2013 Super XV: Fixtures, Results & Table

When I was watching this morning, the thought came to my mind of all the dribble we have read recentlyon this forum about how great some of the UK midfield backs are that were involved the Lions tour, Begs the question, have some people never seen John de Villiers?

Unfortunately South African backs are regularly dismissed as average due to preconcieved perceptions about how we play rugby.

Habana is often similarly dismissed.

Did you okes watch the Sharks-Kings Game? Admitedly it was a very weak Kings team, but some sublime running and handling by the Sharks. Ndungane was a revelation at fullback. He's usually been a safe, but rather anonymous player on the wing, but yesterday, at 15, he was superb, involved in virtually every attacking move of the Sharks...He's obviously been watching Willie Le Roux.

Last year the conference system affected the Sharks. This year the Crusaders finish above the Brumbies due to more games won and a better points differential. Frankly though I'd rather play the Reds at home than the Cheetahs. What happens though if a team finishes above another but the conference place goes to another team. If they leap frog to 2nd do they miss a game and get home advantage or is this mathematically impossible and I'm too thick to realise?

No Kia the rankings are now set.

I meant in future years.

anyone else feel like this format is painfully long?

anyone else feel like this format is painfully long?

Yep, and breaking it in two parts didn't help

Cheetahs are long odds for this title. Three straight away games... Might have to come back if they face the Bulls... Then another trip no matter what. Maybe we have to look at each country hosting the play offs in alternating years?

There shouldn't be 6 play off spots, just 4.

There shouldn't be a guaranteed conference team.

Personally I think the top scoring franchises should be rewarded with home advantage and six teams offers more hope to teams and gives the top teams a well-earned rest. Essentially for them it is a 4 team play off. I have no problem with that. But if there are only two teams getting a rest then we shouldn't bother who the other two teams are when they come to face them in the semis. Just give the top sides the play off berth.

Crucially, if a bottom ranked finalist does make it to the finals, then there should be a two week break between the semi and final to give them a fighting chance to recover. Conceivably you could have a game in SA, NZ and SA and by the 3rd week running, it's extremely difficult to be competitive. By all means give the top ranked team home advantage but give the other team a chance to compete relatively fresh.

Well look at last year, the Sharks came 6th, they went to Queensland, beat the Reds in a display of fast paced high intensity rugby, then travelled to Cape Town to slap the Stormers around, again an excellent performance, then back to New Zealand to play the Chiefs, did anyone expect them to have anything left in the tank?

This year the Cheetahs came 6th, they have to go to Canberra to beat the Brumbies, then back to SA to beat the Bulls then back to New Zealand to beat the Chiefs, alternatively they have to go to New Zealand after beating the Brumbies, then to New Zealand to beat the Crusaders then back to SA to take the Bulls, or a few other permutations depending on who wins on the other side.

All it does is a waste of time and energy, for what? A wee little bit of hope that you are going to win 3 out of three matches on the road against the top three teams in the comp?

I see what you mean. Only have four teams because three matches with likely travel between different conferences is too much. But I like the idea that a team like the Sharks or the Cheetahs have a mathematical chance of winning. Two semis with one and two having home advantage is too predictable. Give 1 and 2 a break for having an incentive to do well in the round robin but have a break like after 2 rounds in the RC between the semi and the final. That way regardless of who makes the final has some chance.

Sure it provides excitement , I mean the sharks fans must have gone ape crazy last year for their team who went on a superb run, however it is probably going to take 100 years before a sixth placed team manages to win.

In the current format. We have breaks all over the place as it is. Can't see the harm in a week off before the final. Build the fans into a frenzy.

The Crusaders in their homeless year did the most travel any team will ever do to get to the final. Still hurts they didn't win that one.

Kia I was actually thinking about that one the other day, and I would hazard a guess that the claim of them travelling that much is most likely an exaggeration. True they didn't play in Christchurch, however they still played in NZ for their home matches apart from the one that took place in London, but then the Sharks also travelled to London to play that match.

So yeah, I agree they didn't play at home, but as for the travel that one can only be calculated.

I'll give you an example, I worked it out on one of the threads on the international section sometime earlier in the year, Jannie du Plessis traveled something like 120 000 kms last year.

SA Super teams have to travel the most undoubtedly. You could be right but not having any home games - even if they were in NZ - extends the mental distance. Like Dorothy said there's no place like home and even though being caught in a tornado must be a harrowing experience, the psychological toll of an earthquake and the aftershocks is much greater. Dorothy ended up in Oz but we went all the way to London.

Honestly, I like the 15-team format, but it could be fixed. The travelling for play-offs is a issue that needs to be looked. I dont think anyone can argue that, Australia to South Africa to New Zealand is worse than Australia to NZ to SA, for example. The South African middle leg is pretty much a death knell, and someone is almost always going to get it.

game on...come on Saders!

Go my red and black beauties!!!!

Off to a wedding Tman. 3 hour drive to Leon. Score updates would be appreciated.  

10-nil....13.05 in.

saders of course

Carter in...Whitelock brilliant run...18-6.

21-6 half time kia...mccaw yet to come on with a try no try look...

This could become ugly.

Cheers for the updates. I was driving.

Come on the Brumbies. Much prefer traveling to Hamilton than Loftus.

Good result for NZ as well. Gives a lot for mckenzie to think about. Match report seems the damage was done up front and then good running lines in the backs.

Come on the Brumbies?

Shame on you.

If it means an easier semi shame I can deal with mate!

The Bulls are not in great shape or form. I reckon they will br easier than the Chiefs

Yeah I agree mate. But traveling to SA for the final is much easier than traveling back from Sa to Oz and NZ.

Give ourselves the best shot for the final is what I want and it's clear to me which route is preferable. Not that either is easy but the travel is much less punishing the semi I prefer.

Crusaders are looking ominous. I'm not sure I'd want to face them anywhere. I'm stuck in that horrible position where I want them to win because they're a kiwi side and they play good footie, but they're the crusaders....

Haha I know that feeling bc. That was Auckland for me growing up. They were a much more complete side full of giants of the game. If the Saders pack are able to dominate they're a handful for any side. Good to see McCaw not come on until the 66th minute. Let the players who have been in form do the damage and then bring him on for psychological effect.

Good to hear that Crotty had a good game. He needs to step up now that Fruean has gone. The Chiefs played well last year after their break and indifferent form before it but the Saders are finally stringing performances together. Saw a funny article on stuff about a 91 year old woman who might well be their biggest fan and is enamoured with Whitelock. Bet she was gushing and hitting the sherry Reuben Thorne had given her when he made that big run to set up the try!

There's some good talent coming through. Taylor and Marshall had good games. Not sure about Crockett and his scrummaging. It's not that he isn't sound (I have strong opinions but no real knowledge of scrummaging). It's more a case of being at one with the ref.

I agree about Crockett. He makes me uneasy in a black shirt. Once you get a reputation from the ref it's difficult to shake.

Franks, Whitelock and Read are genuine talents. Romano has a lot to learn but the thing I like about him is that he has incredible handling for such a big guy. He is great at passing and in the offload. Add in Crockett, Todd and Flynn who are solid domestic players and when they're on song, they're formidable. Whitelock is becoming a key player and it's good to see him make the step up.

If you get front foot ball you give yourself so many options. Add in Carter pulling the strings and that combination will trouble any side. We have looked ordinary when the pack has not gained an advantage. They're the key just like any game but the backs respond best when they have front foot ball. Just like any other side I guess.

Some of Horwill and his ozzie troups will be feeling a little jaded after going back to back mashings in big matches...

Brumbies slightly fortunate to make it through this morning.  Tough trip for them to take on the Bulls in the semi now.

Well the Brumbies played finals rugby, they played territory and kicked their goals.

The Cheetahs were an inexperienced team at finals and it showed, they were naive in the manner they played territory, but you can't take away from the fact that they outscored the Brumbies, they were very effective in defence and should have just slowed down the game and taken one of the earlier kicks at goal before they dominated the last 10 minutes.

Overall, Jake White is teaching his boys how to win finals rugby and you can't take that away from them, not inspiring performance by the Brumbies, but they won.

Just have to say, Love the fact that the Aussies are now fully converted in p.aying Jake White rugby, perhaps the perception of who olays how changes now.

Also, congratulations to the Cheetahs, insoiring season by them, hopefully it proves to be the catalyst for our national coach to realise SA can play ball in hand rugby if you give it a shot.

Cheetahs made SA proud this season.

Cheetahs were excellent Biltong, a real breath of fresh air.

Definitely the years improvers and what a way to end it with the upright being hit- they probably would have surged on over the 20 minutes after that (assuming thats how it works).

The Cheetahs were like the Huuricanes and Sharks last year. They win the hearts of the neutrals with their attacking play. Disappointed for them but they will learn to be a bit smarter in their play next time.

As a one eyed Cantab good to see we don't have far to travel. Won't be easy. Chiefs have proved they can wipe out disappointing form. The Sadists have the best form arguably of the semi finalists but that can change all too easily.

Fairly commanding form though Kia and they dealt to the Chiefs recently.
But agree and Rennie, Smith and co arent mugs. Theyll be ready for this but if the Saders bring their A game it'll be same old...

So we have a Chiefs vs Saders semi in Hamilton and Bulls vs Brumbies in Durban.

A certain NZ finalist with possibly our best chances are if the Saders lose and get a home Chiefs match, or a Saders brumbies in Oz. I can't see a win against the Bulls in SA, despite the Saders form. Seen it all before and we always come off second best.

Carter's not going to play for the Crusaders next year with his sabbatical. I sense there's hunger to have him go out with a bang on the Crusaders. They just look so enthusiastic at the breakdown and so relentless.

Home advantage is definitely a big obstacle to overcome. The Saders have made the past 14 semis out of 16. They have won all their home playoff matches. Away it's a much bigger ask but they are the team to do it. I remember being highly dismissive of the team at the start of the season. Now I'm a believer. Carter will get his send off. I have seen the light.  

So Saders this week huh? Big marker laid.

I personally think the Crusaders are too hot to handle at the moment, the Chiefs willhave to play out of their skins to win next weekend, there seems an inevitability about the Crusaders at the moment, when they start their multiphase moves it is like a wave that just keeps coming, patient, resilient and always gaining more and more momentum.

The Chiefs have the perfect game to look at what not to do against Canty. Their tactics were awful. It's going to be a great derby semi.

Yeah the good thing for the Chiefs is theyll be expecting an A side Saders to front this weekend and will be up for it. If theres one criticism of the Saders they do tend to have a mysterious drop off all of a sudden- particularly the knockouts of the past 3-4 years- the Reds a couple of seasons ago one of them. If they dont maintain the form of the past 2-3 matches, the Chiefs are the side to punish that.