead of Welford Road. I'm also disappointed the Rec wasn't included as it will be around 20,000 attendance by 2015. Franklin Gardens another ground unfortunate to miss out.

These three grounds are what rugby is all about, and it's a shame only Kingsholm of Gloucester has been included.

I also think the Rec would've been great for pool games.

What's the rugby league stadia like up north?

EnglishReign wrote:I also think the Rec would've been great for pool games.

True. And it is in a popular tourist city.

Compared to 1991...

City Stadium Capacity
London Twickenham Stadium 75,000
Edinburgh Murrayfield Stadium 67,800
Cardiff National Stadium (Cardiff Arms Park) 53,000
Paris Parc des Princes 48,712
Dublin Lansdowne Road 49,250
Toulouse Stade Ernest-Wallon 19,000
Villeneuve d'Ascq Stadium Lille-Metropole 18,185
Béziers Stade de la Méditerranée 18,000
Leicester Welford Road 16,815
Brive Parc Municipal des Sports 16,000
Grenoble Stade Lesdiguières 14,000
Agen Stade Armandie 14,000
Bayonne Stade Jean Dauger 13,500
Gloucester Kingsholm 12,500
Belfast Ravenhill 12,300
Llanelli Stradey Park 10,800
Pontypool Pontypool Park 8,800
Pontypridd Sardis Road 7,200
Otley Cross Green 5,000

It's just politicing from the RFU. Welford Road has been snubbed because of Peter Wheelers muscle flexing on behalf of the Prem clubs and the de-powering of the RFU. This is one of the last areas where the RFU can show who the bosses are.

I like and respect Glaws and their fans but is there any logical reason why Kingsholm with a capacity some 10,000 less should be nominated ahead of Welford Road?

ER 2015 made two promises:

1) to pay £80m to the IRB
2) To spread the matches around the country.

Now to achieve promise 1 they apparently need to sell 2.9m tickets. With a total of 48 matches (I think that is right 4 pools with 10 matches each, 8 matches in the latter stage) that is an average of 60k spectators per game. This means that the RFU will use the biggest stadiums they can and if Kingsholm makes the final shortlist the number of games it gets will be minimal, and involve minnows.

We should expect to see the bulk of the games at Twickenham, Wembley, MS, Old Trafford and if it makes the cut the Olympic Stadium.

As to MS ER 2015 will be hiring it from the WRU and then garnering all the gate receipts and perhaps ancillary sales. To maximise ticket sales we should expect to see Wales playing their pool in Cardiff.

Having the Millenn' on there makes no sense whatsoever. It's being hosted by England, so play the games in England. This cross border nonsense devalues the RWC.

Hopefully it won't make the shortlist.

I'd rather Wales be playing their games outside of Wales. They'll be straight down Mill Lane after every game.

I can't understand why Eden Park hasnt been suggested...At least its a proper International rugby ground.

robshaw4england wrote:
In particular not happy about....

Brighton Community Stadium, Brighton

Just picking the one I know most about, why?

It's a brand new stadium with great facilities. It currently seats over 27k and will seat over 30k by the start of the 2013-14 season. The playing area (105m by 69m) is big enough to host international rugby. There's no running track or anything around the pitch, so as a pure stadium it is right up there with the very best. The transport links to the stadium are good.

My only thought is that Brighton doesn't have a top level rugby club, which is very harsh. There are 8 clubs in Brighton and Hove alone (including University clubs) and a total of 40 clubs in Sussex (not including schools). We don't get top level rugby in Sussex, but the benefit of hosting games in Brighton (if selected) will be to the small local clubs who provide rugby facilities to the community. Why should we miss out on this festival of rugby because we miss out on every other week of every other year? Hardly seems fair does it?

Having spoken to people who are mad keen on rugby and people who know of but don't particularly follow rugby about the possibility of Brighton hosting games, I know there would be a huge demand for it down here and I'm sure any games at Falmer would sell-out. I haven't got down to the ground for a football match (as my interest in football is only a passing one), but I hear the atmosphere is fantastic.

I'd love to see a group of Saffer fans from the Boer heartlands stray into a "Specialist" night club in Brighton by mistake. No offence intended honest!

Casartelli wrote:Having the Millenn' on there makes no sense whatsoever. It's being hosted by England, so play the games in England. This cross border nonsense devalues the RWC.

Hopefully it won't make the shortlist.

Oh it will. To deliver the participation payments that the Tier 1 countries demanded, ER 2015 need a stadium the size of MS.

However, I have since read an article that suggested that SANZAR complaints about Wales potentially playing at home have been accepted - so any matches between Wales and any other Tier 1 country will not happen at MS.

Of that might mean that its not full so what's the point?

Seems like the RFU is looking only for the big stadia which have more seats and will take in more £££. I can almost hear the RFU types claiming they are hostimg matches in the Midlands by playing Stadium MK and Leicester City Stadium. And of course, missing the point.

Seeing as Wales get to play in the Melondrome, presumably Scotland can have Murrayfield and make it a GB affair since the tournament will now not happen solely in England.

This isn't just about capacity, although there are massive financial targets to hit that can only be reached in certain stadiums. ER 2015 has said that there just isn't room at Welford Road, the pitch is 9m too short for starters!

Leicester's chairman has had a good old rant about the clubs contribution to the game (true) but what has that got to do with staging international rugby? Nothing. Get over yourself.

Good point offload.

Two weeks ago the ABs played a game in Argentina in a soccer stadium, also about 9 metres Short but also with an ingoal area about 6 or 7 metres deep.

Its like playing International rugby on a school 1sy xv ground.

offload wrote:This isn't just about capacity, although there are massive financial targets to hit that can only be reached in certain stadiums. ER 2015 has said that there just isn't room at Welford Road, the pitch is 9m too short for starters!

Leicester's chairman has had a good old rant about the clubs contribution to the game (true) but what has that got to do with staging international rugby? Nothing. Get over yourself.

Only problem with that reason is that The playing area at #Welford road is bigger than that at the King Power Stadium. Pointless worrying anyway. As soon as certain countries insisted they be paid £10m to participate and with the promises RFU had made to pay a serious amount of money to the IRB to support rugby in small countries - it was obvious that most matches would be held in large grounds. If it makes the list Kingsholm may get to host Uruguat vs Namibia.

The Boer fans would love to visit the all male sauna on London Road, opposite the Pavilion. If it is still there.

The simple answer is that the soccer grounds all have much better corporate facilities than the rugby grounds and that's where the RFU will be looking to make back their money - they know they are unlikely to make much from the group games involving the minnows but they can still sell the "corporate experience" at a good price.
I wouldn't be surprised if they were to link the coporate sales in packages so if you want the big games you have to sign up for the minor ones as well.
Also they know that however much we don't like the idea the rugby fans will swallow it and go the games at soccer grounds and they'll still be able to knock out tickets to the casual fans - I know the difference between Welford Road and the Crisp Bowl is only four thousand but that's still four thousand more tickets at £20 sold.
Final thing - you will still be able to take your beer into the stands, the legislation not allowing fans to take beer into the stands is soccer specific. I should imagine many grounds will look forward to the extra revenue.

As I understand it Wales are not playing all their games at home in Cardiff, might be wrong.

Final thing - you will still be able to take your beer into the stands, the legislation not allowing fans to take beer into the stands is soccer specific. I should imagine many grounds will look forward to the extra revenue.

Brilliant!!

although I'm pretty sure I couldn't drink inside Lens in France 07.

I really Hope the RWC comes to Southampton.

Irish Londoner wrote:The simple answer is that the soccer grounds all have much better corporate facilities than the rugby grounds and that's where the RFU will be looking to make back their money - they know they are unlikely to make much from the group games involving the minnows but they can still sell the "corporate experience" at a good price.
I wouldn't be surprised if they were to link the coporate sales in packages so if you want the big games you have to sign up for the minor ones as well.
Also they know that however much we don't like the idea the rugby fans will swallow it and go the games at soccer grounds and they'll still be able to knock out tickets to the casual fans - I know the difference between Welford Road and the Crisp Bowl is only four thousand but that's still four thousand more tickets at £20 sold.
Final thing - you will still be able to take your beer into the stands, the legislation not allowing fans to take beer into the stands is soccer specific. I should imagine many grounds will look forward to the extra revenue.

Actually its over 8000 more and its all seat. Its all about the money!

offload wrote:This isn't just about capacity, although there are massive financial targets to hit that can only be reached in certain stadiums. ER 2015 has said that there just isn't room at Welford Road, the pitch is 9m too short for starters!

Leicester's chairman has had a good old rant about the clubs contribution to the game (true) but what has that got to do with staging international rugby? Nothing. Get over yourself.

That's a silly excuse as the Club Footy grounds being used are going to have small in goal areas. Here's a shot from the Argentina-England match at Old Trafrord:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/amgreen/3608942034/

Not sure why Both Sunderlands stadium of light AND our St james park has been listed.

Obviously Kingston park is not big enough to support the games for a Wolrd CUp...and is slighlty out of the city compared to the absolutely bang central St James.
It might not fill 53000...but i do think the games would get a good support....as long as they dont price the thing too high!

We do need one of the groups up here though thats for sure.

GeordieFalcon wrote:Not sure why Both Sunderlands stadium of light AND our St james park has been listed.

Obviously Kingston park is not big enough to support the games for a Wolrd CUp...and is slighlty out of the city compared to the absolutely bang central St James.
It might not fill 53000...but i do think the games would get a good support....as long as they dont price the thing too high!

We do need one of the groups up here though thats for sure.

I reckon its because the RWC takes place during the Footy season so they need more grounds as St James park probably won't be available for 3 weekends running.
Assuming Scotland aren't drawn in England's group they will probably play their fixtures in St James Park and/or the SOL.
Same will probably go for Wales (Midlands/London as I dont think they are allowed any fixtures in the MS) and Ireland (NW/MS) with AUS/NZ/SA playing at Wembley, MS and the OS.

The Welsh media and casual fanbase are never going to get their collective heads around us not being allowed to play some or all games in Cardiff.

They'll be interviewing outraged members of the public in the streets, reading out the tweets and texts on Scrum V, having a debate in the Assembly.

Western Mail headline will be "English ban Wales from the Millenn!!!"

Yeah AndyI

That makes sense.

Delighted Glaws are on the list, but think it is farcical that Welford Road is not there. To make matters worse to have the Walkers Stadium there rubs salt in the wounds.

The Olympic Stadium definitely needs to come off that list. One of the charms of rugby is the banter between fans and players. If the fans are half a mile away from the pitch the atmosphere will be rather subdued.

I presume they are basing using the Olympic stadium based on it being converted to a football ground by 2015 so the seats should be closer to the pitch.
In terms of the home nations (assuming no two teams in the same group) I'd put:
England in London
Scotland in the North
Wales in the Midlands/North West
Ireland in the Millenium/South West

Venues:
Southern group
Twickenham
Olympic Stadium
Wembley
Brighton

North
Newcastle
Sunderland
Leeds
Manchester

Midlands
Villa Park
Leicester
Derby
Coventry
Stadium MK

South West/Wales
Cardiff
Bristol
Glaws
Brighton

Quarters
Manchester
Villa
Millenium
Oylmpic

Semis
Twickenham
Wembley

Final
Twickenham

However I think there'l be a lot of changes before this is finalised.

I think thev'e already said Twickenham will host 1 QF, both SF's and the Final.
All about maximising revenue as its the 2nd biggest stadium and costs nothing to rent.
I think the other 3 QF's will probably be at Wembley, Old Trafford and the MS.

I was very surprised indeed to see only 1 actual rugby stadium on the list and even more surprised that it wasn't Welford Rd.

Anyone know any reasoning behind the ommision?

Leicester's chairman has had a good old rant about the clubs contribution to the game (true) but what has that got to do with staging international rugby? Nothing. Get over yourself.

If the RFU had any brains they'd encourage the development of WR and host the Samoa games there. Guarenteed sell outs. Tigers have the biggest club support in the UK, moving the games to the car park with seats won't replicate that. The King Power stadium is an awful choice over an icon of English rugby.

formerly known as Sam wrote:

Leicester's chairman has had a good old rant about the clubs contribution to the game (true) but what has that got to do with staging international rugby? Nothing. Get over yourself.

If the RFU had any brains they'd encourage the development of WR and host the Samoa games there. Guarenteed sell outs. Tigers have the biggest club support in the UK, moving the games to the car park with seats won't replicate that. The King Power stadium is an awful choice over an icon of English rugby.

Looks like the absurd sense of entitlement is not limited to the Tigers chairman

The RFU have decided not to put the Leicester Tigers home ground on the 17 strong long list. It's all about money apparently. They are preferring the Leicester football ground a mile away. So whilst they want to capitalise on the general strength of rugby support in Leicester they want to go for a ground where they can fit 60,000 punters in. And sod the Tigers. It's sickening that such an iconic venue should be sidelined especially as there are plans in hand to add new capacity. It's also ridiculous to think that the ground could be useful for Tier 2 matches. Are you really going to get 60000 to watch the likes of Romania v Georgia? In 2011 I don't think New Zealand were such slaves to the financial model and a loss of 40m was widely predocted. There were games in farflung places like Whangarai and Nelson where I doubt they had 60000 seated. Letter writing campaign perhaps?

Why no Rec or Sandy Park?

These are real West Country grounds not like Castle Grim which we consider to be in the midlands.

The RFU have lost sight of what this RWC should be about, and I think it's disgusting that they expect Rugby Union fans to line the pockets of football clubs.

HERSH wrote:Why no Rec or Sandy Park?

These are real West Country grounds not like Castle Grim which we consider to be in the midlands.

The RFU have lost sight of what this RWC should be about, and I think it's disgusting that they expect Rugby Union fans to line the pockets of football clubs.

Completely agree with that.

Thanks bluestone thats given me a nice warm feeling inside.