Deontay vs Haye - who wins and how?

This up and coming bonafide heavy weight hasn't really been tested but for the sake of heavyweight boxing I hope he succeeds.

If haye and Deontay met now what would the result be? Take into account his age, he's strong and young.

I think a upset would be on the cards.

Haye by quick KO, Wilder looks too open and wild to me at the moment to handle the speed and power of Haye, to be honest i think Haye would struggle not to hit him.

Not a chance! Haye gets a lot of stick for what was, lets be honest, a stinker of a performance against Wlad...

However whilst his opposition at heavyweight have left a lot to be desired he has always look a class above anything that is operating there, outside of the two brothers. He is probably actually reaching his peak years in terms of boxing, especially given the fact he has been in barely any wars.

He mopped up the cruiserweight division within 21 fights and by his 23rd was a Heavyweight champion. That is an impressive feat regardless of who he faced...especially given his lack of size in what will go down as the 'freakishly sized' heavyweight era.

Wilder whilst possessing natural power throws and wastes a lot of punches. He is wild and many of his punches are telegraphed. For the past 5 years anyone with a pulse in the sports 'richest division' has been lauded when coming through the ranks and it is no different for this guy. Put him in any other decade and he would have been exposed by now....put him in the ring with David Haye and I would hedge my bets he is knocked out in 5 rounds.

Haye would be too quick, but more importantly too intelligent. He barely wastes a punch and would bide his time, look for that straight left down the middle with the booming over hand right coming afterwards...slip to the right and connect with a one two which would finish with an uppercut. If Wilder didn't go down then Haye would simply jump on him and swarm him with powerful shots until the ref jumped in.

People insult Haye but he is a special talent, he is just unlucky he is in an era with the kitschkos who are ATG's.

Haye has destroyed everything in his path and Wilder would lose by KO.

We were discussing natural talent the other day on a Mayweather thread, Haye immediately came to mind.

He is blessed with great speed, athleticism and just all around natural ability. Even his cheart and chin are pretty decent. The only thing that would be in doubt is his stamina but that is something which can be worked on...

I wonder how far he could have gone had he actually loved boxing. If he put his heart and sole into in the manner which others, Carl Froch being a great example, did then I would actually imagine him running either Brother very close.

I'm sure he won't retire disappointed mind, 2 weight world champ...undisputed cruiserweight champion...all within 28 fights and plenty of cash in the bank!

owen10ozzy wrote:We were discussing natural talent the other day on a Mayweather thread, Haye immediately came to mind.

He is blessed with great speed, athleticism and just all around natural ability. Even his cheart and chin are pretty decent. The only thing that would be in doubt is his stamina but that is something which can be worked on...

I wonder how far he could have gone had he actually loved boxing. If he put his heart and sole into in the manner which others, Carl Froch being a great example, did then I would actually imagine him running either Brother very close.

I'm sure he won't retire disappointed mind, 2 weight world champ...undisputed cruiserweight champion...all within 28 fights and plenty of cash in the bank!

He has all the ability to be at the very top in boxing apart from the will to fight more than once a year.

Champagne_Socialist wrote:People insult Haye but he is a special talent, he is just unlucky he is in an era with the kitschkos who are ATG's.

Haye has destroyed everything in his path and Wilder would lose by KO.

This is not an insult to Haye but a recognition. In most eras, he would have been remembered as a gifted fighter but not the best. He is a good, but not a great heavy.

Disagree bhb- Obviously if you put him in the 88-00 era he wouldnt beat every fighter there, nor would he do that in the 68-80 era, but every other era has been filled with extremely poor Heavyweights. I mean old Archie was still putting good accounts of himself in the 60s, and he was a 50-year old blown up (by fat) cruiserweight.

You know more than me, but there is normally at least one stand out in any era and I couldn't see that being Haye. Take Marciano for example. You can debate the plus and negatives here, but in my mind at least, the Rock had that little bit more.

Wilder wins kO1

Haye just hasnt fought enough good boxers to ascertain a credible average.

From what I have seen of him at heavyweight. If you have a good jab and can fight at range you will cause him problems. He has good power and athleticism but low workrate, limited jab and stays on the backfoot alot. This means I think he prone to giving up rounds and not the hardest guy to nick rounds against. Ive been suspicious hes been a bit overreliant on raw athleticism and power for his career. I suspect he would struggle against "boxers".

I guess that is kind of my point Manos,

He has relied on those tools which he has as natural talent. The power and the athleticism. He has fantastic speed also...I am not talking Mayweather level but for a heavyweight it is very good..some of those shots he caught Chisora with he didn't see coming, same can be said in his fight against McCormeck.

If he loved the sport as much as the likes of your Hattons (when in camp), Froch, Lennox etc then he would have certainly fought more and I would hazard a guess he would have wanted to get in the gym and fine tune his skills and learn how to go about using those attributes he has to really improve. Instead I get the sense he knew he had great natural ability...doesn't love the sport and sees it as a job...got to heavyweight division and realised all you had to do at the level below the brothers was turn up in shape, use speed and power and you could have almost anyone out of there with a nice quick KO. Cash your cheque and go home happy!

manos de piedra wrote:Haye just hasnt fought enough good boxers to ascertain a credible average.

From what I have seen of him at heavyweight. If you have a good jab and can fight at range you will cause him problems. He has good power and athleticism but low workrate, limited jab and stays on the backfoot alot. This means I think he prone to giving up rounds and not the hardest guy to nick rounds against. Ive been suspicious hes been a bit overreliant on raw athleticism and power for his career. I suspect he would struggle against "boxers".

Which tends to suggest Wilder isn't going to beat him

Im a bit skeptical of his actual technical boxing ability. He hasnt had all that many rounds and hes had little experience against good fighters. He hasnt really ever displayed much versatility. No jab, no inside fighting, not particularly adept at fighting on the front foot etc

If you look at the top opponents he fought I think you could only really classify Mormeck, Valuev and Wlad as being even above average and those three fights werent a resounding endorsement of his ability.

But as you say. Raw athleticism and punching power is enough to beat a pretty rubbish cruiser division and very ordinary heavyweights like Chisora/Ruiz. But it would be interesting to see him in with guys who can actual box a bit. Even the Solis, Chagaevs, Povetkins, Ibragimovs guys that have a bit of pedigree and perhaps the smarts not to be drawn into Hayes gameplan.

DAVE667 wrote:

manos de piedra wrote:Haye just hasnt fought enough good boxers to ascertain a credible average.

From what I have seen of him at heavyweight. If you have a good jab and can fight at range you will cause him problems. He has good power and athleticism but low workrate, limited jab and stays on the backfoot alot. This means I think he prone to giving up rounds and not the hardest guy to nick rounds against. Ive been suspicious hes been a bit overreliant on raw athleticism and power for his career. I suspect he would struggle against "boxers".

Which tends to suggest Wilder isn't going to beat him

I doubt Wilder would but I have really very little to assess him on. Id really only be picking Haye by virute of greater experience and record.

At the moment you would naturally tip towards Haye, however we dont know just how good Wilder is to be honest.

manos de piedra wrote:

DAVE667 wrote:

manos de piedra wrote:Haye just hasnt fought enough good boxers to ascertain a credible average.

From what I have seen of him at heavyweight. If you have a good jab and can fight at range you will cause him problems. He has good power and athleticism but low workrate, limited jab and stays on the backfoot alot. This means I think he prone to giving up rounds and not the hardest guy to nick rounds against. Ive been suspicious hes been a bit overreliant on raw athleticism and power for his career. I suspect he would struggle against "boxers".

Which tends to suggest Wilder isn't going to beat him

I doubt Wilder would but I have really very little to assess him on. Id really only be picking Haye by virute of greater experience and record.

You'd have to think that if Wilder possessed any real boxing ability he'd have demonstrated it by now. No sense in hiding your light under a bushel. I think what you see is what you get with him and whilst it may be good enough to blow away the chaff I doubt it will be sufficient for any fighter with a bit of nous.

Well i suppose its more down to being unable to guage how effective Wilder would be against a higher calibre of opponent. He looks to be quite athletic himself, carries a wallop and has a decent size advantage. He possesses a jab although I have no real idea how good it is given the crud he fights. Haye is an ambusher and I would expect him to fight his usual way with a healthy respect for Wilders size and power. Probably his movement reduces the number and effective of Wilders attacks but if Wilder can keep sticking the jab out and not become reckless then its possible he could pick rounds up. I would assume his overall lack of experience means he gives Haye opportunites though and with Hayes power that could be enough. I havent been massively impressed with Haye against the really big men hes fought to be honest though. I just havent really be able to tell with Wilder because his opposition have just be too soft. Haye would rightfully start as favourite but for me there are alot of unknown quantities with both guys in this particular fight.

owen10ozzy wrote:Not a chance! Haye gets a lot of stick for what was, lets be honest, a stinker of a performance against Wlad...

However whilst his opposition at heavyweight have left a lot to be desired he has always look a class above anything that is operating there, outside of the two brothers. He is probably actually reaching his peak years in terms of boxing, especially given the fact he has been in barely any wars.

He mopped up the cruiserweight division within 21 fights and by his 23rd was a Heavyweight champion. That is an impressive feat regardless of who he faced...especially given his lack of size in what will go down as the 'freakishly sized' heavyweight era.

Wilder whilst possessing natural power throws and wastes a lot of punches. He is wild and many of his punches are telegraphed. For the past 5 years anyone with a pulse in the sports 'richest division' has been lauded when coming through the ranks and it is no different for this guy. Put him in any other decade and he would have been exposed by now....put him in the ring with David Haye and I would hedge my bets he is knocked out in 5 rounds.

Haye would be too quick, but more importantly too intelligent. He barely wastes a punch and would bide his time, look for that straight left down the middle with the booming over hand right coming afterwards...slip to the right and connect with a one two which would finish with an uppercut. If Wilder didn't go down then Haye would simply jump on him and swarm him with powerful shots until the ref jumped in.

I'm sorry owen everything you say here is incorrect.

ONETWOFOREVER wrote:

owen10ozzy wrote:Not a chance! Haye gets a lot of stick for what was, lets be honest, a stinker of a performance against Wlad...

However whilst his opposition at heavyweight have left a lot to be desired he has always look a class above anything that is operating there, outside of the two brothers. He is probably actually reaching his peak years in terms of boxing, especially given the fact he has been in barely any wars.

He mopped up the cruiserweight division within 21 fights and by his 23rd was a Heavyweight champion. That is an impressive feat regardless of who he faced...especially given his lack of size in what will go down as the 'freakishly sized' heavyweight era.

Wilder whilst possessing natural power throws and wastes a lot of punches. He is wild and many of his punches are telegraphed. For the past 5 years anyone with a pulse in the sports 'richest division' has been lauded when coming through the ranks and it is no different for this guy. Put him in any other decade and he would have been exposed by now....put him in the ring with David Haye and I would hedge my bets he is knocked out in 5 rounds.

Haye would be too quick, but more importantly too intelligent. He barely wastes a punch and would bide his time, look for that straight left down the middle with the booming over hand right coming afterwards...slip to the right and connect with a one two which would finish with an uppercut. If Wilder didn't go down then Haye would simply jump on him and swarm him with powerful shots until the ref jumped in.

I'm sorry owen everything you say here is incorrect.

Not EVERYTHING he says is incorrect and whilst I agree with his sentiment that Haye beats Wilder I doubt it would go down like Owen suggests. I think Wilder might be susceptible to the check hook as I do agree his attacks are crude and rushed.

haha! Onetwo...as eloquent as ever!

Would you like to actually debate why everything I say is incorrect?!

''whilst his opposition at heavyweight have left a lot to be desired he has always look a class above anything that is operating there''

What is incorrect about that?

He mopped up the cruiserweight division within 21 fights and by his 23rd was a Heavyweight champion

Or that?!

Wilder whilst possessing natural power throws and wastes a lot of punches. He is wild and many of his punches are telegraphed

Just which part of that is incorrect?!

For the past 5 years anyone with a pulse in the sports 'richest division' has been lauded when coming through the ranks and it is no different for this guy

The above sentence couldn't be truer. Whether it be an american i.e. Wilder, Mitchell....a Brit i.e. Price, Fury even Audley further back...media and fans alike are always looking to jump onto the next prospects bandwagon in the hope they can clean up what has for the past 10 years been called possibly the worst heavyweight division in decades possibly ever!

I don't mind people disagreeing with what I write but at least add something to the argument otherwise skittle off and post elsewhere...

Surprised people are quick to right Wilder off, one thing is guaranteed with this lad, he hits very hard. I have no doubt that Haye would avoid a lot of what Wilder throws but I beleive he'd be wary of commiting himself due to what could come back.

First off owen as you admit Hayes opponents have been poor yet you state that he was a class above them. All true but how does this in any way indicate to you that he will beat Wilder???

It clearly does not. Wilder has been competing with heavies throughout his amateur days and as a pro he is a more seasoned heavy then Haye and can take a punch at heavy better then Haye.

Secondly owen Hayes exploits at cruiser were impressive but please lets not fool ourselves into thinking it was more then it actually was. Haye beat some poor champions in Mocormak and Macrenelli and DUCKED the IBF champ Cunningham....a point you seem to have ''forgotton''.

Thirdly you state that Wilder is wild and telegraphs his punches. Well owen those on his record who he has koed never saw his punches coming so he must be quicker then you all think. Wilder swings his punches which is perfect for someone of his size its effective and Haye would not stand up to those barrages as he is not a trader of punches. Haye has 1 punch and thats the bingo shot other then that he has no jab, no real boxing technique and terrible defense.

IMO Wilder flattens Haye 3 to 5 rounds.

owen I know in your head you are looking for some word to describe what just took place after reading my response to you....

Well let me help you out a little.. the word you are looking for is...........

SCHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOLED!

1. It infers as much as Haye has swatted aside fighters at or above the level Wilder has been fighting.

2. More seasoned heavy, wtf???! How does knocking over a couple dozen stiffs, nobodies and fat rednecks consitute seasoned? Seasoning requires challange, Wilder has had the quantity Haye the quality (in comparison). AND how do you know he can take a punch? Haye's taken a few from Wlad and not gone down, Wilder's never even fought someone capable of throwing back!

3. Haye's 'expolits' are still lightyears ahead of Wilders. 26 or whatever fights in Wilder is still at domestic level, Haye had unified an entire division in 21 and was 2 weight champ in 23.

4. Seriously? SERIOUSLY?? Wilder is a wide swinger, there's no class or 'picking' of his shots. You are right that Haye wouldn't stand up to those kind of barrages but that's only because he's not a fat useless doughnut like everyone Wilder's fought - Haye wouldn't even be there to be hit!

I like Haye and rate him but saying he cleaned up at Cruiser makes me laugh. He had one fight beating Mormeck in a pretty close bout and then he took the remaining strap beating Enzo Mac.
Its not like he dominated for a few years beating all comers, sure he had all the belts but I think cleaned up the division makes it sound like he did something special.

Giving Haye WAY too much credit Tops Wilder has competed at heavy his whole career, won a bronze at the Olympics so clearly is not as kak as you insinuate.

At the end of the day its a fight. Wilder is bigger and has better reach and is only getting stronger, Haye is quick and powerful but when the pressure is on he folds like he did against Thompson and Wlad.

You say Haye took big shots from Wlad????
what fight was you watching. Haye ran and when ever Wlad got close Haye fell to his knees to smell some Wlad crotch.

Simple catch 22 tho 1-2, if he isn't that cack then why in 26 odd fights has he not fought above domestic level?

too much credit to Haye or not, there's no way possible to spin it to show that what Haye accomplised in 23 fights isn't better than what Wilder has to date.

Haye took bigger shots from Wlad the Wilder ever has in his entire career.

TopHat24/7 wrote:Simple catch 22 tho 1-2, if he isn't that cack then why in 26 odd fights has he not fought above domestic level?

too much credit to Haye or not, there's no way possible to spin it to show that what Haye accomplised in 23 fights isn't better than what Wilder has to date.

Haye took bigger shots from Wlad the Wilder ever has in his entire career.

Don't think Hayes exploits are the main focus of the thread.

Its Haye v Wilder who wins? I will go with the younger more natural heavy in Wilder. Haye could not land a decent shot on Wlad, Wilder is a lot bigger and Hyaes chin has always been fragile. If Haye does not get the job done within 3 rounds then its Wilder by stoppage or ko.

Haye couldn't land a shot because Wlad has the best 'D' in the game. Total irrelevance to Wilder.

I'll take the guy with the proven record operating at the highest level for the longest period of time.