What occasions are special enough for Kapa o Pango?

One of the best things in world rugby (and indeed world sport) is the Haka. (Ignoring the copycat rugby league), Rugby is the only sport that acknowledges and embraces indigenous cultures of its participants. For over a century the Haka has enthralled and entertained the rugby public. It is really an amazing spectacle.

The first major development occurred in the 80s when Buck Shelford arrived. Buck is a rugby legend. He even got a mention on a WWE PPV. Now when Buck got into the All Blacks the Haka was a little rundown. It wasn't in good shape. Buck had the philosophy of if you're going to do it, then do it properly. He got it back to its original brilliance. The team suddenly understood its meaning and significance and performed it with 100% effort. Shortly after, the ABs performed at home for the first time as part of their successful 1987 World Cup campaign.

Fast forward to 2005. Ka Mate is world renown. It's universally loved, but whispers surfaced of a different Haka. And on a chilly Dunedin night, the All Blacks unveiled Kapa o Pango. Based on a Haka from the 1920s, this wasn't just any old Haka. It was a Haka for the All Blacks. And it's arguably better than Ka Mate.

Since that unforgettable night the All Blacks have used both Hakas, and have stressed that Kapa o Pango is for special occasions. But last year, it was used more often, and one got the impression that this was diluting the impact of Kapa o Pango.

So I ask now, what occasion is special enough to warrant the Kapa o Pango Haka?



Unfortunately there are some bitter and twisted individuals out there. These people tend to be from the Home Unions and are insanely jealous of the All Blacks superior record. And as such, they grasp at straws and whinge about the Haka (another favourite topic of theirs is their imagined pillaging of PI talent by the All Blacks). Hopefully these sados can keep their disapproval of the haka away from this thread

Daily! Are you stirring the pot? Naughty!

Yeah its a good question and one that's usually decided at the time. Sometimes its used for the specific occasion- ie last 8 onwards regardless of who the opposition was. Sometimes its used for a key match where we might have lot a previous one against the same foe or it will win us the tournament.. Sometimes its used to honour the opposition- I think we used it for the first Argie 4N match?

They risk losing its uniqueness through overuse and getting the balance between preserving it as special and respecting the opposition adequately probably causes a dilemma they can probably do without.

But by introducing it they took on that responsibility and need to maintain it or they'll lose credibility. So far I think theyve got most of them right bar perhaps a couple but between now and the Worldcup should use it sparingly and then only use it against the no. 2 seed in the pool and any knockouts they play.

Not sure France deserve it this year- the first test without key club players. They'll ony bring it out if they lose a match.

If the Aussies beat the Lions they'll certainly use it for the first 4N encounter against them, putting down the gauntlet so to speak.

No bites so far but it's only a matter of time!

I think the only time Kapa o Pango should be used is when the result is in doubt and when we have suffered a loss. England in that respect will no doubt face Kapa o Pango as they inflicted a heavy defeat on us.

Any team that has never beaten the ABs should only get to see it if they come close to beating us like Ireland in the 2nd test or like the Argentina example you used Tman.

I cant imagine an occasion that you wouldnt do Kamate Kamate.

Weddings, flash mobs, baptisms etc. There are quite a few mate. Especially by pakeha. Not a good look!

Kia I can understand a rugby flah mob or a rugby baptism, but my imagination is struggling with the rugby wedding.

You've never seen My Big Fat Greek Wedding?

Based on Greg Feek's wedding. Greg + Feek = Greek.

haha good one Kia, Maybe the Greeks could do Kaponga?

kiakahaaotearoa wrote:No bites so far but it's only a matter of time!

I think the only time Kapa o Pango should be used is when the result is in doubt and when we have suffered a loss. England in that respect will no doubt face Kapa o Pango as they inflicted a heavy defeat on us.

Any team that has never beaten the ABs should only get to see it if they come close to beating us like Ireland in the 2nd test or like the Argentina example you used Tman.

It was Kapo O pango on that day that England won, so I doubt we will fear it Again! Maybe they need to come up with a new Haka just for us?

The pubs opening?

I think it should only be used in RWC Finals.

Regarding Kapa o Pango.

When England played the All Blacks last year, Justin Marshall said that they use Kapa o pango against teams they respect and team they (LIKE TO BEAT) But i guess some times it does not work out for them. the All Blacks that is.

It's an odd mindset the having 2 levels of importance, it can cause lathargic starts in some games or too heightened arousal levels in other, it's a psychological minefield IMHO.

Using the Ka mate gives an impression they don't need to try that hard because the opposing team either lacks quality or rarely gets the better of them, this is a very dangerous mindset to get into.

Using the Kapo is therefore the better option for full intensity and optimum performance, and in this day and age pro rugby requires 100% from the off, in every game at any level.

I suspect the Ka mate will be used less and less as other teams close the gap on the AB's and eventually the Ka mate will become the 'special one' in a reverse attempt to hype up the team.

thebluesmancometh wrote:
I suspect the Ka mate will be used less and less as other teams close the gap on the AB's and eventually the Ka mate will become the 'special one' in a reverse attempt to hype up the team.

Yes but when will that ever happen? Last year they lost one (the last) after 3-0 sweeping the Irish, 6-0 sweeping the 4N scoring at an average win of 33-17 and scoring 50 tries to 17 for the year...as defending WC champs.

Is there a suggestion the gap is remotely closing, ...or is it actually widening perhaps?

Overall I think they get the haka call right now theyve gone down this track and are stuck with it. I don't 100% agree with it but for us kiwi's it adds a bit of spice, something different, just one more thing that sets the AB's apart...hence the challenge for others.

Could they add a new one soon? Or would a third begin to make it seem commercial perhaps?

Also interesting that last year the throat slash was back in when before I'm sure it'd been dropped (may be wrong).

Oh and I love the Haka.

The problem is saving KoP for teams they respect is that the teams that don't receive it will feel disrespected and will label us as arrogant.

Kapa o pango? Think my boy watches that on nicktoons......

Seriously tho....to me, the Haka is the Haka. A great spectacle and tradition for the NZ side. Long may it continue, in whatever version.

They do it whenever they play Wales, playing Wales must be a pretty special occasion for the All Blacks

When the Welsh boys aren't having a tantrum and making them do it in the sheds, you mean?

I do think a disadvantage of KOP is that the opposition gets a wee insight into the NZ mindset for that game depending on which one they use. If they stick to Ka Mate then teams could think ok they're not as up for this as we are, so we can knock them over.

Think it's more the other way round disney. NZ isn't complacent playing the weaker sides. That's why they've lost to so few sides. They're too focused on performance.

If you receive Kapa o Pango though it could give the opposition a boost because they feel NZ respects them enough to perform that haka.

Or 'SSSSSSHHHHHHHIIIIIIITTTTTTT we're gonna get hammered!"

We need to start one and maintain a 100 per cent record with it and then bring it out for RWC knockout matches.

kiakahaaotearoa wrote:Think it's more the other way round disney. NZ isn't complacent playing the weaker sides. That's why they've lost to so few sides. They're too focused on performance.

If you receive Kapa o Pango though it could give the opposition a boost because they feel NZ respects them enough to perform that haka.

As a coach though I'd use it both ways

Kapo - They are scared of you, they fear the loss, they are trying to psyche you out through their own fear, we need to be 100% etc etc

Ka mate - The arrogance that they can disrespect you like that, they think they'll just turn up and win, they'll be complacent etc