Hook halfway to Australia?

Technically yes as he'll be in Hong Kong anyway.

Here are the facts.

1. Only two 10's have been picked for the lions so far.
2. Nobody else in the squad with enough experience at 10.
3. Wilkinson ruled himself out.
4. Biggar going to oz.
5. Priestland not good enough.
6. Flood not good enough.
7. Hook is playing excellent for Perpignan.
8. Hook wasn't selected for Japan tour.

It would be extremely bizzare for Hook to play FOR and AGAINST the lions, but it wouldn't surprise me if he joins them after Hong Kong. The Barbarians game isn't part of the Australia tour and is more of a money spinning marketing gimmick / warmup game.

Didn't Riki Flutey play for and against the Lions?

Based on the interview with Hook in TRP, the player believes he is not on a reserve list.

bedfordwelsh wrote:Didn't Riki Flutey play for and against the Lions?

Ther ehave been a few players over the years who have played for and against them. Flutey was the only one who was an actual full bloodied Kiwi though.

Think Hogg is the utility back for the tour, both Gatland and howley said that last week. They obviously think he has the talent and so do I actually.

Hogg played 20 mins at 10 on the weekend, he looked good. Slotted 2/2 kicks at goal, one from the sideline. Be interesting to see if he plays at ten vs Leinster.

If any of the tens or Hogg get injured then maybe they'll look to hook. Was always a big fan of hook at fullback for Wales, but 1/2p has effectively ended his career for Wales at fullback.

LondonTiger wrote:Based on the interview with Hook in TRP, the player believes he is not on a reserve list.

Do they actually announce a reserve list these days, I always thought they did just so players knew whether to make alternative plans etc. It may just be luck for some like Andy Nicol who was 'funnily enough' on holiday in Oz when he was asked to join party.

Hook seems to be basing it on no communication at all from Lions (or Welsh) coaches.

Hook has had his wish of playing regularly at 10 for a star studded quality squad, he had a massive opportunity to show this perceived undoubted talent in almost ideal circumstances...... and he has had an average season..... some MOM performances, some good, some average and one or two poor games. Have to say he had some good moments against Stade in the Amlin Cup SF game coupled with some dire moments notably missing both conversations and a very kickable penalty at 19-19 much to the home fans dismay and increasing frustration, what made it worse was the figure of their ex-flyhalf Jerome Porical kicking everything in sight. It all seemed like "too little too late" however for Hooky. Shades of his timeline with the Ospreys it appears.

Biggar, Priestland, Laidlaw, Matt Scott, Madigan, Wilkinson, Flood are most probably in eyes of the Lions coaching team ahead of him. Next season with the likes of Rhys Patchell, Owen Williams, Matthew Morgan coming into the picture the international future is not oange (ooops that's our Gav isn't it) its very very grey.

I think a nice relaxing summer with his wife and family, and recharge his batteries will be best for James.

I believe that McBryde asked Gats if selecting Hook, Ryan Jones or Matthew Rees for the Welsh squad would hamper any chance of them being called up to the Lions, and Gats reply was it wouldn't help them. So I take it that Hook could well be the first non-scrum half back to be called upon if any of the Lions backs get injured. But that said he hasn't figured in Gats international plans for a few years now, so not sure if he would get any gametime even if he did get drafted up.

There will be injuries, possibly before a match is played in oz.

Hook and Ryan Jones will feature in some capacity.

t1000advancedprototype wrote:There will be injuries, possibly before a match is played in oz.

Hook and Ryan Jones will feature in some capacity.

Explain to us your words of wisdom, why?

There are 3 FBs, 2 FHs and a utility cover in Hogg,

Standby
9/10 Laidlaw
10/12 - Scott / Madigan
10 - Wilkinson / Laidlaw/ Biggar / Madigan / Priestland
12/13 - Scott Williams / Matt Scott
15 - Byrne / Liam Williams

Ryan Jones is a different proposition entirely, if he hadn't been injured he would have captained the Welsh to the 6Ns title and be on the plane. So can certainly see him on standby along with Brown and Robshaw

Surely the only reason Wilkinsons name is popping up is because it sells newspapers?

He hasn't played as well as most of the names in your post above to warrant being in the Lions squad, that said, I would rather Wilkinson to Farrell, which I guess tells of how much I think Farrell has to prove on this tour. He had ruled himself out of contention in the last rounds of the Six nations and has done nothing since to alter my view on him.

ScarletSpiderman wrote:I believe that McBryde asked Gats if selecting Hook, Ryan Jones or Matthew Rees for the Welsh squad would hamper any chance of them being called up to the Lions, and Gats reply was it wouldn't help them. So I take it that Hook could well be the first non-scrum half back to be called upon if any of the Lions backs get injured. But that said he hasn't figured in Gats international plans for a few years now, so not sure if he would get any gametime even if he did get drafted up.

Wonder if this applies to Dan Biggar too. Surely even Gatland & Howley cannot consider RP after that Scarlets drubbing by Treviso.

I would guess Wilko is number one on the call-up list. Farrell should not be there at all - but he is. Suggesting a tight, bish-bosh gameplan and a 10 who does what he is told.

t1000advancedprototype wrote:

It would be extremely bizzare for Hook to play FOR and AGAINST the lions, but it wouldn't surprise me if he joins them after Hong Kong. The Barbarians game isn't part of the Australia tour and is more of a money spinning marketing gimmick / warmup game.

I hope not.
Not only is there better players available elsewhere (as in other Lions' nations), his days in a Wales jersey are numbered.

samuraidragon wrote:

ScarletSpiderman wrote:I believe that McBryde asked Gats if selecting Hook, Ryan Jones or Matthew Rees for the Welsh squad would hamper any chance of them being called up to the Lions, and Gats reply was it wouldn't help them. So I take it that Hook could well be the first non-scrum half back to be called upon if any of the Lions backs get injured. But that said he hasn't figured in Gats international plans for a few years now, so not sure if he would get any gametime even if he did get drafted up.

Wonder if this applies to Dan Biggar too. Surely even Gatland & Howley cannot consider RP after that Scarlets drubbing by Treviso.

I would guess Wilko is number one on the call-up list. Farrell should not be there at all - but he is. Suggesting a tight, bish-bosh gameplan and a 10 who does what he is told.

Saying RP cannot be considered after the drubbing from Treviso is a daft thing to say. Owen Williams didn't play well to my surprise. When RP came on he showed glimpses of his past form and the team looked a bit better, although still extremely poor.

Farrell is the best 10 behind Sexton in the 6 Nations. I've been watching him since last season, he's a good player and he does deserve to be there. Hopefully Wilko is number one on the call-up list though, or Madigan.

IMO Biggar was the best fly half in the six nations, and coming from a Biggar-hater like me that takes some saying. However Gats seems to have issues with Biggar so that means no hope of a call uo for him. Laidlaw is a decent option, as is Madigan, for the positions they cover. However Gats seems to use the 'used to the environment' argument for selecting some players, and that may work in Hooks favour.

OK - let me make it clearer. After the rubbish Priestland served up in the autumn followed by a long lay-off, he should never have been considered at all. The Scarlets drubbing at home to Treviso in game they might have needed to win - when Treviso had nothing to gain - did not change that one jot.

Better?

Hi SS. It wasn't a good tournament for outside halves after Sexton got injured. I don't think many really played very well. Biggar was just a solid, reliable option for us. He still has a lot to work on. I would prefer the RP of 2011 though,that's if he returns to us.

Saint, Priestland of 2011 would be starting fly half. But Biggar, of this season, has been solid and dependable. And sometimes that is all you need from a fly half. After all ROG or Stevo were just that, but both have been Lions test players.

SS, after RP's run of bad form we were crying out for a solid, dependable option. Now that Biggar has had more games with Wales under his belt we'll have that option to fall back on. But Patchell on the other hand looks like he could be world class. It would be nice to have these 3 playing well for us in the future.
Hook started out well but never really ironed out the fundamental flaws in his game. He's extremely erratic when controlling the game and is certainly the opposite of dependable.

samuraidragon wrote:OK - let me make it clearer. After the rubbish Priestland served up in the autumn followed by a long lay-off, he should never have been considered at all. The Scarlets drubbing at home to Treviso in game they might have needed to win - when Treviso had nothing to gain - did not change that one jot.

Better?

I disagree that Priestland played badly in the Autumn. He was heavily criticised by a few people on these boards but those posters invariably write doom and gloom to be proved wrong after the event.

Dont think Hook will be needed to be honest.....Halfpenny will be taking the kicks at goal if either Sexton or Farrell gets injured.

majesticimperialman wrote:Dont think Hook will be needed to be honest.....Halfpenny will be taking the kicks at goal if either Sexton or Farrell gets injured.

Halfpenny doesn't play flyhalf.

majesticimperialman wrote:Dont think Hook will be needed to be honest.....Halfpenny will be taking the kicks at goal if either Sexton or Farrell gets injured.

Why won't Halfpenny be taking the kicks otherwise? You're very confused today Madge

Risca Rev wrote:

majesticimperialman wrote:Dont think Hook will be needed to be honest.....Halfpenny will be taking the kicks at goal if either Sexton or Farrell gets injured.

Why won't Halfpenny be taking the kicks otherwise? You're very confused today Madge

It seems he thinks a fly-halves job is to just kick. Or perhaps he sees Hook offering little else than just another kicking option, and I don't think his kicks at goal success rate is as high as the rate of Farrell or Halfpenny.

There is an interview with Hook on the BBC site. He states that he has not figured for Wales because Gatland and Howely prefer big players to get over the gainline.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-union/22416956

Strange statement firstly it is unlikely to endear him to Gatland and also both players recently preferred at 10, Biggar and Priestland, according to the WRU site, are actually smaller than Hook!

Seagultaf wrote:
Strange statement firstly it is unlikely to endear him to Gatland and also both players recently preferred at 10, Biggar and Priestland, according to the WRU site, are actually smaller than Hook!

The exaggerated stats never cease to amaze me. Both are taller than Hook, but all three are probably around the same weight, which you can tell by looking at them. The 10 is unlikely to be taking it into contact anyway.

Risca Rev wrote:

majesticimperialman wrote:Dont think Hook will be needed to be honest.....Halfpenny will be taking the kicks at goal if either Sexton or Farrell gets injured.

Why won't Halfpenny be taking the kicks otherwise? You're very confused today Madge

Do you honestly think that Halfpenny will be taking the kicks at goal if either Sexton or Farrell are on the field?

I dont, unless it is a long range kick then he might.

Stephen Larkham was a great 10 for Australia, but he wasn't a kicking 10. never took a kick at goal, although he did do a great Drop goal once. so who ever plays 10 does not need to be a goal kicker. juist needs to be able to get the back line going.

So NO, Hook will not be needed. unless injury of course.

Farrell over Biggar is the biggest mystery.

Hook is better at getting a backline moving

The Saint wrote:

Seagultaf wrote:
Strange statement firstly it is unlikely to endear him to Gatland and also both players recently preferred at 10, Biggar and Priestland, according to the WRU site, are actually smaller than Hook!

The exaggerated stats never cease to amaze me. Both are taller than Hook, but all three are probably around the same weight, which you can tell by looking at them. The 10 is unlikely to be taking it into contact anyway.

It was Hook that said that Gats and Howley preferred bigger players to take the ball over the backline. My point is that neither Priestland or Biggar is bigger than Hook. That is why I said the statement was a strange one to make.

maestegmafia wrote:Hook is better at getting a backline moving

I have not seen any evidence of Hook doing that at test level for the last 2 or 3 seasons. Priestland did get the backine moving in the World Cup before his form dipped, Hook certainly has not.

The Saint wrote:

Seagultaf wrote:
Strange statement firstly it is unlikely to endear him to Gatland and also both players recently preferred at 10, Biggar and Priestland, according to the WRU site, are actually smaller than Hook!

The exaggerated stats never cease to amaze me. Both are taller than Hook, but all three are probably around the same weight, which you can tell by looking at them. The 10 is unlikely to be taking it into contact anyway.

Hook
Height: 1.83 m
Weight: 93 kg

Priestland
Height: 1.83 m
Weight: 87 kg

Biggar
Height: 1.83 m
Weight: 89 kg

I would say those stats are out of date as Biggar seems taller than Hook by about an inch or two, and seems a tad bigger!!

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Saint, Priestland of 2011 would be starting fly half. But Biggar, of this season, has been solid and dependable. And sometimes that is all you need from a fly half. After all ROG or Stevo were just that, but both have been Lions test players.

Yes they were Lions but did the Lions win! The Lions have not picked a decent flyhalf in a test match since Bennett, we keep picking safe no threat 10's even Wilko was off form and lacked pace. I fear the only source of scores will be penalties and forward based tries, 10 is very weak position.

majesticimperialman wrote:

Risca Rev wrote:

majesticimperialman wrote:Dont think Hook will be needed to be honest.....Halfpenny will be taking the kicks at goal if either Sexton or Farrell gets injured.

Why won't Halfpenny be taking the kicks otherwise? You're very confused today Madge

Do you honestly think that Halfpenny will be taking the kicks at goal if either Sexton or Farrell are on the field?

I dont, unless it is a long range kick then he might.

Stephen Larkham was a great 10 for Australia, but he wasn't a kicking 10. never took a kick at goal, although he did do a great Drop goal once. so who ever plays 10 does not need to be a goal kicker. juist needs to be able to get the back line going.

So NO, Hook will not be needed. unless injury of course.

Why would I think that Halfpenny will kick goals? You keep banging on about Gatland being Welsh and Lions coach, yet you don't think he will pick his first choice kicker? You really are priceless sometimes.

I'm not sure why you added your last paragraph? You started your post off by saying you think Farrell or Sexton will kick, then finish it by saying the ten doesn't have to be a kicker and only has to get the back line moving

D Biggar is 6ft 2 inches and Hook is 6ft, not sure what this proves.

maestegmafia wrote:Hook is better at getting a backline moving

In 2008/09

glamorganalun wrote:D Biggar is 6ft 2 inches and Hook is 6ft, not sure what this proves.

That the stats on show are lies.

Seagultaf wrote:

maestegmafia wrote:Hook is better at getting a backline moving

I have not seen any evidence of Hook doing that at test level for the last 2 or 3 seasons. Priestland did get the backine moving in the World Cup before his form dipped, Hook certainly has not.

Really, as i read your post I immediately remembered the2011 six nations he moved to flyhalf against Scotland, set up a try for Williams in the first quarter by taking on the scots with a nice break and offload.

Breadvan wrote:

maestegmafia wrote:Hook is better at getting a backline moving

In 2008/09

He did in 2007 and 2011 too

Risca Rev wrote:

majesticimperialman wrote:

Risca Rev wrote:

majesticimperialman wrote:Dont think Hook will be needed to be honest.....Halfpenny will be taking the kicks at goal if either Sexton or Farrell gets injured.

Why won't Halfpenny be taking the kicks otherwise? You're very confused today Madge

Do you honestly think that Halfpenny will be taking the kicks at goal if either Sexton or Farrell are on the field?

I dont, unless it is a long range kick then he might.

Stephen Larkham was a great 10 for Australia, but he wasn't a kicking 10. never took a kick at goal, although he did do a great Drop goal once. so who ever plays 10 does not need to be a goal kicker. juist needs to be able to get the back line going.

So NO, Hook will not be needed. unless injury of course.

Why would I think that Halfpenny will kick goals? You keep banging on about Gatland being Welsh and Lions coach, yet you don't think he will pick his first choice kicker? You really are priceless sometimes.

I'm not sure why you added your last paragraph? You started your post off by saying you think Farrell or Sexton will kick, then finish it by saying the ten doesn't have to be a kicker and only has to get the back line moving

Halfpenny has the best kicking stats out of those available. Therefor most people would rightfully presume him first choice goal kicker.

Like most aspects of Farrells game his kicking seems to array under pressure. And his kicking for goal is his biggest asset by some distance.

Of course it will be Halfpenny taking the kicks.

Best kicker
Biggest boot
Plus Gatland is coach

Breadvan wrote:

maestegmafia wrote:Hook is better at getting a backline moving

In 2008/09

Disagree with you on this Maes, for Perpignan he very much is playing more conservatively almost Stephen Jones-esque. Biggar certainly gets the backline in more opportunities than Hook does.

Alun,
We'll have this argument until we are pushing up daisies, Hook did/does not create any more opportunities than ROG or Jones did, he made the headline runs tho. The Priestland 2001 version is the closest you'll get to making controlled attacking opportunities. Sexton was very good last week and plays similar to Biggar and the more I look at the make up of the Lions squad the more I think it was a mistake not to take him.

If halfpenny is playing its a for sure he kicks. As good as sexton and farrell are they are not as accurate as halfpenny. Im sure someone is going find stats and prove me wrong

flyhalffactory wrote:

Breadvan wrote:

maestegmafia wrote:Hook is better at getting a backline moving

In 2008/09

Disagree with you on this Maes, for Perpignan he very much is playing more conservatively almost Stephen Jones-esque. Biggar certainly gets the backline in more opportunities than Hook does.

Alun,
We'll have this argument until we are pushing up daisies, Hook did/does not create any more opportunities than ROG or Jones did, he made the headline runs tho. The Priestland 2001 version is the closest you'll get to making controlled attacking opportunities. Sexton was very good last week and plays similar to Biggar and the more I look at the make up of the Lions squad the more I think it was a mistake not to take him.

The only comment I made is the fact that because players played for the lions does not mean they are top players. The only time I posted anything about Hook was the question about the various 10's height's, I have met the two I quoted, I was suprised Dan was that tall but Hook's arms reflect a lot of gym work hence his hand offs and ripping balls from opponents. I agree with your comment it being a mistake not taking Biggar, I susppect there will be another 10 after the BaaBaas game.

Who else noticed Hook's abnormally quick growth during the summer of 2007?

Think there was a steroid shortage that summer!

glamorganalun wrote:D Biggar is 6ft 2 inches and Hook is 6ft, not sure what this proves.

I don't think Hookie is claiming that other 10s are physically bigger than him. He's saying that the Gatland gameplan requires the 10 to ship the ball on to the big crash-ball merchants outside him a.s.a.p. and no clever stuff please. Not the most diplomatic comment, but basically correct.

t1000advancedprototype wrote:Who else noticed Hook's abnormally quick growth during the summer of 2007?

Think there was a steroid shortage that summer!

Hookie has quite a placid on-field demeanour. Any examples of slim young players who have unusually large necks and shoulders AND show a lot of anger/aggression on field? Any going down-under this summer?

maestegmafia wrote:

Seagultaf wrote:

maestegmafia wrote:Hook is better at getting a backline moving

I have not seen any evidence of Hook doing that at test level for the last 2 or 3 seasons. Priestland did get the backine moving in the World Cup before his form dipped, Hook certainly has not.

Really, as i read your post I immediately remembered the2011 six nations he moved to flyhalf against Scotland, set up a try for Williams in the first quarter by taking on the scots with a nice break and offload.

And since the game against Scotland in February 2011 when he ghosted past a prop to create a try for Shane what has he done? Even in that match he went into his shell after 20 mins and Jones had to be brought on.

At his best Hook is world class, but he lacks the ability to concentrate for long enough periods to control a test match. He may score a try or create a break but he also misses tackles, gets turned over, throws wild passes. Unfortunately the negative parts of his game outway the positive.

Many posters have said he plays well for Perpignan, where he features regularly at 10. I have only watched some of his Amlin performances and even in this low pressure competition he blows hot and cold.

He had a number of cameo opportunities for Wales this season, his performances dictated that he was left on the bench in the latter games.

samuraidragon wrote:

t1000advancedprototype wrote:Who else noticed Hook's abnormally quick growth during the summer of 2007?

Think there was a steroid shortage that summer!

Hookie has quite a placid on-field demeanour. Any examples of slim young players who have unusually large necks and shoulders AND show a lot of anger/aggression on field? Any going down-under this summer?

Do you? Care to share some names with us so we can compare and contrats our lists?