Worst Lions Tour of the Pro Era?

Maybe jumping the gun a bit here, but I think this Lions tour is shaping up to be the worst of the pro era and Australia have to shoulder a huge amount of the blame. Some thoughts:

1. Not enough tour games. Part of the enjoyment of the Lions is seeing pthe best players from each of the 4 nations come together and the excitement of seeing combinations and players working together that normally would never play alongside each other This tour seems rushed and we the fans dont get a real taste or build up of seeing the team develop or the new possibilities in action There is also a practical element in that not enough games just doesnt give the team enough time to gel or find itself. There isnt enough time to savour the build up to the tests either.

2. Australia attitude. They seemed to be deliberately starving the Lions of genuine tests in the hope that the step up in class to test level will hurt the Lions. What the Force did is bordering on disespect to the Lions. If Australia arent going to get with the programme and spirit of a Lions tour Id have rather seen them go to NZ or SA.

Its early days so maybe premature to be criticising but I havent been able to feel as involved in this Lions tour as previous ones. It feels rushed and more of an afterthought than a special occasion Australia have done nothing to change this. Thoughts?

No different to what the Boks did in 2009 or All Blacks in 2005. If my memory serves me correctly, both of those held back their test players for the tests only.

I think however, you are being a bit premature, as whether or not the Aussie clubs play their internationals is a little academic, as every Aussie player whether capped or not, if given the opportunity, will relish a game against the Lions and will try their best to get a "club" win over the touring party.

We cant compare against the warm-up act of the BaaBaas, and the Force have a game this weekend they thought best hold their first choice players back for. That is simple game management, but not sure the Force where ever up to fielding a side to take the Lions on competitively.

So to answer your question, "Worst Lions Tour of the Pro Era?"... To early, but don't think so... Worst still goes to 2005, which was no more than a party for the England World Cup team...

The answer to your problem lies in your title.

Pro rugby

Someone says this every year though; either that or "this is the worst Lions team I've ever seen" just because there aren't enough players from that individuals country in the squad. If you think the Lions aren't in for a test before facing the Wallabies then I suggest you take a look at the Reds team for Saturday.

I thought the midweek games four years ago were dull. The Test series produced some of the most tense and exciting rugby I've seen.

I agree with BB. I don't think it's limited to the Australian provincial sides. Same issues occurred in SA and either did or will in the next NZ tour. The same problems occur when we tour Europe and now play club sides. Then there is the issue of understrength sides touring at the end of seasons. The issue is the calender, the demands on players and tensions between club and country..

Why not use pro rugby to advantage. Put a bounty on the Lions heads.

Part of contract with Aussie union - If an Aussie franchise manages to beat the Lions the team gets a $50,000 payout.

At most it will cost them about $250,000 in reality it won't cost that amount as they wont lose every single match.

But it makes the owners of the team pressure the coaches into picking the best team and trying hardest to win. Which makes the Lions tour experience more valuable which leads to bigger returns on and off field for Lions.

red_stag wrote:Why not use pro rugby to advantage. Put a bounty on the Lions heads.

Part of contract with Aussie union - If an Aussie franchise manages to beat the Lions the team gets a $50,000 payout.

At most it will cost them about $250,000 in reality it won't cost that amount as they wont lose every single match.

But it makes the owners of the team pressure the coaches into picking the best team and trying hardest to win. Which makes the Lions tour experience more valuable which leads to bigger returns on and off field for Lions.

Fantastic idea... You should not need extra incentive, beating the Lions should be enough, but in the Pro era, this solution makes sense.

You guys are missing the fact that the Force's hands were forced.

The other Franchises will all play during a window where none of the Ozzie Franchises will be playing Super rugby. The y will therefor be able to put their strongest teams out.

Dont disagree with that Biltong.. However, I believe the Force have nothing to loose or gain in their Super rugby game this weekend, given their table position. That being the case, if they had been offered a $50k win bounty for a Lions scalp, they may have reassessed, given their league position, which game was of more benefit to the club and decided differently on which game their strongest XV should play in.

As suggested by Stag, in the Pro era we have to use the bucks as an incentive, and I think Stag's idea is a good one.

I hope this gets to the ears of the men in charge for the next Lions tour, so that it helps protect the tradition for years to come... ie meaningful Lions tours.

2005 = Worst, and nearly killed the Lions
2009 = phoenix from the flames tour, just lacked the win that Lions needed.
2013 = hopefully series win, everyone loves Lions again

Reds seam to be putting out a very good team, I think the timing of th eForce game wasn't great as they had an eye on super XV, and it is thier bread and butter, and I don't blame Aus for keeping international players in camp, as they want to train and have the best chance of winning as well.

Planners knew it would be a soft game, and maybe thats what they wanted, Two softish games to get the lions of to a winning start and give players time to gel before they start being really tested.

If Gatland wanted a tougher game they could have arranged an emerging Aus or Aus 'A' team. Personally I think they knew it would be a weakened team, and wanted the run out before they start really being tested.

Tour proper starts now against the reds.

Sir Biggles that is where it seems everyone is disagreeing with me.

The Force have sponsors who back them on account of the Super XV competition they play in, not because of a potential match vs the Lions every 12 years.

Because the Force cannot make the play offs everyone is suggesting that the match against the Waratahs don't matter. Why?

Of course it matters, lets look at it from the other side, imagine the Waratahs were in contention to make the play offs, and now they play a weak Force team to benefit themselves and another OZzie Franchise, then the people from NZ and SA will be up in arms because the Force is throwing a game.

You can go around in circles either way to justify a point.

At the end of the day, the facts are simple, the Force has been shortchanged, have been since their inaugural year by the ARU.

The Rebels when they came into existence were and are still allowed to have more overseas players than any other Ozzie Franchise, the Force never had that.

The fact is the Force are sucking the hind boobie of the cow iin Australian rugby and are treated like the step child.

No matter which way Foley decided to select his squad for either match, he was always going to cop criticism.

I still think they will have to go some as a tour party overall to be worse than 05.

Biggles,

I reckon that they will need a rethink in terms of scheduling for the fixtures in 2017 Tour to New Zealand.

The stadia aren't big enough to cater to the Test Match demand and having all the warm up games in one block won't work. People will just fly in for the Test games at the end and unlike Australia they dont have the expat population to help ease the burden on the warm up games.

I'd like to see something like:

01 - Auckland v Lions, Auckland
02 - NZ Maori v Lions, Rotorua
03 - Waikato v Lions, Hamilton
04 - Canterbury v Lions, Christchurch
05 - NZ v Lions 1st Test, Christchurch
06 - Otago v Lions, Dunedin
07 - Hurricanes v Lions, Wellington
08 - Taranki v Lions, New Plymouth
09 - NZ v Lions 2nd Test, Wellington
10 - NZ v Lions 3rd Test, Auckland

I think it keep interest right throughout the tour. With this tour we have the Test Matches on three consecutive weekend and everything else just builds to it. I'd like to see a lot more matches between 1st and 2nd Test.

Ye it'd be pretty special implosion from here on in to rival 2005, Woodward really boobied his selection from the off, then alienated and exhasborated while he stuck with his selection and even made it worse come test time.

That said 2009 wasn't without it's selection shocks, again a number of players were selected rather out of tune with the trends of the recent 6N, and when it cam test time the first test was lost within 20 minutes due to poor selection!

Forward 4 more years on and we are for the third series in a row scratching our heads at a few certain selections, but the proff will be in the pudding, and the test series will highlight wether this tour is going to be succesfull or a failure.

I personally would say that 2005 was a farce, and an insult the lions barely recovered from, and 2009 was a success in that it reignited the passion for the lions, and was a few key selections from a winning tour.

There is one trend though that could be highlighted as the factor for failure in the pro era, but I don't want to say it out loud!

Against NZ or SA its mildly interesting (and the Lions usually lose anyhow). Against Aus its just ganging up and in any normal universe the lions should walk the series but you never know with the Wallabies....

red_stag wrote:Why not use pro rugby to advantage. Put a bounty on the Lions heads.

Isn't that what happened when the Lions when over to Australia last time, it's the only reason I can think of for what McRae did.

This is actually a decent team. Mind you, I still think they going to lose, but they arent on a hiding to nothing. With respect to the tour matches, Australia simply dont have the depth to be hosting tour matches in the middle of S15. I completely see why the Force arent going to over-commit on a "one-&-done" match when they still have a few S15 matches to go. I may be wrong (I cant remember), but arent S15 teams financially rewarded by virtue of where they finish?