2nd TEST - AUS vs BRITISH & IRISH LIONS - 29th June - (KO-11:05 GMT)

First topic message reminder :

2nd Test build-up thread
 
Can the Lions finish the job?
Will Aus bounch back (like we know they can)?
Will the Ref know the rules?
 
Aus have called up George Smith, Jesse Mogg and centre Ben Tapuai but still No Cooper?
(talk about shooting yourself in the foot!)
 
15. Halfpenny,
14. Bowe,
13. BOD,
12. Davies,
11.North,
10. Sexton,
9. Youngs;

1. Vunipola
2. Youngs,
3. Jones,
4. AWJ,
5. Parling,
6. Lydiate,
7. Warburton,
8. Heaslip

Replacements:
16 Hibbard, 17 Grant, 18 Cole, 19 Croft, 20 O'Brien, 21 Murray, 22 Farrell, 23 Cuthbert


Australia
15 Kurtley Beale (Melbourne Rebels)
14 Israel Folau (NSW)
13 Adam Ashley-Cooper (NSW)
12 Christian Leali'ifano (ACT Brumbies)
11 Joe Tomane (Brumbies)
10 James O'Connor (Melbourne Rebels)
9 Will Genia (Reds)
8 Wycliff Palu (NSW)
7 Michael Hooper (NSW)
6 Ben Mowen (ACT)
5 Kane Douglas (NSW)
4 James Horwill (Reds - Cap)
3 Ben Alexander (ACT)
2 Stephen Moore (ACT)
1 Benn Robinson (NSW)

16 Saia Fainga'a (Reds)
17 James Slipper (Reds)
18 Sekope Kepu (NSW)
19 Rob Simmons (Reds)
20 Liam Gill (Reds)
21 Nick Phipps (Rebels)
22 Rob Horne (NSW)
23 Jesse Mogg (Brumbies)

 
For those wanting to see it again and again and again etc.....http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=GEORGE+NORTHS+LIONS+TRY&view=detail&mid=64E92B2D2B1B4128364264E92B2D2B1B41283642&first=0&FORM=NVPFVR&qpvt=GEORGE+NORTHS+LIONS+TRY

Just for the record - 2nd place to Parling and BOD - 14/0 - Lydiate in 4th 11/2 Warburton 10/0

Davies missed 3 of 7 tackles, nearly 50%.  BOD missed 0% of 14.  Davies added nothing in attack, made far too many handling errors and was caught out of position too many times.  BOD added little in attack and one dreadful intercepted pass could have cost us dearly.  BOD wasn't great but Davies was perceptively worse.  I know Fly your a big Davies fan, and he has had a pretty damn good tour.  But today your assertions are not based in reality.   

I agree with you on the try- I dont understand how people think it was Davies' fault.

Meters run is just - depressing. Really depressing. Sexton highest with 41. North down for 10, Bowe 7 1/2p 12

The Oz stats are just a little bit different..

Yeah I thought sexton would have made the most.

This game needed Englands Brown. He loves a gain!

lostinwales wrote:Meters run is just - depressing. Really depressing. Sexton highest with 41. North down for 10, Bowe 7 1/2p 12

The Oz stats are just a little bit different..

Heaslips stats are awful, I think SOB or Faletau should start at 8 next week

Couple of quick thoughts:

Warburton - had a very good game, felt things turned a bit when he left.

BOD and Davies - both made mistakes, neither had a good game - no fluidity in the centres. We really need a ball carrier next week, Robert, Tuilagi - I don't care, one in one of BOD or Davies out. We know it will be Davies out, even though BOD may not deserve place on performance today.

Ben Youngs - was supposed to be the anti-Phillips and provide quick ball and mind. In my view he was pretty poor, and wish he'd been subbed earlier.

Vunipola - had a mare first 30, seemed to recover, but bizarre he ended up playing the 80 when Youngs and Jones were subbed.

Bowe and North - as someone above mentions, all they could do was chase kicks.

Sexton - disappointing I felt, but despite Farrells improving form should probably start next week.

Halfpenny - familiar sight to see him miss the big-pressure kick (though it wasn't easy).

It was a messy, edgy tight game that Australia deserved to win given their last 10 mins, but hell, I'm gutted. Not sure the Lions can turn this around now, but here's hoping!

Didn't see the game but listened to it on radio. Sounding really scrappy and a very gameplan led performance by the Lions. Tense decider next week...

mystiroakey wrote:Yeah I thought sexton would have made the most.

This game needed Englands Brown. He loves a gain!

 

Taylorman wrote:

flyhalffactory wrote:Gatland played a negative containing game............. tactically restrained the centres, brought in players for containment (Bowe, Lydiate) instead of enterprise (Cuthbert, Croft). Poor decision

Gatland you stubborn man didn't even bring Grant on when clearly that would have solved the scrum and hence as a result the losing of so much initial territory. Poor decision

The Aussie try should never come, one poor tackle and one miss-tackle from Croft led to the build-up. He had no choice however when Warbs went off, and our nightmare scenario became a reality Heaslip already off and a flanker injured. Again a crazy bench selection

Three tactically poor decisions

I disagree. The Lions defence was superb and this was the type of game that the Lions were more likely to win. Only thing they did wrong was to not last the 80 on D with the one soft try. Wave after wave was repelled and that must have been Gats gameplan the way the Lions were ganging up on the Oz backs- they did a superb shutout. If they had gone for attack they would have played into the Ozzie hands and would not have had the defence focus required to keep Ozzie out.

Next week he needs to do the same. the Lions wont beat the Ozzies in the loose after two tests, They did last week, but that was due to massive injuries and missed kicks. If he opens them up...they'll get done.

Not saying that we didn't have a superb defensive game, but if the Aussies passes had stuck then this game would have beyond us by the end of the first 40 mins. Davies and BOD clearly were told to hold the defensive line not create opportunities going forward. North and Bowe didn't come into the midfield once which is what both naturally do, clearly told to hold positions.

Clear indicator of the coaches mind-set

Tackles made/(missed) - 144 (14) Lions and 67 (7) Aussies.
Carries / Metres made - 60/148 Lions and 127/418 Aussies

The guys were out on their feet, they tackled to a standstill.

We are not going to win the game that way.

Not sure who I would advocate starting in all depends on the individual recovery and they must be 100% fit to start , but the importance of Warburton defensively was clear when Croft came on, Phillips, Roberts/Bod or Davies has to begin, and Grant must start surely start.

wales606 wrote:

lostinwales wrote:Meters run is just - depressing. Really depressing. Sexton highest with 41. North down for 10, Bowe 7 1/2p 12

The Oz stats are just a little bit different..

Heaslips stats are awful, I think SOB or Faletau should start at 8 next week

Third highest metres carried in the game? If he was awful what on earth was the rest of the pack doing?

As soon as I saw the distance of the last kick I knew it was well out of 1/2p's range. It was near on 60 with the angle. He hit a 50 odd as well as he could have earlier and it hit the bar. He knew he wasnt going to get the last one.

Sometimes the heat of the moment just has to give way to common sense. A tap meant they retain the ball and have a chance. A 50+ kick gives no chance of retrieval. Poor, poor decision making at a critical time.

Duty281 wrote:Both teams defended well, but there was only team with spark in attack today and it certainly wasn't the Lions. Things seemed to go south for the Lions in attack from the moment they went 3-0 up. The breakdown was pretty inept after Warburton hobbled off.

Well done Australia, have a   Linebreaker and any other Australians on here.

Plenty to do for the Lions before next Saturday.

Cheers mate... and Oakey too.  

I am not sure what the percentage is for 55 yard kicks made but i would be suprused if it was more than 10%..

clearly the wrong play by the lions

Hookisms and Hyperbole wrote:Davies missed 3 of 7 tackles, nearly 50%.  BOD missed 0% of 14.  Davies added nothing in attack, made far too many handling errors and was caught out of position too many times.  BOD added little in attack and one dreadful intercepted pass could have cost us dearly.  BOD wasn't great but Davies was perceptively worse.  I know Fly your a big Davies fan, and he has had a pretty damn good tour.  But today your assertions are not based in reality.   

I agree with you on the try- I dont understand how people think it was Davies' fault.

Hookism mate,
I was working on some business stuff as I was watching (grrrrrrrr) so didn't give it my full attention. But in my mind Davies had a much better game however I have taped it and no doubt will watch it again. I noticed Davies running up after a long kick and chase which led to the Lions pen which IMHO was the only real offensive movement all game between the two centres.

Re: the try if you rewind about 60 seconds you will see Croft making a tackle which was easily dealt, with Aussies easily continuing the offensive movement, and then he has an awful miss-pass which led the momentum to the try.

Its easy (and probably unfair) to highlight one player but once Warburton went off we lost shape and awareness, a fresh Croft didn't add anything to our defensive cause which at the end of the day it was clear that was Mr Gs intention

Taylorman wrote:As soon as I saw the distance of the last kick I knew it was well out of 1/2p's range. It was near on 60 with the angle. He hit a 50 odd as well as he could have earlier and it hit the bar. He knew he wasnt going to get the last one.

Sometimes the heat of the moment just has to give way to common sense. A tap meant they retain the ball and have a chance. A 50+ kick gives no chance of retrieval. Poor, poor decision making at a critical time.

Again you don't really watch Halfpenny kick unless it is against NZ or perhaps A sh team. Leigh's miss was well within his capabilities .. it was just like a drunk falling over .. know what I mean

Congrats Linebreaker

flyhalffactory wrote:

Hookisms and Hyperbole wrote:Davies missed 3 of 7 tackles, nearly 50%.  BOD missed 0% of 14.  Davies added nothing in attack, made far too many handling errors and was caught out of position too many times.  BOD added little in attack and one dreadful intercepted pass could have cost us dearly.  BOD wasn't great but Davies was perceptively worse.  I know Fly your a big Davies fan, and he has had a pretty damn good tour.  But today your assertions are not based in reality.   

I agree with you on the try- I dont understand how people think it was Davies' fault.

Hookism mate,
I was working on some business stuff as I was watching (grrrrrrrr) so didn't give it my full attention. But in my mind Davies had a much better game however I have taped it and no doubt will watch it again. I noticed Davies running up after a long kick and chase which led to the Lions pen which IMHO was the only real offensive movement all game between the two centres.

Re: the try if you rewind about 60 seconds you will see Croft making a tackle which was easily dealt, with Aussies easily continuing the offensive movement, and then he has an awful miss-pass which led the momentum to the try.

Its easy (and probably unfair) to highlight one player but once Warburton went off we lost shape and awareness, a fresh Croft didn't add anything to our defensive cause which at the end of the day it was clear that was Mr Gs intention

Davies had an absolute shocker. Offered nothing for most of the game and the only times he got the ball he put in the worst grubber I've ever seen and made a number of handling errors. As Hookism has pointed out his tackle stats are pretty diabolical as well.

flyhalffactory wrote:

Hookisms and Hyperbole wrote:Davies missed 3 of 7 tackles, nearly 50%.  BOD missed 0% of 14.  Davies added nothing in attack, made far too many handling errors and was caught out of position too many times.  BOD added little in attack and one dreadful intercepted pass could have cost us dearly.  BOD wasn't great but Davies was perceptively worse.  I know Fly your a big Davies fan, and he has had a pretty damn good tour.  But today your assertions are not based in reality.   

I agree with you on the try- I dont understand how people think it was Davies' fault.

Hookism mate,
I was working on some business stuff as I was watching (grrrrrrrr) so didn't give it my full attention. But in my mind Davies had a much better game however I have taped it and no doubt will watch it again. I noticed Davies running up after a long kick and chase which led to the Lions pen which IMHO was the only real offensive movement all game between the two centres.

Re: the try if you rewind about 60 seconds you will see Croft making a tackle which was easily dealt, with Aussies easily continuing the offensive movement, and then he has an awful miss-pass which led the momentum to the try.

Its easy (and probably unfair) to highlight one player but once Warburton went off we lost shape and awareness, a fresh Croft didn't add anything to our defensive cause which at the end of the day it was clear that was Mr Gs intention

Game shouldn't have been so close as to be so much in the balance when Warburton came off.

Gatland needs to hold his hand way up high and admit the gameplan was his.  He thought he could contain with muscular defending.  Not the way to play Australia.  He should hoist his hand and stop letting the inquisitions from media and indeed here start to flush out 'bad' performances from individual players.  He gives a holding game to Youngs at scrum and Vunipola?  They and indeed Sexton are charged by an attacking game where ball is kept in the hand and distributed to backs looking for work.
Where were the backs looking for work?  They were at their posts doing the heavy duty defending, like ordered to.  Strange gameplan from Gatland - reminded me of the worst days of Kidney.

I repeat...he needs to put up his hand and say his tactics didn't work.  And if he tries them again next time, that will be a series loss.  You only play a containing game when you've done enough to deserve it on the scoreboard.

I've been out ring shopping s missed the game for the second week running. Could you guys sum up who you thought played well/bad. Ta

Quick view: a reversal of last week we could have won that at the end but also could have lost by a lot more. Can't blame Halfpenny for the kick, never should have gone for it the smart play would have been to tap and take a few more phases. Well played the Aussies, thankfully they made a lot of handling errors due to nerves and a strong defence, they could have run away with that.

We won the breakdown though and I have to eat a few words and say brilliantly played by Sam Warburton, and I think Lydiate too. They had big jobs to do and did so very well. The lineout was a mess, a mixture between losing Croft (well predicted fa09), less accurate throws than last week, probably losing POC and the Aussies actually contesting the ball. The Scrums started horribly but I think there should be props to the props (poor pun intended) for springing back and win some penalties and making some shoves on our own ball to prevent the Joubert-penalty express I was expecting. But then we were dominated in some scrums too so very hit and miss.

Our defence was strong most of the time and I think some Aussies mistakes were due to that, but we were outclassed in attack and as O'Connor grew into his role we looked in trouble. I was surprised they didn't try the crossfield kick to Folau more after the poor kick form Beale still nearly ended up as a try!

Joubert was good, on the whole, I thought. Missed a few things either way, was very whistle happy early on but let the game go on a few times later. We quietened Genia a bit which bodes well but then he didn't have to carry his side this week and still did the job of a 9 very well. I worry that their midfield might click even more next week, but I think we will be better than we were today.



Big respect to LLF who was great, JOC for bouncing back to a degree despite first half jitters, AAC for being solid as a rock and for unbelievable restart steals and a much improved Aussie defence and attack.

Well done also to Bowe, who shone for me, Murray when he came on, the new front row's first big scrum, Lydiate and Warbs (see above) and Leigh until the miss.

Whoever was our on-field captain at the end, what the hell were you thinking?!

flyhalffactory wrote:

Hookisms and Hyperbole wrote:Davies missed 3 of 7 tackles, nearly 50%.  BOD missed 0% of 14.  Davies added nothing in attack, made far too many handling errors and was caught out of position too many times.  BOD added little in attack and one dreadful intercepted pass could have cost us dearly.  BOD wasn't great but Davies was perceptively worse.  I know Fly your a big Davies fan, and he has had a pretty damn good tour.  But today your assertions are not based in reality.   

I agree with you on the try- I dont understand how people think it was Davies' fault.

Hookism mate,
I was working on some business stuff as I was watching (grrrrrrrr) so didn't give it my full attention. But in my mind Davies had a much better game however I have taped it and no doubt will watch it again. I noticed Davies running up after a long kick and chase which led to the Lions pen which IMHO was the only real offensive movement all game between the two centres.

Re: the try if you rewind about 60 seconds you will see Croft making a tackle which was easily dealt, with Aussies easily continuing the offensive movement, and then he has an awful miss-pass which led the momentum to the try.

Its easy (and probably unfair) to highlight one player but once Warburton went off we lost shape and awareness, a fresh Croft didn't add anything to our defensive cause which at the end of the day it was clear that was Mr Gs intention

I thought Warburton had a pretty average first half but great after half time. You could clearly see the change at the breakdown when he went off- clear as day. Thats the problem with having Croft in the side in comparison to other players. What you get in his wide channel carrying you lack in clearing out and defensive work. The problem will be of Warburton misses next week. Tipuric would simply have to come in.

Davie and BOD did nothing in attack, mostly because they didnt get the ball. Look at the defensive work of the two. BOD was absolutely head and shoulders above Davies in that regard. One of those things. Davies has had a good tour, but not so much today. BOD was not much better overall, but still marginally better nonetheless.

AsLongAsBut100ofUs wrote:Congrats Linebreaker

Thanks As.

I had to walk out of the room a few times... it was too bloody much for me. (I pretended to tinker with the new photocopier)
It will be great to catch up with the lads next week. We've had the heaviest rain in June for 5 or 15 years?  but they are expecting it to clear up by Wednesday. It will be a monumental ocassion no doubt. I've given up trying to analyse or predict things. In fact, all this week I've been trying not to think too much about tonight's match. I think we took a step backwards, maybe the Lions did too. Sets it up nicely!

rainbow-warrior wrote:

Taylorman wrote:As soon as I saw the distance of the last kick I knew it was well out of 1/2p's range. It was near on 60 with the angle. He hit a 50 odd as well as he could have earlier and it hit the bar. He knew he wasnt going to get the last one.

Sometimes the heat of the moment just has to give way to common sense. A tap meant they retain the ball and have a chance. A 50+ kick gives no chance of retrieval. Poor, poor decision making at a critical time.

Again you don't really watch Halfpenny kick unless it is against NZ or perhaps A sh team. Leigh's miss was well within his capabilities .. it was just like a drunk falling over .. know what I mean

It was within his range, not WELL within it. With the pressure on it, and the range, and the angle, and no need to go for it at all and a referee giving us penalties at the breakdown, the decision to go for the posts was borderline moronic

Wasn't anywhere near a TV so could't see this. Could some posters please help me with the following:
1. Did they play well or did we play badly? Or both?
2. What seemed to be the main selection problems for us?
3. Realistically, what changes will the Fatman be compelled to make next week?

Edit: Chequered - thanks bud - just saw your post above.

Did I see Horwill crying after the final whistle? I always liked him. But I like him even more if he cries after a win because he loves his country so much.

George Carlin wrote:Wasn't anywhere near a TV so could't see this. Could come posters help me with the following:
1. Did theu play well or did we play badly? Or both?
2. What seemed to be the main selection problems for us?
3. Realistically, what changs will the Fatman be compelled to make next week?

we played well enough for the gaqme plan we clearly were playing.. But you cant expect to shut out aus in 80 mins just kicking and defending!!

there wasnt a selction problem for me, just a game plan problem.

3. PLAY RUGBY!!

rainbow-warrior wrote:

Taylorman wrote:As soon as I saw the distance of the last kick I knew it was well out of 1/2p's range. It was near on 60 with the angle. He hit a 50 odd as well as he could have earlier and it hit the bar. He knew he wasnt going to get the last one.

Sometimes the heat of the moment just has to give way to common sense. A tap meant they retain the ball and have a chance. A 50+ kick gives no chance of retrieval. Poor, poor decision making at a critical time.

Again you don't really watch Halfpenny kick unless it is against NZ or perhaps A sh team. Leigh's miss was well within his capabilities .. it was just like a drunk falling over .. know what I mean

Not quite...I watch the occasional one against France as well.

If they had gone for the tap and went through their phases and, in the panicked melee of late in the game knife-edge breakdowns, they were turned over and Aussie's kicked it out quick for the end to the game.  

Who would be here now saying "we had the best kicker in the NH, perhaps the world on the team, a range that might have been at the edge of his abilty but he's done them before, we only needed three points and some idiot decides to tap???!!!!"

Hindsight.

Near miss but next week hopefully we can go with Gatland's only plan and have both Roberts and Phillips start with Corbisiero to give at least scrum parity. Hopefully Sam can play because who else holds it all together when he is not there. I know this will be unpopular but the Welsh back row of Warbs, Lydiate and Faletau is the most balanced and effective we can put out so should start. I thought Parling did very well today but am not sure more agression in the rucks and a bit of carrying from the second row is needed so would probably prefer Grey or Evans

Feckless Rogue wrote:Did I see Horwill crying after the final whistle? I always liked him. But I like him even more if he cries after a win because he loves his country so much.

Yes he did cry, very much like the prisoner off to the chair won't be there next week lol

George Carlin wrote:Wasn't anywhere near a TV so could't see this. Could come posters help me with the following:
1. Did theu play well or did we play badly? Or both?
2. What seemed to be the main selection problems for us?
3. Realistically, what changs will the Fatman be compelled to make next week?

1) both played oddly. We bossed the breakdown but had a duff setpiece and defended well without offering much other than the maul in attack. The Aussies grew into the game, could have won by more and offered infinitely more on attack and defended well but made a lot of errors. Warbs coming off shaped the game

2) Vunipola was very hit and miss in the scrums (and might get cited), Lineout needed sorting, need some form of attack plan

3) Vunipola won't play. Then there were injuries

rainbow-warrior wrote:

Feckless Rogue wrote:Did I see Horwill crying after the final whistle? I always liked him. But I like him even more if he cries after a win because he loves his country so much.

Yes he did cry, very much like the prisoner off to the chair :)won't be there next week lol

Maybe he had some of Mako's DNA in his eyes?   

"
Who would be here now saying "we had the best kicker in the NH, perhaps the world on the team, a range that might have been at the edge of his abilty but he's done them before, we only needed three points and some idiot decides to tap???!!!!"

OF is the best kicker in the NH.

You are spot on with the rest though. If we had tapped and messed it up, we would all be arguing against it

Again you don't really watch Halfpenny kick unless it is against NZ or perhaps A sh team. Leigh's miss was well within his capabilities .. it was just like a drunk falling over .. know what I mean [/quote]

I wonder if the slight difference in the Australian ball is what had the effect, I have watched him kick them over from ar least 5 yards further out... in fact 10 yards further back tahn the one that hit the cross bar, cannot think of musch else unless the humidity was a factor

Tense finish for you LB! Well done mate, you got there in the end. Are you going to the Sydney game?

From a neutral perspective I'm glad this series has a decider in the last game. Both sides very even and who will chance their arm or who will seek to minimise their error rate which was way too high today? Going to be intriguing to find out and selections will give an indication of the game both sides want to play.

Artful_Dodger wrote:
Davies had an absolute shocker.  Offered nothing for most of the game and the only times he got the ball he put in the worst grubber I've ever seen and made a number of handling errors.  As Hookism has pointed out his tackle stats are pretty diabolical as well.

Beggars belief

Out of interest Dodgy................ do you think he was worse offensively than anyone else?, perhaps made less yardage than any other Lions back.

With regards to the grubber, it was the right decision and if it had come off there was a try in the offering, under pressure he didn't make proper contact but it doesn't hide the fact that it was a good decision.

Out of interest Dodgy............ who would you have selected at 12?

Yes kia. It's a hop, step and a jump away from my new digs.

It would have been tough on us if it were all over after tonight. Imagine the conversations I'd be having with the couple of Lions fans staying here next week?

"Can you please stop bullying the wombat.... and who has mud on their shoes?!"  

flyhalffactory wrote:

Artful_Dodger wrote:
Davies had an absolute shocker.  Offered nothing for most of the game and the only times he got the ball he put in the worst grubber I've ever seen and made a number of handling errors.  As Hookism has pointed out his tackle stats are pretty diabolical as well.

Beggars belief

Out of interest Dodgy................ do you think he was worse offensively than anyone else?, perhaps made less yardage than any other Lions back.

With regards to the grubber, it was the right decision and if it had come off there was a try in the offering, under pressure he didn't make proper contact but it doesn't hide the fact that it was a good decision.

Out of interest Dodgy............ who would you have selected at 12?

I would have started Davies at 12 but would consider dropping him for Tuilagi for the next test. I don't think the grubber was the right decision he had two players outside and even though space was tight it should have gone through the hands. As for his offensive effort, there wasn't any has everytime he got the ball he fumbled, knocked on or did something ineffectual.

Linebreaker wrote:

rainbow-warrior wrote:

Feckless Rogue wrote:Did I see Horwill crying after the final whistle? I always liked him. But I like him even more if he cries after a win because he loves his country so much.

Yes he did cry, very much like the prisoner off to the chair :)won't be there next week lol

Maybe he had some of Mako's DNA in his eyes?   

Possibly, but Horwill. despite his love of cranium exploration under less than clean conditions is a good lad.  
Unfortunately he's Aussie  and will be acting out the criminal of the old ... ex-Welsh Prime-Minister place some Captain found hahahaha

Roberts will also be fit next week, so I imagine he'll slot back in at 12.

Are Kiwis all over the world breathing a massive sigh of relief that FatMan is unlikely ever to coach them on the back of this tactically inept performance?

mystiroakey wrote:"
Who would be here now saying "we had the best kicker in the NH, perhaps the world on the team, a range that might have been at the edge of his abilty but he's done them before, we only needed three points and some idiot decides to tap???!!!!"

OF is the best kicker in the NH.

You are spot on with the rest though. If we had tapped and messed it up, we would all be arguing against it

Seems to be an issue with Halfpenny then..they keep thinking he's going to get the distance- thats at least two crucial kicks in the most important of test matches that have fallen short. This one was 15meters short from trying to force it...because he knew he wouldnt get the distance. Running it gave them 10%chance perhaps, kicking it gave them none. And you cant make decisions like that based on what fans are likely to say afterwards. You need to make the best decision. That wasnt it.

Anyway. We go to number 3..wouldnt have it any other way...

Well played the Aussies. A deserved win that makes for a very exciting finale..!

The game changed when Warburton went off. He and Lydiate were immense today.

Suddenly without Warburton Hoopers name was mentioned at the breakdowns and the penalties went the other way...!

Artful_Dodger wrote:Roberts will also be fit next week, so I imagine he'll slot back in at 12.

Funny you should say that...is Gatland tactically lost without his big Number 12?  Tuilagi then might have been a better choice for this game.  But then again, he wasn't looking for a charging 12 in this game obviously which again highlights the plan was all his.

I agree it was a 10% at best shot. Not the right decision. But i do agree many would have argued if we messed up the tap.


All the same the reality is that Oz deserved this win. So I don't want to take that away from them.

Gatland isn't a bad coach ASBO. To be honest, for most of that the game was being played exactly how he wanted it to be played. Some key errors at key moments let the Lions down. You could argue that the Lions might not well have needed those moments if they'd played with a different gameplan. But then Australia might well have been able to play a different game as well.

Gatland will have to come back to NZ to coach there if he's going to get the top job. That will be good for NZ rugby as we have a lot of top coaches helping out other teams around the world. Same issue with the players.

What I'm going to be intrigued to see with selections this week and inevitably the gameplan will be if Gatland tries to chance his arm more or is convinced that more of the same is required but with fewer errors.

No one will care how the Lions win so long as they do. Deans will be under pressure with JOC at flyhalf. Changes will come from both sides undoubtedly. Just how many and to what extent will be the key.

mystiroakey wrote:I agree it was a 10% at best shot. Not the right decision. But i do agree many would have argued if we messed up the tap.


All the same the reality is that Oz desered this win. So I dont want to take that away from them

Yep...fair call. Pity it was such a scatchy match compared to last week which had everything. The most disappointing thing for me was the handling- so many drops, lost in tackles etc no one could string passes together other than Oz being forced sideway all the time from a very good defence.

The Lions should have already lost this series, that's the bottom line everyone. If you're goign to paly Gatlandball pick Roberts and Tuilagi, and maybe O'Brien, use North as another battering ram.

Thomond wrote:The Lions should have already lost this series, that's the bottom line everyone. If you're goign to paly Gatlandball pick Roberts and Tuilagi, and maybe O'Brien, use North as another battering ram.

+1

At the moment we are playing Gatlandball Lite.

I don't know how close Gatland is to coaching the ABs. I wouldn't have thought very close. As Kia says he would need to come back to NZ first and win something like useful - like a Super 15 trophy. If Cooper wins the S15 again he might move close to the front of the queue.