THE GREAT GRANDSLAM TRADE OFF.

Would you swap the 2012 grandslam for a wooden spoon if it meant seeing Wales win tomorrow?

It's a tough one but it would be nice to see a victory against NZ this century!

If say yes but it would have to be a deserved win against a team with Carter and Mccaw and no dodgy ref decisions. I wouldn't want any question over the victory.

As if that'd matter mckay. It'd be rightly celebrated however the result came about. Wales always seem to do badly after winning a Grand Slam anyway but the wooden spoon could always be used to stir the pot: 'we didn't win any 6N games because we found it difficult to raise our game after experiencing the highs of beating the world's best. Getting up for a school yard scrap just doesn't cut it when you've won the heavyweight title.' Or words to that effect.

mckay1402 wrote:If say yes but it would have to be a deserved win against a team with Carter and Mccaw and no dodgy ref decisions. I wouldn't want any question over the victory.

You might have to 'foe' AWOP to get your wish then

Grandslams are a great achievement, but let's face it they come around a more frequently than beating NZ for NH sides.

I'd take it. Yes please. Bored of Grand Slams now. It only means we can beat teams circa 4-10 in the world. Beating the All Blacks means we've beating the best, rather than just the mediocre sides.

kiakahaaotearoa wrote:As if that'd matter mckay. It'd be rightly celebrated however the result came about. Wales always seem to do badly after winning a Grand Slam anyway but the wooden spoon could always be used to stir the pot: 'we didn't win any 6N games because we found it difficult to raise our game after experiencing the highs of beating the world's best. Getting up for a school yard scrap just doesn't cut it when you've won the heavyweight title.' Or words to that effect.

It would matter to me

Cyril on 606v2 wrote:

mckay1402 wrote:If say yes but it would have to be a deserved win against a team with Carter and Mccaw and no dodgy ref decisions. I wouldn't want any question over the victory.

You might have to 'foe' AWOP to get your wish then

Grandslams are a great achievement, but let's face it they come around a more frequently than beating NZ for NH sides.

England have one grand slam in the last decade. But two wins over the All Blacks.

swap you one slam then?

HammerofThunor wrote:

Cyril on 606v2 wrote:

mckay1402 wrote:If say yes but it would have to be a deserved win against a team with Carter and Mccaw and no dodgy ref decisions. I wouldn't want any question over the victory.

You might have to 'foe' AWOP to get your wish then

Grandslams are a great achievement, but let's face it they come around a more frequently than beating NZ for NH sides.

England have one grand slam in the last decade. But two wins over the All Blacks.

One time I'm glad to be proved wrong. Yeah, it gets a bit samey beating NZ. Twice in a decade is enough for anyone. Bring on the slam!

mckay1402 wrote:If say yes but it would have to be a deserved win against a team with Carter and Mccaw and no dodgy ref decisions. I wouldn't want any question over the victory.

Why? I understand they're the stand out players in a great team but they aren't going to be around forever, beating a team with those 2 out wouldn't make the result less valuable.

IronMike, because all we'll hear about is a devalued win (not from NZ fans, I might add, but from 'home nations' fans).

Cyril on 606v2 wrote:

HammerofThunor wrote:

Cyril on 606v2 wrote:

mckay1402 wrote:If say yes but it would have to be a deserved win against a team with Carter and Mccaw and no dodgy ref decisions. I wouldn't want any question over the victory.

You might have to 'foe' AWOP to get your wish then

Grandslams are a great achievement, but let's face it they come around a more frequently than beating NZ for NH sides.

England have one grand slam in the last decade. But two wins over the All Blacks.

One time I'm glad to be proved wrong. Yeah, it gets a bit samey beating NZ. Twice in a decade is enough for anyone. Bring on the slam!

Unfortunately in another year we (probably) won't have any slams OR wins over the All Blacks in the last decade

HammerofThunor wrote:

Cyril on 606v2 wrote:

HammerofThunor wrote:

Cyril on 606v2 wrote:

mckay1402 wrote:If say yes but it would have to be a deserved win against a team with Carter and Mccaw and no dodgy ref decisions. I wouldn't want any question over the victory.

You might have to 'foe' AWOP to get your wish then

Grandslams are a great achievement, but let's face it they come around a more frequently than beating NZ for NH sides.

England have one grand slam in the last decade. But two wins over the All Blacks.

One time I'm glad to be proved wrong. Yeah, it gets a bit samey beating NZ. Twice in a decade is enough for anyone. Bring on the slam!

Unfortunately in another year we (probably) won't have any slams OR wins over the All Blacks in the last decade

Hey, stop that! That World Cup win is disappearing off the horizon too.

IronMike wrote:

mckay1402 wrote:If say yes but it would have to be a deserved win against a team with Carter and Mccaw and no dodgy ref decisions. I wouldn't want any question over the victory.

Why? I understand they're the stand out players in a great team but they aren't going to be around forever, beating a team with those 2 out wouldn't make the result less valuable.

I can't believe you're even querying why that would be important to a victory that couldn't be questioned.

Trust me, it doesn't matter. Apparently, we didn't win but choked yet again last year in the final. Do you feel cheated because of the so-called dodgy decisions Wales received in their favour against Ireland for example in your Grand Slam?

After the first two losses and the five in a row, I find it difficult to believe that you wouldn't accept a turnaround with open arms. People will always find a way to bring you down if they envy your success.

kiakahaaotearoa wrote:Trust me, it doesn't matter. Apparently, we didn't win but choked yet again last year in the final. Do you feel cheated because of the so-called dodgy decisions Wales received in their favour against Ireland for example in your Grand Slam?

After the first two losses and the five in a row, I find it difficult to believe that you wouldn't accept a turnaround with open arms. People will always find a way to bring you down if they envy your success.

We are getting used to that in Wales, three GS in eight years.

Two GS in five years and a semi final spot at the RWC and we are still constantly being told we are no good by nations who haven't done either of what we have recently.

maestegmafia wrote:

kiakahaaotearoa wrote:Trust me, it doesn't matter. Apparently, we didn't win but choked yet again last year in the final. Do you feel cheated because of the so-called dodgy decisions Wales received in their favour against Ireland for example in your Grand Slam?

After the first two losses and the five in a row, I find it difficult to believe that you wouldn't accept a turnaround with open arms. People will always find a way to bring you down if they envy your success.

We are getting used to that in Wales, three GS in eight years.

Two GS in five years and a semi final spot at the RWC and we are still constantly being told we are no good by nations who haven't done either of what we have recently.

+1

We're also the smallest and poorest nation.

That's my point. In the RC, there is mutual respect because we all know each side is capable of beating the other even with Argentina who have never beaten the ABs. The SH big 3 have all won 3N championships and World Cups and have been the number one team. In the 6N, there is more variation and the pecking order is not so clearly defined. So the knives come out more readily and it's more difficult to prove your case. What they all crave is a bit more consistency.

You have to take into account the psychological benefits that come from beating the ABs for your future games. If you go into a game in the 6N or against a SH giant, there is a huge difference between knowing you have beaten the best and thinking you are capable of beating the best. And that is reflected invariably in your performance.