The Greatest: Round 1: Shortlist for the 10 shirt (VOTING ENDS 23/12/12)

The fly half thread.

Please post below picking ONE and one only from this list of heroes:

Hugo Porta (Argentina), Grant Fox, Andrew Mehrtens, Daniel Carter, Carlos Spencer (New Zealand), Naas Botha, Henry Honiball, Joel Stransky (South Africa), Mark Ella, Stephen Larkham, Michael Lynagh (Australia), Phil Bennett, Barry John, Cliff Morgan, Jonathan Davies, Neil Jenkins (Wales), Rob Andrew, Jonny Wilkinson (England), John Rutherford (Scotland), Jack Kyle, Ollie Campbell (Ireland), Diego Dominguez (Italy/Argentina).

Top three go through to the vote for the teamsheet.

Will update the OP to make up for any glaring omissions.

Players above in no particular order.

Notes:

1. Rules here:
https://www.606v2.com/t38622-the-greatest-introduction-the-rules

2. Previous threads here:
https://www.606v2.com/t38631-the-greatest-round-1-shortlist-for-the-1-shirt#1745446

https://www.606v2.com/t38632-the-greatest-round-1-shortlist-for-the-2-shirt#1745455

https://www.606v2.com/t38633-the-greatest-round-1-shortlist-for-the-3-shirt#1745464

https://www.606v2.com/t38634-the-greatest-round-1-shortlist-for-the-4-5-shirts

https://www.606v2.com/t38635-the-greatest-round-1-shortlist-for-the-6-shirt#1745502

https://www.606v2.com/t38636-the-greatest-round-1-shortlist-for-the-7-shirt#1745507

https://www.606v2.com/t38637-the-greatest-round-1-shortlist-for-the-8-shirt

https://www.606v2.com/t38647-the-greatest-round-1-shortlist-for-the-9-shirt

3. Please note that voting for the shortlist will end at midnight on Sunday 23 December.

I expect most will go for Dan Carter and rightly so because he has the game for today.I would make him my number one BUT,most influential in there era`s A.C.Wallace of the 1905 immortals.1920`s Benny Osler and Mark Nichols,1950`s Cliff Morgan,1970 s Mike Gibson[should have been number one]Nicky Allen could have been but for his tragic death.Other Contenders Hugo porta and Andrew Merthens.

Jonny Wilkinson

I've tried to base my decisions on the players I have actually seen play live, so to that end I will go for Dan Carter, though Cliff Morgan was pretty special by all accounts,

Dan Carter

Barry John

Ooooh, tricky one. Can a player be a true 'great' if, despite being a brilliant rugby player, they are also a bit boring?

Like Steve 'Interesting' Davis, the snooker player.

Dan Carter

Wilkinson.

Carter is technically better but cometh the hour cometh the man... he is/was the ultimate clutch player.

Carter. Not his fault he's been injured in the big World Cup games. Next.

Adrian Dura Stoop... probably before any of us can remember, but he invented the role of fly half (and back play in general) pretty much as we know it today.

But if I can't have him, Carter.

I'll have to be boring and pick Carter.

I do honestly think though that if Wilkinson had played for a better team than newcastle his international point total would be way above Carter's though.

Cliff Morgan.

Christ, I really am showing my age now!

Barry John

Bennett

I have to say Carter

Carter. John second. Agree with Kia totally about his WC injuries.

Jonny Wilkinson

Notwithstanding his last performance, Dan Carter. The complete fly half.

Dan Carter. He just makes it all look so easy.

Jiffy. just mesmeric. Shame he went to RL as I reckon he would now be remembered as Wales best ever player

Diego Dominguez was a classy player, how Italy could do with him now. Still holds the record for points scored in a Heino final. Something like 30, and his team still lost. One of only a handful of players to amass over 1000 points.

Enjoyed watching Jenkins, he was the oddest, goblin like player I have seen but had a great innings.

Honiball was a good no nonsense farmer OH.

Thought Tony Ward might make the list for helping Munster beat the All blacks.

Carter gets my vote.

Easiest one so far for me, Daniel Carter.

Wilkinson???

Sorry but if you can't get into the England team for years over the likes of Flood you are nowhere near greatest in England let alone greatest ever.

Carter has put all to shame, John was a great but he's no Carter!

If Naas Botha had played more test rugby in his prime, he would have been a contender, he won 81% of all his games, the greatest exponent of the drop kick, in 279 first class (Currie Cup) games he kicked something like 214 drop goals, he played in something like 11 Currie Cup Finals and won 8 or 9, but sadly, Dan Carter has proven to be the best.

It going to have to be Wilkinson.

If that Carter bloke keeps it up he could become something special.

Jonny Wilkinson

Hugo Porta

Billy Stead should be on here. One of the all time All Black greats. Was the Dan Carter of pre war flyhalves. Literally wrote the book on rugby tactics.

Carter for me, but I'm biased by time and location. Have to agree with Biltong about Naas. Thought Jonathon Davies would have had more recognition if he hadn't been the only world class player in the side. We saw too little of the great Ella and Porta.

Barry John - Nicknamed "The King" by the kiwis..

Daniel Carter

Dan Carter

Biltong wrote:
in 279 first class (Currie Cup) games he kicked something like 214 drop goals

Really? geez thats phenomenal. Did like watching him play. Until Foxy came along we really struggled with 10's after Kirton and Herewini. The entire 70's we had a real mish mash of 10's right through till Fox, largely part of why our 70's were awful.. Botha was easily the best later in that period with Porta. i thought Ollie Campbell was a good 10 back then but his name never seems to be brought up.

Mark Ella needs a mention too... great player, career too short though.

Have to go with Carter but was a big fan of Merthens too

Wilkinson had more injuries than any 10 I can think of,was very good at what he did.Tackling and goal kicking,his tactical kicking and distribution skills were`nt as good as Merthens.No where near as good as Carter all round,don`t see that
playing for Newcastle effected his International test Record.
Billy Stead of the Originals yes missed him in my selections,but looking at the
1905 backs.Deans,Stead,Hunter,Wallace and the number of tries they scored between them.

Obviously impossible to compare players from different eras, Especially ones we have no footage of, in a game that was amateur and probably more different from today's game the league currently is. We are biased towards recent history. Do we even remember players from our great grandparents era. It's probably fine anyway. The game has changed so much and players today are bigger, fitter and more skillful (the product of fulltime specialist training, talent identification and retention, and continuing evolution in training in both rugby and sport in general).

Emack, the strength of Billy Stead was his tactical ability and his ability to manipulate opposition defences and create space and and time for his outside backs. Jimmy Hunter, the record setting try scorer, said of him "without you I was nothing". With him the team created history, without him (e.g. Wales 1905) the backline wasn't as fluid (as noted by the foreign press at the time). My point is that this was one of the great period backlines (i.e. the best pre WW1 backline) and he was the conductor so should be included in any discussion.

Carter

Easy this. Carter is the best 10 ever.

If you never saw Jonathan Davies play, find some old clips and watch. IMO the best welsh 10 ever and that includes, John, Bennett and Morgan.

Yeah I thought Davies was very good. Hes not often mentioned in the same light as Bennet and John but he was better with ball in hand- very quick for a 10

What, no Owen Farrell?

Din Carter

Mark Ella

Dan Carter, with Wilkinson close behind.

Dan Carter

Dan Carter

Voting Locked.