Blues v Munster

First topic message reminder :

Munster: F Jones; D Howlett (capt), K Earls, J Downey, DHurley; R O'Gara, C Murray; D Kilcoyne, M Sherry, S Archer; D Foley, D Ryan; T O'Donnell, S Dougall, J Coughlan.

Replacements: S Henry, W du Preez, BJ Botha, B Holland, CJ Stander, D Williams, I Keatley, C Laulala.

Blues: Jason Tovey; Owen Williams, Richard Smith, Jamie Roberts, Harry Robinson; Rhys Patchell, Lewis Jones; Sam Hobbs, Rhys Williams, Benoit Bourrust, Bradley Davies, Lou Reed, Josh Navidi (capt), Sam Warburton, Robin Copeland.

Replacements: Kritian Dacey, Paetru Tamba, Scott Andrews, James Down, Luke Hamilton, Alex Walker, Ceri Sweeney, Leigh Halfpenny.

Live on S4C and RTE.

Roberts back for the Blues, be nice to see him play well for the us as he is normally lacklustre. Would be interesting to see the Romanian prop Tamba off the bench, a lot of Blues fans have been asking for a gnarly Eastern European Tighthead (I think hes a Tighthead).

Munster were terrible against a poor Blues side with no scrum platform. The defence was very good, the two young wings played very well but Roberts should be shot for blowing the try for Williams. Good win for the Scarlets and Ospreys, if Munster keep playing like this they will stand no chance of getting into the top 4 for the play off's.

How amazing, I am sure I just saw the Blues win in Munster! Looks like Copeland has made that number 8 shirt his own, Owen Williams may actualy be a rugby player and apparently you don't even need your centres to have met before(or at least played together before) for them able to defend competently and even occasionaly make breaks....

This may have had more to do with Munster playing badly rather than us playing well, but it was fun.

If Murray was playing Cardiff don't score either of them tries. Williams is just a hopeless 'player.'

Just looking at the second try....ROG got side-stepped horribly by the no.8

pete (buachaill on eirne) wrote:Just looking at the second try....ROG got side-stepped horribly by the no.8

The first thing that comes to mind is why did he bother with a sidestep, would have been much easier to just run through him, and he might have injured Rog.

pete (buachaill on eirne) wrote:Just looking at the second try....ROG got side-stepped horribly by the no.8

No change there but he kicked very well.

glamorganalun wrote:

pete (buachaill on eirne) wrote:Just looking at the second try....ROG got side-stepped horribly by the no.8

No change there but he kicked very well.

Notch wrote:

glamorganalun wrote:

pete (buachaill on eirne) wrote:Just looking at the second try....ROG got side-stepped horribly by the no.8

No change there but he kicked very well.

Can't argue with any of that. I suppose that is what you get. You'd expect him to try though

valjester wrote:

pete (buachaill on eirne) wrote:Just looking at the second try....ROG got side-stepped horribly by the no.8

The first thing that comes to mind is why did he bother with a sidestep, would have been much easier to just run through him, and he might have injured Rog.

Aye...!

Seen Shane Williams run through O'Gara before, Copeland wouldn't have struggled much. Nice skills by the number eight though.

Well, what the fook just happened there then ? I think this shows up Munsters inabilities more than it shows up the Blues abilities, Munster could still be playing now and they would not score a try, as world class as Ronan O'Gara is at place kicking, he will create nowt, even more so now at his stage of his career, Munster need some immagintion, and even though the Blues should be commended for their result and performance, they would not get away with this against the more able sides and the less said about the foprwards the better.

Ireland don't have that many good no.8's
Copeland is definately someone to look out for.

Coleman wrote:

maestegmafia wrote:

Morgannwg wrote:Well another mention for Navidi anyway. They guy is playing his heart out every week. Would like to see more of him back at 7 though.

He'll be at seven for blues all through fem and march.

Definitely third in the open side table for Wales at the moment.

Won't make the squad yet though.

Hes playing better at 6 then anyone else in Wales at the moment. So i do think he'll be in the squad.

He has really adapted and fit into the 6 position, I hope he can get used to playing 7 again when Sam is away. He deserves to be in the 6ns squad (ahead of McCusker and Turnball) with Lydiate still out, he is 2nd choice 6 and 3rd choice 7 in my books.

LeinsterFan4life wrote:Ireland don't have that many good no.8's
Copeland is definately someone to look out for.

We said "HANDS OFF" :P

The Blues pack are too weak with two 7's in the back row, they had an international prop, two second rows and Warburton and were still stuffed by a waek Munster pack. It is either Warburton, Navidi or my preferred Tipuric for Wales.

wales606 wrote:

Coleman wrote:

maestegmafia wrote:

Morgannwg wrote:Well another mention for Navidi anyway. They guy is playing his heart out every week. Would like to see more of him back at 7 though.

He'll be at seven for blues all through fem and march.

Definitely third in the open side table for Wales at the moment.

Won't make the squad yet though.

Hes playing better at 6 then anyone else in Wales at the moment. So i do think he'll be in the squad.

He has really adapted and fit into the 6 position, I hope he can get used to playing 7 again when Sam is away. He deserves to be in the 6ns squad (ahead of McCusker and Turnball) with Lydiate still out, he is 2nd choice 6 and 3rd choice 7 in my books.

I think I would have Shingler ahead of Nalvidi.

Not sure on the fitness race for Shingler or Lydiate.

Turnbull and McCusker are out of form, don't deserve to make it.

Lewis Evans is the other guy I rate too.

wales606 wrote:

LeinsterFan4life wrote:Ireland don't have that many good no.8's
Copeland is definately someone to look out for.

We said "HANDS OFF" :P

!

glamorganalun wrote:The Blues pack are too weak with two 7's in the back row, they had an international prop, two second rows and Warburton and were still stuffed by a waek Munster pack. It is either Warburton, Navidi or my preferred Tipuric for Wales.

??

The blues backrow and second row were far better than munsters.

glamorganalun wrote:The Blues pack are too weak with two 7's in the back row, they had an international prop, two second rows and Warburton and were still stuffed by a waek Munster pack. It is either Warburton, Navidi or my preferred Tipuric for Wales.

No doubting that they are the three best options at open side. Don't think blues backrow has looked weak, front five has all season but not backrow.

wales606 wrote:

glamorganalun wrote:The Blues pack are too weak with two 7's in the back row, they had an international prop, two second rows and Warburton and were still stuffed by a waek Munster pack. It is either Warburton, Navidi or my preferred Tipuric for Wales.

??

The blues backrow and second row were far better than munsters.

I think Munster's 29 errors plus running the ball in to touch 8+ times may have had something to do with it

Thats not fair, our back row had a very good game.

Coleman wrote:

wales606 wrote:

LeinsterFan4life wrote:Ireland don't have that many good no.8's
Copeland is definately someone to look out for.

We said "HANDS OFF" :P

!

No!!!

How many games have the Blues been hammered in the scrum including this game, what I mean in weak back row is grunt/bulk, the Blues fielded two Wales second rows and an international prop, somebody is not pushing, reesults speak for themselves. Good result tonight but hardly a great game.

Congrats Cardiff. The pro 12 needs a strong Cardiff . Patchell looks a real find.

ROG is becoming a joke at this stage and yet despite that the panel choose to suggest that Jackson shouldn't be starting at ulster! You couldn't write it

FFS I had hoped for better from Horgan but he is just as bad as every other rugby commentator. They are asking for Pienaar to be moved to ten and dropping Jackson, who has had two bad games, yet they have no inclination to criticise Rog or Williams. Total gobs**tes.

glamorganalun wrote:How many games have the Blues been hammered in the scrum including this game, what I mean in weak back row is grunt/bulk, the Blues fielded two Wales second rows and an international prop, somebody is not pushing, reesults speak for themselves. Good result tonight but hardly a great game.

You're right on that point. Our scrum is very lightweight and i would assume that someone isnt giving it their all. When Hobbs went off the scrum looked a lot better. I don't think we have any good scrumaging hookers either, which is why we want Mathew Rees so much.

[quote="Coleman"]

glamorganalun wrote:How many games have the Blues been hammered in the scrum including this game, what I mean in weak back row is grunt/bulk, the Blues fielded two Wales second rows and an international prop, somebody is not pushing, reesults speak for themselves. Good result tonight but hardly a great game.

You're right on that point. Our scrum is very lightweight and i would assume that someone isnt giving it their all. When Hobbs went off the scrum looked a lot better. I don't think we have any good scrumaging hookers either, which is why we want Mathew Rees so much. [/quote

In Wales we have the Scarlets with three 6's (an old 7 on the bench), the Blues with two 7's and the Ospreys with two 8's and due to injury to Waters the Dragons don't have a 7. The welsh regions could do with moving some players around.

valjester wrote:FFS I had hoped for better from Horgan but he is just as bad as every other rugby commentator. They are asking for Pienaar to be moved to ten and dropping Jackson, who has had two bad games, yet they have no inclination to criticise Rog or Williams. Total gobs**tes.

And a day after he leads ulster to a 5 try win, and ROG overseas possibly the most toothless munster attack in living memory

Coleman wrote:

glamorganalun wrote:How many games have the Blues been hammered in the scrum including this game, what I mean in weak back row is grunt/bulk, the Blues fielded two Wales second rows and an international prop, somebody is not pushing, reesults speak for themselves. Good result tonight but hardly a great game.

You're right on that point. Our scrum is very lightweight and i would assume that someone isnt giving it their all. When Hobbs went off the scrum looked a lot better. I don't think we have any good scrumaging hookers either, which is why we want Mathew Rees so much.

There is a bit of a problem with he back5 not giving enough power, but I think we would be fine if we had Gill and Rees in the front row. The ospreys managed with a lightweight second row for a fair while, a light backrow isn't the blues but problem at the moment. We also have Paterson to come back to 6 or lock.

valjester wrote:FFS I had hoped for better from Horgan but he is just as bad as every other rugby commentator. They are asking for Pienaar to be moved to ten and dropping Jackson, who has had two bad games, yet they have no inclination to criticise Rog or Williams. Total gobs**tes.

Yeah that was pretty silly of him. In all fairness everything else he said other than that was very insightful

Standulstermen wrote:

valjester wrote:FFS I had hoped for better from Horgan but he is just as bad as every other rugby commentator. They are asking for Pienaar to be moved to ten and dropping Jackson, who has had two bad games, yet they have no inclination to criticise Rog or Williams. Total gobs**tes.

And a day after he leads ulster to a 5 try win, and ROG overseas possibly the most toothless munster attack in living memory

From a neutral, Jackson won't make an internaional unless he improves his goal kicker, or ireland can find a goal kicker somewhere else on the pitch

Standulstermen wrote:

valjester wrote:FFS I had hoped for better from Horgan but he is just as bad as every other rugby commentator. They are asking for Pienaar to be moved to ten and dropping Jackson, who has had two bad games, yet they have no inclination to criticise Rog or Williams. Total gobs**tes.

And a day after he leads ulster to a 5 try win, and ROG overseas possibly the most toothless munster attack in living memory

Yeah very silly

wales606 wrote:

Standulstermen wrote:

valjester wrote:FFS I had hoped for better from Horgan but he is just as bad as every other rugby commentator. They are asking for Pienaar to be moved to ten and dropping Jackson, who has had two bad games, yet they have no inclination to criticise Rog or Williams. Total gobs**tes.

And a day after he leads ulster to a 5 try win, and ROG overseas possibly the most toothless munster attack in living memory

From a neutral, Jackson won't make an internaional unless he improves his goal kicker, or ireland can find a goal kicker somewhere else on the pitch

That's not a bad shout. He needs to get consistency but when you watch ROG who is unable to get his team scoring trys you understand the frustration. I make it approx 110mins of consecutive rugby with o'gara at 10 and munster haven't looked like scoring a try

wales606 wrote:

Standulstermen wrote:

valjester wrote:FFS I had hoped for better from Horgan but he is just as bad as every other rugby commentator. They are asking for Pienaar to be moved to ten and dropping Jackson, who has had two bad games, yet they have no inclination to criticise Rog or Williams. Total gobs**tes.

And a day after he leads ulster to a 5 try win, and ROG overseas possibly the most toothless munster attack in living memory

From a neutral, Jackson won't make an internaional unless he improves his goal kicker, or ireland can find a goal kicker somewhere else on the pitch

Valid point.

Thing is Sexton wasn't a great goal kicker, still not world class but he was given a good run.

O'Gara has been a shadow of the influence he used to have..!

Standulstermen wrote:

wales606 wrote:

Standulstermen wrote:

valjester wrote:FFS I had hoped for better from Horgan but he is just as bad as every other rugby commentator. They are asking for Pienaar to be moved to ten and dropping Jackson, who has had two bad games, yet they have no inclination to criticise Rog or Williams. Total gobs**tes.

And a day after he leads ulster to a 5 try win, and ROG overseas possibly the most toothless munster attack in living memory

From a neutral, Jackson won't make an internaional unless he improves his goal kicker, or ireland can find a goal kicker somewhere else on the pitch

That's not a bad shout. He needs to get consistency but when you watch ROG who is unable to get his team scoring trys you understand the frustration. I make it approx 110mins of consecutive rugby with o'gara at 10 and munster haven't looked like scoring a try

Try having Dan Parks at 10 for two seasons

Jackson doesn't need Ireland right now. He's not consistent enough. He needs to be left to work on his game at Ulster. ROG desperately needs Ireland for his ego, but Ireland certainly doesn't need him. He's finished. Madigan or Keatley should take his Ireland place. Jackson should be left to mature- he needs gametime which is why the verdict of the anointed RTE panel is so baffling.

wales606 wrote:

Standulstermen wrote:

wales606 wrote:

Standulstermen wrote:

valjester wrote:FFS I had hoped for better from Horgan but he is just as bad as every other rugby commentator. They are asking for Pienaar to be moved to ten and dropping Jackson, who has had two bad games, yet they have no inclination to criticise Rog or Williams. Total gobs**tes.

And a day after he leads ulster to a 5 try win, and ROG overseas possibly the most toothless munster attack in living memory

From a neutral, Jackson won't make an internaional unless he improves his goal kicker, or ireland can find a goal kicker somewhere else on the pitch

That's not a bad shout. He needs to get consistency but when you watch ROG who is unable to get his team scoring trys you understand the frustration. I make it approx 110mins of consecutive rugby with o'gara at 10 and munster haven't looked like scoring a try

Try having Dan Parks at 10 for two seasons

Parks is doing good things with Connacht currently. They just got a fairly handsome victory and beat Biarritz earlier in the year

Notch wrote:Jackson doesn't need Ireland right now. He's not consistent enough. He needs to be left to work on his game at Ulster. ROG desperately needs Ireland for his ego, but Ireland certainly doesn't need him. He's finished. Madigan or Keatley should take his Ireland place. Jackson should be left to mature- he needs gametime which is why the verdict of the anointed RTE panel is so baffling.

I think so too. Put Madigan in, he looks the best of the three of them currently

pete (buachaill on eirne) wrote:

wales606 wrote:

Standulstermen wrote:

wales606 wrote:

Standulstermen wrote:

valjester wrote:FFS I had hoped for better from Horgan but he is just as bad as every other rugby commentator. They are asking for Pienaar to be moved to ten and dropping Jackson, who has had two bad games, yet they have no inclination to criticise Rog or Williams. Total gobs**tes.

And a day after he leads ulster to a 5 try win, and ROG overseas possibly the most toothless munster attack in living memory

From a neutral, Jackson won't make an internaional unless he improves his goal kicker, or ireland can find a goal kicker somewhere else on the pitch

That's not a bad shout. He needs to get consistency but when you watch ROG who is unable to get his team scoring trys you understand the frustration. I make it approx 110mins of consecutive rugby with o'gara at 10 and munster haven't looked like scoring a try

Try having Dan Parks at 10 for two seasons

Parks is doing good things with Connacht currently. They just got a fairly handsome victory and beat Biarritz earlier in the year

No one could play as badly as Parks had at the Blues for as long as he did and at such a consistently appaulling level and improve that much.

It must be something other than Parks that is helping Connacht.

pete (buachaill on eirne) wrote:

wales606 wrote:

Standulstermen wrote:

wales606 wrote:

Standulstermen wrote:

valjester wrote:FFS I had hoped for better from Horgan but he is just as bad as every other rugby commentator. They are asking for Pienaar to be moved to ten and dropping Jackson, who has had two bad games, yet they have no inclination to criticise Rog or Williams. Total gobs**tes.

And a day after he leads ulster to a 5 try win, and ROG overseas possibly the most toothless munster attack in living memory

From a neutral, Jackson won't make an internaional unless he improves his goal kicker, or ireland can find a goal kicker somewhere else on the pitch

That's not a bad shout. He needs to get consistency but when you watch ROG who is unable to get his team scoring trys you understand the frustration. I make it approx 110mins of consecutive rugby with o'gara at 10 and munster haven't looked like scoring a try

Try having Dan Parks at 10 for two seasons

Parks is doing good things with Connacht currently. They just got a fairly handsome victory and beat Biarritz earlier in the year

Parks is also doing really bad things. He was awful against us in the RDS and I do often see people on the connacht forums critisising him. He is abit hit and miss.

maestegmafia wrote:

pete (buachaill on eirne) wrote:

wales606 wrote:

Standulstermen wrote:

wales606 wrote:

Standulstermen wrote:

valjester wrote:FFS I had hoped for better from Horgan but he is just as bad as every other rugby commentator. They are asking for Pienaar to be moved to ten and dropping Jackson, who has had two bad games, yet they have no inclination to criticise Rog or Williams. Total gobs**tes.

And a day after he leads ulster to a 5 try win, and ROG overseas possibly the most toothless munster attack in living memory

From a neutral, Jackson won't make an internaional unless he improves his goal kicker, or ireland can find a goal kicker somewhere else on the pitch

That's not a bad shout. He needs to get consistency but when you watch ROG who is unable to get his team scoring trys you understand the frustration. I make it approx 110mins of consecutive rugby with o'gara at 10 and munster haven't looked like scoring a try

Try having Dan Parks at 10 for two seasons

Parks is doing good things with Connacht currently. They just got a fairly handsome victory and beat Biarritz earlier in the year

No one could play as badly as Parks had at the Blues for as long as he did and at such a consistently appaulling level and improve that much.

It must be something other than Parks that is helping Connacht.

Parks style suits Connacht

Try having Sam Norton Knight at 10 for a year

I like Sexton. He's great.

On Parks, I think he is thriving in Connacht because the fans and team seem to be behind him, and his value for them is much more than what he brings on the pitch. The younger players like Marmion and Henshaw are learning lots from him, and by all accounts he has been great in training for the younger players with plenty of encouragement and constructive criticism.


On Jackson, the thing with his kicking is that it is quite good, and only went to sh*t for the u20s last year after he changed his technique. I still can't believe they allowed Murray to stop kicking, he kicked for the u20s when he played for them and for Garryowen and he had a beautiful technique.

Brian Haugh is another scrum half you can kick excellently. He was supposed to be very good for Young Munsters today against Old Belvedere, and kicked 8 from 8.

The BBC article on this game is abysmal.

They say that Munster have only won 1/11 home games.

They also state that Downs and Hamilton didn't come on for the Blues even though Downs was on for about 30 minutes, and Hamilton for 10.

wales606 wrote:The BBC article on this game is abysmal.

They say that Munster have only won 1/11 home games.

They also state that Downs and Hamilton didn't come on for the Blues even though Downs was on for about 30 minutes, and Hamilton for 10.

Not the first or last time the BBC man sausage up an article on welsh rugby is it mate...!

pete (buachaill on eirne) wrote:

valjester wrote:FFS I had hoped for better from Horgan but he is just as bad as every other rugby commentator. They are asking for Pienaar to be moved to ten and dropping Jackson, who has had two bad games, yet they have no inclination to criticise Rog or Williams. Total gobs**tes.

Yeah that was pretty silly of him. In all fairness everything else he said other than that was very insightful

He completely ignored everything bad Rog did, blaming everyone else but his friend. Its a load of crap.

The blues actually used all their replacements but Sweeney, which was pretty brave when they needed the win.

I thought I heard the commentators say that phil Davies wasn't there, and the interview after was with rush.

I wonder who made the substitution decision if Davies wasn't there.

valjester wrote:

pete (buachaill on eirne) wrote:

valjester wrote:FFS I had hoped for better from Horgan but he is just as bad as every other rugby commentator. They are asking for Pienaar to be moved to ten and dropping Jackson, who has had two bad games, yet they have no inclination to criticise Rog or Williams. Total gobs**tes.

Yeah that was pretty silly of him. In all fairness everything else he said other than that was very insightful

He completely ignored everything bad Rog did, blaming everyone else but his friend. Its a load of crap.

Completely agree however everything else he said was brilliant I thought. He knows so much more about how the game actually works than all the other commentators (along with Conor O'Shea) the others are cretins.

Again he was wrong in my mind to say Jackson should be dropped for Paul Marshall (who is currently being outplayed by Heaney)

pete (buachaill on eirne) wrote:

valjester wrote:

pete (buachaill on eirne) wrote:

valjester wrote:FFS I had hoped for better from Horgan but he is just as bad as every other rugby commentator. They are asking for Pienaar to be moved to ten and dropping Jackson, who has had two bad games, yet they have no inclination to criticise Rog or Williams. Total gobs**tes.

Yeah that was pretty silly of him. In all fairness everything else he said other than that was very insightful

He completely ignored everything bad Rog did, blaming everyone else but his friend. Its a load of crap.

Completely agree however everything else he said was brilliant I thought. He knows so much more about how the game actually works than all the other commentators (along with Conor O'Shea) the others are cretins.

Again he was wrong in my mind to say Jackson should be dropped for Paul Marshall (who is currently being outplayed by Heaney)

I'll listen to some of what he says in terms of backline play, but he does tend to spout some rubbish on the forwards.

First game Halfpenny has been on the winning side in fifteen games apparently.

maestegmafia wrote:First game Halfpenny has been on the winning side in fifteen games apparently.

Yep, since he beat France to win the GrandSlam