Scotland squad for the 6 Nations

First topic message reminder :

Scotland squad for training camp in Glasgow (January 20-23) ahead of RBS 6 Nations Championship:

Backs: Peter Murchie*, Stuart Hogg, Sean Maitland*, Tommy Seymour*, Sean Lamont (all Glasgow Warriors), Tim Visser (Edinburgh Rugby), Max Evans (Castres), Matt Scott (Edinburgh Rugby), Alex Dunbar* Peter Horne*, Duncan Weir, Ruaridh Jackson (all Glasgow Warriors), Tom Heathcote (Bath Rugby), Henry Pyrgos, Sean Kennedy* (both Glasgow Warriors) and Greig Laidlaw (Edinburgh Rugby).

Forwards: Alasdair Dickinson (Sale Sharks), Ryan Grant, Dougie Hall, Pat MacArthur* (all Glasgow Warriors), Ross Ford (Edinburgh Rugby), Euan Murray (Worcester Warriors), Geoff Cross (Edinburgh Rugby), Moray Low, Alastair Kellock (both Glasgow Warriors), Richie Gray (Sale Sharks), Jim Hamilton (Gloucester), Grant Gilchrist* (Edinburgh Rugby), Kelly Brown (Saracens), Robert Harley, Ryan Wilson* (both Glasgow Warriors), Johnnie Beattie (Montpellier), David Denton (Edinburgh Rugby), Richie Vernon (Sale Sharks), Chris Fusaro* (Glasgow Warriors).

* = Uncapped.

Invited to be with the squad as they recover from injury: Chris Cusiter, John Barclay and Jon Welsh (all Glasgow Warriors) Nick De Luca and Ross Rennie (both Edinburgh Rugby) and Scott Lawson (London Irish).

Note to editors: Alasdair Strokosch (Perpignan) will miss the camp for family reasons as his wife is expecting their second child.

To be fair I think last year's A team win was as much down to England not giving a crap as a good Scottish performance.

Let's see if England decide to turn up this year!

You have to look at what Australia did in thwe Autumn as how to beat England. Try and Fragment the play as much as possible.

You let England run through the phases and Tuilagi will start punching holes and the rest is accademic.

Whoever is in our backrow they need to do everything in their power to ruin the ball when England are in possesion.

Of all the matches, we'll miss Rennie the most in the England game.

I'm hopeful but not overly confident that Rennie will be listed in the Edinburgh team for Munster on Sunday.

If not then at least the following week against Saracens so he gets at least some game time.

I'm not so sure Radge. England don't really operate a classic openside and although you may say that gives us an opportunity to capitalise (as the Aussies did), I also means that we can play two tree cutters either side of the scrum to stop them in their tracks.

If we play Swinson, Brown and Harley in the same side together, with Gray also, I don't think England will find it easy to generate momentum against us, hopefully leaving Farrell to kick the ball aimlessly to our back three....

I've been dreaming.....

I hope that's the case FES, but I'd prefer to see a fit and on form Ross Rennie in the side instead of Rob Harley to be honest. But I think Harley gives us good options from the bench at 6 and 7.

I'm really interested to hear your argument for including Tim Swinson ahead of Jim Hamilton too. I can certainly see your point and Swinson offers more in an open game; but a typical England / Scotland game is an arm wrestle and ends up being decided by 3 to 4 points.

As a result Big Jim is one of the first names on my team sheet as he's one of the only guys the English actually fear in our lineup.

I do think big Jim has to be in there. He's Gloucester captain and plays these players regularly and will know them all inside and out, and must importantly will have no fear or inferiority complex with them.

Yes his discipline is bad but hopefully Dean Ryan can drill that home with him.

Maybe have a different 2nd row in other games, but Hamilton is a must IMO

I'm not sure whether the Glasgow 15 for the Ulster game is a good indication of current thinking at national level; but Murchie's in at 15 instead of Hogg, Jacko is out altogether (but has played 5 on the trot) and Swinson is on the bench. Harley's at 7 again.

P Murchie; S Maitland, A Dunbar, P Horne, DTH van der Merwe; D Weir, H Pyrgos; R Grant, D Hall, M Low, T Ryder, A Kellock, J Eddie, R Harley, J Strauss.
Replacements: P MacArthur, G Reid, N Campbell, T Swinson, N Matawalu, S Wight, S Hogg.

I hope Weir plays well! Same with Dunbar

We could do with those guys being on form right now!

I thought Jackson was supposed to have been MOTM and pretty awesome in the last Glasgow match against Treviso. Why on earth has he been dropped?? Is he injured, or is this another instance of stupid rotation that is currently plaguing Scottish rugby?

Is Ryan Wilson dead? Another form player dropped.

Pleased to see Dunbar given a shot at 13, and utterly delighted to see Low is fit enough to play.

Murchie over Hogg I can sort of understand. Murchie hasn't done much wrong this season, although he's not as exciting a counter-attacking player as Hogg.

I don't agree with it, but I think Toonie is resting those guys and giving others a chance because there's nothing to play for in Europe.

On the rotation thing. I wonder if its some man sausage-eyed way of justifying the increased transfer budgets the pro teams got this year?

I can just imagine a group of accountants (no doubt on expensive secondment from PWC) saying that if some of these guys don't play, the increased budgets should be taken away from the pro teams next season?

Either way it stinks and will bite us in the a8se when half our 6N's squad spend the first 2 or 3 games getting back up to speed with the game they play for a living.

Ryan Wilson also got a sore one to the arm last Friday and probably should have been replaced earlier but was having a stormer at the time. I assume he is injured therefore.

Not sure if this helps:


Not available for selection due to injury:

John Barclay (leg) Mike Cusack (shoulder) Chris Cusiter (shoulder) Ofa Fainga’anuku (shoulder) George Hunter (foot) Finlay Gillies (neck) Angus MacDonald (neck) Chris Fusaro (groin) Sean Lamont (rib) Ryan Wilson (shoulder) Ruaridh Jackson (ribs) Tommy Seymour (leg) Fergus Scott (shoulder)

From Glasgow Warriors website

That clears that up - thanks. Still injury list grows -again

Ah well, in which case I forgive toonie this selection. I'm sure he'll be thrilled.

NB - I was writing scrolls for each player so I thought to save time I'd just do my 23, players who should be noted and a couple of explanations.

1 Grant
2 Hall - We cannot afford stray lineouts. Although Ford brings physicality, I don't think it will be vital to miss.
3 Low/Murray (Sunday issue)

4 Kellock
5 Gilchrist - Playing well for Edinburgh. Can't really say the same about Gray tbh.

6 McInally
7 Harley
8 Beattie

9 Prygos
10 Heathcote

11 Seymour - All about form in my selection. Visser hasn't been at his best and Seymour has exelled for Glasgow. Offers slightly more in defence.
12 Dunbar
13 Grove
14 Lamont
15 Maitland

16 Reid
17 Macarthur
18 Cross
19 Gray/Gilchrist
20 Denton
21 Laidlaw
22 Jackson/Scott
23 Hogg/Horne/Scott

No Tonks? Otherwise very interesting team David. Assuming you're looking at england game as a game that will be a huge defensive effort?

Here's the England squads.. http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-union/20956920

Yeah they have couple of good players it would seem

I forgot about Tonks! Might put him at 15 with Maitland at 14. Hogg just doesn't seem to be in best form.

Yeah agree with you on Hogg. He may have got two tries last week vs treviso but they were down to 14 men so it was more than likely warriors would give 'em a drilling anyway. I think he'll probably get picked ahead of Tonks due to his experience in Scotland jersey. Tonks is untried but I think he will get his chance vs Italy. Maitland is such a great player to have due to fact he can slip to 15 if things go bad in that position.

Seriously what is the deal with Rennie, there hasn't been a single mention of how long they expect him to be out for. Fingers crossed they've been keeping him under wraps and he's available this weekend.

Nailed on to start you'd probably say Grant, Brown, Laidlaw, Visser, Hogg and the rest are probably still up for grabs.

I'd say nailed on of those are only Grant and Brown. Add Matt Scott at 12, and probably Richie at 4.

Laidlaw is under serious pressure from Pyrgos, totally outplayed in the 1872 cup games.

Visser still struggles with his defence and could be dropped for Maitland/Seymour

Hogg has got a case of "I'm awesome" syndrome, and thinks he's undroppable, but has been outplayed by both Murchie and Tonks this season.

UlstermaninGlasgow wrote:I'd say nailed on of those are only Grant and Brown. Add Matt Scott at 12, and probably Richie at 4.

Laidlaw is under serious pressure from Pyrgos, totally outplayed in the 1872 cup games.

Visser still struggles with his defence and could be dropped for Maitland/Seymour

Hogg has got a case of "I'm awesome" syndrome, and thinks he's undroppable, but has been outplayed by both Murchie and Tonks this season.

I agree, but the Edinburgh pack were mullered across both games. Hard to look good when your scrum is being destroyed and your breakdown specialist is injured.

Another factor is that Laidlaw has only played 3 games at 9 in about 3 years. The issue at Edinburgh is that he remains our best 10, and not our best 9, and yet it's clearly in Scotland's interests to have him return to the 9 jersey where our options are more limited.

Personally I think he's left it too late this season to be ready to play 9 for Scotland in the 6 Nations. If that was genuinely the intention, he should have started the season in that position for Edinburgh. He wants too much time with the ball in his hand for a 9, and his passing from the floor is rusty.

Regarding Hogg's attitude, I have no issue with arrogance or overconfidence in outside backs. They need a selfish streak and an unshakable belief in their own abilities - it's what makes Visser such a great attacking player, he'll always seek to take on his man and try to beat him. That's not to say they don't need to make correct judgment calls on the pitch, and know when to kick and when to run, but as long as they do everything with conviction then that's half the battle. Contrast that with Hugo Southwell, a player with all the skills, but so often indecisive and lacking confidence. I'm perfectly happy to Hogg to rate himself, he's at his best when he has the ball in his hand, his head up and sniffing out any weakness in the chase. Murchie probably has edged him this season, but does anyone seriously think Murchie has one iota of the potential that Hogg has? Let's not court mediocrity. Tonks I'll grant you, and excellent runner with a huge boot on him. I have him on the bench in my preferred squad, but he could easily switch places with Hogg.

new here... first post on v2, signed up in anticipation of the need to vent about rant enducing commentry this 6n from Jonathan davies etc...

I agree with FES theres nothing wrong with confidence and backing yourself. With regards to Hogg, he's one of the few scottish players to have this atttribute, probably because he's still young enough not to have had it drilled out of him...yet... you could see it last year when he came on the scene. and added spark to Scotlands stodgey attack.

Welcome to the mad house townsendistarintino!

Edinburgh team has been announced:

5 Greig Tonks

14 Dougie Fife
13 Ben Cairns
12 Matt Scott
11 Tim Visser

10 Greig Laidlaw CAPTAIN
9 Richie Rees

1 Allan Jacobsen
2 Steven Lawrie
3 Willem Nel
4 Grant Gilchrist
5 Sean Cox
6 Stuart McInally
7 Dimitri Basilaia
8 David Denton

Substitutes
16 Andy Titterrell
17 Robin Hislop
18 Geoff Cross
19 Netani Talei
20 Roddy Grant
21 Piers Francis
22 Ben Atiga
23 Sep Visser


Interesting that Laidlaw has been moved back to 10, Denton remains at 8 when usually he plays 6 for Edinbrugh, and Matt Scott moved back to 12.

Still no Ross Rennie!!!

From an Edinburgh perspective, this selection is absolutely spot on, and the strongest squad we could have put out.

Delighted to see Rees at 9, Laidlaw at 10 and Scott at 12, and very pleased to see Ben Cairns back at 13. That to my mind is a very promising midfield indeed, with the best outside backs we have available.

Also pleased that Basilia is retained at 7. He deserves that after some brutal hits in the Leinster match, and there is genuine continuity going on in the pack at long last, with only Titterall ditched (probably for missing a couple of important tackles).

My only quibble, and it's a small one, is that the bench looks a bit silly in the forwards yet again. Bradley seems to want either 2 locks on the bench or no locks - odd. I'd have thought Parker would be on the bench ahead of Talei personally.

Yes, sad Ross Rennie isn't fit, but for the first time in a while an Edinburgh team sheet has pleased me.

Just been on the Edinburgh website and read that Ben Cairns is Edinburgh's top HC try scorer. Odd stat.

funnyExiledScot wrote:Another factor is that Laidlaw has only played 3 games at 9 in about 3 years

thats just not true. He only played about 4 games at stand off in the 2010-2011 season after David Blair retired, and he played scrumhalf for most of the first half of last season until Leonard and Hunter dropped down the pecking order.

Still, that's over a year since he's played 9 on any regular basis.

He'll be up against Ben Youngs/Danny Care, Morgan Parra, Eduardo Gori, Mike Phillips and Eoin Reddan in the 6 Nations, in a position in which he's shown more than just a bit of rustiness. I also note that he's been shifted back to 10 for the game on Sunday.

Anyone seriously think Laidlaw is ready to be an international 9? Even in his heyday at 9 when he played there week in week out, he was nothing special in that position.

If he's to be an option at 9 for Scotland, he needs to be playing there regularly for Edinburgh and be first choice. Just my opinion, but I don't think part time jacks of all trade are going to cut it in the 6 Nations.

I'll be interested to see how that Edinburgh squad gels, especially with Cairns seeing as DeLuca is injured and with Grove and Dunbar our only other viable options at 13 currently.

We shall see! I'm looking forward to seeing how Glasgow get on against Ulster. If these matches go well I think we have reason to be optimistic!

welcome back Cairnsy

And I've won another pair of tickets for the Edinburgh game - think that's 8 tickets this season I've won in competitions!

To be fair it was a game of guess who on Twitter and every thought Tim Visser and I was one of 2 people to get it right - of course it was Matt Scott!

id anyone guess Allan Jacobson?

Wonder what the crowd will be like on Sunday. Due to various bits and pieces last year I missed all the HC games to Murrayfield, so this will be my first one.

Good team selection from Edinburgh as well. I reckon we might sneak this.

Well if we don't I didn't pay for it so happy days!

They've madea special effort to thank the fans this week too so will probably get some sympathy votes.

Over 4000 you'd hope, I reckon maybe up to 6000

Anyone fancy starting an Edinburgh Munster match thread? I can't really be hooped...!

Afraid I can't do it from work. If no-one else does it I might have the opportunity this evening.

So Laidlaws move back to 10 suggests that’s where he’ll be for the 6N, otherwise why not keep him at 9. Moving him from 10 to 9 and back is no good to anyone. On current form in the 9 jersey, Pyrgos has to start against England. If Johnson sees Laidlaw as predominantly a 10 then we’re left pretty short on SHs. It would be Pyrgos and Lawson. Glad to see Scott back at 12. Why he was moved to 13 is beyond me. I’d like to see a Scott-Dunbar/Grove partnership against England.

My preferred backline would be

9 Pyrgos
10 Laidlaw (covering 9 freeing up a spot on the bench)
11 Visser
12 Scott
13 Dunbar
14 Maitland
15 Hogg

21 Heathcote
22 Grove
23 Murchie

How come you rate Heathcote ?

Haven't yet seen a shred of evidence this season that Dunbar deserves the Scotland 13 jersey (perhaps we'll get some tonight), and I prefer Tonks to Murchie, but otherwise we're pretty much on the same page.

I had thought Jackson deserved to be involved on the back of his recent performances (and I've only seen glimpses of Heathcote recently) but Jackson is now injured and missing the game tonight, which could bring Heathcote in to the mix. It'll also be interesting to see how Weir does tonight. Selection is so close at 10 that it doesn't take more than one half competent performance to throw your hat in the ring.

21st Century Schizoid Man wrote:How come you rate Heathcote ?

He's not that bad schizoid, Most Bath supporters reckon he should be playing all the time instead of world cup winning Stephen Donaldson! Granted his last performance was 10-20 minutes of trying to salvage the biggest mess Scottish rugby has ever been in but that wasn't exactly fair on him!

Heathcotes a good player. Probably the most rounded game of all our young flyhalfs

Beattie Motm again - surely must be in the squad!

absolutely. Pyrgos had a great game despite the loss tonight, I'd like to see him on the squad against England, Weir had a poor showing unfortunately. Although was hard to tell whether it was Weir who was off or whether Pinaar simply outplayed him. I'd say Kellock has a wee bit of a foot in the door too after his efforts tonight, Harley was a bit quiet.

Weir struggled tonight unfortunately,Heathcote's playing from the start against Agen tomorrow so a good performance from him will probably be enough to establish him as the form Scottish 10 going into the 6N (still not convinced Jackson can hold it together consistently but who knows). The fact that Weir and Jackson both play for Glasgow is preventing them both from developing a consistent game I fear.

Well having seen Beatties resurgence to form and Hines' current form, I think France is a good place to go for a lot of Scottish players right now, hopefully enough of them will be impressive enough in the 6Ns to be offered that opportunity, I think it'd greatly benefit the development of players domestically seeing as the SRU are nowhere near getting another pro team and support failing coaches.

I'm a Top 14 convert, if we can't have three pro teams, export our players to other pro teams!

We're always looking for a selection yardstick, some single point by which we can judge the quality of a coach's decision-making. In 2011, the clear and obvious choice was to pick Laidlaw at 10 against England. When Robinson didn't, it brought all the other dubious selections into sharp focus.

This year, if Mr John Beattie Jnr doesn't start at 8 against England, then we can safely say that Scott Johnson is away with the fairies.

All other picks can be debated. After tonight, Beattie at 8 must be a certainty.

Fascinating interview with Scott Johnson

http://www.scotsman.com/sport/rugby/top-rugby-stories/interview-enigmatic-scott-johnson-reveals-his-true-colours-1-2733531

Perhaps he really is the man we need. We need someone to put the players heads in the right place and to sort out the right gameplan with the right players selected

We will see

Yeah Prygos did alright considering the opposition. But it was pretty shakey at times. Weir gave it his all but he had a bad game unfortunately. Missed a crucial tackle at the end. Maitland did very well,mcoming off the wing to help the maul roll, actually contesting for high balls where many were just standing around aimlessly. Has to be a dead cert for 14 I reckon. Harley vs nick Williams resulted in Williams brushing him aside unfortunately but he did well in other parts of the game. MacArthur was throwing beatifully again, I really do like him as a player and he defended well too. Murchie did alright at fullback but I still think Tonks is far better.

Great to hear Beattie had another stormer, will be very upset if he is ignored by Johnson. also will have to see how heathcote gets on today for bath.

That is an interesting interview. I still don't think he's the right appointment long-term for us, but I'm delighted that he's so ready to tell us that he isn't Matt Williams!!