Questions for Munster moving forward

- Has emerging loose head prop David Kilcoyne done enough to retain his starting place over his more experienced South African colleague Wian du Preez.

- At hooker is it Mike Sherry or Damian Varley who should be starting.

- What will the make up of our back row be - We have got Donnacha Ryan, Peter O'Mahony, Niall Ronan, CJ Stander, Tommy O'Donnell, Paddy Butler, Sean Dougall, Dave O'Callaghan and James Coughlan to choose from. It is very hard to choose from.

- Ian Keatley or Ronan O'Gara? Or both with Keatley playing as a fullback. Obviously with O'Gara injured Keatley is getting a good run with youngster JJ Hanrahan getting the chance for game time too.

- Keith Earls - he has to play somewhere but where? On the left wing? With Laulala in the centre? With Downey in the centre? At fullback?

- Are Laulala and Earls too similar to play in the centre. Do we need a big lump like James Downey to give us go forward ball in the backs.

- Fullback - a very very very open position. Keith Earls, Felix Jones, Denis Hurley and Ian Keatley are all real contenders for the starting berth.

1. Has to be sherry IMO. A lot more potential
2. Stander will need to be accomodated at 7 or 8. POM should be at 6. Coughlan, butler and Dougal to rotate for the other spot unless one is standout. Butler would be my preferred pick
3. Keatley
4. Hard to say.LLL isn't a 12 and Downey is limited but could bring the best out of earls. Zebo is a cert for a wing spot as is dougie. Wouldnt mind seeing earls at 15 but I suspect 13 is likelier.
5. See above. Genuinely dont know about Downey but I don't think Laulala and earls works
6. Should be between earls and jones. The other two aren't great options.

1. Yes
2. Varley if in better form.
3. Keatley.
4. Earls doesn't have to play anywhere. If there are better options then stick him on the bench or let him learn his trade in the B&I cup.
5. Downey and LLL. Square pegs in square holes.
6. Whoever plays best. Jones if fit and on form otherwise Earls.

Rodders - I would genuinely play Earls over Laulala, Zebo or Felix Jones.

I think he has been playing very well for us this year and his sheer pace has been missed in the last two matches.

He does not have to "learn his trade". Thats just a silly comment. If you dont think he should start fine but he has 30 Irish caps, a Lions Tour and a RWC under his belt.

He does not need to learn his trade.

He doesn't need to learn his trade but he needs to. Larn one position and he needs to do it now! Whether it is 13 as he wants or not. Someone needs to sit him down (penney or the Irish coach) and say "you are 13 (for instance), and you will play there"

He has all the ability but needs a greater focus

Stand,

I'm not sure that either Penney or the Irish coach want him to settle down in one position unfortunately and therein lies the problem.

Personally I think that a Laulala and Earls centre pairing can work but we will need another big ball carrier up front - that will be Stander. If he turns out to be a flop then Paddy Butler development needs accelerating.

That is a problem. Versatility is great but until earls gets to focus on one position he will have a lot of untapped potential. Looking at the set up of the munster team I would be inclined to say 15. Looking at Ireland I would say wing or 13. I think Laulala has a tendency to crab and cut out space for those outside him. He is superb at getting them the ball but I'm not convince he can create the space earls thrives in and at this stage in his career I dont think changing his game is an option.

Downey could work but he needs to be a committed bosher and let earls work off him like Roberts and BOD for the lions. Downey ain't no Jamie Roberts but then the HEC isn't a lions tour.

I agree with you. Just realised I never gave answers to my questions.

- I think Kilcoyne has done enough to earn the starting place for now.

- I prefer Mike Sherry though Varley has stepped up

- I think a backrow of O'Mahony (6), Dougall (7) and Stander (8) with Paddy Butler as an impact sub is the way to go.

- Keatley to start at 10 with ROG on the bench

- I would have Earls as our 13. I think he is a good centre.

- Downey and Earls to me looks the way forward but against the right opposition or if we pick a pack of big bruising ball carriers than Laulala and Earls could work well too.

red_stag wrote:Rodders - I would genuinely play Earls over Laulala, Zebo or Felix Jones.

I think he has been playing very well for us this year and his sheer pace has been missed in the last two matches.

He does not have to "learn his trade". Thats just a silly comment. If you dont think he should start fine but he has 30 Irish caps, a Lions Tour and a RWC under his belt.

He does not need to learn his trade.

I don't think its a silly comment at all. He's earnt all those caps as a utility back come/ wing. Munster have two better wingers. Natural wingers.

In terms of centre well I guess it comes down to opinion. I think you can count the convincing performances by Earls at centre on one hand, and most came with De Villiers keeping him in check. He's as comfortable looking at centre as Tom Court is at tighthead, he can do a job on the front foot but once under pressure the flaws and limitations are exposed. Downey is an 12 and Lualua is a 13. Earls in my opinion is neither.

1. Most definitely - great ball carrying and two solid performances in scrum. One of the things I like about Penny is he didnt haul him off when playing poorly against Ospreys

2. Sherry - both similar in lose but Sherry has big advantage in line out

3. Back row is a bit of a mess - too much being placed on CJ. Would love to see Coughlan back

4. Close call - am happy with either

5 Earls was badly missed last two games at 13- he has so much natural talent that he is a loss to any team. Would prefer him with Downey

6. FB is Jones any day of the week if he is injury free

Overall am dissapointed with lack of progress. On positive some young players developing well - Zebo, Killer, POM, Sherry, POC

Talking of silly comments- '30 Irish caps, a Lions Tour and a RWC under his belt'. Big whoop. And with all that he still can't hold down a place in the Munster team or with Ireland considering how much Kidney has persisted with him. That alone speaks volumes for Earls. Why must Earls be in the side? Laulala is a better 13, Downey is a better 12 even if he is extremely limited. Felix Jones is a better full back when fit. Earls should really be on the team on the wing, but guess what, he doesn't want to play there. He's made a rod for his own back and his only saving grace is the fact Kidney will probably continue to pick him in Irish squads anyway. He is hugely frustrating as he has all the tools to be a good player he is too inconsistent. For every youtube clip Sin puts up for him doing something good there are four of five instances of him making mistakes. For every great try he fashions, like against us at Ravenhill this season, theres plenty of examples of him being caught out of position, poor passing and distribution and porous defence. He just isn't good enough.

The biggest concern for Munster is the backrow. Stag is right about hard choices to be made in selection because you have to pick between such average players. Peter O'Mahony is so far off being an 8 its astonishing. He might be a good player in a few years time but right now he is no where near it. No doubt he'll be in Kidney's plans too. Coughlan is a big miss in the side for sure. The only problem with the CJ Stander talk is Munster fans are making him out to be the next messiah.

Hookisms,

I am not saying that Earls is the finished article or that he is even good enough to play for Ireland right now.

However going to learn his trade in the B&I Cup is a silly comment if meant seriously. My first thought reading it was that it was a wum.

My points about his international and Lions experience are merely to show that he is an established player who has learned his trade already.

Whether he fits into the team or not is one issue.

However to claim he need games against semi professional teams to teach him how to play rugby is utter nonsense.

red_stag wrote:However to claim he need games against semi professional teams to teach him how to play rugby is utter nonsense.

And the comment that Munster need to facilitate him by dropping players who are contributing more to the team isn't?

I don't think he has learnt his trade at all. His running lines are poor (he arcs out and deesn't know when to straighten and give or cut back), he doesn't link with support, he doesn't create space for his outside players, isn't great in contact, his descision making is poor, he's not a communicator, his defensive position isn't great either nor is his short passing game.

He's a good broken field runner and a decent finisher but that isn't enough at this level and for me the Heino and Rabo isn't the place to learn, given that Munsters season is hanging in a balance.

If he's not the best option in any given position then he shouldn't be playing. Do other countries put players ahead of the team? I don't think they do you know.

Earls in comfortably munster most dangerous back. If he starts at 13 then IMO it has to be Downey inside. I would like to see him at full back though for a series of games. If he could develop the nous Payne is showing up here from 15 he could be devastating. High balls would be an issue though

Rodders, I am not disuputing your opinion that other players contribute more to the team. Thats fine, I dont agree but I get your point.

However if you are claiming that Earls needs to play amatuers to teach him to play rugby then it is an exaggeration at best.

- Yes. Was very impressive yesterday.

- Sherry. However it's a position that worries me as both have flaws in their game.

- I'd be very interested to see how O'Mahony (6), Stander (7) and Coughlan (8) goes. BTW the Bulls lost on saturday so I wonder when we'll see Stander this side of the world.

- Keatley. While not completely convinced by him as he's still liable to make stupid mistakes in matches I think he suits Penny's gameplan much better than ROG. With ROG entering the twilight of his career I think we'd all like to see Hanrahan getting more game time.

- Keith Earls -

he has to play somewhere but where?

Why? I don't want to provocative but I think it's fair to say that Earls has not kicked on from when he burst onto the scene and he hasn't fulfilled his early promise.

I would have to agree with almost all of Hookism's assessment above.

- At present I would have Laulala and Downey as our 1st choice centre pairing although I'm a bit concerned that the early season promise shown doesn't seem to be progressing.

- Felix Jones if he stays fit and returns to form but Denis Hurley is doing a decent job at present.

red_stag wrote:
However if you are claiming that Earls needs to play amatuers to teach him to play rugby then it is an exaggeration at best.

I'm not saying that....but its cut and dry to me. If he's not the best in a given position then it's the bench or the next tier of rugby down.

Like this guy is not James O'Connor, he's not 22 any more and he's had chance after chance and quite frankly the substance so far has not matched the hype.

He has, as you have said, 30 odd caps and is yet to score or create a try against a top tier country and yet we keep hearing year in year out how dangerous he is and how talented he is. Well he's 26 now so its about what he has done and is doing, rather than what he and is supporters think he might be able to do.

I just don't think he warrants any special treatment at all. He hasn't delivered so give someone else a chance.

Munster,

Maybe he doesn't have to play somewhere. I rate him highly but if not so be it.

My issue is really with Rodders claim that he has to go learn his trade against Aberavon and Melrose and Cornish Pirates.

rodders wrote:

red_stag wrote:
However if you are claiming that Earls needs to play amatuers to teach him to play rugby then it is an exaggeration at best.

I'm not saying that....but its cut and dry to me. If he's not the best in a given position then it's the bench or the next tier of rugby down.

Like this guy is not James O'Connor, he's not 22 any more and he's had chance after chance and quite frankly the substance so far has not matched the hype.

He has, as you have said, 30 odd caps and is yet to score or create a try against a top tier country and yet we keep hearing year in year out how dangerous he is and how talented he is. Well he's 26 now so its about what he has done and is doing, rather than what he and is supporters think he might be able to do.

I just don't think he warrants any special treatment at all. He hasn't delivered so give someone else a chance.

Damn I thought you would argue..... I feel bad now....

#Justice4Earls... .....

Earls makes his own justice!

Hookisms and Hyperbole wrote:Talking of silly comments- '30 Irish caps, a Lions Tour and a RWC under his belt'. Big whoop. And with all that he still can't hold down a place in the Munster team or with Ireland considering how much Kidney has persisted with him. That alone speaks volumes for Earls. Why must Earls be in the side? Laulala is a better 13, Downey is a better 12 even if he is extremely limited. Felix Jones is a better full back when fit. Earls should really be on the team on the wing, but guess what, he doesn't want to play there. He's made a rod for his own back and his only saving grace is the fact Kidney will probably continue to pick him in Irish squads anyway. He is hugely frustrating as he has all the tools to be a good player he is too inconsistent. For every youtube clip Sin puts up for him doing something good there are four of five instances of him making mistakes. For every great try he fashions, like against us at Ravenhill this season, theres plenty of examples of him being caught out of position, poor passing and distribution and porous defence. He just isn't good enough.

The biggest concern for Munster is the backrow. Stag is right about hard choices to be made in selection because you have to pick between such average players. Peter O'Mahony is so far off being an 8 its astonishing. He might be a good player in a few years time but right now he is no where near it. No doubt he'll be in Kidney's plans too. Coughlan is a big miss in the side for sure. The only problem with the CJ Stander talk is Munster fans are making him out to be the next messiah.

Would you mind going into detail as to why you think POM is so far off being an 8?

As for Earls, hes Munsters best center, Munsters best winger and Munsters best fullback. Thats his problem, he is being moved around all the time. Ruan Pienaar was talking about how it effected his game.

rodders wrote:

red_stag wrote:
However if you are claiming that Earls needs to play amatuers to teach him to play rugby then it is an exaggeration at best.

I'm not saying that....but its cut and dry to me. If he's not the best in a given position then it's the bench or the next tier of rugby down.

Like this guy is not James O'Connor, he's not 22 any more and he's had chance after chance and quite frankly the substance so far has not matched the hype.

He has, as you have said, 30 odd caps and is yet to score or create a try against a top tier country and yet we keep hearing year in year out how dangerous he is and how talented he is. Well he's 26 now so its about what he has done and is doing, rather than what he and is supporters think he might be able to do.

I just don't think he warrants any special treatment at all. He hasn't delivered so give someone else a chance.

The devil is in the detail rods

Earls was 25, 20 days ago.

He is getting the opposite of special treatment - he is being moved around all the time between club & country.

You won't be popular around here claiming Wales and England are not top tier countries

rodders wrote:

red_stag wrote:Rodders - I would genuinely play Earls over Laulala, Zebo or Felix Jones.

I think he has been playing very well for us this year and his sheer pace has been missed in the last two matches.

He does not have to "learn his trade". Thats just a silly comment. If you dont think he should start fine but he has 30 Irish caps, a Lions Tour and a RWC under his belt.

He does not need to learn his trade.

I don't think its a silly comment at all. He's earnt all those caps as a utility back come/ wing. Munster have two better wingers. Natural wingers.

In terms of centre well I guess it comes down to opinion. I think you can count the convincing performances by Earls at centre on one hand, and most came with De Villiers keeping him in check. He's as comfortable looking at centre as Tom Court is at tighthead, he can do a job on the front foot but once under pressure the flaws and limitations are exposed. Downey is an 12 and Lualua is a 13. Earls in my opinion is neither.

He got picked for the Lions on his performances at 13 partnered by Mafi!

profitius wrote:
As for Earls, hes Munsters best center, Munsters best winger and Munsters best fullback. Thats his problem, he is being moved around all the time. Ruan Pienaar was talking about how it effected his game.

Christ! Profitus is really Donal Lenihan!...... .....

rodders wrote:

profitius wrote:
As for Earls, hes Munsters best center, Munsters best winger and Munsters best fullback. Thats his problem, he is being moved around all the time. Ruan Pienaar was talking about how it effected his game.

Christ! Profitus is really Donal Lenihan!...... .....

He is no Mark Robson

Sin é wrote:The devil is in the detail rods

Earls was 25, 20 days ago.

Damn I take it back..... I'll come back in 12 months a slag him off instead then....

Oh and the Welsh try doesn't count because he let Williams score two. Between me and you England aren't tier 1 but don't tell HERSH

rodders wrote:

Sin é wrote:The devil is in the detail rods

Earls was 25, 20 days ago.

Damn I take it back..... I'll come back in 12 months a slag him off instead then....

Oh and the Welsh try doesn't count because he let Williams score two. Between me and you England aren't tier 1 but don't tell HERSH

3 against Wales Rods (2 from centre). Williams is usually on Bowe's side of the pitch Trimble got a try in the 6Ns with Earls in the centre, something he hasn't done for a long, long time when playing with BOD at 13

1) I think he has been very good. Give him another few shots in the Pro12 see if he can push on

2) Sherry, Varley I think is really poor

3) POM-Coughlan-CJ
That has a good balance to it and frees up Ryan to play at lock where he is best. Gets a lot of ball carriers in to the team too which Munster need.

4) Keatly I think. He gets the next few games anyway so hopefully he will kick on and keep attacking the game line and kicking well enough. Needs consistency.

5) Kieth earls doesn't HAVE TO play somewhere.

6) I think Downey is the best 12 and LLL the best 13, I am much more frightened of Lualala (always have been) than most other 13's.

7) I would rule out Keatly and Hurley is a hard working but quite average player. I'd put Earls in there until Jones can force his way in.

Sin é wrote:

rodders wrote:

Sin é wrote:The devil is in the detail rods

Earls was 25, 20 days ago.

Damn I take it back..... I'll come back in 12 months a slag him off instead then....

Oh and the Welsh try doesn't count because he let Williams score two. Between me and you England aren't tier 1 but don't tell HERSH

3 against Wales Rods (2 from centre). Williams is usually on Bowe's side of the pitch Trimble got a try in the 6Ns with Earls in the centre, something he hasn't done for a long, long time when playing with BOD at 13

http://www.espnscrum.com/2011-rugby-world-cup/rugby/story/151600.html

Did you even watch the match?What does the picture in that link tell you.By the way I don't blame Earls for that try I'm just trying to work out if you actually watch rugby matches or just download stat packs and use them to argue on the internet.

rodders wrote:

profitius wrote:
As for Earls, hes Munsters best center, Munsters best winger and Munsters best fullback. Thats his problem, he is being moved around all the time. Ruan Pienaar was talking about how it effected his game.

Christ! Profitus is really Donal Lenihan!...... .....

Donal Lenihan is a tremendious pundit.

asoreleftshoulder wrote:

Sin é wrote:

rodders wrote:

Sin é wrote:The devil is in the detail rods

Earls was 25, 20 days ago.

Damn I take it back..... I'll come back in 12 months a slag him off instead then....

Oh and the Welsh try doesn't count because he let Williams score two. Between me and you England aren't tier 1 but don't tell HERSH

3 against Wales Rods (2 from centre). Williams is usually on Bowe's side of the pitch Trimble got a try in the 6Ns with Earls in the centre, something he hasn't done for a long, long time when playing with BOD at 13

http://www.espnscrum.com/2011-rugby-world-cup/rugby/story/151600.html

Did you even watch the match?What does the picture in that link tell you.By the way I don't blame Earls for that try I'm just trying to work out if you actually watch rugby matches or just download stat packs and use them to argue on the internet.

... Rods claims that Earls try was nullified because he let Williams score 2. Its banter

profitius wrote:

rodders wrote:

profitius wrote:
As for Earls, hes Munsters best center, Munsters best winger and Munsters best fullback. Thats his problem, he is being moved around all the time. Ruan Pienaar was talking about how it effected his game.

Christ! Profitus is really Donal Lenihan!...... .....

Donal Lenihan is a tremendious pundit.

I knew it!!....

Just pick all Irish players.

Drop du Preez, Looloolala, Stander or use them in league matches.

Keep Dougie, cos he's Dougie, and he's earned it.

where is johne murphy? is he injured?

Munster need to realise if you just shift it wide like they did in the first half they will not get anywhere (they didn't get anywhere in the first). Penney seemed to mix things up in the second half, realising that the fplatform needs to be laid for the backs. If you shift out wide form the get go there will be no overlaps or mismatches, forwards need to take it on a few times to get space.


I think a few more backs moves could also be developed we don't seem to have any ones of note anyway.

I think the tactic is to shift the ball wide but a Forward will be waiting outwide to receive it. The Forward will draw in two/three (opposition Backs) to take him down creating space for Munster's Backs. The crucial thing is that the Munster Forwards out on the wings needs to be able to offload/pass back quickly (and they need time to develop this skill). The good thing is that the Forwards won't turnover the ball like the Backs used to (how many times have we seen our backs being bundled into touch).

You need a fit and mobile team for this tactic (Munster have). It will be the 2nd half before the opposition get tired and thats when the trys will start to flow for Munster. (Thats the theory of it anyway!)

LeinsterFan4life wrote:where is johne murphy? is he injured?

He was injured. Think he might be due back any day now.

Earls and Hanrahan in the centre....Downey = Donkey, Casey = ordinary.
The last two games have shown that our centre combination are clueless at best.

ROG or Keatley...would prefer Keatley to step up but he is ordinary as well. Once ROG left the field against Racing we looked lost.


Mike Sherry all the time. Varly is just the most idiotic player we have.

Kilcoyne has been impressive would keep him. One of the players to show well.

Backrow. POM, Coughlan and Ronan/Dougall - Dougall looked lost against Leinster and Racing but played well against E'burgh but then again that doesnt say much. Stander is the unknown.

Hurley at the moment for FB. Jones will probably hit a feather and fall to pieces.

Interview with Penney on Off the Ball. I think interviewers will prepare well when interviewing him in the future!

He explains well what Munster's gameplan is. Very impressive communicator and obviously won't suffer fools.

Wednesday 24th October. Part 1. 51 mins in.

http://www.newstalk.ie/programmes/all/offtheball/listen-back/

Sin é wrote:I think the tactic is to shift the ball wide but a Forward will be waiting outwide to receive it. The Forward will draw in two/three (opposition Backs) to take him down creating space for Munster's Backs. The crucial thing is that the Munster Forwards out on the wings needs to be able to offload/pass back quickly (and they need time to develop this skill). The good thing is that the Forwards won't turnover the ball like the Backs used to (how many times have we seen our backs being bundled into touch).

You need a fit and mobile team for this tactic (Munster have). It will be the 2nd half before the opposition get tired and thats when the trys will start to flow for Munster. (Thats the theory of it anyway!)

Nonesense!

Why is a forward going to draw in 3 backs? What Munster forward has the ability to run over his opposite man. They may make yards but there is no danger what so ever in them either breaking the line and/or outpacing the defence.

The forwards on the wing are used to create width and stretch defences and rarely to actually have the ball in their hands.

Look at the way Leinster use Jennings on the wing off lineouts: he is the furthest man out but he rarely gets the ball (unless there is a clear gap) he is there to create secure ball so that the ball can be quickly played out against a defence which effectively is backwards (backs in the tight and forwards back where the lineout took place). Leinster know the call so they have quick ball carrying forwards who know that when they get in a position to carry off that ruck that they will be coming with momentum and will be up against wingers or outside centres rather than locks and props.

It really is very simple, not sure how you came up with your theory which is instantly nulified by the amount of times the Munster forwards threw the ball in to touch or didn't catch it from going in to touch

Stag has the right of it in that Munster need more backsplay if they go wide and they need to have momentum going forward before they go wide. The only move that Munster use in the backs is the screen and they never employ the dummy screen as an actual option making the entire move semi-pointless. When Keatly is in you see him attacking the line more and looking for guys on his inside shoulder but how often do you see Munster play:

a switch option?
a wrap around?
a blindside winger coming off on of the centres flat rather than wanting the space all to himself?

A lot done more to do.

Excuse me Pete - Keatley used the "Gaffney Loop" on Sunday.

When? I watched the game and didn't see it?

Do you mean a standard loop or with the 13 running off the outside shoulder of 12?

Keatly as I said attacks the line much more and varies his game better

Pete, watch this game between Canterbury & Taranaki (ITM Cup semis) - it will explain better the style of play he is introducing to Munster - obviously Canterbury is far better at it than Munster.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B2ZO65kER44

About 40 mins in, the commentators describe Canterbury's style of play.

Interestingly, that game more or less panned out the same way as Munster last HC games. (Canterbury on top for the first 20 minutes, then Taranaki got back into it and at 80 mins it was a draw. In extra time, Canterbury blew Taranaki away with (I think) 27 pts in the last 30 mins).

Key to Canterbury's game is good ball retention (fowards do this better than backs), patience and the creaction of space. No fancy stuff switches.

Sin é wrote:Pete, watch this game between Canterbury & Taranaki (ITM Cup semis) - it will explain better the style of play he is introducing to Munster - obviously Canterbury is far better at it than Munster.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B2ZO65kER44

About 40 mins in, the commentators describe Canterbury's style of play.

Interestingly, that game more or less panned out the same way as Munster last HC games. (Canterbury on top for the first 20 minutes, then Taranaki got back into it and at 80 mins it was a draw. In extra time, Canterbury blew Taranaki away with (I think) 27 pts in the last 30 mins).

Key to Canterbury's game is good ball retention (fowards do this better than backs), patience and the creaction of space. No fancy stuff switches.

Once someone has formed an opinion and feel they are 100% correct even though the evidence is clearly the opposite the possibility of convincing the person that they are incorrect is only further exacerbated by the next phase which is the obstinate assertion of correctness and the digging in of heels.

Plus the fact that the main issue remains in that at 10, 12 and 13 the players are decent but nothing more. Keatley is ok(ish), Downey is a donkey and Casey only shows the odd flash of creativity.

DOD,

Looking ahead is Keatley, Hanrahan and Earls the way to go at 10, 12, 13?

Hanrahan starting 12 tomorrow....Munster lads get excited!

Sin totally get that the forwards of got better ball retention but forwards also get isolated much more easily. Also it makes very little sense to have locks on the wing, along with TH they tend to be the slowest and least athletic players on the pitch. POC and DOC have grunt by the bucket load it makes much more sense to have them in midfield and someone like POM or Sherry further wide (but not the widest player)

Totally accept that the ball skills of the pack will improve given time and further exposure.

red_stag wrote:DOD,

Looking ahead is Keatley, Hanrahan and Earls the way to go at 10, 12, 13?

Based on the couple of times Earls has played this year, the times we have been most creative was when he played OC or cameo'd there. Keatley is never going to be as good as ROG was at the height of his powers (06/07/08) but looks Ok (for the time being) and Hanrahan looks much better at 12 than at 10 in the games I have seen him play.

So yes I would hope this would be our lineup. I just dont see Downey and Casey as being anything more than replacements at this stage.

I was amazed that Mafi and O'Leary left/ were let go.

I think that it's too soon to judge Keatley yet. I think it's too soon to judge this team yet. I don't know what they're capable of and I don't think that they do either. Munster in my mind still means a bunch of other people who they have to live up to.

I felt the same thing happened against treviso as did against racing: ball going sideways across the pitch. Keatly has started to stand deeper too. There is a complete absence of multiple option attack play to keep defenders guessing and to vary the game.

I don't see the point in playing to each touchline every 2nd phase. I remember doc bashing the 15 after a charge down the wing: he made yards but zebo wud have made more and had a chance of beating the 15.

I think munster need to tweak bits of their gameplan.

Also, thought Casey was instrumental in 2 r 3 of the tries. Not sure why people don't like him he looked v dangerous when he got the ball.

Munster's back3 from sat scares the poo out of me too!