Pacquiao vs Marquez to be held at catchweight 143-145lbs

First topic message reminder :

People were calling for this fight to be held at catchweight and they have been calling for this fight.

But now that it looks like it will happen at the catchweight people were calling for, will the boxing public be happy?

http://www.boxingscene.com/sources-pacquiao-marquez-held-catch-weight--38989

Sources in Mexico are reporting that a third meeting between Manny Pacquiao and Juan Manuel Marquez will likely have a catch-weight in place. Three weeks ago Marquez received an offer to face Pacquiao in a fall trilogy meeting. Marquez had a problem with some of the itemized terms that were listed in the offer. Pacquiao's promoter, Top Rank, is going to issue a new offer to Marquez on Monday. The revised offer will include several changes in areas that bothered Marquez. The catch-weight, reportedly, is going to fall between 143-145-pounds. Pacquiao has weighed between 144-145 for his last four welterweight ring appearances. Marquez has weighed between 133.5-134 for his last two lightweight title defenses. The fight could take place on November 5 or 12 in Las Vegas

What do you make of this news.

Should be a great fight.

Scottrf wrote:

coxy0001 wrote:When did i say Marquez cuts weight?!!??

Have you read anything on this thread? He's 134 on Friday 145 on Saturday, I think it's safe to say he cuts weight for the Friday weigh in.

Please read my comment above.

I don't cut weight, do i? And i only eat carbs the night before but not much to be fair, around 4/5lbs is what i gain before we hit the warm up at 11.30.

Want me to photograph all i drink/eat the night before and then weigh myself before getting into the warm up?!

I couldn't care less about what you do for an amateur cricket game, my arguments speak for themselves. You feel the need to write in capitals and use meaningless statments like end of, the same way Tyson fans use PRIME or FACT.

wow_junky wrote:

Scottrf wrote:

coxy0001 wrote:When did i say Marquez cuts weight?!!??

Have you read anything on this thread? He's 134 on Friday 145 on Saturday, I think it's safe to say he cuts weight for the Friday weigh in.

It's not cutting weight, him and almost every other boxer around likes to ruin their 8 week training camps by going on an eating and rehydrating binge

Maybe when Marquez gets cut he will spring a leak.

We need azania to explain modern nutrition to coxy and why not putting on 10lbs of fluids on the of the fight why you are already hydrated is not good for you.

Scott

Unless i'm mistaken making sure oneself is ready for a particular sport is the same be it professional or amateur?

Naturally with different levels of intensity and detail, but the basic prep methods still stand.

Don't worry, i'll weigh myself on Fri night as i'm at my natural sport weight... then after i'm hydrated to show you what i mean. And i don't look any different or suddenly get any quicker from taking fluids on board that are solely there to ensure i don't lag.

Unless of course you're names Pryor of course.

D4thincarnation wrote:We need azania to explain modern nutrition to coxy and why not putting on 10lbs of fluids on the of the fight why you are already hydrated is not good for you.

And you forgot carbs D4, not to mention every other protein etc

Coxy

We know for a fact that 99% of boxers (heavies excluded) cut weight to give themselves a size advantage on fightnight by rehydrating after weigh-in.

What you do in an amateur cricket match is irrelevant.

coxy0001 wrote:

D4thincarnation wrote:We need azania to explain modern nutrition to coxy and why not putting on 10lbs of fluids on the of the fight why you are already hydrated is not good for you.

And you forgot carbs D4, not to mention every other protein etc

Maybe he goes out for some steak an chips.

How is any of this going to help him if at the weigh in at 135lbs is in top condition?

And that's my point wow_j

Why?

Because Marquez had to intentionally put on weight prior to FMJ

He makes 135lbs with a doddle of an ease

And there is ZERO difference in hydrating yourself fully beyond what you'd walk around at in terms of overall hydration.

C'mon bud, isn't hard. If Marquez cuts weight so much why did he have to intentionally bulk up for FMJ?!?!?

Anyone got a sensible answer before i assume Scott/D4/Wow don't possess a brain cell between them?!

D4thincarnation wrote:

coxy0001 wrote:

D4thincarnation wrote:We need azania to explain modern nutrition to coxy and why not putting on 10lbs of fluids on the of the fight why you are already hydrated is not good for you.

And you forgot carbs D4, not to mention every other protein etc

Maybe he goes out for some steak an chips.

How is any of this going to help him if at the weigh in at 135lbs is in top condition?

You've never played any sport to any level so i wouldn't expect you to understand. Do you think Lance Armstrong weighs more before a giro stage because he wants to go faster downhills? OR because he has to overfill himself (to non dangerous levels) with fluid and especially carbs as he's prepping himself for what he'll burn?

Sensible answers only guys, otherwise i won't bother replying

Stupid, arrogant and argumentative is a dangerous combination.

coxy0001 wrote:And that's my point wow_j

Why?

Because Marquez had to intentionally put on weight prior to FMJ

He makes 135lbs with a doddle of an ease

And there is ZERO difference in hydrating yourself fully beyond what you'd walk around at in terms of overall hydration.

C'mon bud, isn't hard. If Marquez cuts weight so much why did he have to intentionally bulk up for FMJ?!?!?

Anyone got a sensible answer before i assume Scott/D4/Wow don't possess a brain cell between them?!

Never heard of watterlogging eh coxy?

coxy0001 wrote:And that's my point wow_j

Why?

Because Marquez had to intentionally put on weight prior to FMJ

He makes 135lbs with a doddle of an ease

And there is ZERO difference in hydrating yourself fully beyond what you'd walk around at in terms of overall hydration.

C'mon bud, isn't hard. If Marquez cuts weight so much why did he have to intentionally bulk up for FMJ?!?!?

Anyone got a sensible answer before i assume Scott/D4/Wow don't possess a brain cell between them?!

I think a few people are working under the assumption, though, that no matter what 'sensible' argument they present back, you'll still just respond with A LOAD OF CAPITAL LETTERS, EXCLAMATION MARKS AND NASTY NAMES, YOU OL' BOGGER COXY!!!

Me, I'm just staying on the sidelines with this one!

[quote="coxy0001"][quote="Scottrf"]

coxy0001 wrote:Manny trains: Manny trains hard, Manny takes on fluid, Manny has a big diet... comes out of camp firing at 100% and weighs 145.

Marquez trains: Marquez trains hard, Marquez takes on fluid save for the last few days, Marquez comes out of camp at 100% with his timing/speed/power spot on and weighs 135. Then takes on fluid ABOVE what is NATURAL for his body weight

I don't really get how you can be so argumentative with Scott for the simple reason that he is unconvinced by what most people here see as your largely unconvincing logic.

Ok so, Manny trains: Manny trains hard, Manny takes on fluid, Manny has a big diet... comes out of camp firing at 100% and weighs 145.

Fine no problems with that.

Marquez trains: Marquez trains hard, Marquez takes on fluid save for the last few days, Marquez comes out of camp at 100% with his timing/speed/power spot on and weighs 135. Then takes on fluid ABOVE what is NATURAL for his body weight.

The difference here is that you've got Marquez having to drop fluid intake whereas you don't for Manny. JMM would only have to do this to make the LW limit - he does not in the case.

So you'd see JMM weighing what 139-140 before having to dehydrate for the scales? That's fair enough I'd say. In this case he does not dehydrate for the scales - he stays at a good fighting weight: this weight is 139-140

Manny weighs 145 before dehydrating for the scales - which he'd have to do by 1 pound to make 144. He more or less stays at a good fighting weight: this weight is 145-146

Yes, I absolutely agree that Manny will outweigh marquez. I looks to me like it'll be by around 5-7 pounds. It will not be as pronounced as when Floyd fought JMM. Floyd is a WW - he couldn't make 145 (as evidenced by the fact that he paid a financial penalty to fight at 147 against JMM). Manny, on the other hand, is essentially a LWW that doesn't bother to cut weight (compare to someone like Ortiz who fought 147 but weighed 161 on the night)

That said, I agree utterly that the advantage in weight and power will be significant. I agree that Manny will blast him out. I agree that this is another legacy harming fight for Pacquiao with a number asterisks (weight advantage, another old guy, another floyd victim).

I do not agree with the assertion this is a "LW vs a WW - end of". I do not agree with the logic that JMM will have dehydration/water retention issues whereas Manny will not. I'm not sure your arguments on this are as clear and flawless as you think.

Scottrf wrote:Stupid, arrogant and argumentative is a dangerous combination.

You've met my missus then I take it Scott?

How did you find out?

88Chris05 wrote:

coxy0001 wrote:And that's my point wow_j

Why?

Because Marquez had to intentionally put on weight prior to FMJ

He makes 135lbs with a doddle of an ease

And there is ZERO difference in hydrating yourself fully beyond what you'd walk around at in terms of overall hydration.

C'mon bud, isn't hard. If Marquez cuts weight so much why did he have to intentionally bulk up for FMJ?!?!?

Anyone got a sensible answer before i assume Scott/D4/Wow don't possess a brain cell between them?!

I think a few people are working under the assumption, though, that no matter what 'sensible' argument they present back, you'll still just respond with A LOAD OF CAPITAL LETTERS, EXCLAMATION MARKS AND NASTY NAMES, YOU OL' BOGGER COXY!!!

Me, I'm just staying on the sidelines with this one!

Having to bite my tongue with losing it mate!

Some don't seem to realise what Marquez weighed prior to Diaz II and accept he's not a big LW. Sadly i don't have access to their weights in the changing room afterwards, because i can guarantee who would be below 135 and who would still be above 140.

If people still think that Manny is the same size as Marquez then they are beyond help, Coxy.

You can lead a horse to water...

[quote="Boxtthis"][quote="coxy0001"]

Scottrf wrote:

coxy0001 wrote:Manny trains: Manny trains hard, Manny takes on fluid, Manny has a big diet... comes out of camp firing at 100% and weighs 145.

Marquez trains: Marquez trains hard, Marquez takes on fluid save for the last few days, Marquez comes out of camp at 100% with his timing/speed/power spot on and weighs 135. Then takes on fluid ABOVE what is NATURAL for his body weight

I don't really get how you can be so argumentative with Scott for the simple reason that he is unconvinced by what most people here see as your largely unconvincing logic.

Ok so, Manny trains: Manny trains hard, Manny takes on fluid, Manny has a big diet... comes out of camp firing at 100% and weighs 145.

Fine no problems with that.

Marquez trains: Marquez trains hard, Marquez takes on fluid save for the last few days, Marquez comes out of camp at 100% with his timing/speed/power spot on and weighs 135. Then takes on fluid ABOVE what is NATURAL for his body weight.

The difference here is that you've got Marquez having to drop fluid intake whereas you don't for Manny. JMM would only have to do this to make the LW limit - he does not in the case.

So you'd see JMM weighing what 139-140 before having to dehydrate for the scales? That's fair enough I'd say. In this case he does not dehydrate for the scales - he stays at a good fighting weight: this weight is 139-140

Manny weighs 145 before dehydrating for the scales - which he'd have to do by 1 pound to make 144. He more or less stays at a good fighting weight: this weight is 145-146

Yes, I absolutely agree that Manny will outweigh marquez. I looks to me like it'll be by around 5-7 pounds. It will not be as pronounced as when Floyd fought JMM. Floyd is a WW - he couldn't make 145 (as evidenced by the fact that he paid a financial penalty to fight at 147 against JMM). Manny, on the other hand, is essentially a LWW that doesn't bother to cut weight (compare to someone like Ortiz who fought 147 but weighed 161 on the night)

That said, I agree utterly that the advantage in weight and power will be significant. I agree that Manny will blast him out. I agree that this is another legacy harming fight for Pacquiao with a number asterisks (weight advantage, another old guy, another floyd victim).

I do not agree with the assertion this is a "LW vs a WW - end of". I do not agree with the logic that JMM will have dehydration/water retention issues whereas Manny will not. I'm not sure your arguments on this are as clear and flawless as you think.

Why did Marquez have to intentionally bulk up to 142 before Mayweather then? Rather than just stay a bit more hydrated?

Hang on lemme find a link: http://ringtv.craveonline.com/blog/121855-did-marquez-err-by-putting-on-bulk

There you go

Boxtthis wrote:
I don't really get how you can be so argumentative with Scott for the simple reason that he is unconvinced by what most people here see as your largely unconvincing logic.

Ok so, Manny trains: Manny trains hard, Manny takes on fluid, Manny has a big diet... comes out of camp firing at 100% and weighs 145.

Fine no problems with that.

Marquez trains: Marquez trains hard, Marquez takes on fluid save for the last few days, Marquez comes out of camp at 100% with his timing/speed/power spot on and weighs 135. Then takes on fluid ABOVE what is NATURAL for his body weight.

The difference here is that you've got Marquez having to drop fluid intake whereas you don't for Manny. JMM would only have to do this to make the LW limit - he does not in the case.

So you'd see JMM weighing what 139-140 before having to dehydrate for the scales? That's fair enough I'd say. In this case he does not dehydrate for the scales - he stays at a good fighting weight: this weight is 139-140

Manny weighs 145 before dehydrating for the scales - which he'd have to do by 1 pound to make 144. He more or less stays at a good fighting weight: this weight is 145-146

Yes, I absolutely agree that Manny will outweigh marquez. I looks to me like it'll be by around 5-7 pounds. It will not be as pronounced as when Floyd fought JMM. Floyd is a WW - he couldn't make 145 (as evidenced by the fact that he paid a financial penalty to fight at 147 against JMM). Manny, on the other hand, is essentially a LWW that doesn't bother to cut weight (compare to someone like Ortiz who fought 147 but weighed 161 on the night)

That said, I agree utterly that the advantage in weight and power will be significant. I agree that Manny will blast him out. I agree that this is another legacy harming fight for Pacquiao with a number asterisks (weight advantage, another old guy, another floyd victim).

I do not agree with the assertion this is a "LW vs a WW - end of". I do not agree with the logic that JMM will have dehydration/water retention issues whereas Manny will not. I'm not sure your arguments on this are as clear and flawless as you think.

This post is a good summary of the non-Coxy side of the debate, can't really add anything further

I think the thing with pacquiao is that when he trains for a welterweight fight it's common knowledge he has to take on about 6000 calories per day to keep his weight at a level acceptable for a ww fight. Presumably if he took on less calories during training his weight would drop down to his old lightweight or sfw level at the end of camp?

Marquez on the other hand doesn't do this as he is more comfortable fighting at 135, so rather than take on a high calorie diet to keep the weight on, he let's it burn off so he can make weight at a lower class.

Because pacquiao maintains his weight rather than cutting it, his ring weight is never more than 4pm over his weigh in weight. Because Marquez cuts weight to make 135, his ring weight is usually in the low 140's, about 7lb over his weigh in weight. Marquez is actually taller than pacquiao.

I don't think there's an enormous disparity in size between them, manny is clearly bigger having taken advantage of not having to cut weight at welter to pack on a bit of muscle, that muscle giving him probably a 4 or 5 pound advantage over Marquez. But manny weighed 146 in the ring in their second fight and it was still too close to call.

The worry for me is not so much the size, but that Marquez has been in a few wars since their last fight whereas manny has had things pretty much his own way against most of his opponents due to some careful Arum matchmaking, I only hope Marquez still has enough in the tank to give manny a real challenge.

By the way, amongst all the screaming and head in hands moments:

Can i just add i feel their are better matchups for Manny's legacy and as a fan that's why i'm annoyed:

Ortiz
Maidana
Bradley

Am sure any 1 of those 3 (discounted Khan as that'll never happen) would suffice for most people, i just don't think he should be beating up on a 38 year old LW when there's guys nearer to his weight class who are younger and on the way up etc.

coxy0001 wrote:He makes 135lbs with a doddle of an ease

So you've got Marquez making 135 easily? That may be the case, I'm not sure. But, perhaps you can see the point of contention that people have when they hear evidence like: Marquez weighed 145 on fight night with Katsidis and looked good. This would suggest to me that he is in good shape somewhere in the 138-142 zone before cutting for the LW limit (which may rightly enough be a doddle for him). Manny, on the other hand is in good shape around 145-147. He's 5 or 6 lbs bigger to my mind.

I'm genuinely unsure as to what informormation is correct, but it's conflicting evidence like this that leads me and others to question your "end of" type statements - particularly when the're delivered with aggression and a misplaced sense of intellectual superiority.

I hate to tell you guys but Coxy is actually right, not a great indicator but compare Super Featherweight Pacquiao to Welterweight Pacquiao, look at his tale of the tape and you will notice that despite having the same ring weight he is noticeably bigger nowadays than he was before. Also look at Marquez against Mayweather, same weight as Lightweight him but again noticeably bigger.

Boxtthis wrote:

coxy0001 wrote:He makes 135lbs with a doddle of an ease

So you've got Marquez making 135 easily? That may be the case, I'm not sure. But, perhaps you can see the point of contention that people have when they hear evidence like: Marquez weighed 145 on fight night with Katsidis and looked good. This would suggest to me that he is in good shape somewhere in the 138-142 zone before cutting for the LW limit (which may rightly enough be a doddle for him). Manny, on the other hand is in good shape around 145-147. He's 5 or 6 lbs bigger to my mind.

I'm genuinely unsure as to what informormation is correct, but it's conflicting evidence like this that leads me and others to question your "end of" type statements - particularly when the're delivered with aggression and a misplaced sense on intellectual superiority.

He was 142 and looked she-ite for FMJ

He weighed 133 for Diaz II in early 2010 and 134 for Katsidis recently.... it's pretty apparent he's not a big LW and doesn't have much trouble making the weight.

End of

coxy0001 wrote:
He was 142 and looked she-ite for FMJ

He weighed 133 for Diaz II in early 2010 and 134 for Katsidis recently.... it's pretty apparent he's not a big LW and doesn't have much trouble making the weight.

End of

And he draink 14lbs worth of water after the Katsidis weigh in so he didn't go thirsty on fight night?

The Mighty Atom wrote:I hate to tell you guys but Coxy is actually right, not a great indicator but compare Super Featherweight Pacquiao to Welterweight Pacquiao, look at his tale of the tape and you will notice that despite having the same ring weight he is noticeably bigger nowadays than he was before. Also look at Marquez against Mayweather, same weight as Lightweight him but again noticeably bigger.

If he was bigger against Mayweather he would have been more than 145 in the ring, and would have held a size advantage against Pacquiao that night.

Scottrf wrote:

The Mighty Atom wrote:I hate to tell you guys but Coxy is actually right, not a great indicator but compare Super Featherweight Pacquiao to Welterweight Pacquiao, look at his tale of the tape and you will notice that despite having the same ring weight he is noticeably bigger nowadays than he was before. Also look at Marquez against Mayweather, same weight as Lightweight him but again noticeably bigger.

If he was bigger against Mayweather he would have been more than 145 in the ring, and would have held a size advantage against Pacquiao that night.

Doesn't hide the fact that the 142lb version of Marquez looks slow, fat and generally cack. Which has been my point.

As the links says above, he must come in at 135 as he couldn't get his body anyway near 100% at 142. Therein lies the problem that a 145lb monster is beating up on a very good 135lb'r

wow_junky wrote:

coxy0001 wrote:
He was 142 and looked she-ite for FMJ

He weighed 133 for Diaz II in early 2010 and 134 for Katsidis recently.... it's pretty apparent he's not a big LW and doesn't have much trouble making the weight.

End of

And he draink 14lbs worth of water after the Katsidis weigh in so he didn't go thirsty on fight night?

He also never took a leak.

Maybe if Kats would have went to the body he would have still been jiggling now.

wow_junky wrote:

coxy0001 wrote:
He was 142 and looked she-ite for FMJ

He weighed 133 for Diaz II in early 2010 and 134 for Katsidis recently.... it's pretty apparent he's not a big LW and doesn't have much trouble making the weight.

End of

And he draink 14lbs worth of water after the Katsidis weigh in so he didn't go thirsty on fight night?

And carbs dear boy

Do marathon runners not stuff their already honed bodies with as many carbs and fluids as they can fit inside them? Be interesting to see how much weight they put on prior to a race... comprende little one?!

Last post in misplaced optimism:

The 135 of Marquez is dehydrated, the 148 of Pacquiao isn't.

In the ring they would be about 145 (weight vs Katsidis) vs 148 (weight vs Margarito).

coxy0001 wrote:

wow_junky wrote:

coxy0001 wrote:
He was 142 and looked she-ite for FMJ

He weighed 133 for Diaz II in early 2010 and 134 for Katsidis recently.... it's pretty apparent he's not a big LW and doesn't have much trouble making the weight.

End of

And he draink 14lbs worth of water after the Katsidis weigh in so he didn't go thirsty on fight night?

And carbs dear boy

Do marathon runners not stuff their already honed bodies with as many carbs and fluids as they can fit inside them? Be interesting to see how much weight they put on prior to a race... comprende little one?!

So Marquez has to hydrate and carb himself up so he is ready for fight night?

I may be looking at this from a fairly simplistic point of view, but if Marquez does not feel he can come in at a 144 catchweight and be effective does he not have the option of turning the fight down?

coxy0001 wrote:He was 142 and looked she-ite for FMJ

He weighed 133 for Diaz II in early 2010 and 134 for Katsidis recently.... it's pretty apparent he's not a big LW and doesn't have much trouble making the weight.

End of

Yes 134 for Katsidis dues to having to cut for the scales, but supposedly 145 on fight night (although I haven't checked this info - just going on what's been said here).

Funnily enough though, I'd say, beyond all the debate about the scale of the weight disparity and weight cutting in general (which I still think was not well explained), I think that the ultimate point of your argument is the 'end of'. Marquez did not look good coming up in weight. If he were to move up into the LWW division he'd be a small LWW. This fight would be fairer at 140. 144 pushes JMM a bit too much and essentially sets the fight at Manny's optimum weight. Manny will probably balst out another old man and FMJ leftover. I'm not enthused about this fight at 144.

Ortiz at 147 or Bradley at 140 would be much better. Maidana would be a joke fight vs Pacquiao and would get totally destroyed.

wow_junky wrote:

coxy0001 wrote:

wow_junky wrote:

coxy0001 wrote:
He was 142 and looked she-ite for FMJ

He weighed 133 for Diaz II in early 2010 and 134 for Katsidis recently.... it's pretty apparent he's not a big LW and doesn't have much trouble making the weight.

End of

And he draink 14lbs worth of water after the Katsidis weigh in so he didn't go thirsty on fight night?

And carbs dear boy

Do marathon runners not stuff their already honed bodies with as many carbs and fluids as they can fit inside them? Be interesting to see how much weight they put on prior to a race... comprende little one?!

So Marquez has to hydrate and carb himself up so he is ready for fight night?

Even though he has not cut anything.

Poor Pacquiao, how does he cope without hydrating himself up or taking on carbs.

Lumbering_Jack wrote:If people still think that Manny is the same size as Marquez then they are beyond help, Coxy.

You can lead a horse to water...

...but you can't make it rehydrate to a weight where it's not at maximum effectiveness...

BALTIMORA wrote:

Lumbering_Jack wrote:If people still think that Manny is the same size as Marquez then they are beyond help, Coxy.

You can lead a horse to water...

...but you can't make it rehydrate to a weight where it's not at maximum effectiveness...

Nice one.

Scottrf wrote:Last post in misplaced optimism:

The 135 of Marquez is dehydrated, the 148 of Pacquiao isn't.

In the ring they would be about 145 (weight vs Katsidis) vs 148 (weight vs Margarito).

Ditto as i'm giving up as well

Lets just see what happens when they fight as i think you'll find Marquez, who will try to bulk up, will be a fat little punch bag for Manny. They may well weigh the same in the ring, but Pacquiao will be taking advantage of a blown up fat little LW who's lost all his speed because he's out of his comfort zone and has lost all speed and timing because he's carrying too many lbs of extra bulk which his body is not naturally able to carry.

That's me done on the subject. Lightweight champion who's never fought at lightwelter and looked she-ite at 142 VS Welterweight champ Pacquiao who's wobbled guys supposedly bigger than him.

I'm the same weight as BHop but look knowhere near as big or strong, you lot should maybe listen to Brother Nas when he says Pacquiao ain't small and ain't powerful for the weight.

Romeo done. Moving on. Brap.

OK I'll break the last post thing too, for a new argument.

It's like saying Berto-Ortiz was a 147 pounder Berto vs a 140 pounder in Ortiz. It wasn't, Ortiz has just been cutting more and he was 161 to Berto's 156 on the night.

Boxtthis wrote:

coxy0001 wrote:He was 142 and looked she-ite for FMJ

He weighed 133 for Diaz II in early 2010 and 134 for Katsidis recently.... it's pretty apparent he's not a big LW and doesn't have much trouble making the weight.

End of

Yes 134 for Katsidis dues to having to cut for the scales, but supposedly 145 on fight night (although I haven't checked this info - just going on what's been said here).

Funnily enough though, I'd say, beyond all the debate about the scale of the weight disparity and weight cutting in general (which I still think was not well explained), I think that the ultimate point of your argument is the 'end of'. Marquez did not look good coming up in weight. If he were to move up into the LWW division he'd be a small LWW. This fight would be fairer at 140. 144 pushes JMM a bit too much and essentially sets the fight at Manny's optimum weight. Manny will probably balst out another old man and FMJ leftover. I'm not enthused about this fight at 144.

Ortiz at 147 or Bradley at 140 would be much better. Maidana would be a joke fight vs Pacquiao and would get totally destroyed.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q-L38zbjkHc

He was 145lbs on the night, didn't seem to be in too bad of a shape now did he?

Scott

Ortiz was killing himself to make 140 though and that was no real secret.

Marquez doesn't have the same problem, evidence being his weights since going to LW when he's only hit 135 once.

Seriously, i'm done as i'm going to go and burn my weights tonight for retribution of having this cause me to go borderline insane

He was 145lbs on the night, didn't seem to be in too bad of a shape now did he?

Have you read anything i've written?

How good did he look when intentionally bulking up to 142? It's one thing to add muscle mass and keep everything i.e. timing, speed (aka Pacquiao) during camp and it's another to do it like Marquez did and look slow, rubbish and fat.

Manny hasn't weighed below 138 since May 2009. Marquez has weighed above 135 once in that time. If that doesn't spell out the disparity about who is the bigger guy, who can handle carrying more muscle mass (rather than just carb and fluid loading) then i don't know what will.

How many more times do I need to ask ? Cut it out !

Alright, lets call it quits then, but please less of the insults in future.

Oh and one thing, in your own words you slated FMJ for fighting a 36 and 38 year old...

What's your response to Manny fighting a 39 and 38 year old?!?!?!!??!!??!

You haven't got one, want me to find your quote as you're bound to deny it?!?!?!

Scottrf wrote:Alright, lets call it quits then, but please less of the insults in future.

Yup. I'll go outside and breathe!

HumanWindmill wrote:How many more times do I need to ask ? Cut it out !

Cut weight!? Not sure you should be encouraging aneroxia online windy

And i'm moving off this topic as i may implode if i have to converse with D4 anymore

coxy0001 wrote:

HumanWindmill wrote:How many more times do I need to ask ? Cut it out !

Cut weight!? Not sure you should be encouraging aneroxia online windy

And i'm moving off this topic as i may implode if i have to converse with D4 anymore

I'm so busy editing your posts I don't have time to eat, coxy.

HumanWindmill wrote:

coxy0001 wrote:

HumanWindmill wrote:How many more times do I need to ask ? Cut it out !

Cut weight!? Not sure you should be encouraging aneroxia online windy

And i'm moving off this topic as i may implode if i have to converse with D4 anymore

I'm so busy editing your posts I don't have time to eat, coxy.

See, who needs a diet when i'm around eh?! Will assume that message was laced with gratitude

coxy0001 wrote:

HumanWindmill wrote:

coxy0001 wrote:

HumanWindmill wrote:How many more times do I need to ask ? Cut it out !

Cut weight!? Not sure you should be encouraging aneroxia online windy

And i'm moving off this topic as i may implode if i have to converse with D4 anymore

I'm so busy editing your posts I don't have time to eat, coxy.

See, who needs a diet when i'm around eh?! Will assume that message was laced with gratitude

Let's just leave it at ' laced.'

Certainly agree with coxy on the JMM being a 135 fighter.

Some fighters are better at moving up weights than others, and even though JMM started at feather, i think his limit for being the most effective is at 135. He's not a 140+ fighter, regardless if he's only a few pounds lighter than Manny. As we know Manny has carried up his power and speed, at 140+ and JMM will be facing a much stronger Manny in this current catch weight contest than he would get at if the fight was made at 135.

Though there his history between them Bradley would have been the ideal opponent at LWW for Manny.